― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:12 (eighteen years ago) link
― o. nate (onate), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:13 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:13 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:13 (eighteen years ago) link
a huge credibility barrier to hurdle by means of personality
this means not only finding a sufficiently alpha personality, but also finding a personality that knows the limitations of its alpha-ness. you don't see Bush on a horse.
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:14 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:15 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:17 (eighteen years ago) link
― kingfish kuribo's shoe (kingfish 2.0), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link
My prediction = if it gets them anywhere it's through no fault of their own. No, they'll have the Bush admin to thank a thousand times.
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:22 (eighteen years ago) link
STRAPPED: Why America's 20- and 30- Something's Can't Get Ahead
― Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:28 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:30 (eighteen years ago) link
no, you don't get it. (I have no idea what Dem "consultants" say, but I'll stipulate to your kossack/Sirotan belief that they are a monolithic group counseling meekness.) I'm not arguing for Dems to look and act as centrist as possible, I'm counseling that they assert their ownership of the center, aggressively but mild-manneredly (yes you can do those things at the same time) where necessary. Where a Dem position is really way outside the center, which would be rare but conceivable, they should consider whether it may be wrong.
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:34 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:36 (eighteen years ago) link
or they just move the center to where they are.
― kingfish kuribo's shoe (kingfish 2.0), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:38 (eighteen years ago) link
centrism-of-spirit has served Dems very well since Carter thanks very much. the two cultural centrists - Clinton and Carter - won. those who lost were Northern/urban/insider professorial types who did little to argue that they better stood for American values than their opponents.
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:40 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:22 (eighteen years ago) link
Appointed U.S. ambassador to the UN Agencies for Food and Agriculture by President Clinton, McGovern lobbied for a universal school-lunch program funded partly by a $1.2 billion annual U.S. contribution. As an isolationist skeptical of foreign aid, I am able to restrain my huzzahs, but I’d sure as hell rather spend a billion buying lunch for kids in Bangladesh than $300 billion occupying Iraq.
― kingfish kuribo's shoe (kingfish 2.0), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:26 (eighteen years ago) link
http://www.amconmag.com/2006/2006_01_30/images/magcover.jpg
― kingfish kuribo's shoe (kingfish 2.0), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:30 (eighteen years ago) link
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:34 (eighteen years ago) link
― kingfish kuribo's shoe (kingfish 2.0), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:35 (eighteen years ago) link
Clinton - 49.2%Dole - 40.7%Perot - 8.4&
do the math.
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:36 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:38 (eighteen years ago) link
― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:40 (eighteen years ago) link
did you have some other math in mind?
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:41 (eighteen years ago) link
xxpost - In the same issue they run a pro-Gene McCarthy piece, a piece about Mencken, and a piece critical of Greenspan. Like I said, I don't think it's an easy magazine to pigeonhole and although I don't have a sub I always check in.
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:41 (eighteen years ago) link
But back to gabbneb and his "obstructionist binaries" and focus group claptrap...
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:42 (eighteen years ago) link
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:43 (eighteen years ago) link
― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:45 (eighteen years ago) link
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:45 (eighteen years ago) link
― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:46 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:52 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:57 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:58 (eighteen years ago) link
― Allyzay Rofflesberger (allyzay), Thursday, 26 January 2006 20:59 (eighteen years ago) link
uh, actually it's not. Clinton 96 got 49.23. Gore 2000 got 48.38. Kerry got 48.27.
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:01 (eighteen years ago) link
"do the math"
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:02 (eighteen years ago) link
In other words, whose "centrism" are you talking about?
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:02 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:06 (eighteen years ago) link
sorry, I'm still including Perot's numbers. I know how you hate that. Total votes for other candidates vs. total votes for Clinton = Clinton won by a tenth of a percentage point.
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:18 (eighteen years ago) link
and? these corporations give millions to both parties (3 of the 4 are among the top 100 soft money contributors 89-02). they favor Repubs because Repubs are more on their side.
Those resources have been used to push a nakedly corporate agenda under the guise of 'centrism'
this is the sleight of hand Sirota specializes in. he doesn't say that the DLC is doing the corps' bidding, but he tries to make it sound that way. I see no reason to ascribe nefarious motives to the DLC any more than the party itself.
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― gabbneb (gabbneb), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:29 (eighteen years ago) link
― Shakey Mo Collier (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:32 (eighteen years ago) link
This is what is kind of confusing me.
Rahmneb, are you saying that Democrats need to claim ownership of the center and then define later what the center is? Or do Democrats claim ownership of centrist concepts and by default claim the center?
And do they claim the center by crying BUSHCO IS THE MOST EXTREME ADMINSITRATION EVAH by default or does the party just claim the center and then let the electorate figger out how EXTREMIST Bushco is?
― don weiner (don weiner), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:34 (eighteen years ago) link
xpost
― TRG (TRG), Thursday, 26 January 2006 21:35 (eighteen years ago) link