Best Martin Scorsese movie

the protagonist is basically a guy who does not engage with the environment around him, he keeps the city at arm's length. The subsequent events can all be interpreted, in a way, as the city taking its revenge on him for this attitude.

-- Shakey

it's a reductive viewpoint that says "why make this grey, it will be much clearer in black and white."

But I thought that's what you were saying. I mean, you did say that Scorsese (or "the film" or whatever) does not endorse Bickle's self-image. That sounds pretty clear and unmistakable to me. But perhaps I misread you. [to be read with no sarcasm]

Also I never said that saying "these guys weren't heavily involved in thinking through their aesthetic decisions." I said they weren't asking particular questions about star, the filming of violence, and narrative.

Nor did I suggest "that scorsese et al were in total thrall to bickle rather than rigorously examing..." I said "(Scorsese et al. were) more in thrall to Bickle than distanced from him."

I'm well aware for Scorsese the De Facto Film Scholar [no sarcasm] so I'd never say he wasn't thinking heavily about his aesthetic decisions. And just for the record, if you scroll up, I do have love for Scorsese and a fair amount of affection for this film in particular.

And fwiw, Resnais never comes to any black and white conclusions on these matters in the films mentioned above.

what the fuck

delete "saying" xpost

we did actually have a thread on Raging Bull but it was on ILF
Raging Bull: C/D?

Also, "I'm well aware OF"

The King of Comedy
The King Of Comedy: c/d

bozelka, postmortem edits of your own grammar are not going to get you any more respect after that equivocating point-by-point backpedal

also, lol

yeah villain is a little strong, hence the scarequotes. I think Scorcese had some inherent sympathy for the city as the protagonist, but knew that to keep the comedy/audience engagement working he had to make the lead guy's plight sympathetic as well.

x-post

shakey the guy did data entry for a living

KJB define 'in thrall'

ive definitely never read the movie as remotely -sympahtetic- to bickle, its actually the opposite - bickle is a total joke at every single point throughout

Automatic thread bump. This poll's results are now in.

bickle always seemed a joke to me, the line me and my friends quoted all the time was the 'damn, i gotta REMEMBER stuff like that', still c'mon in the wake of dirty harry and death wish and esp JOE and the reactions to them no way did schrader and scorsese not know exactly what they were doing. the critique aspect interests me less than the searchers homage and the (probable schrader selfportrait) picture of the lonely city dweeb which is deadon, you still see these freaks and they aren't marty, they're fucking bickle - this bizarre ball of anger and ego (with some horniness that's never gonna be resolved hidden in there) buried underneath timidity and a windbreaker. even that doesn't interest me too much though and the whole 'o man times are dark lemme tellya times are dark' sheen, even if it was the 70s and times were dark this still manages to turn that into silliness (quoting john simon again, for some reason, i can remember him quoting the 'every night i wipe cum off the back seat' and writing 'every night?'), somewhere david fincher was watching.

cape fear gets a vote and raging bull only manages a tie w/ the departed - ye gods. shoutout to whoever voted for american boy though.

this thread makes me want to see bringing out the dead again. i can't remember that one very well.

It's Taxi Driver in an ambulance, with Nicolas Cage and Ving Rhames.

it doesn't have anything in common with Taxi Driver

(besides the screenwriter)

(and the 'times are dark lemme tellya times are dark. *HOW DARK ARE THEY?* so dark i might just LOSE MY MIND. but i met this one girl, she's nice, i should help her, help her from these dark dark times. also i drive around a lot.)

travis custos

hahahaha

but seriously I hated that movie

John-Goodman-backwards-snow-scene notwithstanding

o i hated it too and have almost completely forgotten it (totally forgot ving rhames was in it). at the time i was selling myself on 'he's biding his time til gangs of new york' - JOKES ON ME!

i had a friend that was a huge nic cage fan and was primed for botd to be some sorta redemption/return to form after the bruckenheimer stuff. NOPE!

I loved Bringing Out the Dead! Don't understand the animosity at all.

re: After Hours - the protagonist (I don't even remember his name, is it anything as goofy as Pupkin or Bickle?) spends most of his time being alternately confused and abused by his city. [..]in a way, as the city taking its revenge on him for this attitude.

interesting thought, it sounds plausible.

if DiNiro and Scorsese weren't at least in partial thrall to Bickle, the movie would be half as good, honest or challenging.

I have to agree. I seem to remember the filmmakers saying in a documentary somewhere that they made TD because they wanted to put onscreen a particular way they all felt about New York. I honestly wouldn't put racism and paranoia past either scriptwriter or director, but do think they at least deal with it and don't romanticize it. The weirder twist, for me, is the anti-racist Paul Simonon and the Clash quoting the "some day a great storm" speech in their song heroizing... the Guardian Angels?!?!

how in the hell could anybody vote for Shine a Light?

The weirder twist, for me, is the anti-racist Paul Simonon and the Clash quoting the "some day a great storm" speech in their song heroizing... the Guardian Angels?!?!

yeah i've never understood the p.o.v. of "red angel dragnet." then again in interviews around that time they all seem completely hopped up on god knows what, so they may not have been thinking clearly. probably they just liked the berets.

the Clash loved a good uniform, no doubt about it

"no direction home" would've been my no. 2.

Cape Fear is such a goddamned silly movie. 2/3rds of must be close-ups of Nick Nolte's sweaty face. Love all the hammy acting tho

yeah on the 'how do you pronounce lawyer' thread i was tempted to post a clip of 'COWN-SUH-LUH'

still can't believe raging bull's poor showing up there

in the words of Lou Reed, "there's just so many favorites to choose from"

kinda most surprised by the high showing for After Hours. Which is great and all.

Cape Fear was where it all went south. Above and beyond the fact that it was a film that just didn't need to be made--the original's quite good enough--it was absolutely hysterical. Those scenes near the end of De Niro ranting and raving...There'd just never been anything remotely so embarrassing in a Scorcese film up to that point.

The Color of Money was pretty lousy. That's the point where I was like "okay Martin's maybe running out of ideas."

Raging Bull is my jump-the-shark moment.

Other than Goodfellas, "Life Lessons" is probably my favorite post-86 Scorsese thing.

There's a lot that I like about The Color of Money, starting with Cruise's performance and the "Werewolves of London" set-piece. Not as good as The Hustler, and Newman's Academy Award was strictly a lifetime-achievement thing--I think he's mostly pretty good, though--but I was still with Scorcese at that point.

i'm sure Cape Fear was just fine to the kids raised on those stinko '80s horror films

Scorsese--I've only written the name 10 zillion times, so it makes sense that I'm misspelling it.

Other than Goodfellas, "Life Lessons" is probably my favorite post-86 Scorsese thing.

^^^^ The guy has a couple of great films and a handful of good moments.

I say five for sure--the four that are too obvious to list, plus King of Comedy--and maybe Who's That Knocking at My Door, although I think that's more a film of great sequences than a great film.

Plus two or three great documentaries the past decade.

holy moses did i enjoy watching shutter island again at the cottage some weeks ago... this movie is MADE to be watched on home video, all the b-movie-ishness just makes so much sense

ditto to 'life lessons' love - i think that was the official entry to my scorsese love (and to my dylan love also)(procol harum love never set in though), i remember seeing that and some clips from a not yet released goodfellas on some pbs thing and just getting instantly obsessed w/ the guy. will rep for age of innocence also though i haven't seen that since it was in theaters and to be honest what i remember most is the saul bass credit sequence - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wi65QJW-c6o. weird that casino, which combines basically the two good scorsese themes - mob story plus story about a guy with woman issues - was such a misfire.

casinowned

I'm excited about Hugo Cabret –- Paris, mystery, automata, Méliès, train crashes...

I would just like to point out that in Cape Fear, Joe Don Baker drinks Pepto Bismol mixed with Jim Beam