US POLITICS SPRING 2011: Let's just call off this country.

who is clamoring for that ?

I'm talking about GOP "grassroots" getting things done more than Democrats - when the Tea Party is yelling for less taxes and regulation on business, it's pretty easy to look like effective because the game riggers are happy to play along.

Anybody who thinks capitalism is going anywhere needs to pass me the bong.

nah i mean i thought greenwald was right abt how the dems should have run more progressive candidates in red states across the board in '08 -- but when you've missed that boat you're stuck w/ the reps youve got

the reps we get are the ones Dems insist are the only ones who merit support in the primaries - this isn't some "oh how'd we ever end up with these candidates?" - progressives in the primaries get a "look, nice thought, but we must be practical" response from party activists; this will happen again next year - lots of head-patting "oh you with your progressive thoughts, how darling - here, vote for this asshole who doesn't support reproductive choice & pray for rain" - this is "practical" i.e. cowardly, short-term-vision who's-got-the-money-in-the-near-picture thinking, and merits a "then you get nothing" response from anybody who's going to want to vote in politicians who'll fight to get back the rights that the elected Dems have sold for political capital

so its hopeless? why bother participating in these discussions then?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MwR1n0p1V7U

Unless capitalism can persist on a planet of finite and depleting resources, then I do think it will have to fundamentally change. I don't think the change will be voluntary, but more of the kicking and screaming type. But I do think it will come.

*takes a massive toke*

I don't dispute that there will (by necessity) be change, but what, besides capitalism can one propose? You can regulate it and tweak capitalism all you like, but a command economy isn't a likely alternative.

(Nice weed, btw)

capital will do just fine with depleting resources

aerosmith i agree w/ that paragraph, to an extent, in that this is something than can & does happen -- i just dont understand your defeatism or your idea that it has to be this way & that there's no way you can affect change. cf j0rdan's defeatism, "cant change why bother"

oh look

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0411/53429.html

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/265238/pro-life-dem-trouble-kathryn-jean-lopez

yeah speaking of that dude needs to go

"the most innocent among us"

I think capitalism is going somewhere, and taking us with it

aka "Where are we going, and what are we doing in this handbasket?"?

dont just do something, snark there!

is the society in Road Warrior a capitalist one

good morning, shakey!

Unlike Marx I'm not at all convinced that progress is inevitable but cheap pessimism is just that, too. We haven't really mastered capitalism yet (though I'd say 2008 - 2009 show that we know how to avoid its worst effects even if we are still allowing that kind of thing to happen) so I'm not at all sure how some post-capitalist economy would function and for those who would propose some kind of democratic capitalism or national capitalism, there is still the problem of competition between nations and international cooperation, though real, is still at the G20 level.

how many deprssions must we endure before we figure out to how improve capitalism?

all of them!

who "endured" this depression? the only people with a real say in our political landscape are still posting record profits

lol Al & Shakey A+ exchange, would lol again

btw I've been listening to music that elevates my spirit for the past hour-plus and I now wish all health to all people of good will politicians or otherwise

dunno about you but I'm still enduring it.

so should I bump the poll thread where I asked for suggestions on which luxury car I should buy or would that be tacky

looking to make a decision in the next 8 weeks and I am curious re: others' opinions/experiences

i have no experience but ive listened to lots of rap songs

Get an Escalade. I drive an Explorer. Gas guzzlers, keep guzzlin'.

I recommend:
http://www.worldofmonopoly.com/fansite/images/tokens/monopoly_token_car.png

so does the popular phrase "late capitalism" not refer to its latter days but the fact that it is never on time?

lol

http://cdn2.holytaco.com/wp-content/uploads/donald_trump_combover.jpg

capitalism takes forever to get its hair just right before it goes out for the evening

I'm gonna make a big confession: I have no idea what you all mean when you reify "capitalism" that way. I can talk that way for jokes but I have no idea what we're talking about, beyond having a system of money & people buying & selling things using that money. If that's all we're talking about, then what are the alternatives? I guess like bartering, or a worldwide gold standard, or something? I get totally confused when people talk about "what's after capitalism". I think this is because I am a dumbass, but I want to understand.

I was hoping I wouldn't need money anymore while Dan's driving me around in his luxury car.

feudalism yo

agrarian communalism

important to remember that 'capitalism' doesn't mean 'the things I don't like about our current, only-partially-capitalistic economic system'.

anarchosyndicalism

absolute freedom and power for aerosmith, indentured servitude for everyone else

sorry I'm in a bad mood today, heavy shit happening

like I think I am a capitalist? that is, I like distribution of labor & being able to save my labor using money, & the variety of the marketplace, etc. I get that local / state / fed gov gives all kinds of bs tax incentives to massive corporations & that US corporations treat people like shit...but I guess I think it's awfully dorm-room-y bullshit to say "capitalism is the problem" b/c tbf I don't want to have to work on a farm b/c it's hot & smelly & pretty hard work! but I'm happy to pay someone else to do those shitty jobs if that's what they'd rather do with their time...I don't think that all makes me Michael Milken but I dunno.

lol u must be a blue dog

If you'd like a command economy, allow me to propose my candidacy for benevelolent despot.

a benevelolent despot, is that like a dictator that does standup

"a funny thing is going to happen to you on the way to the labor camp"

LOL

If my despotism is truly benevolent, there most certainly won't be any stand-up. More like Dick Cavett, sit down drollery.

My labor camps will consist of madatory karaoke until wills are broken.

SIGN ME UP

Euler, bartering and a gold standard aren't incompatible with 'capitalism', which mostly just refers to property rights/who controls the 'means of production'. and that strict definition is sorta useless in 2011 when we all work in the service sector. every country in the world has its own mixed economic system that and using sweeping terms like 'capitalism' to describe them is lazy/pointless. I mean people here who support unions are not 'anti-capitalist', they're supporting an institution within 'capitalism'.

Yeah, it may not be very sexy, compared w/1848 or 1870, but mostly we're just arguing about arcane details in mixed economies, even in China and Vietnam. The real anti-capitalism or anti-modern-economy is probably the kelptocracy 'models' of Africa or the Balkans or Russia - these are the economies that least serve the common good.

SIGN ME UP

Would you like maple syrup or sriracha w/ your gruel?

both plz