The Daily Show

http://www.speakersla.com/2006-07/images/capitol-steps-large.jpg

(The Capitol Steps)

so much fail

anyway you're right nobody but you is qualified to discuss the relative quality of satire

so perhaps the problem is not so much whether or not it's good satire to begin with, but that we've yet to become accustomed to satire with lots of heavy duty merchandising and promotion involved, and an ongoing drip, instead of a book or a pamphlet that can just drive a point home and leave it at that. I think perhaps satire-as-commercial-venture is more than part of the problem here, involving several peoples' livelihoods and multiple companies all jumping in to make a buck off of how easy it is to poke fun at our completely and utter inability to elect anyone worth a flying fuck or practice journalism with any respectability whatsoever

http://www.sitcomsonline.com/photopost/data/818/9421sctv_2.jpg

xp sorry tombot

Colbert's joker is watered-down topical Dada, it's like Jackass News with a little less juvenile enthusiasm and a veneer of political gutsiness that it doesn't deserve.

not fair, sez me. I mean, in one way it's true, and even more true of stewart, but the colbert character has exceeded its expected mileage on the strength of the comedian behind it. He's a funny guy. Characters are his thing, he does them well. Standup was stewart's thing, and he was never great at it, and it's seeming lately to me like he'd be more effective if he stayed in the writer's room.

LOOK GUYS AMERICA FUCKIN BLOWS HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

I mean unless you are actually shakey mo I don't see how that's watchable more than a couple nights a month while already inebriated, as a quite popular form of humor it's pretty fucking gallows

especially when people are apparently so willing to go out and spend money on it

I think perhaps satire-as-commercial-venture is more than part of the problem here

yeah it's not like this has been the exact state of the enterprise since its earliest surviving instances

IT USED TO BE PURE MAN

(qualification: I ain't got cable, I see this shit maybe five times a year, it always strikes me as funny when I do)

yeah thats what i dont get, tombot you essentially seem to be saying 'poking fun at our completely and utter inability to elect anyone worth a flying fuck or practice journalism with any respectability whatsoever' is worthless unless its er worthless

oh right the Candide "best of all possible ice creams" and accompanying comic book series and poster

voltaire fucking roomed with the king of prussia, i dont see colbert pullin that kinda shit

swift just kept pumping out sequels to gulliver, this is not well known because they were all overburdened with expensive special effects and on the whole rather embarrassing

no deeznuts I was arguing you're worthless for sitting there laughing the whole time instead of getting angry

oh right the Candide "best of all possible ice creams" and accompanying comic book series and poster

yeah that Voltaire was indie as fuck! he didn't publish his shit or accept money for it nor a rising position in society, none of that, he just told it like it was

same shit different epoch man, you know this, you're a good deal smarter than I am, don't get all old-guy on me

"if u aint swift, u aint shit"

so taking depressing situations & making light of them to illuminate them further is NOT a satirists purpose. interesting.

Daily show suxxxxxxxxxxxuxuxuxux

in fairness deeznuts the best satirists don't leave you laughing, they leave you with a truly horrible taste in your mouth (cf. Swift, Voltaire, Juvenal especially - this is why Horatian satire is generally regarded as lesser by everyone except the English: it doesn't burn like acid)

perhaps my real problem here is that I personally disagree that this moment in history is appropriate for "and then the prince didst make a poo in his gran's flange" lol satire and needs a bit more of the fucking heat

I was arguing you're worthless for sitting there laughing the whole time instead of getting angry

well, at least one person is angry. Very very angry. The nation breathes a sigh of relief.

Who watches late nite comedy to get angry? I have enough angry during the day.

yes thank you john for that

xxpost, you may have a point

how do you work a pun on "sedition" into an ice cream flavor though

Seditious Berrylicious?

anyway, does anyone remember kilborn era daily show? I seem to remember it being way more talk showy and seemed to satirize local news a lot more. was it around 2004 election when it became like 'culturally relevant'?

Tombot the thing you should remember: in Juvenal's time, in Swift's time, in Voltaire's time, shit was way worse than it is now, no matter how we may like to imagine that our era is totally the worst - if people start starving to death on the fucking streets to a point where you can't take a walk without seeing somebody who'll be dead by the time you're heading home, the fuckin' Daily Show, should there be one, will get a bit more caustic

wait wait a TV character has not one, but several facebook groups??? may god save us all from this horrendous cult of personality

I also disagree that the high-water mark of tolerable shit should be the same in 2007 as 1729 but point taken

I think that getting mad at "The Daily Show" and "The Colbert Report" for (perhaps intentionally) highlighting mankind's innate ability to endure bullshit is a waste of energy.

I also disagree that the high-water mark of tolerable shit should be the same in 2007 as 1729 but point taken

feeling is mutual here man, I'm with you in principle, I mean I wish people wouldn't hear an imagined Swiftian/Juvenalian satire as "shrill" or "over-the-top," but I suspect that any such satire would appear quite unhinged to practically everybody

waiting for Ethan to point out to me that Juvenal devoted an entire satire to how much he hated fags

Daily show:

Bad impressions by Jon Stewart. Everyone he does sounds like the penguin. Bush, Cheney, everyone, all the same.

NOT FUNNY CORRESPONDENTS. Everyone that was remotely funny left.

Interviews can be decent. That's it.

I like Larry Whitmore (sp?) a lotty lot.

Samantha Bee is funny. Rob Riggle and Larry Wilmore can be funny. Jason Jones is sometimes funny.

I love half the time the Samantha Bee and the other half find her grating and not half funny.

I think perhaps satire-as-commercial-venture is more than part of the problem here

this is kind of what i was getting at when i said i don't think one can sustain 'brilliant satire', as such, on daily television; lots of hours to fill, the gig's too regular, no matter how gifted (or angry) given the circumstances he has to pace himself and the show as a showman first and worry about net political impact after(and i make no mistake those circumstances involve his naked ambition to conquer showbiz, not necessarily effect political change, although his current success make it more likely that his political bent will come along for the ride).

that said, the question tom poses about steady drip satire is an interesting one, i just bristle at the sourness and arbitrariness of some of the yardsticks for success posited on this thread(which remind me of a similar debate about michael moore which i don't want to dredge up really). i'll concede he's close to having explored every nook of the 'authoritarian mindset uberman' dig and there's only so many headlines and what-ifs you can run through that mill but i don't think it's close to being depleted as far as comedy is concerned, but then comedy isn't something you can debate(and insofar that it is, 'it's not funny' always beats 'it's funny' rhetorically so i hope you're not chasing that dead horse).

i guess im the only one who finds/found john oliver funny.

i think j0hn d has unintentionally introduced a giant strawman here, in that no one is claiming colbert is one of the most brilliant satirists of the past 10000 years.

xp

I want to see 19-yr-old college girls with Juvenal posters and bracelets.

19-year-old college girl new rhetorical 13-yr-old pop fan

wait wait a TV character has not one, but several facebook groups??? may god save us all from this horrendous cult of personality

-- Curt1s Stephens, Monday, October 22, 2007 8:43 PM (57 minutes ago) Bookmark Link

lol zing. the point was deeznuts challenged the idea that colbert had a cult— saying it was only ppl who edited wikipedia— i c/p all those groups because they all have like 15,000+ members, and yes, it's a relevant point.

http://www.stereogum.com/img/mozstewart.jpg

i have never seen these shows, but the smugness & insularity of the the fans scare me

sorta like ilx?

perhaps

ilx fans are far worse.

xpost

far far worse.
the mail i get is just terrifying.

most fans of TDS/TCR aren't insular tho right? They're just passing fans who watch it occasionally, like me (and I presume many ILXors)

i dunno, occasional viewer not really a fan in the fanatical sense, just someone who likes it but doesn't make a point of seeing it every night. i was talking more hardcore types

but fanatics are insular by definition so your point taken

/sarcasm