"I don't even own a TV"

the second

totally the second

i mean, there are televisions in this house, but i barely then them on, so that's where i'm at.

"...or avatar of cultural snobbery or whatever are more annoying" (sorry, cut off)

for what it's worth i do watch video, just over the internet

It all depends on the person. Some people just don't own a tv or watch any tv because they don't care. Other people pride themselves on that fact—yes, they are real—and it's those people who deserve scorn.

seems more like it tbh

Out of those two choices, the first. However, more and more people don't watch TV on an actual TV, so if there was an "I don't even watch TV" option, I'd pick that one.

I wonder whatever it is that you "take pride in" and how I can pour coruscating scorn on it.

It's cool, I don't like you guys either.

Is it wrong to automatically assume that people who don't own/watch tvs have more fulfulling lives than tv watchers? Or is that a stereotype? Do these people just spend the same amount of time reading trashy novels, or are they out working in soup kitchens and tending to community gardens?

I also wonder how much of this supposed "pride" is entirely projection on the part of a listener who feels weird or conflicted about their own consumption of media.

I don't care who has a tv or not, I only care about the people who brag about not owning one and wanting "bad ass mo'fo" tattooed on their forehead for it.

sadly there's no option for that, so I'm writing in "Minnesota".

...and projects their own ~guilt~ about what they feel they "ought" to be doing instead of watching television onto people who simply don't.

I don't care who has a tv or not, I only care about the people who brag about not owning one

Exactly

oh is this one of these questions that only has one real 'right' answer and anybody who answers #2 gets dogpiled?

xpost

...and projects their own ~guilt~ about what they feel they "ought" to be doing instead of watching television onto people who simply don't.

Sometimes this happens, but other times people are actually huge snobs. I know this is hard to believe.

In its favor, the "i don't even own a TV" remark is one of the shortest annoying things people can say. It generally doesn't branch out into a longer unwanted conversation.

Where does the "brag" in this sentence come from?

People who insist that others are "snobs", I mean I know where I locate the snobbery in this equation.

I can't remember the last time I went to someone's tv-less house and said "holmes you best get a tv in this motherbitch or you ain't gonna see my fine ass ever again" and then did doughnuts on their lawn and left

feel like there must be a more up-to-date version of this. Maybe "I don't use Facebook"?

so in other words you already had an axe to grind and you used a poll as an excuse to bring it up?

cool xxpost

I think this debate is a relic of a bygone age, really. Not a TV doesn't mean much in this day and age, especially if you own a computer.

Nothing wrong with not owning a TV, or not telling people about it. Also in decline, I think, is the sort of smug ostentatious flourish that's meant to make people think you spend the rest of your time scoring operas or translating Proust.

More annoying that both is the sort of person who wants to show off how *discerning* they are in their TV-watching, which is kind of the equivalent of bragging about how you don't listen to pop music.

Isn't that why you start a poll like this, like, always? xp

"I don't get what the hype is around Breaking Bad, maaaaaaannnn...."

xpost polls, that's where I'm a viking

i own a tv, i use it as a 2nd computer monitor

I'm surprised that a trapdoor didn't open up underneath me after I clicked on the first option.

"Actually, we're having goose this year"

It's probably the "actually" that's indicative of smugness and unwarranted pride.

Haha I'm the I don't &c guy kinda, I haven't owned a tv for the best part of a decade and all but gave up watching it because of books (hola aimless) cinema beer and the fact I have to work, I like tv tho & would watch it more if I could.

Snobs who boast about not watching TV are definitely a thing but good for you if you've never come across one. I feel no guilt about watching TV because I'm a typical Guardian-reading HBO/Danish import-watching asshole.

It never fails to amaze me, the things that people will get incredibly judgmental about, and then justify their behaviour by claiming "OH BUT THOSE PEOPLE I'M JUDGING ARE SO SNOBBY AND JUDGEMENTAL". This isn't about anything except projection.

I like tv. I watch a lot of it, but not as much as I once did, and I could probably be just fine watching even less than I currently do. It doesn't make me feel lowbrow and boring, and it's pretty easy to tune out the constant advertising and flip through channels if you don't like what's on.

I guess I'm just curious how the other half lives. If you're not watching tv, it seems like you'd have all this free time to be creative or contribute to society in some beneficial way. But maybe you're just playing Minesweeper. I dunno.

branwell otm itt

this poll is the equivalent of an anvil and about ten of us are standing under it.

OH BUT THE STRAW MAN DEFINITELY EXISTS AND LO I HAVE SEEN HIM

^^^really doesn't hold much weight with me, I'm afraid

It never fails to amaze me, the things that people will get incredibly judgmental about, and then justify their behaviour by claiming "OH BUT THOSE PEOPLE I'M JUDGING ARE SO SNOBBY AND JUDGEMENTAL". This isn't about anything except projection.

― BLEEEEEEE Monday (Branwell Bell), Monday, March 31, 2014 3:24 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol any more projection than you presuming to know our experiences with other people?

I used to work with someone (British) who would only go and see foreign-language films because "the quality is so much better". Surprisingly enough they didn't like any music made after 1970 or so either.

It never fails to amaze me, the things that people will get incredibly judgmental about, and then justify their behaviour by claiming "OH BUT THOSE PEOPLE I'M JUDGING ARE SO SNOBBY AND JUDGEMENTAL". This isn't about anything except projection.

You're underestimating how enjoyable this can be fwiw.

Before I moved my TV over to the new place, I was watching a 17-inch laptop screen - it kind of made me wish I went that way full time. 95% of my viewing is documentaries, mlb.tv and TV shows, I can't say I'd be missing a lot.

OTOH, I then hooked up the 55-incher and haven't seriously considered going back. Partially sunk cost - I got the big TV free and it's not worth selling so what else am I going to do with it?

I don't even know people who say, "I don't even own a TV."

I do a television census each year and anytime the person at the door says "b-b-but I don't have a tv" I reply "whassat, think you're better than me", then fling an Insignia 50" at their forehead

:D

my most recent ex frequently mentioned that she didn't have a TV but it wasn't as a badge of honor, it was a cost cutting measure. I mean she was a horrible horrible person but for reasons that had nothing to do with television ownership.

i have a tv but i don't watch it really, though my wife and i watch a small amount of movies, maybe 1-3 per month. cable packages are expensive. i have a toddler son who takes up pretty much all my time except for my job, i don't really have a lot of time to get engrossed in tv shows. like i said we do watch movies though, after my son goes to bed.

i don't brag about not watching tv but i get annoyed when sometimes all people and the internet talk about is fucking breaking bad or girls or whatever. i did watch the wire though. it took a huge chunk out of a summer a few years ago. i felt like i was probably pretty annoying b/c all i wanted to talk about with people was the wire.

Neanderthal, did you ever think that maybe you're the horrible person?

Both can be annoying but I find the second category more irritating because the non-tv-owning-snob is still kind of an underdog in the grand scheme of things whereas the person mocking them is kind of unwittingly being a bully on behalf of the status quo.

As I said in the other thread though, I feel like the "I don't even own a TV" guy has increasingly become a strawman. Maybe up through the late 90s it fit a certain recognizable profile, but I haven't heard anyone even take a side on TV ownership in many years except in context of having cable vs getting content through the internet.

I did have one friend who even up until like three years ago was all "I DON'T BELIEVE YOU THAT THE WIRE WAS GOOD, IT'S STILL TELEVISION. IT'S THE MEDIUM." Then he watched it.

This isn't about anything except projection.

I'm telling you I've met people like that and heard them say snobbish things about TV-watchers but OK, maybe I hallucinated them. You'd know my own life better than me.

Anyway, thanks to the new golden age of TV these people are far outnumbered by The Wire/Breaking Bad bores so I don't lose any sleep over it.

tbh i do feel like the wire was overrated

*groan*

Where does the "brag" in this sentence come from?

I could see it, if the fact of one's non-ownership of a tv were delivered in an obnoxiously haughty and self-important tone. Because saying this invariably marks you out as different from everyone else you're talking to, then it's more likely to be said apologetically or defensively, but I'm sure there are a few assholes who make this an indelible point of pride.

at least season 5 has shitted on my memory of the show, so it just kind of hangs out in my mind as overrated

Neanderthal, did you ever think that maybe you're the horrible person?

― Herbie Handcock (Murgatroid), Monday, March 31, 2014 3:29 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Ouch

Anyway, thanks to the new golden age of TV these people are far outnumbered by The Wire/Breaking Bad bores so I don't lose any sleep over it.

― What is wrong with songs? Absolutely nothing. Songs are great. (DL), Monday, March 31, 2014 3:31 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

breathless blogging/facebook-posting about premium shows is the new disease. It's like everyone took DFW's line about "rapt credulity" a little too far.

i also never had cable growing up so i've always kind of identified more with the people who don't own tvs

everytime i stay in a hotel i'm like "FUCK YEAAAAAA CABLE!!!!!!!" but then i turn off the tv after one cycle of flipping through

i met someone recently who bragged about not being into movies

i didn't bother to ask him about tv

how do you know he was bragging

Should I start a poll about when strawman came to be defined as "I haven't met/experienced this person/thing so it doesn't actually exist" y/n

I asked a strawman and he said yes he'd love to see a poll like that. But then he would.

It feels like the kind of cultural snob who would have confidently sneered at TV in the 80s or 90s knows that there's a ton of quality drama now so either they've succumbed or they've stopped making a big deal out of not watching. The whole "57 channels and nothing on" line would sound ridiculous now.

I'm telling you I've met people like that and heard them say snobbish things about TV-watchers but OK, maybe I hallucinated them. You'd know my own life better than me.

These people absolutely existed, and anyone who spent more than 2-3 days in Northampton, MA during the late 90s/early 00s met at least 50 of them (and saw innumerable "Kill Your Television" bumper stickers).

don't feel like anybody is even saying itt that they experience this on a frequent basis, just clarifying their position since it was fairly obvious where the OP was going w/ this. I run into way more people who boast "I ain't even on FB, mang, I actually TALK to people!"

how do you know he was bragging

― polyphonic, Monday, March 31, 2014 8:36 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

How else could you spin this? Why else would you bring it up?

I wonder if anyone still writes songs about how awful TV is. I guess they've moved on to writing about how the internet makes us mean and lonely.

"yeah, I really don't ever go to movies. I don't like movies."

xp it's obviously something that used to be a thing, people are just questioning whether it still is

I am probably being one of these people when I tell people that I don't own a Kindle and have no intention of buying one. But the person judging me in those situations is definitely in the wrong because I have unshakeable moral fortitude on my side.

"I met this person, once, they exist, ergo the trope is totes valid!!!" is stil v v weak and straw-manning.

That's different though. You still read books, right?

"I don't like movies, there are a million different kinds by all sorts of directors, silent, talkies, black and white, artsy, docs, cartoons, anime, nature shit but no, fuck it, they are not for me."

One of my best friends doesn't read novels because he doesn't want to waste time reading about people who don't exist and things that haven't happened. The odd thing is that he's an English Lit graduate.

^^^amazing

maybe it's because he's an english lit graduate

"I met this person, once, they exist, ergo the trope is totes valid!!!" is stil v v weak and straw-manning.

This is a cool quote that you made up that no one said, good job

The trope is valid because these people exist in virtually every sphere you would care to mention, most people on ILM would immediately project a load of things on someone who started making a big deal about how they dislike pop music made by girls, or rap music. It obviously doesn't mean that everyone who doesn't own a TV, or dislikes pop music, is one of these people, and I don't think anyone is claiming that they are.

I think there should be room in the world for people to take ideological positions against forms of entertainment. In this particular case, I think the medium has just changed so much that the bases for the opposition have become irrelevant, i.e. the proliferation of high-quality, commercial-free shows available to watch at any time in a variety of formats. When people were "against television" they were usually against a particular kind of activity which was what television-watching used to be defined by (or at least it was how a lot of people perceived it) -- you know, plopping down on the couch, channel surfing, vegging, the boob tube, etc. There were actual structural reasons why television on average was kind of stupefying at certain times in history. Those reasons aren't really there anymore.

<3 "the boob tube". Also "the idiot box".

If this thread keeps going and more ILXors say they've met IRL people like this, how many do we need before strawman status is lifted?

I consulted the strawman, he said five more.

In Britain this used to translate as "we don't watch ITV".

"I think there should be room in the world for people to take ideological positions against forms of entertainment."

There's also room to be able to make fun of jerkwads

hurting otm xxxxp

Clive James's old Observer TV columns show how much has changed. He basically invented modern criticism because when he started in the 70s the idea of taking TV seriously as an artform was new. That snobbery lasted a long time in some households.

Sorry, that should be invented modern TV criticism.

There's also room to be able to make fun of jerkwads

― waterbabies (waterface), Monday, March 31, 2014 3:51 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I don't think you can complain that the world has too little room for this

Bruce Springsteen is a snob: y/n

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YAlDbP4tdqc

Is Rollins the type of person who'd brag about TV non-ownership?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a6otjCKg594

Get off yr high horse, Frank

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkKXdCyGLjY

Television is no friend of mine

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XCumH8LRo1A

Frank Zappa is a creep

my thought on this is that our society is, for whatever reason, unable to cope with someone not engaging in a behavior that 99% of people engage in-- even when that person is not hurting anyone else. See: people who don't own TVs, people who are vegetarian/vegan, people who choose not to drive, people who are transgender, etc. We just HAVE to ridicule those people as wanting to be different and annoying.

Thank you for equating my annoyance with some guy at a party with people who are transphobic.

xpost said by the person who throws the polio afflicted in the clink!

Rollins has done shitloads of television

Poliopolice are you seriously equating not owning a television to being transgender...not to mention the whole "lifestyle choice" aspect of that analogy

Every word in that post is wearing a fedora

Been around the world and found
That only stupid people are breeding
The cretins cloning and feeding
And I don't even own a TV

hahaa i went to youtube to look for the video for that song earlier

harvey danger is definitely the most annoying

Every word in that post is wearing a fedora

― Raptain Chillips (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, March 31, 2014 4:16 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol

This is a weighted poll in that the statement is generally brought up in the context of a reference to a television program, and ostensibly someone who isn't trying to make a point would say "Oh, I haven't seen that" instead of implying that there is no way they'd watch a television show.

If people are talking about the recipe for some awesome salad and it's relatively essential you use a food processor to make it, I don't say "Oh, I don't even HAVE a food processor!"

Or someone is speaking about a musical they saw and you think the right response is, "I don't go to musical theaters"

"Oh, I don't even HAVE a food processor!"

I have said this. haha

those are terrible analogies

sorry.

It turns it from a statement about a work (television show) to a statement about the speaker's life (I don't have a tv). I guess if you're used to making everything about yourself, the latter sounds pretty normal.

Skipping past poliopolice's unfortunate transgender comparison, I've been on the opposite side of this as a (not very strict) vegetarian. Often when I was younger, less so now, a meat-eater would get really cross and defensive with me even though I never lectured anyone and only mentioned being vegetarian if I was invited somewhere to eat. Their assumption was that they were always being judged and yet I got far more grief than I gave. Annoying for me but I knew that there were ultra-judgemental vegetarian/vegans out there making it hard for the rest of us.

These days I eat fish but not meat so I get to annoy everybody with my disgusting hypocrisy.

Maybe transgender is a stretch in magnitude for the comparison to 'not owning a TV', but I think the attitude basically sprouts from the same place. Regardless, I would not hesitate to compare this to people's attitudes to vegetarianism.

xp yeah but musical theater is something almost no one does regularly, and there would be nothing weird at all about saying "oh, I don't have a food processor."

flip u

"Hey, did you see the Knicks game last night?"
"Nah, I don't really watch basketball."

Oh my god, what a jerkwad. Is everything about you, asshole?

The thing is that for every person who is snobby about not watching TV, there are like 100 people who just can't stomach the idea that a person would choose not to watch television, and a significant minority of those people are almost offended by the idea. Too much time on ILX tends to skew one's view of these things, but that's how it is out there.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Axp32y8CAAEyQ0d.jpg

"Hey, did you see the Knicks game last night?"
"Oh, did anyone in your precious ballsport get any home runs?! lol"

"I don't like movies, there are a million different kinds by all sorts of directors, silent, talkies, black and white, artsy, docs, cartoons, anime, nature shit but no, fuck it, they are not for me."

― waterbabies (waterface), Monday, March 31, 2014 1:42 PM (47 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

all of those movies suck waterface

If there was a traditional snobby attitude linked to cultural appreciation of basketball, then sure, that's a good metaphor.

hardly ever watch telly. there are loads of things I would like to watch but teenage daughters mean I don't get a look-in. being a grown-up is rubbish innit.

I've heard people say about football "Why would I watch 22 overpaid morons kick a ball around for 90 minutes?" That's the dick's way of saying "Oh I don't really follow football."

Basically there's a dick way of saying anything.

lol at anyone who was alive in the 90s pretending that the "i dont even OWN a tv" crowd is some imaginary strawman invented to promote our great tv overlords, that shit was all over the place back then.

^^^^^

which is why I said upthread it is increasingly becoming a strawman

"I dont really watch tv (so stop fucking talking about it, this conversation sucks)"

"I don't watch sports, i play sports"

here's a good basketball example:

"a bunch of pituitary cases trying to stuff a ball thru a hoop" - Dr. Morbius

along with the idea that television was going to ruin film, that movies released straight to vhs were all garbage, that television content was going to rot your mind, and that original television programming lacked some kind of artistic integrity that film has or had

That all sounds about right to me.

I've heard people say about football "Why would I watch 22 overpaid morons kick a ball around for 90 minutes?" That's the dick's way of saying "Oh I don't really follow football."

"No microwaves in this house! Mwahahah!"

oh lol microwaves

which is why I said upthread it is increasingly becoming a strawman

Are the people who complain about "I don't even own a TV" also becoming a strawman or are there as many of them as ever?

I thought we were olds here on ilx and used that archtype as a cultural shorthand

I also assumed the people who really hate that it's shorthand
1. do not own televisions
2. think people using a trope are directly attacking them

along with the idea that television was going to ruin film, that movies released straight to vhs were all garbage, that television content was going to rot your mind, and that original television programming lacked some kind of artistic integrity that film has or had

― have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh), Monday, March 31, 2014 4:39 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Most straight-to-vhs movies were pretty bad, watching a film with commercial breaks is a miserable experience, and original television programming was also often artistically harmed by the medium in the days before premium cable. The arguments against television back then were medium-oriented. It wasn't "nothing about this can be good because it's popular," it was "it's hard to write a good drama that gets interrupted every several minutes with a cereal ad." I don't think there's anything particularly snobby about that, everyone hated commercials.

if you were looking for a strawman in the thread about people whose vocabulary is entirely made up of pop culture references I have a better candidate

my thought on this is that our society is, for whatever reason, unable to cope with someone not engaging in a behavior that 99% of people engage in-- even when that person is not hurting anyone else. See: people who don't own TVs, people who are vegetarian/vegan, people who choose not to drive, people who are transgender, etc. We just HAVE to ridicule those people as wanting to be different and annoying.

― Poliopolice, Monday, March 31, 2014 4:12 PM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i think this is otm. plenty of people i grew up with simply see any of these things as "people being trying to be different for the sake of being different, which is annoying". not saying ILX is like this re: transgender folks but loads of people are

Also the activity of Watching Television as in getting some snacks and just spending a few hours a night on the couch watching whatever the fuck came on. Getting rid of television for me was very much about that, much as I don't keep certain foods in the house that I'm bound to overeat.

i dont even have a tv, myself, so definitely the 2nd

I don't even eat food

I can think of people who have about eight zillion slasher flicks on vhs. Who cares if they're "bad," they're just not for you and they're not wrecking your culture.

As for the commercial-supported media thing, people painted premium cable channels with the same brush, as far as I remember. My family /didn't even have cable/ though so I might be misremembering.

(There was also an anti-elitist thing about not having cable television, back in the day. I remember kids with cable not understanding how you had television without a subscription.)

Watching shit is cool, i think we can all agree on that.

people gave me this kind of shit for not drinking soda when i was little

"you don't even drink coke?"

This entire thing might be a completely different beast in the UK, where there's that television fee or w/e. In the US, you could just plug a television in with no fear of getting busted for not paying your television fee. I can imagine there being a harsher divide if you theoretically had to prove you weren't leeching off the public by dodging a tax.

And people stealing cable television were ripping off corporations people generally painted as greedy and incompetent, so they were _sticking it to the man_

"I don't play video games" is probably an analog in the geek world

yeah non-licence holders in the uk routinely receive threatening letters from the govt as it's assumed everyone watches tv

that is a completely diff culture than the US

its more about how they dominate the room than the shows that are on them

I'm an IT bod. I do not play videogames, do not quote Hitch-hikers', would not recognise a Matrix reference...

I do watch TV though.

i own a projector

And the people who get annoyed when i say i dont have one, what business is it of theirs - it was them that started the conversation about some show or other, not me

If my coworkers are talking about some church-related activity, I don't say "I don't even go to church, I'm an atheist"

then I tell them I totally vape, though

http://utopiaorbust.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/vlcsnap-1561484.png

even if they ask you how church was today, you just lie and told them you're still in the second season?

people don't say "i don't even own a tv" anymore they say "i don't even own a tv i watch everything on the internet" but imo that is still an indefensibly snobby thing to say cause you're telling me you probably don't watch baseball or SVU marathons

jk i do both those things on the internet now

do people ask you, unsolicited, what you think of a particular television show?

I'd probably just say that I don't watch that show. I think judging people for owning/not owning a television is odd, but I recognize that it's seen as a status quo of sorts and I don't want to turn television ownership, churchgoing, or anything else into a discussion or judgment, so I just avoid talking about them.

I'm also an outlier in that I'm a 30-something guy who is unmarried and has no children in the middle part of the country, but I don't go around saying "I'm not even married" or w/e.

they say what did you think of doctor who last night

I don't watch doctor who, was it good?

what?

and i say i dont know i dont even have a tv and then they're annoyed im like well i never wanted this conversation i believe in silence in the workplace

see, the real problem there is you hate small talk and shut it down by doing this television statement

i ask ppl if they own a tv as a pre-emptive move, at the bus stop, wherever, i just drop the bomb in advance, then walk off before i get an answer. they're all cunts anyway.

and then some other time theyll say what did you think of this other show and i never heard of it, and i think about different ways of saying i dont even have a tv why are we having this conversation again, i thought bv saying i dont even have a tv you wouldnt come back and ask me about some OTHER show, because i dont want to offend them but in the end i just say sorry i dont even have a tv again maybe they'll stop it with the tv show questions eventually idk

i don't even own a speedboat

I have a tv but I don't have broadcast signal or cable service, so find it hard to succinctly get across my superiority wrt this device/medium

people have never asked me unsolicited, what I think of a particular television show, and never have, not even when I worked in an office with watercoolers and awkward small-talk. it's a myth... isn't it? or did I miss out?

lol

negative strawman, bold move

idk on other hand seeing as they start the whole tv conversation thing because seriously what person without a tv starts a tv conversation....well then maybe they know i'm going to say sorry i dont even have a tv so they want the annoyance because they enjoy judging and looking down on me because of it, and when you put it like that who am i to spoil the fun

I think I have only seen that in that "God Bless America" movie in the last few years, in its satirical takedown of american culture, so it is possibly a thing people do

i haven't even seen "God Bless America"

we need your country, class, and social status to really make a call here, cog

I'm guessing UK by the Doctor Who ref

actually, im a european atheist myself

darragh on fire

The weather? I don't even own any sensory organs.

I don't think ilxors kvetching about people being strident about their lack of tv ownership and cog's obnoxious coworkers being judgmental about the same are coming from the same place

v fancy worldview darraghmac, kudos

oh my parents brought me up that way actually, they would never allow god in the house. in europe.

a person can be judged by different groups of people from different attacking positions, perhaps it would be simpler if i just got one

yeah get a tv dude sons of anarchy is p good

I think I'm trying to say that no one invoking this stereotype on ilx has you in mind, but if you want to play martyr....

ums otm

martvr

I don't watch tv, I'm too busy raisin' hell with my motorcycle gang

There was definitely a point where not owning a TV was a thing some people were proud of. Also not owning a car. Then it was all about not owning a cell phone which gradually morphed into not owning a smart phone. I pretty recently heard someone say "I don't even have a facebook account". Cancelling cable seems to be pretty popular these days. I'm gonna try to jump ahead of the curve a bit and start boasting that I don't have a netflix account.

i don't even have an ilx login

If my coworkers are talking about some church-related activity, I don't say "I don't even go to church, I'm an atheist"

then I tell them I totally vape, though

― have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh), Monday, 31 March 2014 21:03 (24 minutes ago) Permalink

Well obviously you don't just butt in and say "hey everybody I don't go to church," but if someone asked you a church-related or religion-related question, wouldn't you say "I don't go to church?" Because at some point it just kind of sounds like fear to not say so imo.

not so much fear as just fuck this i don't even feel like getting into it...it's the same reason i delete every other tweet and ilx post before i post it

fear is a man's bets friend

why shouldnt people be pleased at not owning a car..they're bad for the environment!

if someone asked you a church-related or religion-related question, wouldn't you say "I don't go to church?"

nah, I'd go to HR

and if someone asks me if i could take some stuff somewhere in my car i say im sorry i dont even have a car not no my car is at the garage getting its fibulator decompressed

it's the same reason i delete every other tweet and ilx post before i post it

otm

i feel like caring too much about religion or getting upset is un-atheistic. if something doesn't exist you should just kinda shrug your shoulders at it not get all uptight. it's like getting uptight about a leprechaun. just a wry internal lol is the only response.

the thing is there's a difference between "I don't own a a car" and "I don't even own a car". I mean obviously it's better to not own a car, but some people are jerks about it.

xxp

if something doesn't exist you should just kinda shrug your shoulders at it not get all uptight.

just a bit of murdering of gay men and female genital mutilation and worldwide terrorism, let's be cool, atheists.

if someone asked you a church-related or religion-related question, wouldn't you say "I don't go to church?"

nah, I'd go to HR

― have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh), Monday, 31 March 2014 21:35 (9 minutes ago) Permalink

lol ok right

yeah thats part of what i was getting at! saying "i dont have a tv" sure who is going to get weird abt that but responding to "hey have you ever seen parks and rec" with "I DONT EVEN OWN A TV" is def a different thing. i mean, i dont have a tv, i have a netflix/hulu/videogame player that is called a tv so i have no horse in this race really. xxp

idk DG i kinda feel like thats not necessarily where most theists are at yknow but its true i dont pry neither

the thing is there's a difference between "I don't own a a car" and "I don't even own a car". I mean obviously it's better to not own a car, but some people are jerks about it.

xxp

― silverfish, Monday, March 31, 2014 5:41 PM Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

"Jerks" how? The feelings of car-owners in the room get hurt?

so its that they feel bad about themselves because they own a car and a tv and they are hurting the environment, but they dont want to admit it so they take it out on me, and somehow im the dick? well if they didnt talk about cars and tvs the whole time the whole mess could have been avoided

and before somebody gets incredulous and strawman grand inquisitor on me that is an actual conversation that i had at a super dull party after said dork waxed poetic about Baby Mama the motion picture so i reserve all rights to clown that fool

Nah hurting its about how you carry yourself imo not the ripple effect intended nor otherwise

the point is that there is a very different connotation to the "i dont even X" and the "i dont X" that is not terribly difficult to parse

might have something to do w/you thinking they must or ought to feel bad about themselves for that

cog are u just sore cos clockwork is kinda passé these days, is that it

ayo jjjj telling ppl how ppl must or how easily they must parse is nagl its 2014

i liked baby mama ok

just a bit of murdering of gay men and female genital mutilation and worldwide terrorism, let's be cool, atheists.

― A True White Kid that can Jump (Granny Dainger), Monday, March 31, 2014 4:45 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

by lecturing ppl at work or by getting all personal angry about something you're not actually doing anything to change any of these things. i agree that religion has often bad efx on the world but unless you plan on actually working or volunteering or giving money to organizations that are trying to change these things, just hanging on to anger about shit isn't actually helping you or anyone

not to mention there are lots of religious ppl that are nice folks who are p normal and probably do more charity shit that i ever do

the point is that there is a very different connotation to the "i dont even X" and the "i dont X" that is not terribly difficult to parse
--Corpsepaint Counterpaint (jjjusten)

Because don't x is for the first time, and don't even x is for all the millions of other times

or as another version call it the difference between "i don't know any songs by Pearl Jam" and "
Pearl Jam? I don't even know who that is"

i'm not down with your binaries there, UMS

cog are u just sore cos clockwork is kinda passé these days, is that it
--fauxpas cola (darraghmac)

I'm sore because I just tripped over the tv on the way to the bathroom

so to paraphrase this whole question is

a) being tuomas
b) clowning tuomas

I wish I wasn't aware of any songs by pearl jam

or as another version call it the difference between "i don't know any songs by Pearl Jam" and "
Pearl Jam? I don't even know who that is"
--Corpsepaint Counterpaint (jjjusten)

Naw not really - the even is when you get asked about pearl Jam in such a way that if course you like pearl jam were just going to assume that without asking and like no actually I don't even know who that is

People so bothered about the tone of the answer maybe they forgot to look at the tone of the question

how dare people make a vague assumption that you mostly conform to the status quo of the majority of people in your area

In it

how dare people make a vague assumption that you mostly conform to the status quo of the majority of people in your area
--have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh)

And that is it in a nutshell!

"How dare you mention that you do something different from the status quo of people in your area. You should just mutter to yourself and walk away sheepishly."

how dare people make a vague assumption that you mostly conform to the status quo of the majority of people in your area
--have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh)

In fact that's a lot of things in a nutshell, right there

Because don't x is for the first time, and don't even x is for all the millions of other times

― cog, Monday, March 31, 2014 5:51 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lol imagining some paranoid twitchy-eyed cog "so did you watch-" "GAAAAAH I DON'T EVEN OWN A TV OK JUST CALM DOWN EVERYONE CALM DOWN"

And really while tv owning is quite innocuous the views expressed above are quite indicative of non-thinking majority viewpoints where it's implicit that outsiders should just "fit in"

"There's no racism here"

how dare people make a vague assumption that you mostly conform to the status quo of the majority of people in your area
--have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh)

maybe that's it. I live 200 miles north of my co-workers. they're probably just scared of what's beyond the wall.

lol I was kind of waiting for that

glad to hear that your lack of watching television is comparable to societal discrimination based on race

discrimination against television non-watchers: AS BAD AS RACISM

And really while tv owning is quite innocuous the views expressed above are quite indicative of non-thinking majority viewpoints where it's implicit that outsiders should just "fit in"

― cog, Monday, March 31, 2014 6:02 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

"There's no racism here"

― cog, Monday, March 31, 2014 6:02 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

take a look at the choices you're making right now

Branwell pitting two sides against each other and disappearing abruptly is some next-level puppetmaster shit.

Maybe Branwell is working on a very long post

og are u just sore cos clockwork is kinda passé these days, is that it

ha genuinely i dont even know what that is

conclusions:

1) if you don't own a television you hate the transgendered
2) it's racist to not watch The Wire
3) we should bomb the crap out of Iraq

people who simply are something vs people who insist on something

choose wisely

namaste, just be

I should know better than to stir the hornet's nest, but sometimes it's really fun to watch them get so outraged when shoe is on other foot!
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Nuclear option

Cog it was a pun on cog, clockwork, cog, is all

it's mad fun to form huge judgements of people off of the tiniest thing you know about them so i support either poll option equally; it doesn't matter if you like tv or not, the important thing is that we can all judge each other quickly and decisively based on the most trivial aspects of our personalities.

Well, ya

everybody should be killed

Everybody is.

Atheist btw, from europe.

Silly human race

http://mute.com/wp-content/uploads/1995/09/mick-harvey-initials-bb-mute187-560x563.jpg

"it started as what seemed an innocuous thread, but soon factions formed and alliances divided. televisions being chucked out into the street. people ripped from their homes. the first warheads were launched in the wee hours on Christmas Eve. It all ended with a big bang."

I wonder whatever it is that you "take pride in" and how I can pour coruscating scorn on it.

― BLEEEEEEE Monday (Branwell Bell), Monday, March 31, 2014 3:13 PM (3 hours ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

tbrr you don't need any help on that front

btw one of these options leads to the embarrassing "nobody in the UK has even HEARD of these 'Simpsons' you pulled last week."

lol

people have never asked me unsolicited, what I think of a particular television show, and never have, not even when I worked in an office with watercoolers and awkward small-talk. it's a myth... isn't it? or did I miss out?

Not a myth - more like a passenger pigeon or a dodo bird now. The last time someone asked me "so what did you think of xxxxxxx last night?" was the day after the Seinfeld finale.

I'm trying to figure out why this type of thing is so annoying. I think part of it is it fee is like the don't even watch a tv'er is sort of stuck in adolescence, still defining themselves by what they don't like instead of what they do like & feeling superior to the unenlightened when in actuality they might be just as shallow.

I mean honestly that speaks to my problems overall with it. Anti-TV folk aren't a pet cause of mine, I just dislike anybody who proudly wears the shit they hate as a badge of honor. People who merely don't own televisions or tell me about it, who gives a shit...

there's one particular acquaintance of mine who makes it a habit daily to brag about what celebrities he hasn't heard of, what rap artists he's never heard music by, and how much he hates a certain movie (which changes by month). find that hella tedious

people have never asked me unsolicited, what I think of a particular television show, and never have, not even when I worked in an office with watercoolers and awkward small-talk. it's a myth... isn't it? or did I miss out?

Last year I started going to lunch with my coworkers because I wanted to be less of an antisocial jerk. About 75% of the conversation was about television. I still try to go with them once a week to keep up appearances, but I look for a quick excuse to head back to my desk when they start asking if anyone saw last night's Grey's Anatomy or whatever.

(I own a TV, but I mostly only watch whatever my kids are watching, which I guess is a version of "I don't even own a TV" but I'd love to watch Girls or Game of Thrones if I had HBO or whatever.)

That's what blu-rays and DVDs are for

there's a friend of mine, a former co-worker that chats w/ me mostly about music and television shows when I logon to our chat system.

but I prefer to binge watch television so tehre's few shows we're ever both watching in real time.

I'm trying to figure out why this type of thing is so annoying. I think part of it is it fee is like the don't even watch a tv'er is sort of stuck in adolescence, still defining themselves by what they don't like instead of what they do like & feeling superior to the unenlightened when in actuality they might be just as shallow.

― Raptain Chillips (upper mississippi sh@kedown), Monday, March 31, 2014 8:10 PM (50 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

because being ignorant is never good?

I just dislike anybody who proudly wears the shit they hate as a badge of honor.

^^^^ this.

http://www.wornfree.co.uk/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/650x626/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/k/u/kurt_cobain_corporate_magazine_suck_white.jpg

calling things passé is out btw

Branwell pitting two sides against each other and disappearing abruptly is some next-level puppetmaster shit.

Hello and welcome to ilx u must be new here

/I just dislike anybody who proudly wears the shit they hate as a badge of honor./

^^^^ this.
--(The Other) J.D. (J.D.)

What about their hate of Fracking?

_/I just dislike anybody who proudly wears the shit they hate as a badge of honor./

^^^^ this.
--(The Other) J.D. (J.D.)_

What about fact you wear your disdain for these people as a badge of honor yourself?

Maybe Branwell is working on a very long post

It's "Good Day to you, Sirs"

cog otm itt, "i don't even own a tv" is not usually something people say unbidden. it's usually a way of saying "i don't watch tv so this direction of conversation excludes me". obviously condescending snobs exist but this statement doesn't automatically make one a condescending snob.

i never really grew up in a tv-oriented house so never really got into the habit. fully acknowledge tv can be great but when i get into things i REALLY get into them so i find i don't have the time to commit to tv series - i can't just watch an episode here, an episode there, casual watching. i find that - with a few other things - you do come across people who seem almost offended that you don't conform to the habits and pastimes of 99% of people within "your" social demographic. "what do you mean, you don't practise the signifiers of the pop culture-consuming middle classes."

obviously i watch tennis on tv, if "crappy internet live stream" counts as a tv.

anyway i'm not a snob about tv as a medium but i am 100% a snob about this attitude:

Also the activity of Watching Television as in getting some snacks and just spending a few hours a night on the couch watching whatever the fuck came on.

― james franco tur(oll)ing test (Hurting 2), Monday, March 31, 2014 8:47 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

i never realised until twitter how many people do this! they watch whatever, they seem to dislike it and they don't even seem to care about it. they just watch it because it's there. EVERY FUCKING NIGHT. i am baffled by and unashamedly contemptuous of this lifestyle. you should be into - really into, enthusiastic and excited about - your hobbies and your cultural consumption otherwise what is the actual point???

(video games are another matter. an appalling hobby in every respect.)

Sorry, I'm still laughing at the ignorance and projection displayed in "Branwell must be a next-level puppet master because... (Branwell goes to bed during time zones that are night time in the UK)!!!"

I half-agree, Lex, but I don't disdain watching TV as wallpaper, I just don't get it. I don't get video games either but how other people spend their time doesn't bother me. I know there are people who find it weird that I spend so much time on Twitter and ILX. I remember reading someone describe Robbie Williams' Angels as "a song that idiots want played at their funerals" and thought it was so gross and contemptuous that I vowed not to sneer at people for their cultural choices anymore. Or at least try not to. Culture has a utilitarian role as comfort and distraction and if someone finds it comforting to watch whatever's on TV when they get home from work as opposed to streaming True Detective or reading a novel then what's it to me?

yeah i acknowledge my snobbery about video games is nagl but allow me that one just because. i don't rescind anything about tv-as-wallpaper snobbery though. the sheer passivity of it combined with the visible dislike of what that passivity gets you, i don't know why it doesn't strike them as a terrible way to pass a life. don't get me wrong i am fully in favour of procrastination and useless time-wasting but at least that should be in service of something that actively enthuses you?

I have a soft spot for full-on TV-as-wallpaper – like actually actively doing something else while it mutters in the background - & that's a function of my youth & always being around TV. It's a comfortable way for me to read quickly - happy memories of eg summer holiday, work through a reading list, Neighbours on in the background.

But I don't have a TV now. I slide too easily into just watching it. I think my logic is something like:

Reading + TV: ok
Just reading: ok
Just TV: uncomfortable with myself, but find it difficult to stop because I love you TV.

I didn't really 'get' TV-as-wallpaper until i started working full-time. Getting home completely knackered after a stressful day at work isn't always particularly conducive to more active pursuits. I don't watch tonnes of TV but i don't begrudge anyone the habit of flopping on the sofa and consuming escapist entertainment.

i don't even read this thread

there is so much great tv out there. some shows are totally involving, beautifully directed, scripted and acted. it's daft to cut oneself off from all that greatness.

at a party the other week someone in conversation mentioned a telly prog that was I imagine made before anyone at the party was born and one wee guy blurted out we don't actually own a tv!! looking feverishly at his girlfriend and sort of nodding involuntarily

I put salt on my TV

the following day I was walking along the canal and he appeared on the path walking towards me smiling with a skateboard strapped to his back and slowed to say hello but I kept my pace and informed him that I don't skateboard as I passed

It never fails to amaze me, the things that people will get incredibly judgmental about, and then justify their behaviour by claiming "OH BUT THOSE PEOPLE I'M JUDGING ARE SO SNOBBY AND JUDGEMENTAL". This isn't about anything except projection.

― BLEEEEEEE Monday (Branwell Bell), Monday, 31 March 2014 19:24 (Yesterday) Permalink

http://static.gamesradar.com/images/mb/GamesRadar/us/Features/2011/04/Mortal%20Kombat%20Week/Evolution%20of%20Scorpion%20and%20Sub-Zero/MK/doubleice--article_image.jpg

I find myself wondering if "I only watch via the Internet" is the new snobbish version of IDEOATV. I'm pretty sure I've been guilty of proselytizing about how going Internet-only will set you free, but I was the same way when I first got satellite+Tivo. All technology has done is make the existing television even more non-linear.

The IDEOATV people have a smugness about them that feels almost class-based. Insert every argument about high-brow vs. low-brow culture here.

Those 60s media guys: McLuhan, Postman, etc. they were really onto something. Television is different.

.

I feel like if you're watching TV programming on the internet you're still watching tv

lalalalala not listening

the fundamental difference is that on the internet you've gone to find that thing you're watching rather than just clicked around to see what's on

the internet is still pull rather than push

or in my case, skim and restate

the fundamental difference is that on the internet you've gone to find that thing you're watching rather than just clicked around to see what's on

― TracerHandVEVO (Tracer Hand), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 9:07 AM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

except if you've had cable in like the last 10 years there's all sorts of on-demand options for pretty much all shows...not to mention everyone who uses a PS3 or Xbox 360 and Netflix/Hulu+ or a Roku with their TV

Is it wrong to automatically assume that people who don't own/watch tvs have more fulfulling lives than tv watchers? Or is that a stereotype? Do these people just spend the same amount of time reading trashy novels, or are they out working in soup kitchens and tending to community gardens?

I didn't pay for cable until October 2012, which was like not having TV at all (thanks to a converter box I could watch broadcast channels in my bedroom). I still only watch the news and use the cable for YouTube and Netflix.

how about people who don't watch live television but run out of quality shows on netflix and just binge through whatever garbage is there

hi

Voted death to "dont even own" obv btw

xp yeah "The Medium is the Message" isn't some hippy-dippy mind-blower like it sounds, it just means that the nature of the medium and the context in which it is used is going to shape the content. If a station needs to have commercial breaks every x minutes, then the show has to be written in a way that it can be broken up easily. If the economics require you to have an enormous general audience, you may need to write the show in a way such that no episode requires thorough memory of the prior episode. There are a variety of reasons why a show like The Wire (sorry to keep hammering that one) couldn't have been written for NBC in the mid-90s, even aside from the censorable content -- it requires a lot of intense attention, some scenes almost require you to pick up on a different dialect of English, each episode builds on the last, etc. It wouldn't work economically for NBC, and it barely worked for HBO in the era of DVD sets and on-demand viewing. My point isn't "The Wire is unequivocally better than 90s television," it's just that I don't buy "television is television, same shit different screen."

I've gone through entire runs of several TV shows on netflix which I exclusively watched while folding laundry. I never pick shows that I really want to watch for these situations, because I'm not paying 100% attention to the show, which means that I know a lot about Dexter and Weeds and a bunch of other somewhat decent but ultimately terrible tv shows. Sometimes I feel like this stuff is taking up valuable brain space.

xpost
1) no duh

2) i'm not talking about HBO stuff or House of Cards vs. like a 90s sitcom...I'm talking about some ppl who seem to think like watching Parks & Rec on Netflix is somehow not "TV"

"I don't take Sky/have a Sky box" is the C21 version of "I don't watch ITV".

(I don't take Sky or watch ITV)

everything is TV! a book is just TV on paper! ILX is just a really bad Frasier script published on page at a time on the internet!

Right but even a show like Parks & Rec can wind up partly shaped by the fact that a big part of its audience is going to watch on netflix instead of on broadcast. I don't know the numbers for that specific show, but if you no longer have to rely solely on the "broad" part of "broadcast" then you can do things differently.

And TBH the writing in Parks & Rec still seems a little sharper than, IDK, Full House.

I don't own a TV. Well I mean, I do own a TV, there's one in my house but I never watch it. Not unless it's something I like, like the news for instance, or University Challenge. And okay, I do like Breaking Bad, but that's it. I may as well not have a TV because who needs one? Mind control. And the adverts, god knows how many ad breaks there must be between segments on Game of Thrones. I may as well just watch the ads even though they're blatantly the best bits. Better than The Voice, which is crap, but I still watch it sometimes. Well most times it's on actually. I don't like How I Met Your Mother or the Big Bang Theory but I have to watch them cos my girlfriend likes them. Oh, and I'll watch Corrie while I'm having my tea but not Eastenders. Well sometimes Eastenders. I like a film too. And then what I like to do, if there's nothing on I'll stream something from Netflix. But on the whole I avoid the telly. Rots your brains. Nature documentaries are good though, I watch those. We've got the nature channel now and I'm addicted, but that's alright cos it's educational isn't it? I'll watch anything factual - war documentaries, nature documentaries, quizzes, Lov'd Up In Ibiza.. But no I don't watch TV. No use for one. Gives you square eyes, I may as well get rid of it.

And TBH the writing in Parks & Rec still seems a little sharper than, IDK, Full House.

― james franco tur(oll)ing test (Hurting 2), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 9:47 AM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

it's no more complex than Seinfeld, and Seinfeld had tons of strange little recurring characters and storylines

my main point is not about the art of TV and how on demand is changing it blah blah blah

IT'S ABOUT MOTHERFUCKERS YOU ARE WATCHING TV SHIT IF YOU ARE WATCHING TV SHIT STEP OFF YR HIGH HORSE

ILX is the best kind of reality tb

no one is on a high horse, this is the point of the thread

mississippi shakedown you're right, the lines between "sit up" and "sit back" have become v blurred

I'm talking about some ppl who seem to think like watching Parks & Rec on Netflix is somehow not "TV"

i have to say, netflix feels a little hermetic to me, i mean it is awesome obviously, but i can't shake the slightly "dead" vibe, like maybe i'm in a post-apocalyptic survival capsule somewhere, a wire piped in with an archive of humanity's televised entertainment on it, enough to last 5 lifetimes. i will often find myself flipping over to live TV and watching something worse on every objective level, but vibing on it more because it's live. i wonder if today's kids will grow up feeling that distinction between something live and recorded?

anyway i can understand people who are basically like, if it's not a live broadcast it's not really TV. it's videotape by another name. you are not participating ins omething as a communal experience with thousands of other people all seeing the same things you are at the same time.

I don't buy that distinction at all. If you watch programmes made for TV you're watching TV. I watch most TV time-shifted these days and never feel that it doesn't count because I'm missing the in-the-moment communal experience.

what if you watch on a one-hour time delay and skip all the commercials?

are people on the west coast forever watching "not tv" because shows air later

yeah DVR already changed viewing habits long ago w/cable!

idk tracer i get the hermetic description but yr verging into "you havent heard them til you've heard them liiiive' territory there by the end imo

ITT - people making dumb parallels.

no one is on a high horse, this is the point of the thread

― lex pretend, Tuesday, April 1, 2014 3:03 PM (2 minutes ago)

bahaha wait how exactly does this fit with "people who use the trope strawman of the "i dont even own a tv" crowd are THE FUCKING WORST" that keeps popping up all over this thread

basically "I watch tv in a slightly different manner than someone else" is the new "I don't even own a TV".

I thought the point of the thread was that people hear people complain about that trope, realize they don't have a television, and think others are complaining about _them_

not everything is about you, guys

well, maybe about a few people who seem to really have a chip on their shoulders about this

High strawhorse trope is the worst

also jesus a bunch of you make it sound like people at parties and work like smell your not-tv-watching from across the room and run over wild eyed and jam a pile of tv guides in your hand like they are jack chick tracts xp

the poll options offered here are very high-horsey

The point of the thread is war.

tbh if your coworkers are hounding you about not watching Parks & Rec or w/e, the problem is that your coworkers are dicks

i put on a shirt and tie and go around my neighborhood to hand out TV guides to my neighbors to spread the good word about television

"quick grab that dude i can sense that he hasn't seen season 4 of Everybody Loves Raymond, my reeducation van is just down the street"

I used to record things off the telly onto vhs, it felt good knowing that millions of people across the country weren't watching along with me

basically "I watch tv in a slightly different manner than someone else" is the new "I don't even own a TV".

i used to have no tv, now i have 3 tvs. but i won't pay for cable, and the only tv i watch is netflix, while riding my bike trainer.

oh, and i only watch the bike trainer netflix on a teeny macbook.

is this good enough?

haha i just read the actual poll options and no matter what wins, we all lose, well done

what about I don't even own a smartphone

People who simply do not own televisions are more annoying
People who insist that people who say "I don't even own a TV" are indicative of some annoying trope or or avatar of cultural snobbery or whatever are more annoying

there's something missing here...

People

option one wins - vindication for those that feel that simple non-tv owners are persecuted
option two wins - vindication for those that feel that simple non-tv owners are persecuted

speaking as a logician its really an amazing trick, srsly

"I watch tv in a slightly different manner than someone else" is the new "I don't even own a TV".

This is OTM, and I'm glad to have slight differences in TV-watching as a good small talk topic with acquaintances. Way more interesting than real estate prices and traffic/driving routes!

please pick one of the following:
- I am right
- I am still right

(xpost. sorry that sounded sarcastic. I actually do find it interesting to hear how different people watch TV now. I'm a just-netflix person theses days, except sports and braking news person. Stream new cable stuff like True Detective from time to time when i can find it easily. Never download anything.)

Option 1 is "x = y"
Option 2 is "(x who say 'x = y') = y"
Not the same thing, really?

I have an antenna for when I feel like watching one of the shows I like when it airs, rather than watching it on Hulu or downloading it the next day, but when the weather is weird the reception sometimes cuts out. My television-watching decision tree is many-branched.

liberals and conservatives

new on hbo this fall

It's almost as if this thread wasn't started with entirely serious intent!

oh wait i didn't read it properly

antenna is actually the best HD signal, better than any streaming service or cable

#TVtips

feeling like your TV watching has gotten stale? - make some popcorn for a special treat!

#TVtips

ums otm

more #TVtips pls

Really you guys? Liveness/not liveness makes no diff in how watching (or listening) makes you feel? When I'm watching a Boiler Room set as it's happening it's more exciting. I'm totally not interested in trying to prove to anyone that they should also feel this way but it's wild to me that it could make no difference.

I say I don't own one even though I do because people who are annoyed by "I don't even own a TV" are just a treat is what, easiest auto-troll ever

when people wanna talk about their fave shows i just "i haven't seen tv in 20 years" which is about right and sounds awesomely smug.

auto-troll?

last night someone twittered despondence over HIMYM, so i googled "HIMYM nutshell" and learned the show had multiple timelines- i had no idea. tv comedy got pretty high-concept while i wasn't looking.

discovered the new version of this via Gawker Media comments today: "I refuse to watch shows with laugh tracks."

Also genuinely shocked not to see any mention of this scene?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEnpT8UiV_w

ha i was trying to find the old suck.com defense of the laugh track but the domain is blocked here at work

I refuse to watch shows without laugh tracks

thing about watching TV 'live' is that I haven't feasibly been able to do it since I was in high school. even in my 20s I was taping eps with my shitty VCR because I was always busy when my shows are on.

also, I have trouble watching one ep at a time for serialized shows, particularly high stakes ones like Breaking Bad. I'm always too starved for more after, and feel too pressured to enjoy myself cos I know I get no more for a week. I did watch live for Season 5 and while I liked it, I kind of missed being able to choose how much I digested at once.

the only things I really care about watching live = sporting events and awards shows.

what's the deal w tv ppl who don't follow any of the programmes on it

i didn't want to be one of those ppl saying "i don't even own a tv."

it's enough to own it. give it a good home. hug your television.

I have a television, but no cable or antenna, so I can't watch shows. I just use it for DVDs and Xbox. Are people saying that what's on television is good? Because in the instances where I am able to actually flip channels...that's all I end up doing (and usually opt for infomercials that feature music clips).

pro-tv people seem weirdly unable to let "i don't watch tv" slide past accepted and unremarked

it's like me telling people that they must follow tennis year-round because it's so amazing and if they display no interest they're just being a snob, or something. leave people be to their interests and their lack of interests!

you scold ppl all the time about what kind of music they like!

I refuse to watch auto-troll, i demand live trolling

Digital antennas are pretty cheap. At least you get a few channels that way.

Lex of one minute ago, meet Lex of nine hours ago: i am baffled by and unashamedly contemptuous of this lifestyle.

Auto-Troll 2 is hilarious, it's streaming on Netflix right now, the actors are a bunch of amateurs!

anyway i think this thread has definitively proved that it's indeed the 'no tv' ppl who are the weirdos

i'm unbothered by people being into their favourite tv programmes! i am disdainful of people passively watching stuff they're not into

it is possible that those people may not be entirely honest about their enjoyment of these activities on social media, just fyi

I'm bothered by people being into "Scandal" and watching it passively.

like yknow many a time i have been like "oh hey facebooks why did i eat that whole cheesecake blarrgh i am so gross" but you better believe i loved the shit out of eating that whole cheesecake

I REGRET NOTHING

maybe they're not being honest when they're disparaging people for having the temerity to reply they dont have a tv or a car either

i don't eat cheesecakes

i wonder what people offended by "i don't even have a tv" think people who don't have or watch tv should say when others start talking about tv. just remain silent??

who is 'cog'

lex, they could change the topic or stay silent, sure

i wonder what people offended by "i don't even have a tv" think people who don't have or watch tv should say when others start talking about tv. just remain silent??

they should talk about cheesecakes

beats me, what if you were standing there talking about tennis with a couple other people? I'd probably go get a coffee or something.

i would prefer they just leave the room or better just go buy a tv right away and catch up

let me blow your mind, here:

I have read music reviews, some written by lex, and enjoyed them quite a bit. However, I never actually listened to the album. Did you know you can read about something, or converse about it, or enjoy the conversation without having any knowledge of the original material?

They should tantrum until whenever

I want them to get on their knees and apologise

well yes, i assumed that was implied just in the phrasing of the question

i wonder what people offended by "i don't even have a tv" think people who don't have or watch tv should say when others start talking about tv. just remain silent??

― lex pretend, Tuesday, April 1, 2014 12:55 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

if the topic of convo is any other thing you don't know much about, what's the answer?

not to be a dick, which it kind of sounded like i guess

I definitely don't watch a lot of the crap co-workers or friends of friends at bars start talking about so I usually just say "oh I haven't seen it" rather than "I don't even own cable" because then it'd seem like I was trying to shift focus. Cause they're not going to go on and on about it to me anyway. Lucky for me I do watch shows in general so if they gave a shit about what I'm up to instead I could talk about those particular shows.

go look for a snack or something to keep my mouth occupied.

"I don't even have a doctorate in Electrical Engineering!"

If people really like shows I ask what they like about them or if there are any cool scenes or characters they could describe

Can't help thinking the Gordian knot of this dilemma could be cut with the rule one of all social interactions: Don't be a dick about it.

always be a dick

Yeah the only reason you'd say "i don't even own a tv" is if you're trying to make sure no other shows come up in conversation either.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_YmtYEel8gVU/SsqudbKDm3I/AAAAAAAABL8/l3V9YUII0aU/s400/GetAttachment.aspx.jpeg

http://incrediblevanishingpaperweight.files.wordpress.com/2012/01/kill_your_television_by_hyge-d35c5i5.jpg

http://apps.cocoharris.net/blog/upload/c/o/cocoharris.net/9a2ccda60f2cc4cbdb40d5cdf46afb21.jpg

http://gwadzilla.blogspot.com/uploaded_images/tv-784317.jpg

xp Next-level move would be to pretend you've literally never heard of television and ask them to explain how it works, like you're Daryl Hannah in Splash.

Can't help thinking the Gordian knot of this dilemma could be cut with the rule one of all social interactions: Don't be a dick about it.

― What is wrong with songs? Absolutely nothing. Songs are great. (DL), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 6:06 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

the crux of the thread seems to be people thinking "i don't have a tv" = being a dick rather than stating a fact

for u britishers

http://www.turnoffyourtv.com/international/bbc.havealifead.jpg

the crux of the thread is that people who are dickish about about not owning a tv was excluded from conversation at the outset

xp That's the strict Branwellian interpretation. Everyone else is saying there are dickish and non-dickish ways of saying you don't have a TV.

garbled grammar there

and, well, not really, since that's most of what the thread is about as far as i can tell

haha this makes me want to turn on E channel full blast

http://bobsegarini.files.wordpress.com/2013/06/kill-your-tv.png

If we've learned anything from this thread, it's that tv ownership is in no way necessary in order to keep up with popular shows, so when your annoying co-worker asks you about Two and a Half Men, "I don't even own a TV" is a weak response at best.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/1/1e/Amusinghkn.jpg

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/f/f8/FourArgumentsForTheEliminationOfTelevision_0.jpg

hello, the 90's.

http://www.darlingbudsskullfkcrew.freeserve.co.uk/Kill%20Your%20Television%20-%20www.thedarlingbuds.co.uk.jpg\

ha, xps

the crux of the thread is that people who are dickish about about not owning a tv was excluded from conversation at the outset

― goole, Tuesday, April 1, 2014 1:14 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ding ding ding we have a winnah

But they do not exist they are figments of the imaginations of judgmental assholes DO U SEE

The concept of a "TV license" is pretty weird to me as a non-Britisher.

you might even think that the cultural context of television ownership is very different

when i read descriptions of van surveillance driving down streets searching for unlicensed TVs i only think of this:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/96/Rover.jpg/250px-Rover.jpg

how much is the bbc license?

i don't even know anyone who doesnt own a tv who isnt a dick about it

am manic for tv

This is the thread we buy TVs in, right

If we've learned anything from this thread, it's that tv ownership is in no way necessary in order to keep up with popular shows, so when your annoying co-worker asks you about Two and a Half Men, "I don't even own a TV" is a weak response at best.

― nitro-burning funny car (Moodles), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 2:19 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Even more of a reason why that co-worker is likely going to think you're trying to shift the conversation to how superior you are, unless you ease into that fact a little less abruptly.

exactly

when i read descriptions of van surveillance driving down streets searching for unlicensed TVs i only think of this:

I am pretty sure those vans didn't detect anything. Scientifically I'm not even sure it could work in theory. They just go round knocking on doors of houses that don't have licenses.

sounds like some black ops shit to me

The IDEOATV people have a smugness about them that feels almost class-based. Insert every argument about high-brow vs. low-brow culture here.

social status / background is definitely at play here, but i'm having trouble pinpointing how exactly... at this point there is probably no correlation btwn income level and owning a tv

tv is the cheapest form of entertainment for a family id imagine

when I was a child you could kick a ball in the street

when the weather's nice i can go days (weeks?) without watching tv. thank god for hulu/amzn/netflix tho bc there can be a lot of shitty weather around here

The IDEOATV people have a smugness about them that feels almost class-based. Insert every argument about high-brow vs. low-brow culture here.

social status / background is definitely at play here, but i'm having trouble pinpointing how exactly... at this point there is probably no correlation btwn income level and owning a tv

― hug niceman (psychgawsple), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 1:56 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

well for one, there's a huge class gap in broadband service in the US so IDEOATV'ers and cord cutters are likely middle class or DINKS

there's a huge geography gap, too

some of my coworkers who commute from relatively rural areas have no real broadband options other than cellular with really low download caps, so there's no way they're streaming video

yeah, there's some satellite broadband but it's hinky and super expensive

Your smug IDEOATV types (who don't exist in Branwellia) are overwhelmingly from the intellectually and culturally privileged. Such people are unlikely to come from the poor end of the economic spectrum so I think class is very much in play.

Sneering at the masses consuming their low brow prime time opiates comes from a similarly privileged sense of superiority.

tv is for old people

i should tell my 3 year old who is addicted to Dora and Dinosaur Train

she is beyond her years

she writes great fake captions to New Yorker cartoons

the fuck does intellectually privileged even mean, patent holders?

Educationally, sorry.

agree smug classism often at work

i own several TVs and watch none of them

i own two TVs, one for the butler, one for the au pair

TVs watch our children

xps - right, and the geography thing has a class element to it also

i guess i just have a problem with people itt who make it sound like they are being victimized for their lack of adherence to the status quo / not owning a tv. ime rejecting tv (or at least certain aspects/forms of tv - cable, reality tv, laugh track sitcoms, daytime anything) is a gross new type of status quo in certain circles

this could be more of a millenial/generational divide than a class divide tho

Such people are unlikely to come from the poor end of the economic spectrum so I think class is very much in play.

Sneering at the masses consuming their low brow prime time opiates comes from a similarly privileged sense of superiority.

― two bunny rabbits on mushrooms singing Proclaimers songs (onimo),

that is some sweet projecting there, love it!

whats yr income cogs, your parents income, etc

whats wrong with just watching the telly after work/on a sunday evening just for the sake of watching the telly

Looking a little better since we sold the land off to the developers!

Though you have to wonder about what types of people will be moving into the village now!

sometimes its nice to sit with yr m8s on a saturday night and laugh along with the sketch on ant and dec's saturday night takeaway when they made peter andre sing mysterious girl into a tuba and then tell someone he had a fetish for scottish men, what is wrong with that lex, what should we do instead? talk abour #brandydeepcuts instead?

i would feel pretty smug telling some TV license official, "why, I don't even own a TV!" then watch the long, slump-shouldered march back to the van in pouring rain. meanwhile, i have called the van license people on them...

sooo much projection happening itt

so i hear

Projectors are great if you have enough wall, saves space too.

urban haute bourgeosie don't fuc with tv

bourgeosie they don't fuc with tv
burbbhrbhbbhbburbbb

Projectors are great if you have enough wall, saves space too.

― Evan, Tuesday, April 1, 2014 3:23 PM (15 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

my projector didn't do 4K so i threw it in the trash

I want to get a cheap projector, does anyone have recs

every cheap projector i've used has been plagued by a really noisy fan

Every nice non-tv themed conversation one tries to have is plagued by a really noisy breaking bad fan

i dont even own a tv

I don't even own a projector

time to go listen to the dirty projectors

I stare at a garbage can with a face painted on it.

I own a TV but I took it apart and played with the RGB offset and various stuff and now it's for noise/experimental use only.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRNCFuEoJvI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5XhwwCzzfw

The first one is a performance, the second more or less just experimenting w oversized magnets.

I stare at a garbage can with a face painted on it.

― the Bronski Review (Trayce), Tuesday, 1 April 2014 22:57 (3 minutes ago) Permalink

Ugh, the ads are relentless

I met someone who said she didn't read fiction.

Beloved family members always die in fiction

I am pretty sure those vans didn't detect anything. Scientifically I'm not even sure it could work in theory. They just go round knocking on doors of houses that don't have licenses.

― Yuri Bashment (ShariVari), Tuesday, 1 April 2014 19:53 (Yesterday)

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-JMFFiek-peM/TimTfmrDfnI/AAAAAAAAAaY/68yHxJXy67I/s1600/Comms+Act+2003+SW+evidence+%25281%2529.png

lol i just bought a dora cup.

I met someone who said she didn't read fiction.

― have a nice blood/orange bitters cocktail (mh), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 6:08 PM (17 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

ha heard that one a few times

Do you think they're making it up?

I've heard the "I don't read fiction" thing from a few people. these people actually do seem to read a lot, it's just all non fiction.

haven't heard "I only watch documentaries" film equivalent.

lol i just bought a dora cup.

― beavis bacon (zxc), Tuesday, April 1, 2014 6:24 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

is this like a diva cup

my tv got stolen in a burglary and this thread is triggering

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e3/Trigger_Happy_TV_Titles.jpg

Most annoying: Being earwormed by "Flagpole Sitta."

it's actually a pretty good lyric in that context, a sly detournement on the phrase "i don't even own a tv", which was common in the 90s. so when the asshole singer says it, it's not meant to be a humblebrag or w/e, it's talking about some bizarro world where TVs actually have enslaved humans. *tokes*

i guess thread has taught me that the annoying thing about "IDEOATV" is that 99% of the time this response is provoked it happens in response to some annoying coworker or rando at a party talking about a tv show, which is something that 100% of all people with coworkers/randos deal with because even people who own TVs do not watch every show on it. people who try to shame you for not watching parks and rec are annoying even to those who watch other tv programs. but saying "IDEOATV" is like implying that every single person with a tv is conspiring to shame you when really annoying people are just really into shaming everyone. of course it's a totally rational and sensical thing to say (if someone recommends an app or something for my phone i will say "look at my phone this is not a smartphone" but i will be visibly bummed about my shitty phone :[ ) but it often comes off as "i don't *E*V*E*N* own a tv you unspectacular norm" key word "*E*V*E*N*" like it doesn't fucking matter barely anyone watches P+R anyway

tho i'm assuming this is different in stalinist england where there are only 4 channels of government-mandated programming and all they show are doctor who and east tenders

thread taught you 99% of em huh

i dont even own a tv... it owns me O SHT

I guess it's only really since the birth of my daughter that I had even really considered our not having a tv as an explicit lifestyle choice, but thinking about it i guess it has now become more of a conscious decision than it was originally.

I don't know if that has perhaps subtly changed my tone when it comes each time to answering this tv question, and it can be easy to get tone wrong - especially on certain subjects!

My boring experience: Used to watch a bit more TV when I cohabited with my partner but since financial circumstances meant we had to live apart I generally don't watch it, for a number of reasons.
First of all my living room is massively uncomfy to sit in. Our sofas are horrible, my housemate and his g/f are always in there and making it messy and it's just not a very nice place to be. Our aerial is rubbish too so even if I do try and watch something it's usually peppered by digital interruption.
I still watch a few shows though - mostly via the internet, so I like having the choice of what I'm viewing.
It's easy to be snobby about TV watchers, the kind of people who come home and spend hours each night just vegging out to whatever's on, but I try not to be that person because I waste an awful lot of time doing other things, surfing the net, listening to music and other stuff that wouldn't be considered directly productive. Over the years I've tried to cultivate a less passive lifestyle in my evenings, writing when I get home, making music, exercising etc. Right now it would destroy me to come home from work and just watch pre-programmed telly, but I can see why people do it.
Since I stopped watching TV as much, I'm always shocked at how overblown and obvious a lot of stuff is - particularly TV adverts which I genuinely find depressingly showy and fascinatingly manipulative at the same time. It's something I think people get desensitised to after a while, but when I'm not exposed to it, it really does freak me out quite a lot.

lots of adverbs about adverts in that last post. apologies.

the self-satisfied declarations of IDEOATV remind me of a dude I knew back in 1995 who used to pop into discussions of the OJ trial just to say, "What are you talking about? OJ Simpson? I've never even heard of him."

Most annoying: Being earwormed by "Flagpole Sitta."

I'm glad it's not just me! Every time I see the thread on New Answers...

My parents just watch TV all evening more or less regardless of what's on. I just refresh ILX all evening regardless of what's on. We will never understand each other, to the point of thinking the other preference is wasteful, moronic and rude (certainly I know they feel that way about me looking at my phone or the computer, even if they're just watching TV, and I kind of feel the same about snoring in front of News 24 from 6pm until bedtime every evening), even though it's basically the same thing.

Flagpole Sitta has been stuck in my head ever since this thread started and I'm not pleased.

You're lucky. They cut off my legs, now I'm an amputee.

God damn you.

why did peep show use that as the theme? they had a perfectly good theme!

Automatic thread bump. This poll is closing tomorrow.

Voted third option

My friend told me he doesn't watch TV when I asked him if he'd seen True Detective yet. I nearly thumped him, because he does watch TV.

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

the sockpuppets have spoken

I'm not sure I even understood the question in the first place.

Can we go through it again?

I realised I was a bit out of touch when I picked up a TV for free off the street and plugged the RF cable into the back that I presume is connected from my wall to an aerial on the roof, only to remember that they don't even broadcast analog TV any more.

http://drspikecook.com/files/2013/05/raising-the-bar-2dygued.jpg

yes you are out of touch

tbh I'd forgotten about that as well, and we've had a TV the whole time, but we have no analog aerial in our flat, just a Sky dish.

digital telly can come thru your analogue aerial

but you need a digital receiver for it

and a telly don't forget

I don't even have an analogue aerial.

Occurred to me the other day that "I don't even OWN a microwave! It would just sit in the corner of the kitchen doing nothing!" has now superseded IDEOATV! as a signifier of bourgie smuggery among some of my acquaintances.

is there analogue for microwaves for what sopranos/wire/mad men/breaking bad/true detective are to the telly?

hot pockets iirc

Use as a rice steamer.

quinoa actually

The landlord offered me a microwave but I had to turn it down, not out of smuggery but rather because the kitchenette in my bedsit has so little surface area that I would have no room left to prepare food :(

Most new TVs are digital ready so you can just plug in the rf rabbit ears and get HD broadcast. Best HD around! Better quality than most cable or satellite

telly goes on top of the microwave

i DVR hot pocket commercials so i can watch them while i cook a hot pocket

How many bites per second you getting

1080pepperoni

I wouldn't even know what 1080pepperoni is

it's a snowboarding ariel trick where you do 3 complete turns with your dick out

a gazelle is involved

as is the little mermaid

shd've been an option for that rhetorical 180 where you oh fuck it i'm knackered fuck yall bourgie cunts

haha