White trick-or-treaters in blackface: C/D?

That bit you got right, certainly.

I wouldn't let my child wear blackface, or anything like that. I don't understand why anyone would let their kid go out like that. Maybe in some world of complete equality of oppurtunity, equal rights, equal status, it would be ok, but we very much don't live in that world.

I can remember the black & white minstrel show being on bbc1 every week, sat night iirc. It was very popular, though we didn't used to watch it.

When we were kids in junior school (this would have been in the early 1970s, I think 1972.) one year the school nativity play was done in blackface, ie as if the play was done by the black & white minstrels. This was the teachers idea. I remember my parents and others not being very keen on the idea. Nevertheless it went ahead.

If I think about it now, I feel kind of dizzy, what the fuck, you know? Why the fuck did they do that? It would be nice to think that people in 2005 had more sense than people in 1972, anyway. Obviously some people don't.

well i think a white kid in a ben wallace jersey with an afro wig should be welcomed, and i can think of plenty examples where that type of stuff is interesting and funny and ok (one of the funny things about this whole argument was that i actually stuck up for ted danson's whoopi-written celebrity roast, or the concept at least - not actually funny but i dont think it crossed any lines that good comedy shouldnt, different of course if its johnny carson or colin quinn in blackface)

ok. That's all I'm saying though seriously Ted Danson sucks.

Also if you're allowed to play Ann Coulter I am too, dude. Don't get too crazy on the idea that you gotta explain power distribution problems! :P

When I was a kid (7-8), my favorite movie was "The Wiz." My school friend Kianga and I, along with a few other kids, put on an playacting production of the show in school at one point. I played the wis, and tried my best to dress up like Richard Pryor, including an afro wig and blackface. My motivations were totally positive--I loved the movie and was trying to emulate something I loved. Kianga played Dorothy--she was black, and didn't use blackface. Neither one of us had any idea what the context of blackface was.

The more interesting questions to me revolve around whether *the parents* recognized the faux pas here, and what that means. I wouldn't let my kid do it either, but the problem comes when I try to explain to him or her why doing it is wrong--in a better world, where the historical context of blackface was less clearly terribly, it seems that my child could take exactly the *wrong* message away from being forbidden to dress up as Ben Wallace of whoever, and that message could perpetuate for yet another generation the fallacy that there is something a priori wrong/different/lesser/frightening/whatever about people of different races.

I mean obviously, we're not in that world, but what's the right solution here?

xpost thank you ally thank you stelfox!!

You know as well as everyone else that he meant wigs and has even since backed off that, so what are you even getting at?

Why's Ben Wallace with a wig and no blackface such a crap costume? I mean, it's Halloween. No one is especially authentic. I had foam abs on my old Batman costume, but it was recognizable enough that I was Batman though the whole thing was made of spandex and foam. A white kid with a Ben Wallace type afro wig, the Ben Wallace jersey, and saying "I'm Ben Wallace" is really authentic/recognizable enough.

Yeah, that's why I keep asking how old these kids were cos that can make a big difference in this argument, quite frankly as to whether their parents condoned it, just how innocent it might or might not have been, etc.

xpost J I think that's what Dan was getting at, about how it's just as likely a kid might take away the wrong message as the right one, dependent on WHY he wanted to dress that way, how old he was, how it was explained exactly, etc etc.

xxpost ethan like I said part of the problem seriously was your (well admittedly somewhat overblown argument tho really that's how we roll) argument getting conflated with someone else's argument as well that it's not even ok for white kids to wanna wear negro league stuff and feeling guilty for having red and black and green beads. The lines were purty blurry for a while in my head who was saying what actually, but that is cos I need more coffee.

I was Batman for like 3 years in a row in high school.

Um, it's not (other than the fact that I don't like the Pistons!), that was my point! That without the blackface is ok! If you reread the original post, it was stated that this wouldn't be ok.

You mean that picture alone? Yeah, it is kinda funny.

All of these blog entries have taught me that apparently, blackface is still a common practice. I mean, "Shirley Q. Liquor". Good grief.

And yes Ben Wallace is a RUBBISH Halloween costume because he is just a normal human.

fuck that, things aren't ever that rigid! There are many explicable and inoffensive contexts for use of a word like "nigger" (swap in 'spic' or 'faggot' or 'bitch' or what-have-you…) be they scholastic, illustrative, recaimed, or as emblematic of a particular attitude or speech pattern. Provided they're used with an awareness of their history and context, and among people who understand their use as other than blankly derisive or for labelling purposes, I hardly see any reason why we should continue to avoid them at all costs. It's privileging in this way that continues to keep them powerful and hurtful.

Such a stupid blanket statement.

if i were a parent perhaps i will, as well as teaching them not to offend people with blackface etc., also to teach them not to take offence themselves of these things that are, fairly outdated ideas/connotations.

i think this would make the world a better place.

surely that's a bonus.

-- jdubz (dr_...), November 1st, 2005.

yes, we know stelfox can do much better

plz note also said creation and consumption occurs against a backdrop of of nasty homophobia as well

http://www.screenselect.co.uk/images/products/7/1327-large.jpg

I'll get my coat.

you can kinda see how some fucked up kid might draw the conclusion that hitler would make a good costume

better ban GTA while you're at it

1) algierz baller caricature stuff

i got given a heap of this stuff and i do admit, i only ever bust it out when the rest of my clothes smell, because i feel a complete twat in it!