just watched the first two eps last night. i actually have yet to watch THE WIRE, which is weird, i guess, cause im from baltimore, but i anticipate it being frustrating how much people are gonna wanna substitute WIRE-circle-jerks for actual talk about TREME. i mean, i get it, but im enjoying coming in cold so far.
― 69, Thursday, 22 April 2010 22:58 (fourteen years ago) link
so far this thread is pretty light on Wire talk aside from referencing what actors from it are here (and i'll take the blame for some of the Wire comparisons that are on this thread, heh). 69 do you still live here?
― some dude, Thursday, 22 April 2010 23:29 (fourteen years ago) link
god please no more "authentic" scenes...that busking scene is fucking tragic. this show needs to cut back on the "soul" asap. oh those damn tourists seeking "authenticity", they can never feel the soul of new orleans like the real new orleans natives goddamn do!
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 25 April 2010 20:13 (fourteen years ago) link
I think maybe you're misinterpeting those scenes? It's the righteous keyboard player that comes off as a dick (as does Steve Zahn's character for similar reasons in most of his scenes).
― Nhex, Sunday, 25 April 2010 20:18 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah he does come across as a dick, but don't believe for a second that he's meant to be a dick in relation to the tourists. couple that with the "we used to build shit in this country" part 2 "now we teach digital media" rant...
you think people are watching and the majority think "what a dick" at these scenes?
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 25 April 2010 20:22 (fourteen years ago) link
Yes! And I think it's definitely intentional. The tourists seem naive and goofy, maybe a little rube-ish, but not as mean as that guy - his partner, the violinist, is pretty embarassed for him during the scene. Also, in a later scene they imply somewhat that the street musician is lying and bragging about what he was really doing during Katrina. Though I agree that there doesn't seem to be that kind of self-awareness with John Goodman's character, he's a little too directly cast as a authorial mouthpiece.
― Nhex, Sunday, 25 April 2010 20:29 (fourteen years ago) link
i dunno...feels dangerously like writer's opinions on shit being allowed to spew forth a bit too much. even if the dude is a dick it's still pitched as authentic new orleans dude vs clueless rubes...
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, 25 April 2010 20:32 (fourteen years ago) link
already in love with the violinist tho...
diet lizzy kaplan
― cozen, Sunday, 25 April 2010 20:45 (fourteen years ago) link
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Sunday, April 25, 2010 3:32 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark
i really didn't know what to make of this, as i suggested above. maybe we were supposed to think it was the busker that was full of shit?
what i DON'T think was meant to happen: audience thinks the busker's music sucks. which is sort of did. to make it clear that it was supposed to be "good", we got a bunch of reaction shots of locals (read: mostly black people) bobbing their heads appreciatively. otherwise i wouldn't thought it was an intentional pisstake.
― by another name (amateurist), Monday, 26 April 2010 14:00 (fourteen years ago) link
I definitely thought the busker was being depicted as a bit of a cunt, to criticize the sort of elitism that can follow if you take your "in the know" attitude too far. I think this wasn't particularly ambiguous, as the reaction shots of tbe violinist being embarrassed of him, and the later scene with her questioning his stories of heroism during the flood didn't make him look particularly sympathetic. Even though the Christian tourists were shown to be kinda clueless, I felt they were depicted in a more positive light, especially in the later scene were they did try to find out more about the "real" New Orleans. I took the whole thing to be a bit of self-deflating criticism on part of the makers of Treme, as (based on the two episodes I've seen) the series obviously fetishizes NO music and culture to some extent, but they wanted to show what happens if you take that sort of fetishism too far. Looks like they're doing something similar with DJ character too; even though he's more sympathetic than the busker, it's quite clear that his enthusiasm for "realness" sometimes goes too far as well.
― Tuomas, Monday, 26 April 2010 14:27 (fourteen years ago) link
I was sold as soon as I saw Cool Lester Smooth in full Mardi Gras Indian dress. I'm going wherever this boat is taking me.
Most interesting character plots to me thus far: Violinist/Keyboard player busker drama, and Antoine's assault on Shawn Kemp's super baby daddy status.
In the running: Antoine's ex-wife looking for her lost son, Big Chief Lambreaux and his family's struggle to rectify its role in post-Katrina New Orleans, and his attempts to bring the tribe back together.
Least interesting: Steve Zahn, although he may bring the lol's occasionally.
― Clerk all KNOWIN (B.L.A.M.), Monday, 26 April 2010 16:36 (fourteen years ago) link
havent seen last nights episode yet but the stevie-d-lookin busker guy comes off like a dick (intentionally on the writers part, i think) and his music sucks (i assume this is unintentional)
they are going to need to lose a lot of the hard-on for authenticity and soul and whatever for this to be as good as the wire
― max, Monday, 26 April 2010 17:03 (fourteen years ago) link
robcorddry Watching Treme on HBO. I hope it's as important as it is boring.
― Jolyon Swagg (jim in glasgow), Monday, 26 April 2010 17:07 (fourteen years ago) link
man, i'm having a lot of trouble distilling my feelings about this. i know ilx isn't big on "authenticity and soul" but when it comes to shit like second line music and indian music, those are in no way abstract concepts. it runs deep and if you're not playing it right, somebody will definitely let you know. and i really believe that doesn't exist in quite the same way anywhere else in the u.s., and i appreciate that they're trying to get it across.
on that note, i'm hoping for more brass band stuff and less time spent on ragamuffin buskers (character stuff aside), galactic, etc.
― emotional radiohead whatever (Jordan), Monday, 26 April 2010 17:25 (fourteen years ago) link
btw a way better version of that 'saints' arrangement is on this record: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000WF1PCK/ref=dm_ap_alb41
― emotional radiohead whatever (Jordan), Monday, 26 April 2010 17:28 (fourteen years ago) link
when it comes to shit like second line music and indian music, those are in no way abstract concepts. it runs deep and if you're not playing it right, somebody will definitely let you know.
This could not be more true.
I still remember when I was living in Northwest Mississippi, and my cousin was living in New Orleans, I used to be able to get out of work and make it within receiving range of the WWOZ Afternoon Brass show on Friday afternoons on the weekends I would go and visit with her. Damn, those fat tubas are AWESOME.
― Clerk all KNOWIN (B.L.A.M.), Monday, 26 April 2010 17:33 (fourteen years ago) link
right but its not really the authentic-music stuff that bugs me, its the cartoonish 'outsiders' and john goodman polemics. THOUGH the violin and piano duo do bug me, because they suck
― max, Monday, 26 April 2010 17:57 (fourteen years ago) link
agreed
― emotional radiohead whatever (Jordan), Monday, 26 April 2010 18:03 (fourteen years ago) link
The Katrina Tour thing was kinda hamfisted.
― no turkey unless it's a club sandwich (polyphonic), Monday, 26 April 2010 18:05 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah personally it's not that the music guys are authentic, it's the sort of misanthropic feel of the treatment of "outsiders" so far and the john goodman polemics are just sort of wrong/stupid yet it's like you're supposed to pound the couch and go "damn right" every time he speaks.
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Monday, 26 April 2010 18:11 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah and i think that aspect feeds off of the "authentic music" bit--like because theyve taken such great pains to really get the music right, and because the music trades very seriously on authenticity (i did like the "bourbons got pride" joke), the writers think they can carry that over to all aspects of the show
― max, Monday, 26 April 2010 18:16 (fourteen years ago) link
i dunno there are a few layers of irony in a hipster kid busking careless love and then getting vicious wrt authenticity
are they setting him up as the Voodoo Shop Killer?
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Monday, 26 April 2010 18:27 (fourteen years ago) link
you mean this?
http://www.amazon.com/Shake-Devil-Off-Murder-Orleans/dp/0805088938
― emotional radiohead whatever (Jordan), Monday, 26 April 2010 19:03 (fourteen years ago) link
qft
― da croupier, Monday, 26 April 2010 19:06 (fourteen years ago) link
xpost that's the one
― all yoga attacks are fire based (rogermexico.), Monday, 26 April 2010 20:00 (fourteen years ago) link
― Jolyon Swagg (jim in glasgow), Monday, April 26, 2010 12:07 PM (5 hours ago) Bookmark
LOL x1000
― by another name (amateurist), Monday, 26 April 2010 22:37 (fourteen years ago) link
the third episode was ok. the problem with TV, for me, is that so often the nature of the system of making series TV ensures that no director has much of a free hand in how to treat the material. and so in terms of the texture (stylistic and emotional) of an episode, it will often just feel kind of... blah. so while i'm reasonably invested in the characters, some of the scenes just seemed so indifferently shaped as to really tax my interest. this latest episode was the first where that was a strong problem. some scenes were handled well, others (the encounter between the bar owner and her husband in front of her bar) were really sloppy. but most were just blah, as noted.
― by another name (amateurist), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 19:24 (fourteen years ago) link
no motivation to watch the third ep but will do at some point...
― I see what this is (Local Garda), Tuesday, 27 April 2010 21:12 (fourteen years ago) link
Most interesting character plots to me thus far: Violinist/Keyboard player busker dramahttp://www.amazon.com/Shake-Devil-Off-Murder-Orleans/dp/0805088938Yup. The first time I saw those two characters and heard that she had been flashing people after Katrina, Zachary Bowen and Addie Hall immediately came to mind. You can draw numerous parallels. That relationship will certainly end badly.
― Jazzbo, Wednesday, 28 April 2010 18:30 (fourteen years ago) link
More about that here ...
― Jazzbo, Wednesday, 28 April 2010 18:36 (fourteen years ago) link
she had been flashing people after Katrina,
wha?
― by another name (amateurist), Wednesday, 28 April 2010 21:46 (fourteen years ago) link
apparently to ensure that cops/guard had a reason to keep coming by their block
― emotional radiohead whatever (Jordan), Wednesday, 28 April 2010 21:46 (fourteen years ago) link
treméh
(j/k, this is ok-to-pretty good but as I ws saying to ilx user gukbe earlier today I'm not feeling the need to street team it just yet)
― g.w.f.nagl (cozen), Wednesday, 28 April 2010 21:47 (fourteen years ago) link
it's kinda funny how everyone's having the "i don't know about this radio DJ guy, am I supposed to sympathize with him or is he just an annoying doofus?" when that could probably describe, like, every role in Steve Zahn's entire career
― Thug Motivation 102: The Weinspiration (some dude), Wednesday, 28 April 2010 21:57 (fourteen years ago) link
Also, The Wire had some annoying doofuses.
― no turkey unless it's a club sandwich (polyphonic), Wednesday, 28 April 2010 21:58 (fourteen years ago) link
i like the steve zahn character. the interaction w/ his totally reasonable neighbors was nicely played. he's using the "authenticity" of tremé as an alibi for being an asshole. so to its credit the show, while obviously very invested in "authenticity," plays it up as a pose as well.
― by another name (amateurist), Wednesday, 28 April 2010 22:01 (fourteen years ago) link
Steve Zahn's stripper song was great.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 28 April 2010 22:21 (fourteen years ago) link
yeah, it was funny how he invites his friend over to hear his amazing, intense new song... and it's simply a revelation about a gaggle of strippers moving in across the street.\
my posts these days make me sound mildly retarded. i apologize for that.
― by another name (amateurist), Thursday, 29 April 2010 00:53 (fourteen years ago) link
Wow, interesting stuff about Bowen and Hall, I had no clue.
Dunno if you've seen this, it's a nice blog by a Tulane music prof on the music in Treme:http://soundoftreme.blogspot.com/
Great article on Tootie Montana:http://www.louisianafolklife.org/LT/Virtual_Books/Hes_Prettiest/hes_the_prettiest_tootie_montana.html
― Brakhage, Thursday, 29 April 2010 03:46 (fourteen years ago) link
I think Zahn's character is being redeemed - you can see why people like him, even if he's childish and irresponsible. He rushed right over to the restaurant with his check to make up for being a dick.
I'm confused by Goodman's reaction to Zahn - Goodman instantly loathed him, which I thought was weird for a guy who professes such love for the culture of NOLA. The only thing I could think of was he's wary of anybody out to interest his daughter in low-prestige, low-wage occupations (like being a musician). But his despising Zahn seemed really intense and came out of nowhere. Am I missing some subtext here?
― Brakhage, Thursday, 29 April 2010 03:51 (fourteen years ago) link
i definitely picked up that goodman's character was concerned about zahn perving on his daughter.
the character goodman plays gives off an impressively imposing vibe. i'd be scared of him too.
― by another name (amateurist), Thursday, 29 April 2010 04:01 (fourteen years ago) link
i should add-- this was partly because there was a POV shot of zahn sitting a bit close to her on the piano bench, followed by a shot of goodman looking a bit incredulous. i think he's just supposed to be an overly protective father (and we know the zahn character is a perv, even if he may not be that kind of perv).
― by another name (amateurist), Thursday, 29 April 2010 04:03 (fourteen years ago) link
i mean, c'mon, Davis does look kinda dirty. that shaving line was wonderful.
― Nhex, Thursday, 29 April 2010 04:41 (fourteen years ago) link
I did see that POV shot - but Goodman's adverse reaction to Zahn is immediately after opening the door to him, that's what confused me. Goodman's dislike of him seems to be of the entirety of Zahn's character, rather than just fear of molestation. I'll let it go because I'm sure they'll follow up on this in future episodes.
― Brakhage, Thursday, 29 April 2010 05:07 (fourteen years ago) link
I'm enjoying this but I feel that something needs to happen soon, aside from that kid being beaten up it all feels a bit first-episode still. Enough scene setting, now give us an idea of where you're going to take this.
― Matt DC, Thursday, 29 April 2010 13:35 (fourteen years ago) link
I was confused by the piano lesson scene too. The Tulane professor hasn't come across characters like this around his beloved city before (he's surprised that a low-income musician didn't shave before giving a lesson)? And I didn't think it could be construed in any way that Davis was interested in his daughter, despite his reputation. Yeah, I think they've run into each other before and we'll learn more about that later.
― Jazzbo, Thursday, 29 April 2010 15:05 (fourteen years ago) link
Davis seemed to know Goodman's wife, so why not...
― Matt DC, Thursday, 29 April 2010 15:34 (fourteen years ago) link
― Matt DC, Thursday, April 29, 2010 9:35 AM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
yeah... i kinda said this upthread and maybe it's unrealistic to expect a seasonal arc quite as heavy and dark as The Wire usually had (at the very least the body count is gonna be a lot lower), but it seems like they have to be building to something and it feels like those gears are still turning very slowly.
― Thug Motivation 102: The Weinspiration (some dude), Thursday, 29 April 2010 15:35 (fourteen years ago) link
I also think Goodman knows that his daughter a little developing hell-raiser in her, and wants to prevent her from being exposed to what he perceives - probably correctly - as a BAD influence.
Davis is an asshole, but he seems to have more good intentions than not. I think, like a lot of pothead musicians I know, he's just a very selfish person who rarely pulls his head out of his own ass.
― Clerk all KNOWIN (B.L.A.M.), Thursday, 29 April 2010 15:42 (fourteen years ago) link