Taking Sides - HD-DVD or Blu-Ray?

No real benefits over dvd, other than quality which is never a great reason for people to upgrade who wants to upgrade all there dvds/player/tv when DVD is perfectly acceptable to most people.

DRM built in, probably be cracked but will be annoying

Split format ala VHS/Betamax

Rise of iTunes/legal digital downloads/Bitorrent/IPTV/Video on demand etc

I see it as being a little more popular than SACD and DVDA.

High quality textures/audio maybe on PS3 but that Xbox360 went DVD is a good indicator that DVD is good enough to stopgap before consoles start using online distribution ala Valves Steam.

Blu-ray
Pro: Higher capacity per layer, great industry support both in hardware and software, 1080p capable players available
Con: Production problems means potential hardware shortages, EXPENSIVE (twice the price of HD DVD), compatibility with old-school media OPTIONAL

My personal take is that consumer fatigue will cause most consumers to stay away from BOTH of these formats in the short term, especially as a lot of people are still in the process of converting their old VHS to old-school DVD. If these things really catch on, it probably won't be until late 2007 or early 2008 at the soonest.

Ricoh apparently has new technology that makes it possible to do both formats without costing a zillion dollars. That may make the difference for consumers who are waffling because half their favourite movies are available on HD DVD while the other half are on Blu-ray.

Also the DRM requirement for HDMI/HDCP compatible input on screens is big one, alot of HD screens out there are not HDCP compliant. If the publishers decide to require it.

The new Toshiba players will NOT do 1080p even if you have the screens. The Blu-ray player from Samsung WILL do 1080p if you have a screen capable of that resolution. So if you're looking for a player that will handle the 1080p screen you're getting down the road, HD DVD isn't it.

Ha ha - I said this in the last meeting we had to discuss how we were going to lead the world in HD-DVD and Blu-ray content. Cue much murmuring and, "No, no, this HAS to succeed."

tell that to Apple & MSFT, both are about 2 years out or less.
Also, digital cable does what.

jalr'mai is correctamundo.

wimax will be able to stream hdtv, for instance. and for less than the ridiculous early adopter investments these optical formats are going to be asking for the next year and a half, trying to recover losses. It almost makes me feel sorry for the companies that sunk the R+D, but hi, writing on wall, greedy fuckers.

my box at home can stream movies on demand really well altho not HD.

I think it's all balls and I'm so glad my long-term job security has been gambled on this.

I'm currently using an upconvert DVD player with an HDTV and the picture quality is amazing and the DVD player and DVDs are dirt cheap. I can't imagine that an HD DVD or blu-ray is going to add that much more to my viewing experience and it's going to cost a lot more.

http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2007/12/04/why-low-def-is-the-new-hd/

Supposed to be a big announcement next month at the CES by Bill Gates which will finally decide which format will succeed in the long term. Either that HD DVD is dead or more likely that HD DVD drives will be fitted as standard to Xbox 360s.

Tracer plz to summarise that ridiculously long article into handy take-home soundbite.

"In summary, Apple wins again (probably)"

As with audio, punters don't give a crap about quality and would rather watch harry potter on youtube than on Blu-Ray or HD-DVD.

More or less

* sub-SD mobile video has taken off in a huge way; HD is useless on a phone
* DVDs upscaled on HD television sets look fantastic already

thx!

by the way, when i was in new york earlier this year i watched Letterman on a friend's girlfriend's gigantic HD television, and yyyeeeeeuccchhhh

* DVDs upscaled on HD television sets look fantastic already

this is more OTM than I ever imagined. The final nail for me was when I saw Assassin's Creed played on a 60" giganto-plasma that was capable of 1080p - I was all "holy shit this is amazing, is this full 1080p?" and dude is like "no this is actually just upscaled from the component signal"

There's one particular HD title I worked on recently - it has sold 37 copies worldwide. 37. I can think of a couple of others which can't have even reached that figure.

What does Tay Zonday look like in HD

El Tomboto - that Assassin's Creed still would have been 720p being upscaled - which is fair a lot different than upscaling a progressive scan dvd, I'd imagine. You're just start with a much higher res image which can have a lot more detail, etc...

Anyhow, a good 1080p transfer is going to have a lot more detail and a lot cleaner look on a good 1080p HDTV, than a 480p dvd being upscaled to 1080p. But I would agree that the average consumer couldn't give a shit (or at least not enough to drop a couple of thousand and to bother setting up all that stuff to work right).

Yeah, the comments in the article comparing HD disc formats to SACD and DVD-Audio seem OTM to me in that regard

Sorry, I can't type in English today :(

The one thing I've seen in HD that was really wow - 1080i NFL broadcasts on a big plasma

this thread does remind me I need to e-mail my landlady and ask when they're getting the roof dish upgraded

the truth is HD DOES look a lot better but upscaled DVDs still look GREAT so ya.

it also depends on the dvd and how it's encoded too. ppl forget about that whole thing.

Since getting HD a couple years back it's really the only thing I watch. If there's a movie I really want to see it's only theater or HD for me - anything else is kind of unacceptable. I don't think I'm the average consumer, but it's a big deal for me - I'm actually less precious about music and whether it's on a serious hi-fi etc.

...though I care about music more.

I am considering a PS3 for Gran Turismo and Blu-Ray, but I'm still not sure. I figure $$$ upfront for the first kind of player and something $ later if blu-ray loses.

Another problem with HD-DVD & Blu-Ray is that there still aren't really many very good movies out on either format. And of course, in most cases, what is on there is a lot more expensive than the standard DVD versions. Lots of people didn't switch from VHS to DVD until the prices on DVDs got more than competitive too. For instance, the 28 Days Later DVD is $9.99 US on Amazon right now, while the Blu-Ray disc is $27.95 - and this is a movie that supposedly looks no different in either format. Why would somebody in their right mind buy the blu-ray disc even if they had a player?

Would somebody in their right mind buy that movie in the first place...?

would somebody in their right mind buy a movie?

no way, movies are expensive! they cost tens of millions of dollars!

The de laurentiis family bought Dune as a gift for all of us

They're both basically doomed, unless Warner takes a side soon, and then the other side would be immediately dead.

I don't care about Warner. I do care about Criterion. I just want them to start putting out HD movies - damn it. I don't care which format - I will buy either player I need at that point, which will hopefully come soon (but I doubt it).

Warner chooses Blu-Ray. HD-DVD is pretty much dead.

ya that's somethin.

And Toshiba cancelled (or at least postpones) their CES press conference? God, this is really bad for HD-DVD. I really wish I hadn't stupidly bought a player a couple months ago when they were doing their warehouse-is-on-fire sales. At least I've only bought a couple discs beyond the freebies.

if you got one for cheap you will probably be able to scoop up tons of good movies when the format dies. i mean, even if you didn't get one for cheap. the point is, you'll probably get your money's worth.

and some studios are still HD-DVD only, so it's not going to be obsolete for a while

Suppose HD-DVD dies. And a Blu-ray costs just as much as the DVD equivalent. Will there still be a reason for consumers to go Blu-ray?

Unless computers start making all their built-in optical disc drives Blu-ray *and* DVD compatible, and/or offer cheap portable Blu-ray readers/burners, Blu-ray is going to have to eat money for a long time.

...

I mean I still see many kids on buses use CD walkmans. It's not as if iPods have really "won" yet either, ya know?

^^^Wut

they're saying apple might start putting blu-ray in macs as early as this season.

Suppose HD-DVD dies. And a Blu-ray costs just as much as the DVD equivalent. Will there still be a reason for consumers to go Blu-ray?

Blu-Ray is HD. Regular DVDs are not.

Yeah, I was thinking of pawning off my HD-DVD player, but that was just crazy talk off the initial shock of the announcement. I'd only do it if I was a gamer and wanted a PS3 anyway, which I sort of don't.

i'm glad we could talk you down.

Haha

I do have to say this will probably curb any future HD-DVD buying for now.

lol @ warner brothers rescuing the playstation 3

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=friS4OOcdgQ

^^^ lol

Even I have to admire the bloodshed today with both Best Buy and Netflix effectively telling HD-DVD to fuck itself.

I'm glad this all seems to be coming to an end, hopefully people will start flocking to Blu-Ray and the prices will eventually drop to my affordable range.

I'm actually a little surprised that the clearly (or so I'm told by film geeks and tech-heads) superior format actually one this battle. I still remember my parents' dismay at the Betamax fiasco.

Blu-Ray is not the clearly superior format.

so they're still going to be regionally coded? Fuck THEM

Fuck them ALL

fuck it anyway -- dvd is fine as is. regional coding is a big pain in the arse, about half of my dvds are from outside of my region, and i have a six sense-type feeling that blu-rays will be harder to hack than my venerable five-year-old samsung.

Blu-Ray is not the clearly superior format.

I'll confess to not knowing a whole lot about either format as far as specs go, but every person I know whose opinion I really trust when it comes to these types of things swears that Blu-Ray is much, much preferred to HD.

it's preferred but not better

Fuck them ALL

^^^this

eh downloads will win in the end

not really

for the foreseeable future "hd" downloads are so compressed that they're not gonna look much different than dvd.

i.e. downloads will win NOW cause DVD on an HDTV looks fvckin fantastic

downloads wont win until delivery/bandwidth problems are sorted - but bluray is just a stopgap

it's all just a stopgap until we get hd chips implanted in our penises.

i.e. downloads will win NOW cause DVD on an HDTV looks fvckin fantastic

-- Tracer Hand, Tuesday, February 12, 2008 3:13 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

this actually depends. some dvds i have look really good on my hdtv, some look like total shit. all depends on how they're encoded.

and hi-def looks much better, generally. depends on whether people will want to show off their fancy sets or not.

There was just a big article on movie downloads crippling bandwidth for a lot of ISPs, so I'm guessing some of the smaller guys are going to start putting limits on how much can be downloaded.

that's another thing for sure. everyone's putting a cap in users' asses nowadays.

i mean if the number of ppl in any given neighbourhood who rent a movie in any given night downloaded a 5gb movie (approx size of a compressed hd flick)... it'd be disastrous. it'd be the hd 9/11.

yah all that stuff is pretty fascinating ip multicast local isp throttling googles mysterious data centers and dark fiber etc what will happen nobody knows???

but the fact that the roll out of paid movie dls and bluray are happening simultaneously doesnt bode well for the discs

Bandwidth is not an issue, less than 10 years ago It would take me an hour to download one album at 56kpbs dial-up speed, 5 years ago I could download a 700 mb DivX via ADSL in a couple of hours, I can now download a 4gb HD h.264 file in an hour via ADSL2+. Five years down the line there will be VDSL, or fibre optical cable, or some other method which will allow me to download 40Gb in an hour.

It's only going to get cheaper and cheaper to transmit data over time.

and yet isps are making it more and more expensive. standard plan over cable here = 20gb dl cap. that's like 4 movies/

while its obv true that bandwidth increases over time if everyone started dling movie right now it wouldnt matter if you had fiber or whatever - because the bottleneck is actually at where your isp connects to the larger internet - the only reason people can get good dl speeds now is cause everyone isnt using their max bandwidth at the same time.

which isnt to say there arent solutions - like say serving the videos over each isps own network where there is plenty of bandwidth - apple or whoever would just needs a data center hooked up to each isp - or the isps could build their own and rent them out

im sure theres tons other solutions too - obv im no expert on the topic - but it seems as demand grows theyll figure this out - theres too much money to be made not to

i'd personally be as happy as a clam if i could get dece quality hd downloads over the intertron. still i have the feeling they'll fuck it up somehow, the same way they've fucked up any other legit digital distribution system.

Exactly, I think the point is not everyone is going to start downloading movies all at once, it will be gradual, and the more people want it, when they start getting HD tellys, when people buy a "media centre" connected to the internet, gradually the infrastructure will grow to support it.

it is gonna be a hueg shift tho - have you heard the stats on bittorent? its like 50% - 75% of all internet traffic. and most people have no idea what it even is.

I thought most blu-rays weren't region coded, though they can be. There's just three regions too, right?

They're trying to drum up traffic while the iron's hot, but:

http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/02/15/hd-dvd-deathwatch-were-making-it-official/

annnnnnnnnnd its all over
http://www.reuters.com/article/technologyNews/idUSL1637974620080216

our long national nightmare is over.

Only slightly bizarre that the announcement was made before Universal or Paramount could have a chance to announce their switch over to Blu-Ray, but still ... ha!

Apparently, some people are still in denial (cf. comments).

Nfinity
@ Feb 15th 2008 4:23PM
The two formats will co-exist.. as there is ZERO reasons not too.. the whole ONE FORMAT is needed is a bunch of bullshit. Simply why:

PS3 and Xbox 360 (I won't even count Wii but that's 3 FORMATS).. all COMPLETELY different technologies, have unique (exclusive games on each). In order for a person to play all those games, they have to buy 2 $300-$400 game consoles. Publishers, took consumer and business sense approach and most of them publish in both formats.

This is a simple reality. Anyone who says this isn't the same as Blu-Ray and HD DVD scenario is obviously supporting lying.

Here simple pointers:

PS3 = Blu-Ray
Xbox 360 = HD DVD

Electronic Arts, Activision, Ubisoft, 2kSports, Sony Games, Microsoft Games = Warner, Universal, Paramount, Fox, Disney, Sony, Weinstein.

Some games are exclusives on Xbox 360 - Some games are exclusives on PS3 = Some movies are exclusive on HD DVD, Some movies are exclusive to Blu-Ray.

PS3 = 3.5 million units in the States
Xbox 360 = 10+ million units in the States

ratio about 3:1

Blu-ray (with PS3) = 3.7 million units in the States
HD DVD (with add-on) = 1+ million in the United States

ratio about 3:1

The difference? PS3 and Xbox 360 are everywhere... Blu-Ray and media says that HD DVD should die?

Completely illogical? I think so.

SO I assumed Blu-ray was the Beta of the '00s but now Toshiba is dropping all of its HD DVDs and Walmart are going to sell Blu-ray exclusively. What the hells? I dont even know what a blue-ray disc looks like.

http://www.hkfilm.net/mkfatal.jpg

A Blu-Ray disc does not look like a little red x.

http://www.tonis-records.de/images/7-Vinyl-CB_A45000_blue.jpg

it looks like a cd

or a single vinyl

about a month ago i decided to call all discs that look like CDs "CDs" but i haven't put it into practice yet

I've seen some of these "HD" downloads and they don't look very good. Similarly, the on demand HD stuff from cable doesn't look nearly as good as HD programs. Going to get a PS3 within the next couple months for sure.

spencer it all depends on who what and where you're getting your HD from.

about a month ago i decided to call all discs that look like CDs "CDs" but i haven't put it into practice yet

I was just thinking the other day about how we call movies on VHS "videos" and movies on DVD "DVDs," even though they're both videos.

LaserDisc FTW!!

spencer it all depends on who what and where you're getting your HD from.

-- s1ocki, Tuesday, February 19, 2008 12:00 PM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

What would be best?

about a month ago i decided to call all discs that look like CDs "CDs" but i haven't put it into practice yet

-- Tracer Hand, Tuesday, February 19, 2008 10:18 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Link

I intermittently do this and it was not a decision, just woeful ignorance generally

What would be best?

-- Spencer Chow, Tuesday, February 19, 2008 8:09 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

a few sites did a side-by-side with apple's new service and apparently while it's not as good as blu-ray it's still pretty competitive.

OPTICAL MEDIA IS DEAD

Tom, so I love 2001. When will I be able to download the highest picture quality and all the extras that are on the BD?

WHAT DO YOU LOOK WITH THEN YR NOSE HUH?

burn

i have a feeling optical media will be around a lot longer than ppl think

I WANT TO DOWNLOAD MOVIES INTO MY FLYING CAR

obviously optical media is not actually dead. I still think blu-ray is this decade's laserdisc

i dig those Laserdisc though

i dunno everyone i know before they have an HD-TV is like "who cares DVD is fine"

after they get an HD TV they are all "OMG Blu Ray i luv uuuuuu"

i only have a regular tv so i'm waiting but that seems to be the pattern

there's definitely no reason to care about this stuff if you have a regular tv.

no offense.

I hope we'll start seeing some better movies coming out on blu-ray now. It's amazing how shit the blu-ray library is, honestly...

http://freakonomics.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/03/04/what-are-the-lessons-of-the-blu-rayhd-dvd-battle-a-freakonomics-quorum/

seriously the quality of what we consider an expert in this country becomes more depressing by the day.

and once again I would like to ask everyone to do whatever they can not to prop up Sony in any way whatsoever as their notorious hatred of consumers and death grip on a vast content library means only good things for whenever they're forced to relent

(this from a guy who bought the james bond ultimate collection (MGM/UA is all sony) but only on regular DVD and only at a steep discount)

LOL @ TOMBOT

:-P

BOOOOO

recommend me something currently on blu ray that will fascinate me.

planet earth ftw

^

Also, Verhoeven's Black Book

also, verhoeven's planet earth

also, planet book

i think the first blu ray disc I will buy will be A Bug's Life, because that was also the first DVD I bought, and it isn't anamorphic and looks like shit.

i kind of want to buy the neil young archives except I'm not that big a fan and can't imagine actually messing with it.

The thing about blu-ray that has brought me the most joy is seeing older films given a spanking hi-def transfer. Plenty of recent films look great on br, but watching stuff that I've only ever seen on tv or crappy old 4:3 VHS can be a true revelation. Specifically: The Thing, Mad Max 2 - The Road Warrior, all the Kubricks, and Black Narcissus.

I got the restored Godfather box set for my birthday. Haven't put it on yet, but I'm hoping it will be the one to finally make blu-ray seem worth the bother.

oh it's amazing, esp if you're used to the shitty dvds

the thing that should most be on blu-ray - "playtime" by jacques tati

it is!

you know what looks insane on blu-ray? Dr. No.

tracer read this

http://somecamerunning.typepad.com/some_came_running/2009/07/the-blu-sweeties.html

obviously optical media is not actually dead. I still think blu-ray is this decade's laserdisc

― El Tomboto, Tuesday, February 19, 2008 9:01 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Laserdiscs were around for almost 2 decades as the best home video format, before DVD came around. So if Bluray is the next laserdisc, you should upgrade immediately, unless you want to wait 20 years for the next format.

Obvious choice but Blade Runner: The Final Cut is one of the best bluray's out there.

they will be streaming HD quality straight to my TV soon enough. I'm with tombot on that. xp

I think they'll cut corners with HD streaming just like cable companies cut corners with their HD channels. Even if your internet connection is good enough to hack it (mine certainly isn't), I don't think a streaming service will be comfortable giving you 1080p streaming at a reasonable price. They'll just cap it at a level they think the consumer is ok with.

s1ocki - holy shit.

ts: dvd vs blu-ray

Can't currently play blu-ray on my laptop.

blu-ray looks better

i own speed racer blu-ray

i do not own a blu-ray device

this is the way i live

i have owned an HDTV for three years. i have never seen an actual HD signal on it (and no, .mkv bluray transcodes don't count).

what do you have hooked up to it?

http://www.gamersover40.com/images/pong_game.jpg

i have a blu-ray player ands till haven't watched a blu ray disc. I did buy 2001 though.

Dear home video advertisers: your unsubtle rearrangement of the wording of all of your ads to read "Now available on Blu-Ray and DVD!" and showing pictures of only Blu-Ray discs is not going to make your 21st Century iteration of the laserdisc any more popular to the people who have spent hundreds or thousands of dollars over the past decade amassing a movie collection in a not-all-that-different-but-perfectly-serviceable format. Retards.

Which is to say that I vote for DVD over Blu-Ray, obvs. Blu-Ray should be treated like a premium format for people who want something a little extra, not like something that is going to necessarily overtake DVDs.

they should be more humble and stop trying to sell their products?

no, what i think they should do is bring BD price down to parity with DVD. then they'll sell them.

Perfectly serviceable? Absolutely. Not all that different? Er . . . the difference between 480p and 1080p is actually really, really significant. If you're not seeing or feeling it, that's cool, but it really is there.

The good thing is that the hardware is all backwards compatible, so when Blu-Ray reaches a certain market penetration (and cheap recorders are available), and manufacturers stop making DVD players and studios stop making DVDs, you'll still be covered.

BD is coming, nothing u can do to stop tht sorry

I just don't understand the public's demand for HD at all. WHY are so many people willing to spend hundreds more just so they can have a slightly clearer picture on the TV?

Exactly. I guarantee most people don't really appreciate it that much from an aesthetic or technical standpoint. It's just some new effing gadget to jizz all over. I can appreciate its existence, I just don't care enough to make the investment in a big switchover.

It's just some new effing gadget to jizz all over.

This jizzing that you speak of drives a whole sector of the consumer market. It's small, yes, and different than the "early adopter," because that consumer may actually have complaints about the product which may be useful to the company producing that product. No, this consumer is the "omnivorous, insatiable adopter." They have too much money to care what they buy, but not enough to know how to value it. If they don't like it, they won't have any insight on it, they'll just buy something else. They're the 20-something kids of rich parents, the nouveau riche who are totally tech-ignorant, and the upper-middle class who are gloriously irresponsible with money. They're not a make-or-break demo, but they do spend a shitload.

The marginal cost of a Blu-Ray player was pretty low if you were in the market for a 5th generation video game console in any case (the PS3 is one of the better players). I have some movies of the Baraka/The Fall class of eyecandy that would undoubtedly benefit, and I can afford it, but won't adopt for a simple reason: at the moment, there are no Blu-Ray players that are also seamless upconverting all-region unlockable DVD players. About a third of my DVD collection are R2, R3, or R4, and I'm not about to clutter my AV stack with another box just to play a handful of movies that would really benefit.

The best thing I've seen for marketing blu-ray is Disney's new approach, doubling up DVD and Blu Ray for the same price. So, the new Snow White release can be purchased in a pack with blu ray discs and a bonus DVD of the film for the same price as just a DVD of the film with some extras. They're doing the same with Up. It's animated movies like that that really interested me (since I have a kid and have to see the things a hundred times and want them to look cool, but also want to be able to send the dvd off with him to grandma who does not have a blu ray player. ok she doesn't have a dvd player right now either for some reason but I did buy her one). If they did this for everything I'd surely buy more stuff on blu ray.

I watched Heat on DVD the other day and the quality was absolutely awful, at least on my laptop screen which is admittedly at a higher resolution than a standard TV

Not to make this a whole big thing, but...do we really need all of this fidelity? Does every representational image have to mirror reality down to the smallest crystal-clear pore on Ryan Reynolds' nose? I was watching some 70s flick on DVD for the first time the other day and was a little bummed at how much character had been scrubbed out by the digital upgrade from grainy film stock. I think there is an extent to which the application of a hi-def sheen is kind of an affront to a filmmaker's original intention.

I know, I know. I sound like a total vinylhead here, maaaaaaan...

Not to make this a whole big thing, but...do we really need all of this fidelity? Does every representational image have to mirror reality down to the smallest crystal-clear pore on Ryan Reynolds' nose? I was watching some 70s flick on DVD for the first time the other day and was a little bummed at how much character had been scrubbed out by the digital upgrade from grainy film stock. I think there is an extent to which the application of a hi-def sheen is kind of an affront to a filmmaker's original intention.

I know, I know. I sound like a total vinylhead here, maaaaaaan...

― I HEART CREEPY MENS (Deric W. Haircare), Sunday, November 1, 2009 6:07 AM (42 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Bluray/HD doesn't "scrub" grainy film stock, it reproduces it. You're just reminiscing on the video noise you had on VHS.

I just don't understand the public's demand for HD at all. WHY are so many people willing to spend hundreds more just so they can have a slightly clearer picture on the TV?

― Mr. Snrub, Sunday, November 1, 2009 2:34 AM (4 hours ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

Because it's not slightly clearer, it's much clearer, sharper, more detailed etc.

500 lines of resolution vs. 1080.

This is like saying you don't see the difference between 16mm and 35mm.

I think there is an extent to which the application of a hi-def sheen is kind of an affront to a filmmaker's original intention.

I kinda feel if this is your attitude then you might as well just buy a projector and rent a theater or something, because viewing a film in any setting less than a darkened theater with a 10 foot high screen is probably not going to cut it. FWIW I'll take a hi-def polished transfer over a VHS pan and scan any day.

it's not a SHEEN that gets put over the film, its a more faithful reproduction of the film itself! its not like filmmakers are making movies on VHS or something.

why would you be OPPOSED to movies looking better??

>at the moment, there are no Blu-Ray players that are also seamless upconverting all-region unlockable DVD players.

My Sony BDP-S350 does exactly this, although I'm not sure what you mean by seamless. It upscales very respectably, and there's a hack for multi-region DVD playback. I *do* find the current scarcity of multi-region Blu-Ray players frustrating (Momitsu aside), but this will doubtless change with time.

and slocki otm - a well-mastered blu-ray is light years closer to watching a film as the director intended than VHS or dvd can manage. I already stanned this upthread, but my greatest enjoyment from BR has been seeing older films in high-definition, after years of only knowing them from tv or vhs.

xxxpost

Yes, HD only goes part of the way to recreating what's recorded on the film. I think you'd need a player with about 6000 lines to replicate what's on film.

This is why I invested in BD. The 1080 lines of information made me realize this is what Kubrick wanted 2001 to approximate. I threw some letterbox DVDs on and was surprised at how undetailed they look in comparison. DVD being 480 pixels high + a lot of those being lost on TV with the black bars = some LOL youtube resolution

I agree the Disney DVD+Blu-ray for the same price packaging is the way to go, and if all studios did that I think consumers (or at least I) wouldn't get the feeling they're being bled as they're pushed to yet another overpriced but built to expire format.

That said, does anyone have a real idea how well Blu-ray is doing? There's so much sketchy obfuscation out there, beginning with the utterly ridiculous notion that everyone who buys the PS3 is somehow a Blu-ray supporter and a notch in the format's favor. If I knew it was truly gaining market share I'd take Blu-ray more seriously as something other than a video-phile niche.

I think it's actually doing pretty well. DVD's not going to die anytime soon, but Blu-Ray is still growing somewhat rapidly.

The Digital Entertainment Group released 3rd quarter sales for BDs were up 66% for 3rd qtr 2009 compared to 3rd qtr of 2008, and 83% Year-to-date. It was 12% of all new theatrical home video releases. I have no idea who the DEG is but if these are accurate I think it's at the point where it really takes off in 1-2 years.

Like Josh said, I don't think PS3 or player unit sales should determine the technology's path, but I think actual movie sales might be a better number. Since Blu-Ray players can be had for as little as $100 now, I think by the end of next year we'll be at the point where it's kind of pointless to NOT buy a Blu-Ray player over anything else. We'll see if that translates over to movie sales.

The price of the media needs to come down too. If you're halfway respectable and intelligent you're buying new releases for $15-$20 off Amazon, which is what DVD prices were like a year go (and still are, for newer discs), but if you go to Best Buy or Wal-Mart you'll see some mediocre new releases for $35 or more. Ugh.

I don't know if it represents a peek at what is to come, but this week Best Buy is having their first pretty huge sale on Blu-Rays. Their flier this weekend showed pricing for Blu-Rays in different pricing groups of $10,$15, and $20. Rather crap selection from what I was able to tell, but is this the start of more reasonable prices?

Online pricing for blu-ray is starting to live in the real world, I'd agree, but most physical retailers in the UK seem content to let stuff fester on the racks at absurd prices like £27.99. The only way to get any value is in two-for-ones etc, which are starting to creep in at places like HMV, and hopefully will be even better in the run up to Christmas and the sales afterwards.

For those already in the blu-ray camp you may already be aware of the excellent site DVDBeaver, which has a huge archive of reviews for sd and hd disks and does extensive comparisons between the sd and blu-ray versions of films with very useful screenshots. Their main focus is on picture and sound quality, and if you're unsure over whether it's worth upgrading an old favourite from sd you'll generally find an answer:

http://www.dvdbeaver.com/

I love DVDBeaver, but my understanding is that their image comparisons are suspect and inconsistent.

Also, per the Best Buy sale, I think Best Buy is officially in the process of phasing out all/most home video, or significantly limiting it. In terms of market share, it's Netflix that's leading the way, and I presume Netflix and video on demand will damper sales of whatever in the near future. Which leaves DVD fading and Blu-ray in stasis, before it has a chance to take over and fade away, too.

Netflix and video on demand will damper dominate sales of whatever

A lot of this returns to death of physical media discussions. The bottom line for me is that until there's the infrastructure, ease of use and crucially bandwidth to support the same quality of sound and picture as I get on blu-ray ie. 1080p video and uncompressed audio, *on demand* then I'll keep buying disks, or renting them through Lovefilm (uk netflix style disks in the mail service). Realistically, this is going to be at least 5 years off over here and assumes big progress being made in the telecom infrastructure.

With that said, even when dvd and blu-ray are totally defunct, I'll still have a stack of films on disk that I can watch whenever I want to. Doubtless will have a 3D tv by then and will be discussing the merits of 8000p resolution...

why are cds/dvds/blu-rays SO expensive in the uk/europe anyway? they're so cheap to manufacture... you can buy a spindle of 50 cd-rs over here for like $20... i just don't understand it.

I don't know about SO expensive - shopping online I'll very rarely pay more than £12/$20 for a blu-ray, generally I'll keep an eye on Amazon or Play.com and buy in their sales which make them more like £8/$13 or so. Most CDs on Amazon are between £5 and £8 ($8/$13). Is that way off the beam of US prices?

hm

Dag, this Variety story makes it seem as if the industry is banking on Blu-ray breaking through in 2012:

http://www.variety.com/article/VR1118010838.html?categoryid=13&cs=1

2012? Two years of digital evolution from now? Really? By then they'll be beaming HD content straight into our brains.

maybe they mean the MOVIE 2012

I'd watch more blu ray if netflix charged less to rent them.

yeah i've been pretty disappointed with Netflix instant "HD" streaming through Xbox Live...to me, it usually looks worst than DVD, and not even in the same neighborhood as Blu-ray

I'm amazed BD players haven't fallen in price more quickly. It didn't take long before sub £50 DVD players appeared on the market, yet it's a struggle to find anything much cheaper than about £130. Until players become much cheaper Blu-ray will remain a niche market. Other thing is the leap in quality between DVD and Blu-ray, especially if you have an upscaling player isn't as significant as the improvement between DVD and VHS.

It didn't take long before sub £50 DVD players appeared on the market

I'm not sure about that. DVD was launched in, what, 1997? I bought a Sony (OK, it was a Sony but it was an entry-level model and it was on offer at Richer Sounds) in late 2002 and it was about £130. The no-brand supermarket players seems to arrive about a year later. For there to be Blu-ray players on sale in Asda for £50 the format itself needs to be massively more popular. (And it's doing badly in Europe and I know only too well - I work in the industry and we're hanging on to our jobs).

It's the industry's own doing. Blu-ray players were/are priced so high because the patent holders are, erm, holding tight to those patents. Proprietary greed, etc.

yeah i've been pretty disappointed with Netflix instant "HD" streaming through Xbox Live...to me, it usually looks worst than DVD, and not even in the same neighborhood as Blu-ray

This is a bitrate problem -- Blu-Rays have a bitrate of about 40mbps, while streaming HD is usually less than 20mbps. See http://blogs.zdnet.com/Ou/?p=962&tag=rbxccnbzd1 for more on that.

BTW, if you live in the US and want a good Blu-Ray player, you can get a Sony at lol Wal-Mart this weekend for $148: http://gizmodo.com/5397060/walmart-selling-200-xbox-360-this-weekend-with-free-100-gift-card

whoa. that's tempting. is there a catch? is that a decent player?

here's the irony, which of course the electronics industry is banking on: once i buy a blu-ray player, i need to justify it by getting an HDTV. and once i buy that, i need an appropriately fancy sound system. etc. etc. so what i think is a bargain will probably end up costing me $$.

It's a very good player -- Sony is the inventor of Blu-Ray so their players tend to have very good functionality, load times, etc. Amazon reviewers give it 4 stars avg.

It's the industry's own doing. Blu-ray players were/are priced so high because the patent holders are, erm, holding tight to those patents. Proprietary greed, etc.

― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, November 4, 2009 6:27 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

also the whole format fiasco that this thread was created to address!!

Also, you sort of need a 1080p ready TV to get the most out of the format, no? Just a big clusterfuck all around, I'd say. I can't imagine a worse roll-out of a new technology. It all felt/feels so ... premature.

where in the world will i be able to buy a 1080p tv?? hmmmm

Some of us have HD TVs already that aren't 1080p, and aren't inclined to upgrade the TV just to get the most from the video, which seems sort of backwards. This shit isn't impulsive "let's buy a new TV!" cheap, either, which is of course why the economy is stalled. I should buy a new TV and Blu-ray player ... for my country! If they were smart, they'd market the format in the U.S. as patriotic.

I don't care how much better an disc format is, I hate having around all those discs. I use netflix, download, and stream media. I can't really see myself buying any type of dvd ever again.

Josh i think blu-ray's still gonna look pretty sweet on a 720p

i just realized i've turned into the devil sitting on your shoulder

If they were smart, they'd market the format in the U.S. as patriotic.

Red, White, and Blu-Ray?

2012? Two years of digital evolution from now? Really? By then they'll be beaming HD content straight into our brains.

― Josh in Chicago, Wednesday, 4 November 2009 19:53 (Yesterday) Permalink

Cable companies and satellite don't even have the bandwidth for multiple HD channels that are in 720, so they downgrade the signal on as many channels as they can get away with. Even FIOS, the only service I know of that delivers full 1080p on multiple channels without nasty compression, has a limited number of channels compared to the other services. And all the internet streaming sites don't want to have to shell out true HD. Hell, youtube is losing millions a month on hosting fees for shitty hypercompressed mpgs as it is.

So just how are people going to be able to stream 1080p movies in the near future? If they have no internet service and the copper cable is solely devoted to streaming one movie at a time, maybe that will work...

So what we're saying here is that HD online and on satellite TV is essentially a lie, because even if there are 1080 lines, they're shitty compressed lines?

I have a 26" full-HD compatible television with a very good DVD player; there's no reason whatsoever for me to shell out for BlueRay.

So what we're saying here is that HD online and on satellite TV is essentially a lie, because even if there are 1080 lines, they're shitty compressed lines?

I have a 26" full-HD compatible television with a very good DVD player; there's no reason whatsoever for me to shell out for BlueRay.

― exploding angel vagina (Scik Mouthy), Thursday, November 5, 2009 7:54 AM (19 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

I've found that on cable, they'll usually give you 2 or 3 really good channels, like ESPNHD. They look pretty much HD to me. But they'll compress other channels, so you'll get pixellation. Which defeats the purpose, obviously.

Once I got an HDTV, it really revealed the limitations of DVD. To each his/her own; I know there were people who never really saw a difference in video quality between VHS and DVD (they just liked having movies on a disc instead of a giant tape).

btw, a fun story I've heard is that cable companies are actually paying stations to not broadcast in full 1080p, because then people might notice that they're getting a better signal on FIOS.

>I know there were people who never really saw a difference in video quality between VHS and DVD (they just liked having movies on a disc instead of a giant tape).

a friend of mine resisted buying a dvd player until 2007, her reason being that she treasured her VHS tapes and liked "to hear them wind" in the machine...

I can see the point of HD if you've got a 32inch TV or larger; I just don't really like enormous TVs.

I was at a presentation about a year ago on the future of TV in a streaming context and one guy was talking about what comes after HD, which is when you project onto a full wall and can sit 2 feet away from it and see every detail. Why would you want to?!

Of course, this all handily ignores the fact that not all Blu-ray transfers are created equal. Sure, Pixar is aces, but there are lots of shoddy Blu-ray transfers about. Getting better, I admit, or at least more consistent, but Blu-ray does not always equal top quality. My biggest fear, to be honest, is that the unctuous push toward Blu-ray wil mean less work on DVD transfers in order to win hearts and minds for Blu-ray. We'll see, I guess.

Total coincidence, but my friend just invited me over to check out his new Blu-ray player and A/B a few discs (he kept his DVD player connected to watch .avi files). We watched a few Pixar shorts, and he showed me the level of detail Blu-ray achieves. Even he admitted it was sort of minor but still noticeable if you look for it. We then compared the Blu-ray of "The Shining" to the DVD, and it's largely the same, with some real minor differences on the Blu-ray - glimmer around the eyes, that sort of thing (which was also the biggest dif. between the DVD and Blu-ray of "Blade Runner"). "Spinal Tap," obv., was not some reference quality transfer, but "Pinocchio" looked good. Again, not significantly better than the new DVD transfer, but the difference was there if you looked for it.

In the end, he conceded it was mostly a new toy. I wasn't exactly blown away myself, though if they found a way to integrate the technology better with the special features, at least as more than just a weak promotional vehicle, the format might be more enticing. I know Neil Young fans are feeling hosed over the dearth of downloadable content to the Blu-ray Archives set, for one.

>We then compared the Blu-ray of "The Shining" to the DVD, and it's largely the same, with some real minor differences on the Blu-ray - glimmer around the eyes, that sort of thing (which was also the biggest dif. between the DVD and Blu-ray of "Blade Runner")

Wow, this genuinely surprises me, because I've got blu-ray and dvd of both those and the difference (to my eyes) is immense, not just in terms of sharpness and resolution but also in colour depth, contrast, lack of visible artifacts etc.

I guess it really is horses for courses though, and if the benefits aren't visible there certainly is no point "upgrading" - you'll save some $$$ for sure.

How big is his TV Josh? My impression is that you need a pretty big one to see a real noticeable difference.

Big TV and proper HDMI cabling is urgent and key otherwise yeah, no point bothering.

Do Blu-ray players actually have composite outs?? That would be lolsome

They sure do. I've a friend who complained that they were unimpressed by the picture from their PS3, had it hooked up to the HD TV by a scart cable...

Wow, this genuinely surprises me, because I've got blu-ray and dvd of both those and the difference (to my eyes) is immense, not just in terms of sharpness and resolution but also in colour depth, contrast, lack of visible artifacts etc.

^^^ this, in fact for all the Kubrick stuff. Blu-Rays of "2001" and "Full Metal Jacket" are really, really amazing compared to the DVDs. (Which were, in all fairness, pretty damned well-mastered themselves.) The barracks scenes in FMJ just pop in a way that the DVD never did for me with the increased contrast.

Hmm, well, maybe I misworded it. The difference was apparent, to my eyes, but not significant. Like, hardly a deal breaker, superior but not to the extent that the DVD looked outright inferior.

I think his TV is 42", which is pretty much the cusp, isn't it, for amplifying the superiority of the Blu-ray. Though it wouldn't surprise me if he, like 99% of people, had it connected/calibrated improperly. I haven't seen an HD store display yet that wasn't calibrated improperly, to some extent. And like stereos, in the end - different eyes, different light, different combos of media ... beyond reference quality Pixar stuff, there are lots of variables in play.

remarks about hd cable otm: when you start getting used to 720p/1080i being piped in on hundreds of channels all day every day, going back to regular DVD, you realize the huge difference.

just do not get suckered into paying like $50 for a premium hdmi cable... they are all created equal. buy one for $5 on ebay.

and also ya you do NOT need 1080p to see the benefits, 720p/1080i still looks worlds better too.

ALSO if you want to really see what blu-ray can do i still recommend "planet earth." or "dr. no." i was watching north x nw last night and it looked pretty phenoms too.

and UP looked INSANELY great. don't forget it's not just the resolution, it's the color space as well.

i watched a Blu-Ray rip t.o.r.r.e.n.t. of Up the other night on my 26" 720p TV and the picture was just DINGGGGGG like a fucking diamond - sick

so like a full-res rip? yeah, i watched a 1080p rip of children of men that looked amazing. obviously a bit compressed but still wowzer.

i dunno, i guess so! of course i haven't seen the normal DVD - it's probably pretty nice too

yeah i remember how good the upconverted incredibles DVD looked on my hdtv. they really know how to encode their shit at pixar. doesn't hurt that they skip the telecine step either.

josh,

frankly - and i have access to like a shitload of really expensive TVS at work all the time....i don't think there is a marked difference between 720p and 1080p if the TV is smaller than about 46 inches...

say if you have a 32 or 36 i really don't think you will notice that much of a difference.

in fact you might be able to get a pretty sweet deal right now on, say, a 36 inch 720p Sony or something since ppl are so uptight about 1080p and getting the "best" resolution...

at 46 or especially over 50 inches, you will see some differences between 1080p and 720p....but either way 720p is always preferable to 1080i.

So is this blu-ray thing here to stay? My previous DVD/home cinema thing died and I've gone for a better one - with a Blu-Ray player. Got myself BBC's Planet Earth and Life series for showing off the spex, the Ice Age and Mummy trilogies for the mindless enjoyment and ordered a couple of the favourites so check for differences (the thirtheenth floor, dark city, the cure's trilogy), but I'm now a but uncertain about where to go now.

This obviously isn't the new DVD format (I mean, Bad Santa on Blu-Ray? Why?) - there's some kind of upscaling going on so the better DVDs look pretty great (Nine Inch Nails' Besides You In Time looks fantastic) and their surround is also quite fabulous sometimes, but still: is Blu-Ray the 320 kbps of physical media?

to check for differences <- typo

http://www.tvshowsondvd.net/graphics/news3/MadMen-S1_Bluray.jpg
http://www.criterion.com/library/bluray

Wow! Thanks for the link!

Unfortunately:

26. Are Criterion’s Blu-ray discs region-encoded?
Yes. Criterion is licensed to sell most of its editions only in North America.

that's a bummer :(

It does mean there's a HD version ready, waiting to be picked up by a European distributor, though.

ROFL @ the oh-no-you-don't vote here (scroll down to see the customer review scores).

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000X9FLKM/ref=s9_al_bw_ir01

Also, a message to whoever decided that some (all?) Blu-Rays shouldn't remember any settings or resume where you stopped watching: way to fuck up your shiny new format, idiots.

I think this comes down to if the disc is mastered to use the Java BD functionality ie. if it is, then Resume will not be possible. I've got about 60 or so blu-ray discs and only a handful allow a dvd style Resume. Something you can try, Stan, is setting a bookmark before you stop playback - if you press the green button on yr remote it will do this (again if the function is implemented on that disc!).

I think most of the disney / pixar stuff is mastered tht way

anyway just got a PS3 and I think I'm gonna crack my BD virginity with... MOON

http://i39.tinypic.com/2uiar6d.png

HD-DVD iirc

should have to reach into gloop-filled egg to retrieve the box imo

when when when ?

ha, ste you wouldn't buy that would you?!

HA well no not really, but surely they'll release a normal box too. or is this all a big TEASE ?

should have to reach into gloop-filled egg to retrieve the box imo

Should shoot out on a spring and hit you in the face tbh.

should insert itself into your torso and spring out from your chest in a gruesome and bloody fashion, killing you, imo

they're saying apple might start putting blu-ray in macs as early as this season.
― s1ocki, Saturday, January 5, 2008 10:59 PM (2 years ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

just fucking put the drives in already apple you dicks, we get it you love itunes but itunes is shit

Bad Lieutenant: Port of Call New Orleans is, surprisingly, a gorgeous Blu Ray showpiece.

ROFL @ the oh-no-you-don't vote here (scroll down to see the customer review scores).

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000X9FLKM/ref=s9_al_bw_ir01

― StanM, Sunday, March 14, 2010 3:51 PM (1 month ago) Bookmark

lol @ 90% of reviewers giving a most beloved movie trilogy 1 star

3,201 Reviews
5 star: (201)
4 star: (30)
3 star: (42)
2 star: (42)
1 star: (2,886)

tht whole fiasco is disgusting

Looks like they're just giving it low ratings because they're the theatrical versions and not the extended cuts that'll inevitably get their own BR release. I can understand the hate, this is a blatant cash-in, you know they've must have the masters ready since they made the extended cuts for DVD years ago.

lower quality than the HDTV broadcast from a few years ago too

wtf wtf

planet earth BD set doesn't contain the planet earth diaries from the terrestrial broadcasts

wtf

stop feeding the system, man

http://www.thehdroom.com/images/bluray/large/5604.jpg

it looks so good tho, so so good
xp

fffffffffffffffff 2001 is ridiculous looking

planet earth BD set doesn't contain the planet earth diaries from the terrestrial broadcasts

They weren't filmed in HD, so perhaps they were held back from what was BBC/2Ent3rta1n's flagship BD release at the time. I can definitely remember doing standard-def (480i or 576i) "making of" subs for one natural history show though (they were just bundled as extras rather than running immediately after the 50min feature). I guess it wasn't this one.

Life is high-def all the way (the Disc0v3ry edition with Oprah W commentary has the Attenborough "On Location" sections as extras; it has an 11th Oprah v/o "Making Of" episode too).

are there some blu-ray players that are considered to be the best and most reliable? tbh i've looked online and certain sites contradict each other and editor and user reviews contradict each other so i'm not sure where to start.

I seriously suggest just getting a PS3. You can use it to watch Netflix Watch Instantly; you can use it as a media center ...

^^^happy with mine

is it worth it even if i don't play video games in your opinion?

If you don't want to *ever* play video games then maybe not, but the Netflix-ability is really something I could never live without.

when i got mine it was £250 for a blu-ray player or £250 for a ps3, it seemed too good value to pass up

bd players need updates all the time and the ps3 has better connectivity options (ie wireless) than yr average player, you can get a remote for it and everything

some of the new Blu rays have Netflix apps built in, but yeah if you even think you *might* play some games Ps3 seems the way to go

And you can stream directly to it from your computer

just got a panasonic DMP-BD85K, pretty happy with it. does netflix/youtube, also plays divx and avi files from a jump drive, including ones with subtitles. you can get one for < $200.

most serious gearheads would recommend an oppo but you will pay for it.

also the panny can connect to the inet via wireless or cat5 cable

also does firmware updates over the web too

Where do people currently stand on this issue?

wait what

Where

do people currently stand on this issue?

are you asking where ppl stand on blu-ray vs hd-dvd? cuz the credits rolled on that one, man

I'm going to wait for a while until one format clearly takes off and the prices start to come down.

this is like yr driest humor ever

>is it worth it even if i don't play video games in your opinion?

These days, probably not - a new PS3 is still going to cost the best part of $300/£280. Latest gen standalone blu-ray players (as Edward says) will offer most or all of thesame playback/streaming/network functionality and are getting cheaper all the time. I got an LG player earlier this year for just over £100, but even in UK supermarkets you can get players for about £80 now (and sometimes much less on last gen models). Another benefit of a standalone player for me is it's quieter and fits in my AV stand better.

Regarding reliability, my LG replaced a Sony that broke after just over a year (and cost twice as much). Hoping to get more use out of this, but will have to wait and see. From what I've read the blu laser assembly elements are a *lot* more failure prone than good old DVD(fwiw, it seems that PS3s are just as susceptible to this type of problem).

eureka has just started doing blu-only releases

guess it's time

xpost: not arguing with your recommendations, but my PS3 is silent as far as i can tell.

i ended up with a PS3 and it looks great and seems vv quiet.

Yeah, I've never noticed a noise issue with my PS3.

lol omar is a gamer now

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/e/e1/Sega_gamegear.jpg

Reviving again to note Omar's question above from the last revive -- I realize it hasn't even been a full year yet, but any general change in recommendations about kind of player? Signed, Not a Gamer.

definitely getting a blu ray playa for Christmas:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oEZa3dekjxs

Ned, we have a PS3 and dont really game much at all..Mr Veg does most gaming on PC. but it's a great DVD/bluray player and through wifi it's a good media server for torrents etc. We backup music to a nas drive & can play all that through PS3 too. I love it, because it's not a unitasker.
And firmware updates arent a problem with wifi hookup, it's automatic on startup.

They are $$$ I know, but definitely a good workhorse for the pricetag. Lots of bang for your buck.

So I could get one of the 160 GB slim bundles as noted above and be good, essentially. Then a key question --does this thing handle all DVD regions as well? (Keep in mind I've already got a fairly extensive DVD library from all over the place.)

sadly no, not that I've found....I have a cheap DVD player that I region-code hacked to for those. No region code hack for PS3 that I've found.

Yeah, that could clinch it for me in terms of sticking with a standalone model, then; I don't have oodles of non-R1/all-region discs but I do have a chunk and I'd like to be able to watch them, obv. -- I use a Mac at home so AppleTV was going to take care of various streaming media needs on that front when it comes to my music etc.

i can't believe i've never seen showgirls. so am i going to have to get a blu-ray player or what? can't i stick with dvd?

About your first statement! (Yes, why HAVEN'T you seen that?) Is the DVD version out of print or something?

lol i rly don't know. i finally just watched "Cruel Intentions"

Got a blu-ray player this week along with "The Searchers" and "2001". They're both stunning. Crazy.

Good stuff :) I remember the first time I watched 2001 on blu I was blown away. If you can stand to double-dip on one film, then the Kubrick blu-ray box set is a real treat and thoroughly recommended.

So how long does Blu-ray have left to 'happen' before the next format wars comes along?

Bluray almost certainly the last optical media. Ultra HD is being trialled though it will most likely be as a streaming service which will need superfast broadband which will probably take 3-8 years to deliver.

HD-DVD ftw.

we're still not even close to streaming Blu-Ray quality, are we? when you stream "HD" from Netflix or whatever, i assume you're not transferring anywhere near the ~40 gigs of a typical BD.

xpost

Yeah, still a way off. tbf, HD video compression has come on a long way since the BR standards were set, but the thing that HD streaming cannot manage (currently at least) is uncompressed audio. Even my (UK) cable tv providers HD channels are still "only" Dolby Digital audio. I got a new AV receiver a while back which can handle DTS-HD Master Audio etc and this brings almost as much joy as HD video for me.

pixar films in blu ray are something to behold

^^^

Showing my wife Finding Nemo on Blu-Ray was how I convinced her we needed the PS3.

I just read that on the Bluray of The Apartment you can see the face powder and eyeliner on Jack Lemmon and Fred MacMurray. Exceeding the technological limits of the ers in which the work was produced has its drawbacks.

(ie, I don't want a Bluray player)

Back in the day you'd never have seen that detail on the big screen, what with all the cigarette smoke in the theatre, everyone blurry eyed through being stoked up on whisky and gin since breakfast.

Misread this as "Showing my wife Finding Nemo on Blu-Ray was how I conceived her" etc etc

I think the (kinda jarring at first) details one picks up on like makeup, wrinkles, obviousness of studio sets vs. location shots in a sequence, etc. become less distracting the more you watch. Also, if the film is just plain engaging these things do fade into the b-ground. Some of my SD DVD's upres'd thru my new blu setup look great as well, esp. Criterion stuff (later Melville, b+w Renoir).

However all the stuff I burned from 700 mb avi's originating off some c. 1983 vHS - many of my favorite films like hard to find Rivette/Tourneur/etc. - looks like blobby shit.

anyone seen any good Blu Rays lately?

Do you mean films that are good in themselves, or stuff that shows off the blu medium as well? If the latter then Hugo looks fabulous, as do Melancholia and the Tron set with old and new; Tron Legacy in particular is stunning. Don't know if you're multi-region equipped for blu, but the Criterion BBS Story boxset is *fantastic* and seeing stuff like Head and Easy Rider in glorious grain-heavy HD, with uncompressed audio is a total treat too.

Peeping Tom looks amazing on Blu-ray. Along with Alien, that's the one that has really stood out for me.

Road Warrior bluray is pretty a+

The Star Trek reboot looks amazing on blu-ray.

otm

Yeah, Alien is one I saw recently that was most O_O. Beautiful.

Some recent purchases that look great: "Mysteries Of Lisbon", "Ronin", "Kuroneko", "Seven Samurai", "Excalibur".

There is a simply AMAZING slapfight going on at Jeff Wells's "Hollywood Elsewhere" over the upcoming Criterion Rosemary's Baby blu-ray disc and the proper aspect ratio for the film: http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2012/07/criterion_cleav.php (It's being mostly propagated by Glenn Kenny.)

(Note: Wells has not called anyone "fat" yet, but "fascist" has been busted out nearly a dozen times.)

Yeah that whole thing is v entertaining!

I'm purple-faced with rage. I've got stomach acid. I'm spitting saliva on the rug.

lol jesus

Who cares? It's not 48 fps so it'll suck.

I liked when Wells got in a tizzy over the Anatomy of A Murder edition and how someone at Criterion dug up a photo taken from the audience perspective at the film's original premiere that proved they were using the correct A.R. and uploaded it to Facebook.

Wells admits he was misinformed, talks about steak, harasses a widow

Oddly enough, the actual ratio was 1:1

all the reality shows out there and THIS isn't televised

priorities

haha, was Wells called a fascist by Polanski?

http://hollywood-elsewhere.com/2012/07/letter_to_polan.php

Recommendations for a long-lasting, low-end BR player?

Still not decided on this

How low-end, Morbs? A $100 Sony BR player should last pretty much forever.

Yeah, that LG I ref'd upthread (purchased early 2010) is still going strong. If you go too no-brand and cheap it'll probably have a lousy UI and disc mechanism (= noisy). $100 will get you a fast, reliable player that's nice to use.

Seriously guys, do I go with BR or HD-DVD? I wanna know

I got a Samsung for around $80....

And so you can all have a laugh, it never occurred to me that this wouldn't work with my hardy tube TV. So now I need to get a flatscreen, and fuck this world.

Or perhaps there is a way to do it, at least with some models.

My wife and I have an older flatscreen we might be getting rid of, but it doesn't have an internal tuner - you have to have a cable/satellite hookup to watch TV, you just can't get over-the-air channels. But it's great for BRs and DVDs.(It's 720p resolution.) If you can hang tight I'll see for sure if she's OK with getting rid of it, if you want it. I'd rather give it to someone that can use it than just throw it away.

I watch Blu-Rays, via my PS3, on a non-HD, non-flatscreen TV - this is in the UK, obv.

I recently asked a local dealer about multi-region bluray players, and was told that because of the online link/upgrades on bluray discs, multiregion bluray players can only play non-home-region dvds, not blurays - can this be true? there are def region 1 only blus that I wld to watch/own at some point.

There *are* true multiregion blu-ray players, mostly from the company Oppo, but they're expensive (still several hundred quid at least).

There's very few that support changing the blu-ray region via the remote control (unlike dvd, which lots will do), but I recently upgraded my no-brand multiregion unit to a Toshiba BDX3200. This is an "old" model and I had to get it from eBay, but with a firmware tweak it will play any region of dvd AND br disc.

The online link/upgrades thing is not a red-herring though as I can imagine that if the player downloaded and installed new firmware it might lose the multi-region functionality. Simple solution is that I don't have it connected to the internet.

Thanks Bill, v. helpful

thx PD, but I think this will be resolved shortly one way or another. Also, I have to watch something and write about it by Sunday.

"Pristine images," feh.

one CAN buy a converter from HD for a tube TV, but that's $70-75, so kinda pointless.

The idea of watching a BR on a tube tv is very strange.

yeah, i wish i could turn back time and never commit to one.

what have you against televisions that were made in this century?

found mention of this on the criterion boards --

http://www.searsoutlet.com/Blu-ray-Player-SR212S/d/product_details.jsp?md=ct_md&pid=105725&mode=buyUsedOnly

all-region blu-ray player for $50; found one at my nearby sears. havent set it up yet & tried the code, etc but assuming all goes smoothly there'll be a whole new world of movies to acquire and aggregate in stacks and put off watching!

http://www.theverge.com/2014/5/1/5670786/sony-earnings-adjustment-impairment-charges

I'm getting leery about buying blu-rays because i know i'll have to upgrade everything again when the 4k/8k TVs become a thing.

Kinda of a random question here but: recently got a basic Samsung SE-506 ODD for my MacMini, partially because I just needed a new one, but also because it handles Blu-Ray. Now I know Mac and Blu-Ray aren't always happy with each other but I figured what the heck, especially since I am between TVs for the present. Anyway, the drive works perfectly with CDs and DVDs just fine, so clearly the Mac recognizes it -- I'm running El Capitan as well FWIW. However, it's not recognizing any Blu-Rays, and I did download a trial version of this as a test:

http://www.macblurayplayer.com/features.htm

As you can see from this:

http://www.macblurayplayer.com/how-to-play-bluray-on-mac-os-x-10-11-el-capitan.htm

The program is supposed to recognize a disc via step 3b, for instance, and recognizes a DVD as mentioned. But again, no BD disc appears either in the program menu or on the desktop. So is it simply best to assume that while SE-506 handles other discs just fine, it's just not recognizing Blu Rays at all and is simply defective? Answers on a postcard etc (and thanks in advance!).

Can't believe it's been 10 years since this format war. Difference between DVD and Blu-Ray/HD-DVD was so minor compared to VHS vs. DVD. HDTV's and players/Xboxes/Playstations were super expensive so until very recently, I'd never had a decent sized HDTV and a Blu-Ray player. Sorta going nuts with the compulsive buying. Fuck Barnes & Noble and their amazing 50% off Criterion sale.

My Panasonic bluray player started getting jittery when playing discs after just three weeks. Does it need an update? Surely a bluray player shouldn't need updates just to play discs?

I don't know the specifics, but I believe part of the blu-ray system runs on Java, and I remember instances where players had to be firmware updated to play certain discs (Avatar, among others)

but the issue you're describing sounds more like perhaps a faulty unit that should be returned for repair/switch?