Television

That's a dreadful thing to say.

This is a joke right? Television had been around for years before U2 even decided to become a band, and Edge cites Television as an influence. Edge couldn't hold a candle to either Verlaine's or Lloyd's playing, without effects boxes there would be no U2.

anyone heard (WTF?) the new richard lloyd hendrix covers (WTF?) and/or seen a recent show?
http://www.brooklynvegan.com/archives/2009/04/televisions_ric.html

I got his first solo album. Strikingly like mid-period Nick Lowe!

damn i didn't know he just played D.C. a couple weeks ago, i totally would've been into seeing Lloyd cover Hendrix

so i went last night. he didn't really play many hendrix songs but did do sterling versions of "friction" and "elevation." dude is an a-mazing guitar player. he had laryngitis though which sucked

Billy Ficca's playing drums with him right? That'd be a bonus for sure.

Sounds awesome.

I keep hoping Television get together and do another album like they did with that s/t one in, what, the early '90s?, that surprises me by actually being pretty good.

i think it was billy yeah and the two of them were having a lot of fun together. a few times it seemed like they were making up songs on the spot for a minute or two before going into something familiar

cool, wish Lloyd/Ficca would come to my neck of the woods.
there were some rumors that Television was recording an album -- without Lloyd!! -- a year or two back. Don't know if that would really end up being a Television album or just a Tom Verlaine solo record. Anyway, they had been playing about an albums' worth of new songs between 2002-2006. Not exactly the most ambitious band in the world, in terms of recording, though.

that brooklynvegan link upthread mentions that television are currently recording, with jimmy ripp on guitar.

ah yes, that is what I had heard. i think Lloyd made a big announcement a few years back about how he was quitting Television once and for all, but that he gave them his blessing to continue without him. Still, Television w/o Lloyd just seems like Tom Verlaine solo -- Ripp, Ficca and Smith have all played on his solo records, anyway. Whatever, it'd be nice to have some new Verlaine/Television material. What I've heard from various live tapes sounds prettty sweet.

Who is Jimmy Ripp :(

Dude who played guitar with Verlaine throughout the 80s and 90s. Great player actually.

at this point, he's probably logged more hours with Tom than Lloyd has.

at the last television show i saw, 2005 i think?, he played some great stuff i didn't reccognize. I particularly remember a long song with a terrific eastern motif.

Sounds hopeful. Still sad to think of that band without Lloyd.

yeah, would be pretty weird to have a Television album w/o Lloyd -- is there a single review of that band that doesn't talk about the dueling Verlaine/Lloyd guitars? it's pretty much their signature.

i've only seen television once - one of the early '00s reunion shows in DC - but my main takeaway was that i'd severely overrated verlaine and underrated lloyd as guitarists. verlaine was a mess (sometimes in a really good way, obvs) with flashes of inspiration, but lloyd was lyrical, hypnotic, and locked on. it was weird to realize how many times i'd listened to recordings and been like "omg verlaine!" when it was actually lloyd's playing. verlaine rules, but i think his stuff is more of an "if you catch him on a good night, wow" kinda thing.

yeah i don't think Verlaine's heart is in the epic intense guitar solos these days. he can still do great stuff, but i think he left the heavy lifting to Lloyd in the various reunions. Like when I've heard latter-day versions of "Little Johnny Jewel" Tom barely seems there, whereas he kills it on those 70s recordings.

yeah...you just hear Verlaine's name so much more than when you hear guitar stuff on the albums you kinda assume it's him until you learn otherwise...i wish they'd credited who did which solos/leads on Marquee Moon like they did for the self-titled album.

xpost

they did! it's on the vinyl, anyway.

I heard somewhere or other that Lloyd's parts were a lot more written than Verlaine's, much truth in that ya suppose?

ah really? I need to check my CD reissue to see if it's in there.

oh totally, re: Lloyd's parts. On Marquee Moon, Richard doubletracked every note he played.

xpost the guitar solo credits etc are def on the rhino cd reish

saw the reformed television twice this decade, and both times the tension between verlaine and lloyd was self-evident in the way that they played together, stood on stage together, glared at each other (mostly tom) etc etc - i wouldn't say that either of 'em was 'better' on the night, tho' the second time around (2004) the whole group was noticeably sloppier - the first time i saw 'em (at the Tortoise curated ATP in 2001) the version of 'little johnny jewel' they delivered was stunning and tom v was on fire

in 2006 i saw verlaine and ripp play a really sweet duo set at the 100 club - ripp was v. much the accompaniest and subservient to the master, and verlaine seemed much more engaged w/ the material and event, even when playing a few of the old hits - i don't ever expect to see tom in action so close up and personal, and he was def. on form that night - so he still has it, still

yeah i've heard some of the Ripp/Verlaine duo (mostly instrumental) -- really lovely stuff!

btw if yr interested in hearing a bunch of vintage Television bootlegs, I did a long overview at my blog a couple weeks back: http://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/ I'll get around to the reunion years someday.

hmm: http://aquariumdrunkard.tumblr.com/post/677685931/indieandyy-careful-by-local-natives-originally
Aquarium Drunkard will be digitally releasing L’Aventure on June 22, featuring 8 Los Angeles bands each covering a track from the 1978 Television LP, Adventure.
1.The Henry Clay People: “Glory”
2.Foreign Born: “Days”
3.The Happy Hollows: “Foxhole”
4.Local Natives: “Careful”
5.The Deadly Syndrome: “Carried Away”
6.Imaad Wasif [ft. Lykke Li]: “The Fire”
7.Dirt Dress: “Ain’t That Nothin’”
8.Growlers: “The Dream’s Dream”
don't know any of these bands ... good/bad/eh?

local la bands, seen most of them, none of them are that bad but nothing really that special about any of em

^^ tyler--any chance that you could re-post No Glamour-- later TV @ Academy '92?

yeah, sure i'll re-post that one. totally an amazing set. blows away the s/t record. lloyd's solo on 1880 or so = craaaaaazy.
i'm in the process of putting together a couple of comps covering unreleased Television songs from the 70s and the 00s for the blog, too.

Venus de Milo has no arms, fwiw

^^ thanks tyler--sounds great!

this covers thing has me thinking -- are there any really *great* television covers? i liked chris stamey's mellow take on "venus" ... feelies do a good see no evil. clientele did a nice version of "the fire" a few years back.

[ft. Lykke Li]

Huh? How'd she get involved? (swedish pop princess (imo :))

LOL Upthread somebody said Television was a rip-off of early U2. I fervently pray that they were kidding.

'Marquee Moon' remains one of the great guitar-oriented rock LPs, a distinction that was certainly not damaged by the inclusion of "Little Johnny Jewel" on the reissue. The arrangements are also spot-on, the melodies infectious. The other records are also very good. 'The Blow-Up' is a terrific sounds-like-you're-there live recording & the s/t comeback disc was better than I thought it was going to be. 'Adventure' isn't as crazy-good as 'Marquee Moon' but I think it suffers only by comparison. Pretty solid throughout & it makes me wish they had continued long enough to do a 3rd LP so we could really judge its sophtware (sic) slump qualities more accurately. BUt - there ya go...

LOL Upthread somebody said Television was a rip-off of early U2.

omg holy lols

It was dave q, it was a joke

this is cool -- the classic ARROW bootleg, uploaded by the taper/bootlegger himself: luckypsychichut.blogspot.com/2009/11/television-arrow-bootleg.html
pretty awesome bootleg (most of it shows up on the Blow Up, but as the dude notes, it sounds better here). Johnny Jewel might be the definitive version.

cool indeed, thanks

From that blog:

Tom Verlaine is now my girlfriend's grumpy upstairs neighbor and has (like myself) lost most of his teeth, but I still get a kick out of seeing him stumbling in off the street with a pizza for dinner, mumbling a few random problems that need fixing to the doorman.

haha, sounds about right.

Hate the way The Blow Up sounds

Would be nicer if he'd uploaded the whole show, not just the stuff on Arrow. I might have been at this show btw. They played at My Father's Place three times in '78 & I don't remember which one I went to. It was definitely before the Adventure album came out. I spent a fair amount of time thinking TV had a new song called "Fatso, Fatso."

lol. i've got at least one of the complete father's place recordings, incredibly jealous you got to see it in person. television was pretty much the best band on the planet at that point. just amazing.

Hahaha
There's a link in the comments to a blog that offers an entire 78 Television show. Not sure if it's the same gig though (can't check quickly as I'm browsing on a not so handy phone).

phone allows xposts...

tbh i remember it less for the performance than for the pigeon who shat on me afterward. The club was situated next to a tall viaduct, & people parked underneath (illegally, as it turned out -- that's nominally what did the club in, lack of legal parking, though what really did it in was NIMBY on the part of the good people of Old Roslyn). usually the pigeons would be kind enough only to use the cars for target practice, but this one was particularly ornery. The performance was great, of course. I'm an old fogy, though -- in 1978, the bar was just set higher. Lots of performances were great. I prolly just go to the wrong shows, now, i dunno...

i'm even jealous of your pigeon story. srsly, if i was granted one time machine trip it might be to go see television around that time.

just posted this - an imaginary third 70s television album made up of unreleased live tunes 1975-78 http://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/post/5667774473/kingdom-come-the-lost-television-album-dont-get

all over that thanks!!

damn tyler awesome

thaking u

no problem. it is pretty good!

:):):):):)

got around to getting Portland '78 off yr blog and jesus fucking christ

weirdness!
Metallica's Lars Ulrich On His Cult Heroes
To me, Television’s first record still sounds as fresh today and as all-round awesome as it did in 1977. I grew up in Copenhagen, and pretty much I got everything I knew about music came from this tiny record store there. There weren’t any Danish music periodicals, so it was all word of mouth in this place, and I remember this guy called Tim who put me onto all kind of things – including 'Marquee Moon'.

Television played Copenhagen around the time it came in, and I saw them in this tiny venue. The Pistols had played in Copenhagen in June or July of 77, the Ramones played as well. ACDC came down too, and played in early September. So in the span of about three months the Pistols, Ramones, ACDC and Television had all played in my home town as headline acts. Excellent! Those concerts were actually what kept me alive at that time.

With Television, I got the sense that here was a real band who were really connecting with each other. Obviously Tom Verlaine was the mainman, but some of the songs on that first album, like 'Friction', are just so intricate. That one's actually like this real hard rock track too. Don’t tell anyone this but 'Marquee Moon' is one of my secret tracks for Metallica to play. I'm gonna try and sneak that one in there without anyone noticing!

"i rememberuuuh how the darkness duhbuhlledyeaah"

Ah recalluh.....lightnin struck itselffffffah

the lightningggggah rode itself!

I'm imagining Lars' double-bass-drums bit from "One" ruining the post-solo breakdown.

who's actually had the guts to cover marquee moon? i've heard that kronos quartet version, but can't think of others.

One could argue that Richard & Linda Thompson covered it before it was recorded...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uXB4q-V14TI
hee hee

this television cover band from NC actually sound pretty rad:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2cIwVhL183A

Kronos Quartet covered Marquee Moon on an Elektra anniversary comp. Not on YouTube...

I remember liking it. Probably have the tape somewhere in the attic

I do have the cassette version that the previous owner transferred onto CD.

It's not all that, really.

Ha, just now seeing that tyler already mentioned it. Ah well, it's here: http://somegirlinspace.blogspot.com/2007/04/marquee-moon.html.

i heard a mashup of the original television "marquee moon" with the kronos quartet version. which was interesting. didn't quite work.

Ah recalluh.....lightnin struck itselffffffah

Been enjoying the lost third TV album!

oh cool, yeah there's some good stuff on there. amazing that there hasn't been some sort of television box set ... or at least a rarities comp.

tyler, the "lost" "third" "album" is aceee, thankyou very much.

^ seconded, well done Tyler

The actual third album is quite excellent – my introduction to the boys.

Thanks as usual Tyler

apparently there's a new television track on some japanese benefit LP? can't really find too much info, but it's without lloyd. so strange.

http://www.headheritage.co.uk/headtohead/unsung/topic/62553/

kind of a bizarre tracklist!
Vinyl Japan/Eikoku Ongaku
” OMOIYARI FOR JAPAN " international music rescue vol.1
vinyl japan label 英国音楽 2CD set 2100 ( inc: VAT )

DISC1:
1.AUTAMATA / OUT OF THIS ( from the album " MY SANCTUARY " )
2.BOZ BOORER / TOKYO CALLING ( special recording for this charity album " )
3.DAGMAR KRAUSE / MESSAGES ( previously unreleased song )
4.DEAF SCHOOL / TAXI ( live version )
5.THE DIVINE COMEDY / CERTAINTY OF CHANCE ( previously unreleased version )
6.ELLIOTT MURPHY AND THE NORMANDY ALL STAR BAND FEATURING OLIVIER DURAND
/COUNTERCLOCKWISE ( from the album " ELLIOT MURPHY " )
7.FRIENDS / THIS IS THE START (TRUMPET MIX)( unreleased different version )
8.THE HEP CHAPS / JUST DUG SPUDS ( from album " CLOSE YOUR EYES " )
9.HONEY BANE / THIS AIN'T REALITY ( from the album
" ACCEPTANCE OF EXISTENCE "
10.JEREMY GLUCK & KATE McEWAN / WHISPER(MARTY THAU MIX)
11.JIMMY RIP & THE TRIP / SLOW SOUTHERN WAYS ( unreleased version )
12.THE LOTUS EATERS / IF YOU LEAVE ME NOW ( from the album " DIFFERENCE " )
13.MENACE / I DON'T CARE ( from the album " TOO MANY PUNKS ARE DEAD " )
14.THE MONOCHROME SET / EINE SYMPHONIE DES GRAUENS( unreleased live version )
15.PAT FISH / ALL THE SAINTS ( unreleased song )
DISC2:
1.RICHARD HELL / TIME ( from the album " DESTINY STREET REPAIRED " )
2.RICHARD LLOYD / GLURP ( from the album " THE RADIANT MONKEY " )
3.TELEVISION / MISTAKES ( previously unreleased )
4.TOM VERLAINE / LEAVES ( special new recording for this charity album )
5.PHIL WILSON / I OWN IT ( previously unreleased demo version )
6.THE POOH STICKS / JUST ANOTHER MINUTE ( from the album " MULTIPLE ORGASM" )
7.SECRET AFFAIR / LAND OF HOPE ( from the album " THE SINGLE COLLECTION " )
8.SNIFF'N' THE TEARS / PRAY ( from new album " DOWNSTREAM " )
9.STRANGEFRUIT / THE BELL ( previously unreleased song )
10. TENDER TRAP / SUDDENLY ( from the album " DANSETTE DANSETTE " )
11.TREE / ALRIGHT ( special new recording for this album )
12.THE UNDERTONES / THRILL ME ( from the album " GET WHAT YOU NEED " )
13 VANESSA CONTENAY-QUINONES / SHOW ME HOW ( special new recording )
14.WOODENBOX WITH A FISTFUL OF FIVERS / TWISTED MILE ( unreleased version )
15.THE ZOMBIES / SHE'S NOT THERE ( from the live album " LIVE AT THE BLOOMSBURY THEATRE, LONDON " )

There was a great 80s jangle band from Mississippi called The Windbreakers that did a pretty good job covering Glory. I can't find any links to it on youtube but you can hear 30 seconds of it here:

http://www.amazon.com/Windbreakers/e/B000ARA13E/ref=sr_ntt_srch_lnk_1?qid=1306506196&sr=8-1

The Windbreakers were okay, but I think they had the worst band name ever.

was actually surprised this didn't already exist, but i guess it's coming out next week:
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41C4w8sJiXL._BO2,204,203,200_PIsitb-sticker-arrow-click,TopRight,35,-76_AA300_SH20_OU01_.jpg

ooo

looks to be pretty long! at least long compared to some of these 33 1/3 books. guess you've gotta have at least 100 pages to discuss verlaine's solo on the title track.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rh9fHZ17HWE&feature=player_embedded
new track! ummm underwhelming, but sort of cool.

So I caught a bit of a pretty rad broadcast on WNYU yesterday -- they had a guest who seemed to have written a book about Television or maybe just the CBGB scene or something, but I didn't catch who he was. Anyway, the guy played this version of Friction from some demos recorded by Eno while Hell was still in the band, so fucking awesome. Found it here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjEFuUNc3Uc

Whole broadcast is here:
http://wnyu.org/2011-09-29_newafternoonshow

BrYan Eno, ha.

Marquee Moon with the guitar lick on the other beat:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YS27RAXhBWQ

http://www.thedailyswarm.com/headlines/televisions-richard-lloyd-tells-his-side-story-comment-section/

Ha. Verlaine is kind of my least favorite thing about Television, although I'm kind of shocked at how bitter Lloyd is after all these years.

I saw Television play maybe a decade ago, and they were pretty good. But Lloyd broke a guitar string a couple of minutes into "Marquee Moon." Surprisingly, the band did not stop playing while Lloyd - patiently, almost slowly, definitely not smiling - crouched at the side of the stage and changed the string. The rest of the band sort of ambled through the song til Lloyd joined in again at the very end. Wasn't terrible, but it was strange!

was that the Metro show -- odd, I don't remember that at all! I remember the whole show being fantastic tho, what a high!

It was the Metro show, yeah. It was totally great, wasn't it? I want to say it ended with "Prove It" and feature some "Nuggets" cover. "MM" didn't sound bad minus Lloyd, oddly. I just thought it odd how he handled it, and that he had neither a second guitar nor a roadie to change the string for him.

Oh yeah, they covered "Psychotic Reaction."

Josh, yeah that show was super duper good. couldn't believe I was standing there watching Television! the thing that struck me the most was Billy Ficca's drumming -- what a fantastic drummer! like, I always thought of Television as a guitar band, and never really concentrated on the rhythm section, but watching Ficca live really noticed how solid he is

I also want to say that show was the same night Joey Ramone died. or was it John Fahey? they both passed in quick succession. I remember driving home and learning that one of them had died. wiki tells me it would have been feb or april 2001

Lloyd spilling all this bile after leaving the band he was in for 30+ years is just kind of uncomfortable and unnecessary -- like even if every word he says is true, it's like dude, you hung in there that long by choice, you have noone to blame but yourself, stop patting yourself on the back for being so 'loyal' to the guys you're now trashing all over the internet.

TBF, hanging in there didn't exactly take a of effort.

well he makes it sound like he was constantly putting his life outside the band on hold for three creatively fruitless decades in which they only made one forgettable album and were always discussing recording again. which does suck for him, if true, but again it's a 'fool me once, shame on you' thing.

Sure, but if that's your thing, and you like doing it, then yeah, you would cancel tours and sessions and stuff every time Tom Verlaine asked. It was foolish, after all that time off, for Lloyd to really sacrifice anything for the sake of the band. All I know is that I honestly appreciate Lloyd's contributions to those Matthew Sweet records more than anything Verlaine has done since "Marquee Moon."

I have his solo album, it sounds like Nick Lowe.

ha -- I love the '92 "reunion" album.

Alchemy? Because he made some other solo albums after that with Swedish only release or something. Alchemy was great, complete with a "Love Is Strange" sound alike, RIP Sylvia Robinson. So yeah, like Nick Lowe, fair enough.

All I know is that I honestly appreciate Lloyd's contributions to those Matthew Sweet records more than anything Verlaine has done since "Marquee Moon."

QFT.

i dunno, you gys are missing out, verlaine has a lot of stellar material/guitar playing post-MM.
lloyd freaking out is weird, but i think he might just be a weird dude.

gys = guys

posted this elsewhere, but you want a primer on how good verlaine can be w/o television, check this out: http://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/post/8834986475/pull-down-the-future-covering-two-decades-of-live

All I know is that I honestly appreciate Lloyd's contributions to those Matthew Sweet records more than anything Verlaine has done since "Marquee Moon."

ur totally out of your mind. Listen to the shit Tyler posted.

re: the stuff Lloyd's been posting. Lloyd and Verlaine are both dicks. Lloyd, additionally, is for-real crazy. All of it should be taken with a huge grain of salt (a salt lick maybe).

Richard Lloyd's live "Real Time" is fantastic.

it's funny, when i interviewed lloyd many years ago, he was surprisingly friendly/norma, for the most part. i had expected a really cranky dude. don't know if he kinda goes through phases of craziness or what.
lloyd does get some pretty sweet guitar spots on the new rocket from the tombs record. on spotify if you're curious.

"friendly/normal" not norma. having trouble typing today.

Lloyd's website is an embarrassment of riches for guitar students (especially for guitar students who love Richard Lloyd's playing). Every lesson is accompanied by a thoughtful bit of advice/wisdom, and nowhere does he come off as cranky or not-all-there.

...aaaaand now that I check his site, it seems the lessons are nowhere to be found.

yeah, i remember a lot of those lessons. maybe he released a dvd of them or something?
at some point, he had all of this bizarre pseudo mystical stuff up, couldn't tell if he was kidding or what.

He took down the lessons from his website! (xpost)
I remember them being interesting, kind of deep, not just "here are a few of my favorite chord shapes and licks," which you wouldn't really expect from him anyway, but still.

I printed out a few of the exercises, and have used them every day for years now. Invaluable shit.

yeah, there's some guitar-y stuff left over in the ask richard section. he seems pretty reasonable there for the most part.

re: RFTT, I saw Lloyd with them in around 2005 or so, and yep, he killed. The crowd was hanging on every note. David Thomas, for his part, sat on a chair in the middle of the stage with a bottle of Courvoisier.

Me preferring Lloyd on the Sweet records has nothing to do with Verlaine's own undeniable talents. It has to do with ... preference. As in, what I actually prefer to listen to. Lloyd (and Quine) were just such a surprisingly perfect fit for that stuff.

Yeah, I want to say I saw RFFT that same year, mostly for Lloyd, honestly. Want to say Thomas was barely ambulatory, leaning on a cane.

huh, i saw an earlier RFTT show (2003-ish?) and Thomas was pretty explosive. He did sit a little bit, but he also went nuts.

Fuck I wish I could find this article written by a dude who traveled with RL on one of his recent tours, kind of a profile piece. I thought I had the link in my email somewhere... anyway, I am far from a behavioral health expert but it seemed pretty obv RL was bipolar.

Re: RFTT I wonder if Thomas was hurt for those shows? He has a pretty active stage presence IME

He was pretty hefty, and it looked like his knees were suffering. This was in NYC, whenever it was.

On the plus side, after the show, Thomas stayed in his stage chair and personally sold RFTT CDs (possibly to circumvent that venue's policy of taking 20% of bands' CD sales). I probably wouldn't have bought one otherwise, but I'm glad I did (for getting to meet Thomas and for Lloyd's playing on the record).

Is this the most underachieving band in the history of rock? You could make a strong argument. They had all the talent in the world, and one of the three or four best debut albums ever. But after 1977 it was all downhill, save for a handful of good songs.

For sure. There are some people that think the band started to go downhill before it even hit the studio!

While I happily agree that MM stands at the apex of TV/Verlaine/Lloyd's output, statements like "all downhill save for a handful of good songs" srsly boggle my mind. I mean, tons of ppl say this, it's not a minority view at all. But I don't know how to reconcile it with what i hear...

yeah, i just think that if you really like marquee moon, then you'll find plenty to love in the records that came after.
do any of them reach the heights of MM? maybe not, but very few things do!

Yeah, like I said upthread, I love the '92 album as much as Adventure – two very good albums.

the live album shows that adventure's problems were more bloodless production and not so much material (i think the adventure songs on the old waldorf just shine)

^ this

i dig the more textured approach on adventure's slower songs -- the fire, carried away, days, but yeah, the rockers come off way better live.

i'd put "the dream's dream" old waldorf up against anything on marquee moon

otm, it's otherworldly.

The first time I listed to the Old Waldorf show I wasn't looking at the track listing, and the segueway from "The Dream's Dream" into "Venus" blew me away.

Old Waldorf is basically the 2nd Television album as far as I'm concerned, everyone should own it.

the rockers come off way better live.

Ain't That Nothin' in particular.

Richard Lloyd is 60 today. Happy birthday, dude.

shine on you crazy diamond

Seconded

Happy birthday!

Aside, fun Verlaine stories from Steve Kilbey yesterday

when i was a kid
i was scouring all the music rags
looking for the next big thing
i read a small article on a band called television
in a mag called rock scene
it was written by patti smith
she wrote about this guy tom verlaines hands
how he was the kinda guy you’d wanna lose yer virginity to….
over the next few years there were tantalising references constantly
all of em saying how this band were incredible
johnny jewel a single (kinda strange but intriguing)
and bits and pieces until in 1977 the first album came out
of course it was called marquee moon
and verily it was all they said it would be
an incredible record
34 years later today
i got an email from some guys watching televisions current progress
co guitarist richard lloyd is out
and some other guy jimmy rip is in
theres a whole argument going down on youtube
richard lloyd weighing in slagging off tv
funny that people are interested in these ancient clashes
i met tv in 1988
he was opening for the church and peter murphy
he wanted to borrow my acoustic guitar
it was a black guild ..it got stolen n broke my heart
as soon as he played one note you could hear it was him
a totally unique approach dare i say virtuoso
pk sometimes has this effect like a total understanding
anyway tv was sposed to go on murphys bus
but within one second tv had some falling out with murph
and ended up on our bus for a whole tour
he started the night with a 30 minute set
alone with an acoustic he was kinda ordinary
he was very jokey in a bizarre way on and off stage
he was a total caffeine and nicotine man too
he was always wired tho he eschewed all other substances
television had been a huge influence on us all
we were all quite surprised n impressed to have tv with us
he treated me a bit like an annoying kid and i probably deserved it
i blabbed on to him all day about television ..why i liked them…
but he was bemused and sent me up a bit
we played monopoly for real money once on the bus
and tv bickered over the fuckin’ rules and argued the toss
eeerrr kil-bee lets see uh this triple double in jail rule
uh i think this is an uh english rule and uh i aint goin’ to jail..
how bizarre to be arguing monopoly rules with verlaine
somewhere in dakota or wherever as we sped thru the night
as the tour progressed tv would come out each night and play with us
we did :you took and cortez the killer with 3 lead guitarists
3 of the very best you can get too
offstage however
tv was an incredible stingy miser arguing over every last cent literally
eerrr uh kil-bee uh you should pay an extra 75 cents for your share of the fries
this was one of the complaints on the you tube vids toms meanness
he was never very complimentary about richard lloyd either
lloyd didnt have anything to do with it if you listened to tv
he downplayed the guy right outta existence
it was unnecessary i thought to be so ungracious….
one day off in houston we went to this place
it was 1988 and you could record your vocal over a cassette backing
i sang my vocal over i left my heart in san francisco ( for DT)
tv got some old country n western track n giggled n whispered n muttered
he played it back to us convinced he’d found some new direction
one night the phone rang in my room
eerr kil-bee eerr uh i’m down here in the bar with some divorcees
and i was ah wondrin’ if uh you could uh take one off my hands …
he was very charismatic and quite the ladies man
every night different women would seek him out backstage
strangely none seemed too bizarre for his taste
he had a little sweetie in every town
one morning we checked in some place early on the east coast
it was winter and snow lay on the ground
tv suggested a walk
and we hiked up this hill with a reservoir at the top
it was 630 in the morning and we interrupted something
cos suddenly about 10 big black guys were chasing us
baying for our blood
tv and i ran downhill into the woods
tv was like a thoroughbred horse leaping thru the trees
it was weird to be in such a pickle with a one time idol
anyway the stuff that happened onstage when he joined us was magic
he could coax a million sounds from a guitar trains and birds
and doppler effects and helicopters and guns ..anything..
but you could never see exactly how he did it …he was a true genius
we vaguely planned on recording together but his heart wasnt in it
we bickered over the financial details and that was it
i dont believe it would have worked out anyway
tv had some essential suspicious jokey sarcastic ny schtick
it was hard to get through it
he insulted lembo who was trying to manage him
and lembo couldnt see the financial gain
as opposed to the grief n pain that managing tv would bring
he was ungrateful in spades and just incredibly penny pinching
like a scrooge from brooklyn or something
it was an unnerving mixture
we drifted apart after the tour i never saw him again
marty played on on of ’is solo records
and the church did an insipid uninspired version of friction
funny seeing tv on that show in portugal just filmed lately
that same old cagey grin that same old tom cat jive
jesus what a character
ha ha

hee hee
too bad verlaine and lloyd seem to loath each other. they sure sound good together
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=72GLZ-8zQEo

I was trying to think of the right way to describe Lloyd's place in Television, not a co-equal, not a sideman. When he first joined he's said he felt like George (with Hell and Verlaine as John and Paul), but once Hell split it's not like it was really Paul and George. Lloyd seems like the catalyst that made Verlaine's ideas work and turned them into something bigger. Which maybe Verlaine couldn't forgive him for, in a way.

I dunno, it seems Lloyd kept the George role, whereas Verlaine and Smith did different than John and Paul.

or something.

http://static.ow.ly/photos/normal/k1Cs.jpg
saw this in Denver this morning. don't know the band, would be tough to pull off Television, you'd have to have chops!

Hmm, over here they'd have to state, explicitly, that they are 'tribute' acts.

in tiny type, it says Wire Faces Performing As ... though I guess it doesn't say that it's tribute acts to blondie, talking heads et al. would be awesome if someone went to this tiny club thinking they were going to see the ramones, miraculously reunited.

Given the enduring popularity of Hot Topic Ramones & CBGB shirts, it wouldn't actually surprise me to see "The Ramones" -- Marky and a cast of young ringers -- touring state fairs sometime (like the version of Foghat I saw that had only the original drummer, Roger Earl.)

Now you said that, I can just about read it. Usually that's the "Here Goldmid productions presents" line.

Obviously, that's a tribute to Harvey Goldsmith performing as a promoter.

not sure how they're going to play television songs with just three dudes

one of those dudes has four arms though.
i read up a bit on them and i guess they're a little proggy? or at least mars volta-y. whatever, i'm not going.

Given the enduring popularity of Hot Topic Ramones & CBGB shirts, it wouldn't actually surprise me to see "The Ramones" -- Marky and a cast of young ringers -- touring state fairs sometime (like the version of Foghat I saw that had only the original drummer, Roger Earl.)

― Blue Doggie Sweater (Dan Peterson), Thursday, October 27, 2011 3:27 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark

he's been touring around playing a set of Ramones songs w/ a band called Marky Ramone's Blitzkrieg, which i think is totally fine and cool since he's not messing w/ the Ramones name or anything

Some new song I guess by Verlaine:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h81L7VrFzro

That's an old Civil War-era folk song. I like the noir-y band arrangement! Maybe an outtake from Songs And Other Things?

Oh god. I only just realised the T of Tom and the V of Verlaine = TV = Television. I am the stupidest person alive.

^^is that supposed to be well-known? Whoa.

After roughly 23 years of Television fandom, that never occured to me.

ha, i think i remember reading an interview w/ either Hell or Verlaine where they said it hadn't occurred to them either! or that the name 'Television' came before Verlaine chose the name Verlaine.

puns that you had missed

i don't even own a television record

The Blow-Up, at least on Roir's once notoriously (but no worse than many a homemade) normal bias lo-fi cassette, was better heard as the earlier vinyl boot Arrow (prob ditto the digital Arrow posted on tylerw's blog, along with several other Television and Tom Verlaine sets). Funny, I was just remembering how their (mostly Verlaine and Lloyd's 70s rep as self-destructive and generally shady was summed up as "an ill-natured hippie band" by Creem's Robert Duncan. And how Buffalo Springfield's June 2011 Bonnaroo "Bluebird" epic (currently on YouTube) reminded me of Neil Young, in a very good way (way better than any of the early Springfield extensions of it I've heard so far, incl the one on Retrospective). Then I came across robertchristgau.com's archived 2004 review of reissued MM and Adventure (each with a worthy bonus track, he says) and Old Walrdorf (which he says sounds a lot better than Blow-Up) and he now (or on then, in '04) thinks Verlaine sounds somewhat like Young and Garcia, though not as "raw" as the former, or "clean" as the latter. Refined and dirty, awright! Though xgau also starts by saying Television were doomed to commercial failure because they didn't sound like anyone before or since (h'mmm, maybe he means the overall effect, incl Verlaine's "strangulated" vocals). Also, extended solos were def not favored in emerging 70s punk/pop orthodoxy/trends.

Oh yeah, the extended Verlaine reissues from a few years back are worth checking too, and the most (?) recently released albums of new material, on Thrill Jockey (but those two should've been pruned and merged into one medium-length set.)

Oops. I meant the 2011 "Bluebird" reminded me of **Television** in a good way!

Bluebird was the 'Marquee Moon' (track) of its day, and Buffalo Springfield was the Television of its day. Multiple guitar assault

here's a bit from the review of that television cover band
Wire Faces' performance as Television was one of the great highlights of the evening. Dressed in nerdish art-school clothing, guitarist Ian Haygood looked like Tom Verlain, while drummer Shane Zweygardt sang just like him. Although most of the bands got the crowd bouncing and dancing, Wire Faces held them spellbound with a flawless note-by-note rendition of almost the entire Marquee Moon album. Zweygardt shimmied atop his drumstool while belting out each song with an electrifying energy and incessant mimicry of Verlain's nasally whine.
hmm

kind of like that new verlaine track! not amazing or anything, but what the hell, i'd like the dude to be more active.

God bless the uploader, he just put up a hilarious video of Verlaine & Co messing with mtv brazil:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXaUwo2DSns

hee hee
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dNAvIBKkAJQ&feature=related
this is good too.
would be interesting if Verlaine did a memoir, though I won't hold my breath.

http://30.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m1rl1aJY0L1qdivb3o1_500.jpg
This day in 1974: Television plays their first show at CBGB.

& if you're interested in hearing roughly what they sounded like: http://ow.ly/9yMDD

pretty awesome that the "birthplace" of punk originally had such a cornball logo. and "fancy guitar pickin's."

u know what it stands for yeah?

ha, yes. still!

Wild Flag did an ace version of "Evil" last night in New Haven as the first song of their encore.

http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_m3rgdiOmCw1qzy30io1_500.gif
Dave Bowie!

He went by that in his "Regular Ol' Dave" period

That's Dave Bowie, you know, he ran a lamp shop on 53rd and AoftheA's...

think they had a quote from Louie Reed on another flyer.

Louie "Louie Louie" Reed?

Dick Lloyd was on fire that night.

hee hee.
btw i've re-upped that television compilation i made featuring, um, dick hell. http://ow.ly/aNKo3 in case anyone didn't get it the first time around.

Was it a minutemen or firehose song where watt says 'dick hell'?

http://www.wikipedia.org/DavidBowie/RegularOlDave

During this exceedlingly brief, little-known period of his career, Bowie gained 20 pounds and began wearing sweatshirts, baseball caps and jeans. He wrote several songs for a planned country-influenced album, "Just a Good Ol' Bowie," none of which he ever recorded.

If I click on that link, will I be rickrolled?

Last '/' should be a '#' I think.

holy SHIT! The Portland 78 show has by far the best version of MM I've ever heard, like a million times better than the studio one, any one, just. WOW.

The Portland show is amazing. Unlike the Waldorf show all of the stuff from Adventure has a real tension as well as intention. Also there are about twenty people in the audience.

MARQUEE MOON - LIVE! http://ow.ly/bj0k4

Thanks for this, anticipating eagerly.

oh cool

is there any comprehensive collection of Television's '70s live repertoire of songs that ended up on neither MM nor Adventure? been reading the 33 1/3 on MM and wow they discarded a lot of songs on the way to making that album.

god there are so many... I think tyler maybe put up a collection on his blog?

just search the "Poor Circulation" boot, there's at least half a dozen on there.

some dude, search doom and gloom from the tomb for the comp "I was hearing, hearing something else": it's a really thorough round up of stuff that influenced them, their contemporaries, and lots and lots of their own stuff that didn't make it onto the records iirc

sweet thx

yeah some dude - here's the richard hell years: http://ow.ly/aNKo3 and here's the post-richard hell years "lost songs": http://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/post/5667774473/kingdom-come-the-lost-television-album-dont-get

evidently Television had quite a young following in Argentina.

weird!

So Lloyd went completely apeshit again: horrible gig, insulting Billy Ficca and his bassist, throwing drinks at Ficca, hitting women and eventually being taken away to a hospital. Wrong meds, or so I heard.
I really wish someone close to him would start caring about this instead of letting himself ruin his livelihood and reputation like this.

eek! yeah, what is up w/ him these days. maybe ficca is looking out for him to some extent -- not like he's going out on the road w/ him for the big bucks, i assume. though if lloyd is throwing drinks at him, that might not last.

http://www.clevescene.com/scene-and-heard/archives/2012/06/12/concert-review-richard-lloyd-at-the-grog-shop

Shortly before taking the stage, Lloyd and Ficca started shouting, appeared to shove each other and then threw their respective drinks at one another. Lloyd walked up to the microphone and pleaded Ficca to still play despite the fight. “You quitting or playing? I want you play. I love you like a brother,” he told Ficca. “Yeah, like Cain loved Abel,” responded Ficca. After a short stand-off, Ficca finally acquiesced, and the band opened with the Lloyd tune “I Thought,” an anxiety-ridden song that bristled a little more than usual. At the song’s conclusion, Lloyd muttered, “I’m so tired of the crap I have to put up with.” While he appeared intoxicated, he maintained that wasn’t the case. “I’m high on life,” he yelled.

Even after delivering spot-on renditions of the Television tracks “Friction” and “Elevation,” Lloyd was still simmering. “I take all the blame,” he said while tuning in front of his amp with his back to his audience. The show was so sparsely attended, however, that even when Lloyd didn’t speak into the microphone, you could still hear what he was saying. He sounded like someone with Tourette Syndrome as he muttered random things about Gamma Rays and DNA tests. Before playing the tune “Monkey,” he said, “monkey see, but monkey don’t do,” alluding to the fact that he wasn’t happy with the performance of his band mates.

ugh, sucks. from people i've talked to, ficca is one of the nicest dudes from that scene, lloyd must really be off the rails.

hitting women

so they gave him the "i abuse women" meds. oops!

It's really hard to keep manic depressives on their meds. They start to really miss the cosmic high of their manic phases.

yeah, it's gotta be the sort of thing where lloyd *knows* he did his best work off of meds (and high as a kite).

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNmEq-cP9Oo
don't really understand this but maybe the guitaristos out there can dig it.

what is that distinctive guitar sound on little johnny jewel, very "close up" aurally--it kind of sounds like when i would plug an electric guitar directly into the 4-track...does anyone get what i mean? such a bizarre song...

the "official" version of LJJ I mean

i think that is exactly what it is -- a guitar plugged straight into the recording device. it is a weird sound for sure -- doesn't really sound like anything else, which i gather is what Verlaine was going for.

i love how that solo sounds like it is always falling apart...i always think, i can play something that sounds vaguely like that but it never works. and i actually like the way that the solo sounds almost divorced from the backing track, although maybe that was just poor production? anyway, i am sort of obsessed with LJJ right now!

it's a pretty lo-fi recording and the mix is definitely strange. i heard the blow up version of LJJ first and was kind of taken aback by the single on first listen. love it though.
the feelies did the direct plug-in thing a bit on crazy rhythms too -- don't know if it was because they knew television had done it, but i wouldn't be surprised.

Wild Flag opened its Pitchfork fest set with a dead-on "See No Evil."

That bizarro guitar sound, by the way, barely sounds like an electric. I guess it could be or most likely is, but it almost sounds like a nylon string or something, or even a prepared guitar...

Thanks, all. I never thought it might not even be an electric...interesting!

Regarding the Feelies...in the early days, both live and in the studio, and their music was really fierce. You hear the live bootlegs and the pre Crazy Rhythms studio recordings and they're pretty punk rock. Only when it was time to do the LP did they suddenly decide to be really different and do everything direct I think. I think it was an iconoclastic thing where they wanted to be different from everyone else and not sound like another punk rock band. At the time the LP annoyed some of their fans and associates I think, because it didn't represent how they sounded then, and I think now they even have some regret that they didn't keep working the way they had and capture their sound as it was at the time. Of course many of their fans, myself included, think Crazy Rhythms is one of the best and most unique rock records ever.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jnUHuYIEjAk

My session guy guitar teacher says this, re: the LJJ sound:

"It's as clean as it gets…… Tele into the board direct? 0.0 effects too…Very present and angular… If it's in an amp, the amp is barely even on…………. "

He also noted it was like a template for the Talking Heads guitar sound.

verlaine's original conception for their debut was to just record live at rudy van gelder's studio, playing live like a jazz group. but i guess the rest of the band (and perhaps elektra) nixed that and they and hired the dude who engineered for led zep and the stones. good decision in the long run, i think.

The story the band tells is that Glyn Johns would have a couple of bottles of wine to start out with, then after he inevitably passed out the group produced themselves.

yeah the liners to the rhino re-ish talk about johns coming in, mic-ing the drums and out comes john bonham's drum sound. and the band is like noooooooo. still would be interesting to hear a bonham sound on marquee moon.

re: the feelies, interesting that terry ork managed them in their early days, as he did w/ television. guy had good taste. there are apparently some feelies "ork sessions" from 1977 that remain unreleased. i found something that was labeled "ork sessions" but they seem to be early live recordings, not studio demos.

also, the intro to "loveless love" seems like an extension of johnny jewel's second part.

The story the band tells is that Glyn Johns would have a couple of bottles of wine to start out with, then after he inevitably passed out the group produced themselves.

Except it was Glyn's brother Andy.

Close enough. Point made.

If some home DJ out there could remix a Bonham sound from Television tracks now, that might well be groovy--but back then, not so much a punk-beyond-punk, in-yo-face move like these cosmic epic solo junkies of CBGB's were already known for--as something ridiculously self-inflated, since Zep was seeming a bit overexposed, to put it mildly (I wuz there, and still liked 'em, but like many younger rockheads ready to give all arena dinosaurs a rest, or at least give Television's Dead x VU missing links a shot). Eno said that his duo albums with Fripp were just guitars plugged directly into the board.

Although he might have messed with the mixes later. Isn't Le Noise board-direct, with Lanois adding at least some effects in real time?

The Beatles' "Revolution" is board-direct, with the distortion coming from the levels in the red.

here's the feelies' glenn mercer on recording direct:
we had a lot of problems getting a good guitar sound in the studio. We tried everything. Different amps, different rooms. Pretty much exhausted everything we could at the studio we were at. Mark Ambel, the co-producer of that record, said "why don't we record the guitar direct and feed them back to an amp when we're ready to mix?" We were scheduled to mix in a better studio. He told us that we'd get a much better sound there. So we were recording the guitars and doing it direct, which is like a rule. NEVER RECORD THE GUITARS DIRECT. It sounded really dry and dead. But we really started actually to like the sound. A lot of the guitars on the record were kept that way. We actually found that when you record direct, it's a little bit closer to your ear. You have the space of the speaker and the ambience of the mike when you're recording it. A lot of what people think are acoustic guitars are just electric guitars recorded direct. A kind of dry sound.

but re: television, yeah i wouldn't change a thing about marquee moon -- to me it's the perfect mix of a minimalist approach and just a straight-ahead 70s classic rock guitar thing.

That Wild Flag video is fantastic.

Do not mix a Bonham drum track onto Marquee Moon. Now!

Another thing making the single of "Little Johnny Jewel" so striking at the time, was having pts.1 & 2, the well-earned confidence of that--like "Tom Joad," which was maybe 7 minutes total, but pt. 1 ended at just the right point, and the whole thing, whole lives, flew by so lucidly (Happy 100th BDay Woody G! Television should cover you someday)

xpost Doubt Le Noise is direct at all (nor does it sound it). Neil loves his amps.

dudes i'm contributing live rarity kinda things to this site now. first up is of course, television: http://www.aquariumdrunkard.com/2012/09/12/television-live-the-whisky-a-go-go-los-angeles-1977/

cool! this is a great set.

Thanks for the live show...very nice. Kind of interesting cover of "Friction" here, by some ex-no wavers and early indie-rockers. (A few steps required to listen...still trying to get the mp3.)

http://www.sensitiveskinmagazine.com/timber-released-unreleased/

article doesn't mention Rick Brown's origins in Information.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/07/16/cbgb-drama-rock-club_n_1677947.html

great quote here from Chris Frantz:

I don't think Tom ever recommended any band to play CBGBs and certainly not Talking Heads. I was the one who approached Hilly on our band's behalf. As far as I know, Tom Verlaine has never done a single favor for anyone...not even himself.

hmm, never heard this song covered before. sounds pretty ok
http://soundcloud.com/tennisinc/tennis-guiding-light/s-LJyOL

Foxhole:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&v=6sCQ0hEYhZE&NR=1

英国音楽 / VINYL JAPAN very proudly presents
【 TELEVISION 】来日決定!!!!!!!
＜TOM VERLAINE / BILLY FICCA / FRED SMITH / JIMMY RIP＞
MAY 02 ( THU ) 下北沢 GARDEN
MAY 03 ( FRI ) 吉祥寺　CLUB SEATA
福岡＆大阪も
詳細は、近日中。

I've never seen that Foxhole clip before. I got chills!

There *should* be a TOTP clip of "Prove It", but it got wiped by the BBC, and for some reason I never saw it at the time.

yeah, that clip is great, tho it always depresses me that there's no other pro shot footage of the band in the 70s.

yeah the foxhole was staple tipsy on youtube viewing for me for some time. but dang, would love to see them doing prove it, or jsut about anything else really from that time, it's a tragedy

those Japan shows are the first ones I've heard of in quite awhile. Two years, maybe even?

yeah they played in south america two years ago? lloyd-less television still seems bizarre...

I saw a Lloyd-less Television in Central Park a few years back. Lackluster.

That Central Park show wasn't very good. Except when they played the new material. I do have confidence that the Rip-for-Lloyd lineup can be great, based off the decades of telepathic interplay verlaine has had with Rip in his solo projects. But if it jells it's gonna be Rip as sound painter for Verlaine's foreground, not a yin/yang like it was with Lloyd.

yeah, ripp is great, the bootlegs from the 80s are fucking incredible. i mean, it basically comes down to verlaine now, whether he's interested in playing or not. maybe without lloyd he'll feel he has a little more to prove? i don't know, that dude doesn't care about anything.

bit harsh, tyler - few years ago i saw verlaine and ripp perform a really nice intimate duo show together (in the 100 Club in London) and he was much more relaxed, happier, engaged than i've ever seen him w/ Television (tho' of course the palpable on-stage tension between him and lloyd did make things v inneresting...)

When he actually gets on a stage or in a studio, he commits. But he really is one of the hardest to motivate motherfuckers in all Manhattan.

ha, yeah, i was just kidding. mostly. verlaine just seems like a hard guy to pin down. i've watched one of those duo shows on youtube and it was great.

And I feel like I get why, just from his body of lyrics. He's such a symbolist that he'd rather just sit around and dream. Actually doing things is way too explicit.

xpost to self

haha, yeah.

meanwhile, here's lloyd's latest missive on facebook:

Here is a link to my blog entitled Yoga, Hypnosis and Gurdjieff. I invite everyone who wishes to participate to simply add comments from which exchanges may form, as crystals form in salt water. "If thy salt is lost it's savor, what good is it - only to throw to the swine and let them trample it underfoot." So please do contribute even if you know nothing of the subjects. There is no better way to learn as to teach, and as teaching is part of my calling, I am at the ready. --Richard Lloyd.

[link doesn't work]

classic

lolll
oh in case anyone didn't get it, this comp of hell-era Television stuff is still available: http://doomandgloomfromthetomb.tumblr.com/post/18962115402/television-a-season-in-hell-soooo-heres-a
hell's autobio/memoir is out sometime soon...

weirdness:

Richard Lloyd
This coming Monday, the 14th, the song "Guiding Light" is to be featured in the hit comedy series "How I Met Your Mother" 8 PM Eastern Time. If you are a fan of the show, or of Marquee Moon, from which the song is taken, be sure to watch and enjoy!

Hope it will be in one of How I Met's Canadian 80s teen-tween show-within-the-show eps, or do they still do those? Only times I could stand to watch.

The expanded Verlaine solo reissues from sev. years back feat. worthy input from Ripp, often enough.

wait a second, WHAT expanded Verlaine solo reissues? If there's been anything but straight no-bonuses reissues I wanna know about it???

Sorry, don't have 'em at hand and gotta get to work, but look 'em up---I'll try to find the promo package when home again (I don't remember any revelatory bonuses though, which may be why I didn't try to review--do remember good sound, but whether better than reissues you have I dunno, haven't heard more)

Yeah thx lemme know! The only ones I know of are the Collector's Choice of Flash Light and S/T (no bonuses) and back in the late 90s the Infinite Zero reiss of Dreamtime (which did have a bonus or two). The Miller's Tale 2CD had its share of rarities, of course, most significantly 3 tracks from the 'Lost Album' and the first non-defective CD version of 'Five Miles of You'.

Been listening to the self-titled a lot lately. What a great record. Totally slept on, and I feel would have been better received it had been released 10 or more years later.

Correct on all counts. I love that album so much.

yeah it's a nice one -- weirdly i read somewhere (can't remember now) michael stipe repping for it, "rhyme" in particular.

o wait i found it -- http://popsongs.wordpress.com/category/ask-michael-stipe/

I’m curious what songs you’ve heard in your life that made you just drop whatever you were doing and go, “You know, why can’t I write a song like this,” or, perhaps, “Damn, I wish I had written that.”

short list: Birdland, One, Beautiful Day, Man Who Sold the World, Ashes to Ashes, Karma Police, Rhyme[by Television], and more recently l.e.s. artistes

someday i'm going to have to put together the 4th television album, since verlaine refuses.

Hope someday comes soon...

The title of the record should be Verlaine Refuses.

there was one someone did a while ago called Call Mr. Lloyd

Been collecting 1992 tour gigs just because I can't get enough of that record

... and I'm glad I read this whole thread because this whole time I was imagining Verlaine as the lead guitarist

this 1993 NC show is killer: http://ow.ly/jhY2I
when they were on during that first reunion tour, they were amazing.

Really enjoyable new review of Hell's autobio, which I gotta get---linked on this ancient, still worthy thread:
richard hell takes apart poor journalist

Wow thanks tyler for the 93 show, I didn't have that one

yesterday...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BR3q6RegGHs

cooool. even w/o lloyd, still sounding pretty good.

when they were on during that first reunion tour, they were amazing.

Yes. I saw them in Washington DC and they were good in a way few bands ever are. Saw them about 10 years later and they were awful.

yeah i have a couple really bizarre early 00s shows where they seem to have forgotten how to play.

cooool. even w/o lloyd, still sounding pretty good.

― tylerw, Friday, April 19, 2013 2:58 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

lloyd may still be living in mpls, he played some weird show here a couple years ago, had an ad on our craigslist for guitar lessons....um i'm not sure how functional he is these days

Who's replaced Lloyd?

Great blog by Richard Williams

i think that's jimmy rip on second guitar. he's a session guy who's collaborated with verlaine off and on. very skilled but not nearly as manic as lloyd.

yeah jimmy ripp has been verlaine's second guitarist outside of television for 30+ years now. he knows the parts.

yeah i have a couple really bizarre early 00s shows where they seem to have forgotten how to play.

saw them in london in the early 00s and they were soooooo boring. broke my heart as they've always been one of my favourite bands, but they were so... tasteful. like, knopfleresque.

i have a few good 00s shows by them, seems like it all depends on whether verlaine is interested in being there, which is probably only half of the time.

had an ad on our craigslist for guitar lessons

u should hit him up

i follow him on facebook, he's always asking for students, even via skype, i think.

Which show Steve? QEH or ULU? Cos I saw them at ULU in maybe 04 and they killed. Finished with an incredible Psychotic Reaction.

The really weird one was the first gig in London after the reformation, at the Forum in 94 (or 93. I don't recall). Maybe 200 people there. Upstairs closed, downstairs almost completely empty. Verlaine asked for some blue light, and then the whole show was played under two blue spots and nothing else. I recall an amazing Little Johnny Jewel though.

It was the Shepherds Bush Empire, April 2001. Seems like I just caught a bad night - wish I'd been at the Forum show you describe, though.

saw them at the tortoise-curated all tomorrow's parties, and at their later ULU show. they were great both times - but the tension between verlaine and lloyd onstage was palpable, particularly at the ATP show, like almost uncomfortably so. the ATP gig started out very well-attended but the crowd soon started to thin out - think television are just a bit too 'sophisticated guitar solos' for the indie kid purists of days. they were much sloppier at the ULU show, but seemed to be enjoying themselves a bit more, and the one new song they played (something like 'sahara'???) was excellent. a year or so later verlaine and rip played a beautiful duo show at the 100 Club on Tottenham Court Road, and i'm not sure that TV has been back since.

new song you mention is probably this -
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYrTcCBM6hw
verlaine's been playing it with and without television since like 1997.

btw looks like you can still grab this --
http://www.earcandyarchive.com/wp-content/uploads/resized/71.jpg
http://www.earcandyarchive.com/?p=24
It was 7 years ago that I first heard Tom Verlaine say:
“This here’s a newie….goes like this”

And finally a new Television album is nearing completion,
albeit without Richard Lloyd, who left to persue The
Radiant Monkey and his own musical vision. So its sheer
conjecture as to which of these new TV songs will have made
it into the studio along with replacement, Jimmy Rip.

Here, then, is a compilation of live performances of those
new songs as performed in recent years. May this serve as
a fitting farewell to Mr Lloyd’s involvement with the group
and an appreciation of his contribution to the evolving of
these new songs.

These are audience recordings so sonic quality is not ideal.
However,the passion is all there in the zeros & the ones…

01 I Could Sleep All Day (Washington DC 2003-03-24)
02 Rise & Fall (London 2005-06-21)
03 Frustration (Sao Paolo 2005-10-25)
04 Flower Spasm (London 2005-06-21)
05 Balloon (Washington DC 2003-03-24)
06 Persia (London 2004-06-23)
07 The Sea ((Hamburg 2004-06-18)

bonus tracks:
08 Swells Pt 1 / Stars / Swells Pt 2 (Sao Paolo 2005-10-25)
09 Stax (Hamburg 2004-06-18)
10 Stockhausen Pysche Jam (London 2004-06-23)
11 Bowie medley (London 2002-06-18
12 Love Theme From Piranha (London 2002-06-18)
13 “Hits On TV” (London 2002-06-19)

Jeff Tweedy's wife Sue reportedly gave him lessons with Lloyd for his birthday once.

Can I tell my fave Television story again? Yeah? OK, cool. The last time I saw them, in 1998 or something, they were at the start of "Marquee Moon" when Lloyd broke a string. So as the band played the song, as a trio, he very calmly, and very slowly, moved aside and patiently changed the string. Very. Patiently. Took his sweet time. In fact, didn't strap the guitar back on until the last few seconds of the song. It was hilarious.

they're doing marquee moon in its entirety in australia this fall
http://www.atpfestival.com/newsview/1304162359.php

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eH8Iqv6LkVc&feature=player_embedded
weird! last weekend television played "i'm gonna find you" an unreleased tune from 1974. have they been listening to the old bootlegs?

Well you know there's this blog they may have stumbled upon

haha, that would be terrifying.

I'm thinking people need to talk about Adventure more often!

let's talk about it!
Television played this one last week, which they never did back in the day:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtSsXABdBNw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HtSsXABdBNw

i really like that song. the clientele do a groovy version but it doesn't appear to be on youtube.

Crazy, I've just seen these posts and I'm actually listening to 'The Fire' right now on my copy of Adventure! Great song, and absolutely wonderful guitar work as always. I can see why Adventure tends to get overlooked... it followed up a stone-cold classic in Marquee Moon, and its material is a touch more relaxed, maybe... but the more I listen to it, the more it gets its claws in me. There really isn't a song on Adventure I dislike, for what it's worth!

I recall Adventure getting a two star review in UNCUT for the reissue, alone with MM's five stars. Seemed really OTT rather than standing on its own merits (which it has). It's not MM but it's not a two star album either (IMO).

Also surprised that, at that time (00s anyway), it seemed Adventure was getting quite a lot of credit on its own whilst keeping things realistic, rather than people dismissing it offhand just because it wasn't MM (and it isn't, but anyway..)

Yeah, that's more than a bit OTT, IMO... I definitely don't think Adventure is a two star record!

finally watched the 1974 tape from ork's loft. verlaine is so animated, jumping around & smiling, kinda reminiscent of thurston moore circa 1983 & in fact the blurry untuned guitar sound resembled sonic youth to a startling degree. huh. too bad hell's mike didn't work but still a revelation.

I think my issue with Adventure is how it kinda fizzles out with the last track.

Now, it has the title track to 'end' it, which isn't exactly 'great' but it does what was needed.

C'mon! It has "Foxhole", "Careful" and "Aint that nothing". And "Glory", and and and....

Terry Ork's loft rehearsal
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kcGEcB5M4es

"Persia" is my new jam

yeah it's great, total trance music. i have one version that's close to 20 minutes.

I think my issue with Adventure is how it kinda fizzles out with the last track.

Get outta here, the solo is among the best guitar playing I've ever in my life

Ever heard that is. LOL. And believe me I've tried to play it.

I hate to say this, but Television could be the most underachieving band in the history of rock and roll. All that talent, the immortal debut, and that's pretty much it.

xxp: i've always wished for a side-long version of The Dream's Dream

"yeah it's great, total trance music. i have one version that's close to 20 minutes."

Ysi?

hate to say this, but Television could be the most underachieving band in the history of rock and roll. All that talent, the immortal debut, and that's pretty much it.

I'm a stan for the '92 album.

Side 2 of Adventure is where I'm at.

that ork loft youtube is one of my most watched/listened to things of the past month, i think i saw it on tyler's blog

http://25.media.tumblr.com/f7baf4507ec5c13242a6354ed6219307/tumblr_moc9es222E1qzy30io1_500.png

also i did look for that 20 minute version of "persia" and .... I must have imagined it? Maybe it just felt like 20 minutes.

Ha, those Whisky photos are great. Peter Gabriel looks like he's 12.

http://soundcloud.com/nyctaper/wilco-marquee-moon-television
pretty much note perfect -- if anyone can out-verlaine verlaine, it's nels cline.

Tweedy is no Television-guitar slouch himself!

hello richard, this is adam. i read that you gave jeff tweedy a guitar lesson and was wondering about some of the things you talked about, seeing as how i love both his and your playing. hopefully you can shed some light on this. i plan on checking out some of the lessons on your site and appreciate them very much!

thanks, adam

Hello Adam,
Thank you for writing, and for your interest in Jeff Tweedy and myself. Unfortunately, private lessons are just that -- private. For that reason, I cannot answer your questions with respect to what might have taken place between us, but we are and have been friends for a rather longtime -- Wilco opened a number of shows for Matthew Sweet many years ago when I was on tour with Matthew. We all became warm friends then and remain so, even though Jeff lives in Chicago and I live in New York. His wife called me a couple of years ago because she wanted to get him a guitar lesson from me for his birthday. So I flew to Chicago and we spend the day together. And I just saw him a month or so ago in Brazil when we both played at the Tim Festival in Rio de Janeiro.

Best regards,
Richard Lloyd

https://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-prn1/996165_10151512923682690_646880720_n.jpg

tyler where was this?!

you should post that stuff to tumblr or facebook so it's easier for me to repost it and get all kinds of cool points.

haha, it's on richard's facebook page - he says "This has been one of the posters I have used in the past. Still valid, I teach Guitar and Music theory without recourse to music notation clefs or any reading, which does not suit Guitarists. My student learn to view the Guitar from a new perspective that can completely change the way you look at music itself. PM if interested, --Richard Lloyd."
https://www.facebook.com/richard.lloyd1

tbh i'm sort of interested! i wonder what his rates are.

the text reminds me of those Dr. Bronner's soap labels.

yeah! i was thinking it seemed kinda turn of the 20th century. i am fascinated by this sort of thing -- i have a guitarist friend who has some theory of the guitar via mandalas that i definitely do not understand, but sort of like hearing about.

I thought about that once years ago. It was intimidating though. I actually asked Bob Bannister if he'd be interesting in giving lessons but he passed.

i have a guitarist friend who has some theory of the guitar via mandalas that i definitely do not understand, but sort of like hearing about.

His name's not Robbie Basho is it?

ha, i actually asked him about basho and he said "who?"

Man, would actually be interested in hearing Richard lay this all out. Where does he teach?

he's in nyc afaik, i think he's said he does skype lessons though.

Think skype lesson would be a little too crazy for me, but will keep that NYC thought in mind when I get up there. I just bet that it is pretty fun and wild hearing him talk about what he does and getting to ask him questions.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mNmEq-cP9Oo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lSifKZ80H4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fjWFqz1Sjps

Hah, thanks man. A window into the experience.

My buddy Alex took lessons with him for a couple of years here (NYC). I think he was p affordable.

He was living in mpls-stpl last I heard though?

I think I watched those videos before but all I remember from them is Richard playing while being like "1 2 5 6 4 1 5 3 5 2 1 4 4 4 5 6 3 5 2 1 6" for about ten minutes.

That's about what I remember

a friend took a lesson or two from him. apparently he's very touchy about tv questions or requests to learn tv songs.

yeah i can see how that would be boring for him -- obviously he's deeply into the theory of the guitar... not how you play "see no evil" but how you come up with the riff to "see no evil" yourself.

... or using the guitar to see BEYOND evil

He was advertising for new students pretty recently on Facebook too, not sure if he still is.

reading the richard hell autobio now finally and man he does not have any use for richard lloyd at all

also: is billy ficca an underrated drummer? he does some pretty crazy stuff on the television albums

Seeing ficca live is even more impressive.

he' s not underrated as far as I know

what's the deal with the Hell/Lloyd drama?

i don't know the source of it but in the book he basically says lloyd only got into television because he was fucking terry ork and then only talks about how whiny lloyd was all the time

So he doesn't mention the fact that he was a fucking awesome guitarist who any band would be delighted to have as a member?

well any band apart from Television

Can easily imagine those two guys not getting along and Tom Verlaine somehow finding a way to make it worse.

i probably say this about every 70s Television bootleg, but here's one of my faves. second set is all request! http://ow.ly/ojJKj

you do! but they're always great!

Television is playing Athens, GA on November 7 and doing all of Marquee Moon. I'd be a dumbass not to attend, right?

Whaaaat yes you need to go. It's more like the Tom Verlaine band with ripp replacing Lloyd but they are still amazing. Smith and ripp are the anchors and tv and ficca are the wanderers.

Man I wish I could come down for that. Link?

http://www.georgiatheatre.com/

Put it this way: There's a 12" single of Tom Verlaine, and on the b-side is a version of "Marquee Moon" performed live in 1987.

Basically, if the band can play, the song plays them.

I decided the allure of the spectacle vs. my general everyday apathy about Television wasn't enough to spend $30.

Well, if you don't get the album..

Then again, I never got "Horses", but I have the 2CD version with a live performance, and saw the "Rockpalast" performance, and enjoyed both live renditions.

if i were anywhere on the east coast, i'd go see that show... seems weird that they'll do "marquee moon" right in the middle of the set after decades of it being the closer.

Fuck I wanna goooooo

no idea, but i'd be a little surprised if they didn't schedule a few more US dates?

i just bought my ticket.

Xpost that's what I'm banking on... Time to go peruse the mm list...

Tyler, think you maybe even let me know this, but Chris Forsyth & The Solar Motel Band are playing a set "as" Television sometime soon in Philly. That band is getting really good live (well, they already are pretty great, but could be really achieving launch in the next couple of months ...). I bet they are gonna kill those Television songs, though seeing Verlaine in person can't really be replicated.

yeah i saw that! i know chris is a television superfan, so i can only imagine he's going to do it right. i think he even has taken lessons from lloyd himself.

I imagine they are gonna nail the sound at the very least, but both guitarists seem capable of getting some of the magic right as well. Would certainly go if I lived near Philly!

Television is playing Athens, GA on November 7 and doing all of Marquee Moon.

can't believe I missed this thread revive ... really glad I got tickets before they sold out

lol, start holding your breath!
http://www.rollingstone.com/music/news/revamped-television-have-a-new-album-in-the-can-20130920

"Marquee Moon" is something of an anti-song, 10 minutes of disciplined disorder, lacking melody and a chorus

"Lacking melody" totally OffTM.

yeahhh, pretty much all of that is wrong? not a lot of "disorder" in there that i can hear.

it is utterly through-composed except for the solos

and i mean, the "chorus" is the "life in the hive" bit, right? it repeats three times, after each verse...

Meanwhile, 16 songs frontman Tom Verlaine and the band recorded in December 2007 await vocals and mixing, though a release date is still not scheduled.

OK so the situation has not changed since those Facebook posts from Jimmy Rip a year or two ago. Oh well. At least this article had a few comments from the engineer who recorded the sessions.

haha, yeah.
btw y'all should check out this recent johnny jewel cover - https://soundcloud.com/solar-motel-band/03-little-johnny-jewel it is pretty awesome

i liked the detail that TV favors low powered amps in the studio.

while i wait for this new television album, i'm going to drink bottle after bottle of fred smith's artisanal wine - http://www.cereghinosmith.com/

it is utterly through-composed except for the solos

Yeah, totally. I remember bringing one of their songs to my guitar teacher, who spent a few minutes on it before basically telling totally awful me, yeah, sorry, no way, this is completely, elaborately through-composed and would take us hours.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYtj6FAdVBc

That kid with the green Mosrite or whatever is my new hero.

short Verlaine interviews a-poppin'!

http://www.beat.com.au/music/television
http://www.theaustralian.com.au/arts/review/creating-new-waves/story-fn9n8gph-1226684923004
http://www.fasterlouder.com.au/features/37044/We_interviewed_Televisions_Tom_Verlaine_it_didnt_go_so_well

There's even some valuable nuggets here and there. One particularly striking bit where he describes how he used to write in the early TV days. And, of course, lots of cussedness, bloody-minded evasion and sphinxery.

lol at that last one...

Yeah he was pretty hard on that kid in his clamlike way

That kid was a pretty shitty interviewer, tbh

He got a little out of Tom on his(the kid's) pet interests

Wonder if Verlaine prefers Fearless or Witness

another one - a verlaine media blitz!
kind of cute that he actually says nice things about the teenage band doing marquee moon
http://themusic.com.au/interviews/all/2013/09/04/television-tom-verlaine/19031/
Recently he was surprised by a YouTube link sent to him by Television bass player Fred Smith. The footage featured a band of teenagers covering Television’s title track from the 1977 album Marquee Moon. “What’s incredible is that it’s the best version I’ve ever heard anybody play,” Verlaine continues. “The bass player loses it a bit but the two guitar players, for being that young, play it really good. The singer is a girl, which is really strange; I don’t know what to make of the girl’s voice. But I thought, ‘Geez, these two guitar guys really got this thing down’.”

There he mentions the piano thing again, him taking the right hand part and RL taking the left hand. That strikes me as a v revealing piece of process trivia. Has he talked abt that before this recent spate of articles?

mm, would like that youtube link.

scroll up!

he has talked about that composition technique in regards to "venus" i think, just figuring out the interlocking guitar parts.

did an ilxor say hi to me at the Athens show? (bl0unt??) if so, sorry dude, i was kinda freaked out b/c i hadn't been in athens in 3 years & i didn't recognize you. didn't realize till after i'd walked away that it might have been someone from on here.

Excellent show, I even enjoyed the endless tuning .... "Psychotic Reaction" was not what I was expecting as an encore!

Awesome.

Wow to that encore.

Is blOunt still here on ilx?

was playing the roof of the georgia theatre last week and was soooo bummed that i was not going to see them. i dunno, the clips/recordings of the band post-Lloyd have sounded pretty solid, almost as though Verlaine is stepping up a bit more, as opposed to just letting Lloyd do the heavy lifting.

Psycho Reaction was the encore at the 2004 Irving Plaza shows

he is now known as "balls" xxp

xp they've been doing it pretty much since the beginning -- i think verlaine has said it's his favorite rock song.

ps, this 76 show has been around for a while, but this version is apparently speed corrected/remastered for what it's worth - http://dbs-repercussion.blogspot.com/2013/11/tele-vision-new-york-city-december-1977.html

1976, despite what the URL says

Thanks

Here's another clue for you all
The Georgian was balls

Richard Lloyd went to Stuyvesant? How did I not know this? Did you know, tylerw?

Or was this just a rumor started by Lester Bangs and Dave Marsh?

two shows in brooklyn thanksgiving weekend 11/29 and 11/30. Tickets on sale friday. AYEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

happy for you but also ;-( for me

Man, I'm really on the fence about trying to see them. But if Lloyd was still in the band, I wouldn't think twice about going.

I went to both Tom Verlaine Band shows at Bowery Ballroom in whenever that was (07?) and it was transcendent. This is the same group except with ficca. Think of it this way, smith and rip are the anchors now, the landscape guys; verlaine and ficca are the wildcards.

there are at least 10 youtubes up from 2013 performances to enter into evidence.

esp recommend the argentina Guiding Light.

yeah, regardless of what it's called, seeing verlaine/ficca/smith onstage together is going to be worth it

there haven't been any Television shows without Ficca, have there? certainly hope not. i would go for sure if i wasn't going there this weekend for WFMU.

i don't think Ficca has ever been absent.
nerve_pylon, I got an email a few months back from a dude who knows you, talking about tapes he might have of Television way back when...any movement on that? Let's make it happen.

let's email jon lewis on that when someth happens

;)

BTW verlaine's drummer on that last solo album and tour has since passed away. Sad. He was a big guy but did not look v old.

oh no kidding? that is a bummer.

I heard a set with Jimmy Rip the other day from around the other day presumably. Just doesn't seem to have the same hypnotic magic as the band did with Lloyd.
Could be a couple of things including being 35 years since the more hypnotic material was recorded, but I think they still had some of that when they came back in 92 and possibly the last Lloyd tour.
Shame, I should have made sure I saw them back when i had a chance to with Lloyd.

Well i have the live sets from the 70s anyway. Shame there isn't more visual footage of them from then though.

ERRATUM: the guiding light on youtube i mentioned is san francisco, not buenos aires

So I don't know how to make a playlist on youtube but yesterday I added all the videos of 2013 TV performances to my favorites list. About half are from the south american dates from this spring and half are from the dates of the last few weeks, particularly san francisco. My youtube user name is jpl725 so if you go to my favorites list these should be the first dozen or so videos you see.

cool, thanks, Jon!
listening to this new Rhys Chatham LP and there are some verrrrrry Television-y moments on the first track.

Just spent 50 minutes trying to get tickets on ticketmaster's site and now it looks like both nights are sold out ;_;

ouch!

depressed

duuuuude, no! where is the show, is it in a tiny place or something?

yeah. The new Rough Trade store in Brooklyn has a performance space. Just 300 ppl, supposedly. Became aware of that last night so we were going at it as soon as the sale went up but just got the spinning wheel of "Searching for tickets" until it was too late.

that's a bummer -- 3-2-1 til scalpers start selling 'em?

only one on craigslist so far but I would suppose so yeah

hey jon - i may have a spare for the friday. would you be interested?

hell yes (though I do hate to leave my partner in crime behind, but... hell yes). I am at joncroaker (at) g m a i l (dot) com

'92 Television show was prob the first one where i saw a lotta '70s ppl w/ gray hair

haha i am a 70s person with no hair. sent you a message, jon.

Just in case a spam filter snags me: I wrote you back in the resounding affirmative. :D

finally getting around to richard hell's book, pretty interesting stuff, though it is funny that (at least in Hell's hindsight) he and verlaine were pretty much done with each other after Television's first gig. also strange that hell has nothing good to say about richard lloyd. especially since i just listened to marquee moon yesterday and holy cow, lloyd's guitar sound remains celestial.

y'know, if i had a sore point with their show at rough trade, it was jimmy rip's slavish imitation of lloyd's sound on marquee moon. he played a tele through all kinds of pedals. really nailed the sound to a t. then when it came time to improvise, instead of lloyd's pythagorean modal whatsis, out came some bendy technique-heavy studio guitarist stuff. who's he gonna impress with that? not a house full of television fans.

yeah, some of Ripp's solos on the sydney show don't quite mesh, even though he's sticking to the basic structure of most of Lloyd's stuff. of course, I thought that occasionally when Lloyd was in the band during the 00s. He sometimes slipped into those chopsy show offy moments too. i actually liked Ripp's mid-song lead on 1880 or So.

I think Hell's gripes about Lloyd are more to do with his personality rather than his guitar playing

oh yeah definitely, but he doesn't even give Lloyd the obligatory "but boy he sure could play that guitar". I guess when Hell was in the band Lloyd might not've really figured out his sound yet.

mm, self evident?

https://31.media.tumblr.com/4705d710d6e75a094343cf89d47dd45d/tumblr_mya7o5iS8i1s4tb5bo1_400.jpg
kind of funny that they got the album title and the single title wrong, but i would've liked to see this bill.

Any Only Ones shows up?

only only ones bootleggy kinda thing i have is from (i think) 1979. And the quality is kind of bad iirc.

Never did get into that late 70s American-issued comp, Special View, but hoped some shows might show me the way to their critically-acclaimed specialness--think it was mainly Peter P.'s voice what put me off.

i love 'em but his voice may indeed be an acquired taste. but then again, so is verlaine's! Their BBC sessions are awesome.

I always liked Verlaine's voice! It suits his good-to-great stuff perfectly; can't save the weaker stuff, but there's not too much weaker stuff and that's the law of the jungle anyway. I'll check TOO's BBC Sessions, thanks.

Television to take off! To The Great White North

http://ih.constantcontact.com/fs126/1102271303916/img/1069.png

weird lineup

The first album popped up on random shuffle yesterday. Man, the drums on that thing are every bit the equal of the guitars.

When I saw the two tiny venue Brooklyn shows in November, I was really able to get a good look at what ficca was doing. So amazing. The way he takes advantage of the sides of the drums is so cool. He'll drag the stick along those metal ribs (excuse my ignorance, these are for tuning, right?) to get a rapid series of rim shots, for example.

xp Late response but one's best intro to The Only Ones is the Peel Sessions comp.

There's all these interesting fests popping up in the Midwest too. Television is at Big Ears Festival in Knoxville. Check out the lineup: http://www.bigearsfestival.com/

Then there's this, but without Televivion (Earth is playing both):

http://www.missionfreak.com/assets/overlay-e1af1a2b621ffc19de03121063a7c839.jpg

I often wondered how he did those 'rimshot rolls'

Hmmm what are the pros and cons of going to see Television in 2014 if I rate Marquee Moon about 8 out of 10 for personal enjoyment and haven't heard much else of theirs?

8 pro, 2 con?

jesus, fucking go!!!

OK, you helped make that an easy decision. Merci.

Seeing the band next week. Been a while.

Wished they'd come back my way. Saw 'em during that '90s reunion phase

Really good last night, though I could do without "Persia."

It's obviously obvious, but it finally struck me last night:

Tom Verlaine.
T. V.
TV
Television.

puns that you had missed

I just got that. Fuck.

TV
T.V.
Tom Miller

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5v7FZwyOdvU

Persia is the greatest thing ever on some nights; on other nights it's just okay. I hope they are able to bottle it when a studio recording eventually comes out.

http://dangerousminds.net/content/uploads/images/undercoverss15televisionmarqueemoon.jpg

Japanese fashion line features iconic images of Tom Verlaine and Television

Thought that was a Halloween costume. I would totally give all the candy to a kid who trick-or-treated as Marquee Moon.

Ha otm

I just noticed that Television will be performing in Philly between Christmas and New Year's. Wondering if I, a fan of Marquee Moon and lover of that original CBGB period who never saw them before, should see them or if they're a shell of their former self. Any opinions?

NYC Native: The band is not the same without Richard Lloyd. I am assuming he won't be there. I saw them in Central Park a few years back and it was lackluster at best. If Lloyd is somehow on board I'd say by all means attend.

Disagree. Lloyd is inimitable and irreplaceable but they remain very much worth seeing. Ripp has his own thing to bring. The rough trade shows were excellent. I don't blame kwhitehead for forming that opinion based on that Central Park show though -- it was right after Lloyd left and it sucked.

yeah, i mean you shouldn't expect the heights of 1978 or anything, but if you like hearing verlaine play guitar, how could it be bad? not to mention that rhythm section.
the recent instrumental set in NYC last weekend sounded interesting.

this is cool -- numero is putting out an Ork Records box set -- television, hell, chilton, feelies, many more!
http://scontent-a.cdninstagram.com/hphotos-xfa1/t51.2885-15/10946552_327555314118909_2025837582_n.jpg

!

it is a GOOD IDEA.
feelies stuff is particularly exciting because those recordings have never been released (or bootlegged afaik)

Richard's jug-like runs on "Fire Engine" <3

Has anyone ever seen Tom Verlaine or Richard Lloyd reference any interest in Wishbone Ash? You listen to the guitar playing on songs like 'The Pilgrim' especially on their live record, you definitely find some sonic similarity with Television. I know Thin Lizzy and Maiden were both inspired by the dual guitar playing, but in some ways you can hear it quite a bit in Television.

Richard's jug-like runs on "Fire Engine" <3

Hmm. I don't think I have seen Verlaine or Lloyd talk about Wishbone Ash at all, but I can see why you'd come to that conclusion. I might dig out Adventure for a listen soon, it's been a while.

Just saw them live the other night. I don't know Wishbone Ash, so can't say. I heard bits of surf, Duane Eddy, Coltrane free jazz.

I saw Television most recently maybe a year or two ago (post-Lloyd era), and I took a guitar nerd friend of mine who was a) somehow not terribly familiar with Television and b) weirdly unimpressed. I think he dismissed it as "faux-naive" or something like that.