i think the opposition w/ laurel got set up cuz a bunch of ppl voted for the joke answer from the perspective of "despite being creepy & weird & awkward of that dude to say anything publicly, that chick is pretty hot tbh" & thinking that voting that way was kinda edgy/lol -- laurel pointed out it was a depressing result -- ppl got defensive cuz they felt she was conflating them w/ the creep ... or something idk
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:29 (fourteen years ago) link
xp to granny dainger -- never understand why ppl come in to threads where folks are having reasonable mature discussion & act like its some crazy clusterfuck insanity thread ... this isnt exactly brits-buys-a-bottle-opener stuff here
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:30 (fourteen years ago) link
x-post Yes agreed but I don't think that was ever in question. In fact, I thik that was the whole point of her original post!
― bear say hi to me (ENBB), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:30 (fourteen years ago) link
it's okay to have thoughts of whatever kind in your own head.
people have sexual thoughts about other people sometimes. there is nothing wrong with this, ever, at any level.
we should not be so ready to believe these things imo.
― goole, Wednesday, December 2, 2009 4:25 PM (5 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
To clarify this is what I was disagreeing with.
― bear say hi to me (ENBB), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:31 (fourteen years ago) link
I wouldn't have gone that far (xxxxxxp), I think all you can reasonably ask of people is that they keep their inner monologues to themselves, but I am intrigued with the idea. Honestly although you can't prosecute or condemn someone for their thoughts, you can sure as hell think of less of them for it if they tell you something that indicates they are out of line, in your estimation.
― WHY DON'T YOU JUST LICK THE BUS DIRECTLY (Laurel), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:31 (fourteen years ago) link
i can think of a lot of thoughts its not ok to have in your head
― max, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:32 (fourteen years ago) link
if actions can be more or less good, then thoughts too. i mean, what's the difference? yeah yeah, whether it affects others, but the "don't affect anyone w/ yr bullshit" is more of a political issue than a moral one.
xp eh 'natural' -- as far as human sexuality even is such, so what?
i don't have any grand solutions, but i'm dissatisfied with a state of affairs where "don't [act like] a creep" is fine but "don't [think like] a creep" is like 10 steps too far. why?
― goole, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:32 (fourteen years ago) link
1mx xps
― goole, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:33 (fourteen years ago) link
i must not think bad thoughts
― jazzgasms (Mr. Que), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:33 (fourteen years ago) link
ENBB i think its perfectly legit to critique personal sexual ideas as much as anything else! just because it occurs to someone 'naturally' doesnt mean its above consideration -- a lot of 'natural' ideas of sexuality are actually the result of environmental stimuli anyway
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:33 (fourteen years ago) link
*having thoughts furiously*
― 鬼の手 (Edward III), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:33 (fourteen years ago) link
deej i never understand why some people think they need to be schoolmarms.
― hope this helps (Granny Dainger), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:33 (fourteen years ago) link
Ppl have been very open and I think the range in how much ppl feel free/threatened wrt sex talk/thoughts in public is perhaps the most significant thing. It would be harsh to ask ppl to take responsibility for how vulnerable they feel their identity is to the gaze of others. I guess I think it would be best if the strange man at the liquor store was disempowered, if that expression made him vulnerable rather than the woman whose ass it was, if him doing his "I have a boner" thing was more of a risky personal confession than a landgrab. But, def as long as we're young and hot enough to be desired and probably forever, the sexual threat is going to bear way more on women, and that can give any guy's thoughts/looks/behaviour an extra potency to women they're dealing with, regardless of intention. So I think that puts the onus on guys to be aware of potentially very different levels of comfort/openness w/expressing/receiving desire. I don't think the answer is to try and find a standard of behaviour you can justify, and say that beyond that, if anyone is uncomfortable it's their problem. Sometimes that is hard and there's probably an 18 year old woman in rural Afghanistan who would never be comfortable talking to me alone, not my fault, but what can you do?
― ogmor, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:33 (fourteen years ago) link
sorry to interrupt your sexy time, granny danger, perhaps there are other whole entire internets out there for you
― goole, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:35 (fourteen years ago) link
ilxor.com: your source for schoolmarms
― curtest hipness (Curt1s Stephens), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:36 (fourteen years ago) link
dude sorry my negative reaction to people being all "yes let's start questioning people's baser thoughts, that will surely be really productive and something that always works well for the human race" rankled you so
― hope this helps (Granny Dainger), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:37 (fourteen years ago) link
Laurel's original post was fine.
Laurel's second post was idiotic lashing out at black people a la Michael Richards.
Only horseshoe and I called her on it and she never actually apologized for doing it.
I'm still fucking pissed off about it but, on balance, not really surprised, because this is pretty much exactly what I expect from all of you; it's still disheartening, though.
― Huckabee Jesus lifeline (HI DERE), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:37 (fourteen years ago) link
― hope this helps (Granny Dainger), Wednesday, December 2, 2009 3:37 PM (4 seconds ago) Bookmark
no one asked for peak inside your brain im fairly certain
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:38 (fourteen years ago) link
I think it's time this thread got laid. Then maybe it can have a snack and go to sleep happy.
― Of course I want frosting. I'm a Scorpio. (kenan), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:38 (fourteen years ago) link
Hahahah Dan you are doing EXACTLY WHAT I PRAISED YOU FOR, which is policing these boards for levels of EVEN JOKEY racism that might read as fucked up or offend normal readers (and mine was purposefully way beyond that). My point EXACTLY is that no one does this for any other issue on ILX. And see? You can't let it go either.
― WHY DON'T YOU JUST LICK THE BUS DIRECTLY (Laurel), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:39 (fourteen years ago) link
hi dere im pretty sure i said something too
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:40 (fourteen years ago) link
did you SB her? xps
― everyone stop (dan m), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:40 (fourteen years ago) link
in other words i have been otm in this thread
her point as i read it was that there is a strong taboo on ilx against racism but not one against "equivalent" levels of sexism. which, fair enough, as far as it goes.
xp
― goole, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:40 (fourteen years ago) link
im trying to argue its more nuanced than that but w/e
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:41 (fourteen years ago) link
dan perry turns into tombot, thread is complete
not that laurel's racist trolling was excusable
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:41 (fourteen years ago) link
her point was pretty lame
― jazzgasms (Mr. Que), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:42 (fourteen years ago) link
Hahaha shut the fuck up, Laurel. It's not cute, it's not funny and it's not intellectually honest.
You could have made EXACTLY the same point by posting EXACTLY the same thing without using the word "nigger". So WHY DID YOU?
― Huckabee Jesus lifeline (HI DERE), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:43 (fourteen years ago) link
And see? You can't let it go either.
Um. Laurel, do you really think he should just "let it go." Hopefully you will say you are just kidding about this post, too.
― jazzgasms (Mr. Que), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:44 (fourteen years ago) link
(not that it makes it any better)
The fact that you were upset and the fact that you have a valid point doesn't actually give you carte blanche to do a Michael Richards in my eyes. If you think that makes me overly touchy, so be it.
I'll note that you STILL HAVEN'T FUCKING APOLOGIZED.
― Huckabee Jesus lifeline (HI DERE), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:46 (fourteen years ago) link
dan can we not make this about you please
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:48 (fourteen years ago) link
The point is that Towel Head and Camel Jockey are perfectly good substitutes.
― Of course I want frosting. I'm a Scorpio. (kenan), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:48 (fourteen years ago) link
http://cdn0.knowyourmeme.com/i/6512/original/DoubleFacePalm.jpg
― cantus in memory of benjamin bratt (omar little), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:49 (fourteen years ago) link
kevin just a quick tip--shut up, now
― max, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:49 (fourteen years ago) link
the racism comparison/n-bomb out of nowhere bugged me out to and I figured it did everyone else too. nobody even ever says anything like "did you see the black on that n****r?" and if they did it would be in a completely different context/tone than saying "did you see the ass on that one?"
comparisons of sexism and racism are generally unsuccessful because while they are both morally reprehensible, boneheaded forms of discrimination they have completely different histories and social connotations/consequences, so basically any time you try to draw the comparison you should at least have the common sense to not drop n-bombs even if it is to "make a point"/elicit a specific reaction
― curtest hipness (Curt1s Stephens), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:49 (fourteen years ago) link
fwiw goole's questioning of people's thoughts weren't completely wrong imo, i mean you shouldnt be having sexual thoughts about children, for example.
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:50 (fourteen years ago) link
ppl got defensive cuz they felt she was conflating them w/ the creep ... or something idk
yeah, doesn't much of the discomfort of this stuff comes from feeling... not as distant to the guy as you'd like? I'm sort of imagining that's what people who voted "slamming" were half confessing? It isn't like ilx not to mention 'narcissism of small differences' etc! It's the thing from the DFW article on Blue Velvet, etc...
I don't get how people can say this thread is a clusterfuck, honestly. It's really good!
― Gravel Puzzleworth, Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:51 (fourteen years ago) link
k3v .... dan isnt making it 'about him'
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:51 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah that was poor wording an i apologize, i just thought the thread took an interesting turn and we had all already called her out on it
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:52 (fourteen years ago) link
u need to let your ideas catch up to your condescension before dropping jaded-bombs on ilx
― ice cr?m hand job (deej), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:53 (fourteen years ago) link
you guys should really bring paedo into this too.
― omaha deserved 311 (call all destroyer), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:53 (fourteen years ago) link
maybe you can come up with the unified theory of objectionable thoughts.
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, December 2, 2009 4:50 PM (3 minutes ago)
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:53 (fourteen years ago) link
is it okay to masturbate in front of a baby if you find it physically attractive?
― there but for the grace of mod go i (Curt1s Stephens), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:54 (fourteen years ago) link
yes k3v i was referring to your post
― omaha deserved 311 (call all destroyer), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:54 (fourteen years ago) link
Dear Kevin K
Thanks for reminding me I shouldn't be having sexual thoughts about children.
You're the best,
Que
― jazzgasms (Mr. Que), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:54 (fourteen years ago) link
good job picking up on that
cya
― brutt fartve (k3vin k.), Wednesday, 2 December 2009 21:55 (fourteen years ago) link
good contribution btw