itt a strange man asks if you saw the ass on that one

assage

allow me to assage you all

oh god what is this i wield

there's this weird tacit vibe i'm getting that finding someone attractive and wanting to have sex with him or her is an inherently bad or wrong thing

itt a ass man asks if you saw the strange on that one

kevin you should be in church

This is how it is about entitlement/ownership: if men feel shut out from a normal or "successful" world, one of the first things they do is band together against outsiders, frequently women, who have less power/lower status and can be safely used to prop up men's egos, even without the woman's knowledge (like when her azz is rated out of her hearing).

I don't know where to begin with this - "band together against outsiders"?

there's this weird tacit vibe i'm getting that finding someone attractive and wanting to have sex with him or her is an inherently bad or wrong thing

Really struggling w any kind of answer to this, tbh. I don't THINK that's what I'm saying but then again I can remember the few times that someone's appearance has made me think of sex. Usually it just isn't even connected.

the dude is reaching out to another human being because he is sexually and emotionally frustrated. it has nothing to do with asserting or taking advantage of gender status.

I mean obv he is crepey

http://www.ugo.com/lifestyle/school-fashion/images/entries/Band-of-Outsiders-Trench-Coat.jpg

it kinda does

not something that can be easily explained on the internet though bc people will get all "are you saying wanting to have sex w/ someone is BAD?!?!?!"

tbf they would irl too but it's different

Curtis, that is just not true. Given the existing ugh...power? I don't know the approved academic words for this -- disparity between genders, it's not even possible! When men perve on women to other men, esp women doing nothing more than minding their own business in public, it is about having the right to make them a thing, a body part, to other people!

I can remember the few times that someone's appearance has made me think of sex

i can remember the 10+ times today that someone's appearance has made me think of sex.

FACTS
XP?

Maybe I was being a little hyperbolic w the "band together" thing but that seems like a human nature 101 thing to me, that when under perceived threat, people pull their personal or group identities inward to exclude those who might be part of the threat or at least are Not Like Them. That guy who shot a bunch of women in a gym is the extreme of this, but basically talking about women on the street is like the "harmless" end of the same thing. Not actually harmless at all of course.

When men perve on women to other men, esp women doing nothing more than minding their own business in public, it is about having the right to make them a thing, a body part, to other people!

do you think this is still true if a man is talking to a close (male or female) friend? just curious.

it's hard for me to conceptualize sexual interest and/or the desire to express that interest as good or bad, right or wrong. that's what i meant by "underlying impulse".

understand that some forms of real-world sexual expression are socially undesirable (perhaps threatening or even harmful), therefore appropriately shunned or even punished. but it's perfectly okay to desire and to wish to express it, right? it seems to me that people desire and objectify not because they want to or choose to or are taught to, but simply because they do. because that is the way the human animal works.

i would fault ~this~ guy for the crudity and thoughtlessness of his attempted camaraderie, but not for anything else.

if only ~those~ guys would sack up and respectfully approach the women they find so attractive maybe there'd be more love in this fucked-up little world

i was gonna post the ready or not scene where the disgusting jr high boys give rates out of 10 to all the girls that walk down the hallway by their locker but the clip is like 10 mins long

i would fault ~this~ guy for the crudity and thoughtlessness of his attempted camaraderie, but not for anything else.

^^

and the crudity has a lot to do with what laurel is saying - but I don't think that secretly thinking "dude is right, that chick was slammin" puts you at the same fault as creepy dude

~8===D~

do you think this is still true if a man is talking to a close (male or female) friend? just curious.

Not sure, Jordan. I guess at least if you say smething to a friend, you presumably know how that will be received by the other person; you aren't just assuming that they're gonna be down with it cos they have a penis, for instance, like it's something universal that all men share.

crutidy

what if the strange man was saying "did you see the ass on that one?" to a super butch chick about another chick

and i'll post the gilmore girls episode where lorelai rates the pizza delivery guys on a scale of 10, come on xp

(I hope my saying chick so much is not bad form itt)

if only ~those~ guys would sack up and respectfully approach the women they find so attractive maybe there'd be more love in this fucked-up little world

Were you there when I started panicking b/c I coulnd't get pizza place guy to leave me alone while I was waiting for my order last night? :( I shouldn't have panicked I guess but he was ignoring ALL my social cues to stop being familiar w me, and he kept getting closer and closer.

"did you see the crazy guy with the tinfoil on his head?"
"no, and I totally see through your attempy to objectify him due to your sense of exclusion from society, crepe."

really, ~that~ guy COULD be doing what Laurel is saying, but to categorically say ALL such guys who do that are is bad sociology 101.

That guy who shot a bunch of women in a gym is the extreme of this, but basically talking about women on the street is like the "harmless" end of the same thing. Not actually harmless at all of course.

― WHY DON'T YOU JUST LICK THE BUS DIRECTLY (Laurel), Tuesday, December 1, 2009 3:23 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

no. i do not accept this. this is a wrongheaded and terribly, terribly pernicious way to conceptualize male sexual desire and the communication of such. to see and to desire is basic, absolutely basic, to the human psyche. to attempt to communicate this desire to someone "safe", someone who presumably will not object to the expression, is the most natural and harmless thing in the world.

is there a sort of "us and them" conceptualizing going on in the though-process that chooses another man as the "safe" object of such communication? sure. but it is again perfectly natural, normal and harmless.

it has NOTHING to do with the radical sort of psychotic alienation that would lead someone to shoot a bunch of people. we can compare the two things in an abstract sense as they're both examples of dividing people into mental groups, but beyond that the comparison is horribly unfair.

I guess part of the panic is my reluctance to be bald-faced rude about it, I keep hoping that you know, being frosty will send the msg, cos I don't want to go over the edge in public and start yelling at people.

this is one of those things that i feel like is deeply ingrained in what dudes do all the time and it's one of those things that might creep women out even when it's casual and harmless, but we can't really imagine why or how it would be creepy. it's likely just one of those things women catch just on the periphery as they're passing by, but it weirds them out, and over time it just builds into this thing where you start to feel like guys like this are just repulsive.

gear once more bringing truth to mayhem

yeah. i agree that there's a weird complicity involved in a stranger doing this, but would fight for my right to engage in general smash-talk with friends.

xxxp

like it's something universal that all men share.

some guys are like that, though. esp ~that~ guy ie obnoxious gregarious guy. they're always making comments about the bonehead play the local quarterback made or how their old lady is raggin on them and you know how that goes, my man har har.

There does seem to be an "us against them" dynamic in this kind of behavior, but it doesn't have to be rooted in a perceived threat. More often than not, I think ~these guys~ just don't know how to relate to women on an equal civil level, and they probably take their cues from pop-culture depictions of the two sexes as separate alien species.

this is one of those things that i feel like is deeply ingrained in what dudes do all the time and it's one of those things that might creep women out even when it's casual and harmless, but we can't really imagine why or how it would be creepy. it's likely just one of those things women catch just on the periphery as they're passing by, but it weirds them out, and over time it just builds into this thing where you start to feel like guys like this are just repulsive.

Truth. I am getting like nervous and cry-y just thinking about the pressure that I feel from the behavior discussed in this thread.

i don't feel like most guys that say shit to you in public places feel threatened. though feeling threatened is sometimes an element of sexist behavior.

yeah. i agree that there's a weird complicity involved in a stranger doing this, but would fight for my right to engage in general smash-talk with friends.

tbh my stance is that there is a line which dudes have gotta learn. many choose not to. crossing this line is an act of mild sexual terrorism, rising to rape. fostering a gang mentality regarding the treatment of women creates a situation where men can act (initially talk, then physically behave) in a sexually barbaric manner. ~this~ dude approaching you is the first step on this ladder.

hence i can totally see where laurel, harbl etc are coming from.

I get nervous and cry-y when I think about the possibility of approaching the opposite sex because I'm worried that they will think I am a creepy dude

Plus, I love doing this with girls about guys, too.

crut i don't have the impression you should worry

i talk about women all the time with my male friends, and banter about it with my female friends sometimes too, but i think you just have to be respectful. that public ogling shit, the "hey bro you see that one?", i dunno...it does weird me out when i'm drawn into it.

take her, dude

in a way, i see the caveman communication of desire for profoundly alienated people as a kind of relief valve. they're all alone in their heads and trapped with this sense of frustrated longing - unless they can share it with someone else. it's a way of easing the burden, of turning separation into a cause for community.

of course, there are solo rapists, who don't even need a social or family situation to terrorise women (admittedly, their problems may have begun in such situations). these people scare me the most, but they aren't nearly so widespread. most rape is familial/social.

i think gear/other hoos/omar little/whatever we're calling him these days regularly displays class and discernment on threads like these - heed him imo

also i <3 contenderizer's awesome overthinking - never change, sincerely, plus your ponderings on my username have been noted and <3'd

Laurel's mention of cues missed at the pizza joint is quite important here. Sometimes, girls want to be flirted with, quite saucily, even, and others they want absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with you. It's really quite easy most of the time to figure this out and quite quickly.