Hello Mudduh Hello Fadduh: ILX Rolling Parenting Thread

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I am lost for words, Michael.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Monday, 6 February 2006 12:19 (eighteen years ago) link

if every parent could sleep uninterrupted for 8 hours every night, most of the problems of the world would disappear immediately.

I managed to let my husband sleep for eight hours straight this night. Hurrah! I'm happy for him. He definitely needed it. I do too, but hey I have breastfeeding to do.

I bought a breastpump today. They should have told me I need a machine to sterilize (?) the stuff. Also a machine to warm up the milk. I'm beginning to understand why breastfeeding is so easy; but then I needed the pump because I can't keep breastfeeding forever. :-(

Nathalie (stevie nixed), Monday, 6 February 2006 13:12 (eighteen years ago) link

boiling water is adequate for sterilization of the tubes and parts and such. You don't need a machine to warm the milk, either. Do NOT boil breast milk or heat it in the microwave because it wipes out some of the good stuff your body produces. Just get hot water (not scalding), put breast milk in the bottle prior to feeding, and put the bottle in the hot or warm water and let it warm up. Also, read up on how long you can leave out breast milk before you have to refrigerate/freeze it. It can last at least 3 hours, maybe more, without spoiling when it is freshly expressed.

don weiner (don weiner), Monday, 6 February 2006 13:20 (eighteen years ago) link

My baby Sara is 15 months, she laughs a lot, sleeps quite well (apart since she's started growing teeths very recently) eats alright, still doesn't walk on her own (but she can take all the time she wants) and is a "sunny" baby.
I breastfed her until she was 7 months, even though it was difficult to adjust that with working. When she was born, she cried all the time for three solid months, but I guess you're biologically made to tolerate that and still think "my little lovely little one". Now she is very serene. Recently, late in the afternoon, she has taken to sitting next to me and reading her own books. I love this!
Now we are maybe waiting for a little brother/sister. And we're not scared. just a little happier if possible.
But then my mood today is particularly supported by the unusual fact that she slept from 8pm last night to 8 am today :D

misshajim (strand), Monday, 6 February 2006 13:52 (eighteen years ago) link

about breastfeeding, I think should be encouraged to rely on her own right balance of instinct/rationality. I had so many people telling me what to do and how to do it, that i was mental. consider that at first Sara cried ALWAYS, so there was always room for my mother, sister, mother in law, sister in law to give me their own precious opinions ie. "you probably do not have enough milk" "your milk is too heavy" "you let her breastfeed too long" etc...
But she cried soooo very much and loud, that she scared everybody away but me and her father.
eh eh eh
how i love the little one!

misshajim (strand), Monday, 6 February 2006 14:08 (eighteen years ago) link

Teething: A Lull

http://static.flickr.com/11/96251660_01966e66a2.jpg

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 07:57 (eighteen years ago) link

We have both had haircuts since then.

Did you survive the move, Michael?

(I expect an answer in six weeks or so.)

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 07:58 (eighteen years ago) link

hi misshajim! are you from italy or is that just where you got your email address?

how is the diaper rash nathalie? are you using any ointment to treat it? I find that I have to use some ointment every time I change a diaper just to prevent diaper rash. I don't know the brand names in europe but there are a few kinds here, Desitin (with zinc oxide and cod fish oil) is probably most effective at getting rid of it but it is so stinky that I don't use it unless he actually has a rash. I usually use vitamin A&D ointment to put a layer of grease between his rump and the diaper (and of course I'm changing as soon as possible after the diaper gets wet). He never seemed much bothered by a bit of diaper rash but he never had a bad case.

In a month or so, maybe sooner, you'll get your first smiles from your girl and it'll be so nice!

Recent developmental leaps for my boy (two months old on thursday): Found his fist, can consistently bring it to his mouth to suck, holding his head up reasonably well if he tries, can take a rattle from my hand and shake it!

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 13:57 (eighteen years ago) link

Rest well (if possible) wishes to Michael -- we moved when our son was eight months old. All I can recall is being very sore and very tired and very much on the brink of snapping.

Andy_K (Andy_K), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:02 (eighteen years ago) link

parents of older children, help me! i need advice on the unruly toddler phase. the nearly 5yr old nephew's behavior has gotten bad, to the point that school is complaining and his mother is at her wit's end. he basically doesn't know when to stop with things - he'll push something until it breaks, pinch you until you yell, etc despite having been told off repeatedly for whatever it is he's doing. it always ends in tears, and he seems to take absolutely no note of consequences. behavior charts and reward systems and the naughty step and even the occasional whap on the tush have been tried, none to much success. he's a really sensitive, loving kid in general, but these episodes are making everyone treat him like the bad seed. is he going to grow out of this? should we invest in a miniature straitjacket?

lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:11 (eighteen years ago) link

how is the diaper rash nathalie? are you using any ointment to treat it?

It's not that severe. We use iosine (or sth like that) which is CRAP as it leaves red stains. Grrr. On top of that we use Daktazin. Zinc cream isn't enough.

We, Ophelia and I, went to Kind&Gezin today: She's now 57 cm and well over 4 kilo 500 grams! She's in the 10 percent bracket! She's doing pretty well actually. She already follows us: watches us move from one side to the next. She also hold her head up pretty well. Sadly she also sucks her finger if she's hungry. Some days are pretty good: no crying and waking up every two hours for a good feed, but other days she howls like tomorrow (and milk) will never come. :-)

From tomorrow I'll try start pumping milk. It's quite complex: not as easy as getting yer tit out. hah! But it'll be necessary in a few weeks when the shop will (hopefully) get busier.

Nathalie (stevie nixed), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:22 (eighteen years ago) link

invest in a psychological evaluation. I know this seems daunting and/or cliched but something is clearly "going on" wrt his behavior that could be tied to learning abilities and/or emotional development just as easily as socialization. has the school suggested anything along these lines? is there a counselor or social worker connected to the school? ultimately he'll grow out of it but early intervention will speed the process and help his parents, too.

xpost

m coleman (lovebug starski), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:24 (eighteen years ago) link

maybe the kid has food sensitivities? Does he have a good diet generally?

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:41 (eighteen years ago) link

With the unruly nephew, is the connection between the punishment and the crime being made REALLY, REALLY clear? Also, if he pinches until you yell, the time to grab his hand and calmly and coolly say "Don't you EVER pinch me again. Don't you ever pinch ANYONE again" is before it hurts. He's testing his limits, and the limit for hurting, breaking and teasing needs to be zero, not when somebody starts crying.

I could just kill my brother in law sometimes the way he is screwing up my nephew's head. He's been trying to reason with the child since he was a baby, and he's such a pushover that as soon as the boy starts crying from being caught and punished, bro-in-law is immediately picking him up and hugging and comforting him, "Aw, it's okay, you just did a bad thing, it's okay, don't cry." Does he not realize what's coming out of his mouth? YOU DID SOMETHING BAD = IT'S OKAY.

pixel farmer (Rock Hardy), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:45 (eighteen years ago) link

psych evaluation might be worthwhile but don't presume that parenting is unrelated either. Many people employ a naughty step or timeout or other forms of punishment ineffectively--discipline is an ongoing process that occurs constantly and not just when your kid behaves poorly. Many times parents think that kids are ignoring consequences when, in fact, the consequences are not properly employed, are in a state of flux, or are not consistently employed or explained or prepared for. Thorough, objective environmental assessment is essential, and many times, parents are unable to do this themselves. Your description sounds frightening, Lauren. Addressing that sort of behavior should be a huge priority, which I assume it is. I'd also suggest reading books by a guy named John Rosemond--he's very much old school but like any other parental guide, it may make sense to your situation.

don weiner (don weiner), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:48 (eighteen years ago) link

he's going to to see a child psychologist soon. in the interim, i thought i'd see what other people had experienced. we've thought of the food/behaviour link and are trying to limit refined carbs and sweets with e-numbers based on his reactions.

if he pinches until you yell, the time to grab his hand and calmly and coolly say "Don't you EVER pinch me again. Don't you ever pinch ANYONE again" is before it hurts. He's testing his limits, and the limit for hurting, breaking and teasing needs to be zero, not when somebody starts crying.

yes, and that's how he's treated. unfortunately, he doesn't stop. that's the $64k question, really - why?

lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 14:50 (eighteen years ago) link

I'm at a loss. Don OTM about John Rosemond — he's added a veneer of Christianity that wasn't there when I was reading his columns 15 years ago, which may or may not give a parent the squicks, but his nuts & bolts advice about behavioral training is very good.

pixel farmer (Rock Hardy), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Systems theory = it doesn't matter why, the only thing that matters is the behavior. It's very unlikely that a psych eval will immediately offer up usable gold ("I do it because I...I need glasses!"), but yeah behavior like this doesn't just come out of nowhere. Better to work it on two fronts simultaneously.

Sad to say it, but if all the charts and steps and stuff just aren't working then maybe it's just time to put him in his room alone for five minutes and let him break his own stuff. A five-year-old will wise up real quick if he actually has to suffer the same punishments he's inflicted on others.

Haikunym (Haikunym), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:03 (eighteen years ago) link

i'll look for the rosemond books, thanks.

lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:16 (eighteen years ago) link

what are e-numbers?

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:17 (eighteen years ago) link

numbers assigned to chemical additives in food. a pack of brightly-colored candy would have an ingredient list ending with e328, e514, e112, e489 and on and on, for example.

lauren (laurenp), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:20 (eighteen years ago) link

Lauren, there's a fair amt. of good stuff for free at Rosemond's website, http://www.rosemond.com

Here's the beginning of his current column:


Children should pay attention to parents

John Rosemond

02/16/2006 - By the time a child is 3 years old, he has come to one of two conclusions concerning his parents:

Conclusion One: It's my job to pay attention to my parents.

Conclusion Two: It's my parents' job to pay attention to me.

A 3-year-old who reaches Conclusion One can be successfully disciplined. Furthermore, his discipline will be relatively easy. A child who reaches Conclusion Two can be neither successfully nor easily disciplined. This is so because the discipline of a child rests primarily on whether or not he is paying attention to his parents, and it is a fact that a child will not pay sufficient attention to parents who are acting like it is their job to pay as much attention as they can to him.

The child who reaches Conclusion Two has acquired, by age 3, an attention deficit. Not attention deficit disorder, mind you, because there's nothing at all wrong with him. Nonetheless, there will definitely be disorder in the house. His parents will say things like "he doesn't listen to us," "we have to yell to get his attention," and "we have to get right up in his face before he does what we're telling him to do." Yep, he has an attention deficit all right, but not one caused by a chemical imbalance or some malfunction in his brain. This attention deficit was caused by well-meaning parents who think good parents pay as much attention as they can to their kids; that the more attention one pays ones child, the better a parent one is. That is, after all, the prevailing belief, and it has prevailed since the late 1960s, when the newly emerging professional parenting class—people like me, with capital letters after their names—claimed that a child's psychological health was a function of how much positive attention he received from his parents.

pixel farmer (Rock Hardy), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:24 (eighteen years ago) link

oh, like red dye #2 in the states, good good, that stuff is horrible.

teeny (teeny), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 15:34 (eighteen years ago) link

Re: diaper rash - when Spencer was a baby, he kept getting a rash that I could NOT get rid of. His doctor diagnosed it as more of a fungal infection, and said to use Lotrimin on it, and it worked. Just so you know...

luna (luna.c), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 22:44 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, is there anything cuter than an 8 year old with headphones on, loudly singing along with Sinatra songs, doing sweeping arm gestures and wee dance steps? Because I can't think of much.

luna (luna.c), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 22:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Edith is a cutie! (sorry, I have nothing to say on this thread other than "aw, your kid is cute")

ailsa (ailsa), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 22:52 (eighteen years ago) link

We moved. I'm not on the laptop this time as there's no wireless connection here; rather I've just performed a series of gymnastic manoeuvres to extricate the desktop PC (box C51, folks) and the monitor (unboxed but behind three sets of partially-dismantled Ikea Billy units) from the comically-overstuffed 2nd bedroom. Phone was connected this afternoon.

It's cardboard city (195 was an underestimate; we've found two boxes labelled K35, a few unnumbered and unlisted and then there were the unlidded last-minute krazy-kram krates). The gas fire works. Previous occupants left stone figurines, framed photos of kittens, a wrapped bar of Imperial Leather on the bath and - shudder - a tupperware container of mealworms to feed the visiting robins. We love the place but need to rework every room. By the summer it will be a home.

Getting back on topic, Ava loved her tag-team kiddie-minding trip with Suzanne and Maria (and Josh and Luke and Ruby and all the other rugby-crazy babes), coming back with rosy cheeks and sleeping like a rock from 7:30. This morning I was appallingly hungover (two pints of Stella on a mostly empty stomach) and probably not best placed to judge Ava's rambunctious reaction to her new surroundings. A mushroom omelette and a pot of Earl Grey later, and I could see that she was loving it. There are mirrors everywhere (some left here, some ours, yet to be hung and so at ground-level) and Ava can't contain her joy at that. Difficult to get her to bed but she's down now with a convection heater in her room hastily rigged up to a timer. Hope she sleeps the night through.

The crappest baby-related thing about the move was defrosting the fridge on Sunday morning and hence having to chuck a whole host of ziploc-bagged food. (We left it outside on the bathroom windowsill but forecasts of -2C overnight were unfounded). For the first time in her life Ava's eating out of shop-bought jars (decent organic stuff from Planta, but still). If we'd known our vendors were going to leave a chest freezer (plugged in and operational) in the outhouse we could've saved days of home cookin'...

Pam is so fatigued she's got ill and is sleeping through a chair design docu on TV. If only we could find the VCR... Oh dear, Yentob's just got his kit off. Scratch that.

Michael Jones (MichaelJ), Tuesday, 7 February 2006 23:14 (eighteen years ago) link

Thank you, Ailsa.

Well done Mike and Pam and Ava. I am thinking of Mirror World in The Mighty Boosh.

I am going to work on Edith realising it's her job to pay attention to me. Well, I suppose I am already working on it, as I often balance cuddly toys on my head for a laugh.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 08:51 (eighteen years ago) link

re: diaper rash, we've used different things, but it seems like aquaphor has been most reliable. it's basically just petroleum jelly from what i can tell, but their baby ointment has helped more than anything else.

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 08:58 (eighteen years ago) link

(and michael, my sympathies. we're contemplating moving this year when our lease is up, but i think the sheer horror of trying to do it with an almost-2-year-old at that point will probably keep us here for at least another year.)

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 09:00 (eighteen years ago) link

I congratulate and condole with you, Mike. I was born on the day we moved house, apparently (and also during the world cup). I imagine that was pretty stressful (although come to think of it a fairly good excuse for my mum not to have to do any moving).

Hey, I have just checked and England didn't even qualify in 1978! All along my dad has led me to believe that he wasn't at my birth because he had to watch a tense England match! Bah.

Archel (Archel), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 09:29 (eighteen years ago) link

It must have been Scotland vs Peru.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 09:42 (eighteen years ago) link

Ah, the 3rd of June.

aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 09:45 (eighteen years ago) link

Why did the Scotsman strangle his pigeons?

Because they kept saying, "Peru, Peru".

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 10:07 (eighteen years ago) link

I was born on the 19th if that helps anyone do the necessary detective work...

Archel (Archel), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 10:10 (eighteen years ago) link

I lost interest after the 11th (Scotland/Holland), but googling shows there wasn't a match on the 19th.

SO JUST WHAT WAS YOUR DAD DOING THEN, EH?

aldo_cowpat (aldo_cowpat), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 10:31 (eighteen years ago) link

!!

Archel (Archel), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 10:31 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha - wrong sport Archel!
http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/june/19/newsid_2940000/2940656.stm

NickB (NickB), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 10:36 (eighteen years ago) link

Haha, I never thought my dad liked cricket but looks probable!

Archel (Archel), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 10:38 (eighteen years ago) link

I can't wait to breastfeed, although I'm scared that I'll struggle with it.

Trust me, the first few days and even weeks will be hard, but after that it really does get a lot easier. If you can't cope, get some painkillers and/or cream. I did and it made it a lot easier. The funny thing with my breasts: the right one is still struggling a little - Ophelia attacks it baracuda style - and during the night they get massive. You can prepare your breasts before your baby's born: try drying your nipples off with a *hard* towel for example.

Don't freak out when your baby vomits a bit of bloody milk, it doesn't harm her/him at all. :-)

What made it easier for me: I tried pumping milk twice. The midwives frothed at the mouth but I wanted to try it. I just wanted to have the choice. It was as if I wasn't allowed, as though *I* was the kid.

Nathalie (stevie nixed), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 12:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Mrs. Hunter delivered a beautiful baby girl yesterday, 7 lbs 15 oz, 20.5" long. Everyone is doing well. Except I think the 2 year old is starting to suspect that she will be coming home with us and generally infringing on his domain. I'll try to get a picture up if I can later.

Hunter (Hunter), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 20:18 (eighteen years ago) link

Woo! Congratulations!

pixel farmer (Rock Hardy), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 20:23 (eighteen years ago) link

Congratulations!

Jaq (Jaq), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 20:23 (eighteen years ago) link

yeah, congrats!

gypsy mothra (gypsy mothra), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 20:41 (eighteen years ago) link

congrats!

don weiner (don weiner), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 20:53 (eighteen years ago) link

2 year old boy suspicious of a newly arrived sister, eh? This is a familiar sentiment, in that it was my own experience. According to my mom I would have nothing to do with her for a few weeks. ;-)

And, of course, congratulations!

Ned Raggett (Ned), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 21:15 (eighteen years ago) link

good job hunter family!

teeny (teeny), Wednesday, 8 February 2006 21:35 (eighteen years ago) link

Rock on.

PJ Miller (PJ Miller 68), Thursday, 9 February 2006 09:00 (eighteen years ago) link

Oh wow! Congratulations!!!! :-))))


The breastpumping is not as easy as I figured. First time it went excellent, this morning no milk at all. BOO. I'll need to pump when my breasts are at its fullest,namely at night.

Nathalie (stevie nixed), Thursday, 9 February 2006 09:00 (eighteen years ago) link

It's a girl!! Congratualtions to you all and good luck in the weeks ahead!

NickB (NickB), Thursday, 9 February 2006 09:09 (eighteen years ago) link


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