ILX Parenting 5: I'm a big kid now

(irrelevant side question for hurting 2 - Is there like a general lawyers talking about being lawyers thread?)

we've erred on the side of caution re: screen time - basically none until almost age 2, with the intermittent emergency exposure to smartphone/tv programming while travelling or out in public (restaurant/theater performance etc.) My youngest has just in the last few weeks been exposed to TV programming (primarily Pee-Wee's Playhouse lol) he seems moderately into it and will wander up close to the screen for a bit and then go do something else. He will be 2 in January. Veronica didn't watch any TV at all except for one brief episode where she was up inexplicably puking in the middle of the night at about 1 1/2 so we let her watch TRON with us. When she was almost 2 we let her start watching Yo Gabba Gabba. These days her TV viewing is restricted to the weekends, between 2-4 hours spread over Friday night to Sunday night. And she gets to play video games on her nintendo or pad while on long car trips.

we've got screen time for our (almost) 4-year-old down to a movie once a week (almost invariably frozen but this is changing) and bugs bunny on sat. mornings for 30-45 min. she doesn't ask for more unless she's with her grandparents (of course!) or wants to look at photos of herself on the computer. she started with yo gabba gabba too and some sesame street though she never really got attached to either. she'll watch soccer with me occasionally but usually if it's on she ignores it.

Can't remember if I've said it here before, but an episode of Yo Gabba Gabba gives me time to shower if I need to get ready before F has had his first nap. So that's 23 minutes of screen once or twice a week. It pleases him greatly to see DJ Lance's giant face appear.

i'm not into the costumed whatever they are but dj lance is awesome.

feel like YGG is a p ingenious synthesis of various things the creators know will push this generation of parents' buttons - Mr. Rogers, Pee Wee's Playhouse, Gimme Gimme Octopus, a patina of hip hop

I know it's a cliche to say it, but Sesame Street continues to be really smartly written and there are a lot of subtle jokes and comic nuances aimed (I assume) at adults.

we like peter rabbit, word girl, daniel tiger's neighborhood, adventure time, dora (ugh), and of course frozen. daniel tiger's neighborhood has some really useful songs ("if you have to go potty - stop and go right away" super useful, also "you gotta try new foods cause they might taste good," and "if you feel so mad that you want to roar... take a deep breath and count to 4.")

Gro-ow-nups come back. Yeah we use those a lot. It's such a boring show though, can't stand to watch it with her.

I put a temporary moratorium on frozen viewing because she always seemed to have tantrums after, too intense.

grownups come back great too! such a useful show tbh.

Mr. Rogers was so much better, always visiting cool factories and shit

Now there are no factories to visit, only customer service call centers :(

sometimes they air vintage mr rogers episodes and we've recorded them for the kids -- some of the really early ones are pretty surreal, like pre-trolley live action plays.

dora = so much shouting

Veronica liked Frozen but the hypnosis-level obsession seems to have passed her by, she doesn't beg me to keep renting it or anything (she saw it once in the theater and once at home)

what she *does* keep asking me to watch are Justice League Animated Series episodes

xp

I generally love the nexus of drugs, new age spirituality and childrens programming found in the late 1970s. Early Sesame Street was just on a different plane.

daniel tiger's neighborhood has some really useful songs ("if you have to go potty - stop and go right away"

Need this song!

Ivy is currently ignoring the Bulls game.

I would very much like to murder at least half the characters on 'My Big, Big Friend'

So has anyone else dealt with an "I want...I don't want" tantrum? Like where they say "I want water" *gives water* "I don't want it!" *throws it down* "I want it!!!!" ad infinitum?

aka "psychological torture"

haha yes

fucking WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORST

they're testing you

Yeah I know. Usually my strategy is "I'm not playing this game" and walk away/ignore/etc, but long tantrums often ensue anyway.

tantrums must not be indulged, it just encourages the behavior

imo

"We do not negotiate with terrorists"

Oh yeah, I am definitely practicing non-indulgence doctrine. But lately they just go on anyway.

Perfect time to not feel guilty about staring at your phone!

When I see a tantrum in public, I try to signal the parent that it doesn't bother me and it's no big deal to me if their kid is screaming. Kids do that sometimes. Especially tired kids. (shrugs) It's no skin off my nose.

Nothing wrong with kids wearing themselves out with an emotional tirade imo, so long as all it nets them is they finally get tired of it and stop. Granted, tantrums can be very loud and very annoying, but what can you do? Physically trying to stop them, or pleading with them to stop, or threatening them to stop, is usually counterproductive. Bribing them to stop is so much worse.

I see it as a temporary regression to infancy, where screaming and crying is the only way an infant has to communicate. Kids who throw tantrums really aren't that far removed from infancy when you think about it.

When I see a tantrum in public, I try to signal the parent that it doesn't bother me and it's no big deal to me if their kid is screaming

yeah, it reflects more poorly on the kid than the parent imo (and not really that poorly depending on the age/circumstances/etc)

parents responding by indulging their child tho, they get a shoutout on my judging thread

also always just reminds me of this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1KgLrZuDng

other parents are much more forgiving of behavior (since they know it's common) than non-parents who get all huffy and ask u why you can't control yr kid

I always think of that Louis C.K. line "Now I think 'what did that shitty kid do to that poor mother'"

When you say don't indulge it, you mean don't give the kid the thing she's having the tantrum about, right? Like, "I want Cheerios!" "Here are your Cheerios." "I don't want Cheerios, I want toast!" "Here are your Cheerios." As opposed to making toast (which if I understand this particular illogical phase of toddlerhood correctly, the toddler would probably also reject).

Because I have read that sometimes with a kid has a tantrum you should hug it out with them, if they'll let you. Does that actually work?

Or maybe not does it work, but does it make it worse in your all's parenting experience?

depends on the source of the anger/frustration but at times giving my girl a bearhug (with some quiet talking) calms her down immensely. at other times, she's liable to get louder, more physical. though she doesn't do this nearly as much as other kids.

she's almost four and sometimes i think she still needs to be swaddled.

there's hardly a hard and fast rule about what will calm kids down, that's gonna vary depending upon the kid, the situation etc.

When you say don't indulge it, you mean don't give the kid the thing she's having the tantrum about, right? Like, "I want Cheerios!" "Here are your Cheerios." "I don't want Cheerios, I want toast!" "Here are your Cheerios." As opposed to making toast

yeah if they're just screaming and yelling and being wildly inconsistent/irrational, don't just keep trying to please them by meeting their whimsical demands, because then they will just keep asking for more/different crap. and the next time they want something, they know that throwing a fit is the way to get it. generally speaking.

There are times when the hug/killing the anger with love approach works, but not always. As with most parenting things, I find there is literally nothing that always works. Part of why I've started to hate parenting "method" books.

Part of why I've started to hate parenting "method" books.

I read a bunch of these before I had kid #1 and now that I'm on kid #2 I regard them as slightly less savory than snake oil

Those things are just anecdotes masquerading as science.

My parents had a whole huge shelf of parenting books on our bookcase, and they were both college educated so I figured they had sorted everything out according to the best available evidence. I put a lot of faith in their parenting judgement when I was a kid, even when it pissed me off to no end. But when I became a parent too, I confessed to them that I hadn't read all those parenting books like they did, and they said "oh, we didn't actually read those either, son."

Ha!

I try and get to the root of what's causing them to tantrum. The way I see it a tantrum is them unable to handle emotion, whatever it is, so when Molly gets cross then I'll ask if she wants a hug and see if I can validate her feelings so that she knows that I understand and then she can calm down and we can talk about it. It doesn't mean she'll get her own way, but that she'll be more likely to listen to what I have to say. God I sound like a hippy. It does seem to work though.

Beeps would mostly respond to hugging it out but the same approach infuriates Henry. For him humor will do the trick but it's hard to hit that sweet spot when you're frustrated yourself.

last thing you just said so OTM. I totally agree that it works best to be emotionally even, calming, try to understand their emotions, be patient, etc. (usually). But sometimes it's like I NEED TO LEAVE FOR WORK TEN MINUTES AGO AND YOU HAVE BEEN REFUSING TO GET IN THE STROLLER FOR FIFTEEN

God yeah, I've become very good at picking my battles and will only 'fight' for something worth fighting for, and when faced with time limits I'll give them another option, that I'll go alone/take them out in PJs/they'll have to walk/ etc. and follow through. Always follow through, always give an alternative that still works for you, and never phrase anything as a question if they don't really have a choice.

K wouldn't get up today so I literally dressed her in bed and put her straight into the stroller and left. She kind of looked like a mess but I guess a <3 year old can get away with that.

<3 year old!

haha aw