White trick-or-treaters in blackface: C/D?

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was TO bring. eh whatever

xpost Seriously. "I need to know how they wrap up their hair at night! Dammit...you're taking away my cross-cultural experience"

Candicissima (candicissima), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:07 (eighteen years ago) link

and West of the Hudson

Is this actually true? I got my stat from Upski Wimsatt so it could be wrong, but I'm interested.

deej.. (deej..), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:08 (eighteen years ago) link

I just have to say I'm happy I got through Harvard before the enforced their stupid "random uppeclass House assignment" policy; the entire point of the houses was that different ones had different focuses/personalities and one reason why a lot of the black students gravitated towards certain Houses (besides the bomb-diggity rooms) was because they DIDN'T go to schools where they got to interact with a lot of other black students. The enforced randomization basically sent the message that enriching OUR experiences was clearly secondary to enriching the experiences of other demographics.

Dan (850 Square Foot Suite Senior Year) Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:13 (eighteen years ago) link

xpost You don't have to be "international" to slide between those categories, though!

In a total offhand observational stereotyping gesture, I'd say yes: poor minority students do indeed tend to look toward pre-professional tracks more so than liberal arts. It's my experience that poor people of any sort are likely to make that decision, for obvious and healthy reasons: they're going to college to make something of themselves, and are pretty up-front about moderate wealth and social status being involved.

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:13 (eighteen years ago) link

"as if the only reason we came to college was the bring some color into his life" and "enriching OUR experiences was clearly secondary to enriching the experiences of other demographics"

this is actually the only basis on which the supreme court has found affirmative action in higher education to be valid; thankyew rehnquist/scalia

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:39 (eighteen years ago) link

The enforced randomization basically sent the message that enriching OUR experiences was clearly secondary to enriching the experiences of other demographics.

very possibly right, but what if they had different ideas about what would enrich your experience?

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Well, clearly they DID have different ideas about what would enrich our experiences; I don't want to directly attribute the damming quote to him because I'm not 100% sure he said it but I remember the dean of students at the time basically saying, "It's too bad that the minority populations on campus are retreating to familiar, safe ground by segregating themselves from the other students." Given the private school/raised in white suburb demographic amongst the black students, this was kind of a baffling and retarded comment seeing as we hadn't all been bused in from random predominantly-black areas around the country.

Dan (Excruciating Back Pain) Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Is this actually true? I got my stat from Upski Wimsatt so it could be wrong, but I'm interested.

in absolute 2000 numbers, NYC has twice the black population of Chicago. maybe there's something different if you start looking at different metro definitions, but i doubt it.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Well it'd be nice if the students' stated opinions were taken into account in what was going to enrich their experience, don't you think?

Allyzay knows a little German (allyzay), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 19:58 (eighteen years ago) link

Lots of things would be nice.

discus (dr g), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:01 (eighteen years ago) link

Dan Perry OTM

The main rebuttal of "why are all the black kids sitting together" is "well, why are all the white kids sitting together?" Just because there are less of us doesn't mean we're not just sitting with our friends like everyone else. Just because we all look the same (though we really don't) doesn't mean we are. My all-black table actually had a token, my white friend Aaron from HS, and it used to baffle the shit out of everyone. For whatever reason.

Candicissima (candicissima), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:07 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah geez and why aren't their more white kids in black frats?

Andy_K (Andy_K), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah geez and why aren't there more white kids in black frats?

Andy_K (Andy_K), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:32 (eighteen years ago) link

Sleep dep has never fucked so much with my spelling skills.

Andy_K (Andy_K), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

I read those posts backwards and was disappointed to see you hadn't originally asked why there weren't more white kids in black farts.

nabisco (nabisco), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:49 (eighteen years ago) link

Well it'd be nice if the students' stated opinions were taken into account in what was going to enrich their experience, don't you think?

Heavens, no.

Austin Quigl3y (gabbneb), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 20:58 (eighteen years ago) link

If I had been white friend Aaron I would've introduced myself as Marisa Tomei.

Air America (used to?) air a commercial insinuating that not allowing a white kid into a black frat would be wrong because any form of discrimination is bad, yet another case of blacks huddling into separatist comfort zones.

Andy_K (Andy_K), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 21:06 (eighteen years ago) link

Yeah geez and why aren't there more white kids in black frats?

Because they always break the canes during step routines?

Pleasant Plains /// (Pleasant Plains ///), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 21:07 (eighteen years ago) link

OH MY GOD

Dan (I Have Lost My Shit) Perry (Dan Perry), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 22:16 (eighteen years ago) link

Why do people not worry when like, Asians all sit together at the same table?

Allyzay knows a little German (allyzay), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 22:24 (eighteen years ago) link

ATTN DAN PERRY

YOU MIGHT'VE MISSED THIS ON ESPN.COM

http://search.espn.go.com/keyword/search?searchString=mike%20tyson&page=multimedia&multimediaCount=15

Allyzay knows a little German (allyzay), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 22:56 (eighteen years ago) link

Why do people not worry when like, Asians all sit together at the same table?

because white people don't need to be liked by Asians

gabbneb (gabbneb), Wednesday, 2 November 2005 23:11 (eighteen years ago) link

Some of these might be pics from that party but mostly they look too cool to be Chicago students.

Paul Eater (eater), Thursday, 3 November 2005 00:37 (eighteen years ago) link

http://www.lunacynet.com/league/images/s3_lazarou.jpg

RACISM AT HALLOWEEN!

My friend (of indian descent) went as a grand-wizard. He got my other friend's mum to make the white hood for him.

dog latin (dog latin), Thursday, 3 November 2005 18:12 (eighteen years ago) link

why wasn't anyone pissed about all those kids dressed up as ghosts? that's inexcusable, they're making fun of the dead!

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:39 (eighteen years ago) link

thats clever, what you did

_, Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link

When did ethan turn into gareth?

KSTFUNS (Ex Leon), Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:44 (eighteen years ago) link

did you get my depressing postcard from lanfortshire?

np: vioxx ~ waterfalls of ecstacy (2 bad mice remix)

_, Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:48 (eighteen years ago) link

x-post: when he quit using apostrophes?

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:49 (eighteen years ago) link

gareth used apostrophes too, back in the day

_, Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:50 (eighteen years ago) link

Why aren't the witches offended by halloween?

Am I right, folks?

deej.. (deej..), Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:51 (eighteen years ago) link

i suddenly regret making that joke

J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Thursday, 3 November 2005 19:52 (eighteen years ago) link

who couldve guessed youd regret a joke equating black people with dead people

_, Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:23 (eighteen years ago) link

No one cares if Mexicans all sit together at a table, either.

Allyzay must fight Zolton herself. (allyzay), Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:25 (eighteen years ago) link

How about Peruvians?

discus (dr g), Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:33 (eighteen years ago) link

"You forgot about Poland!"

Dan (Obligatory Bush Quote) Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:37 (eighteen years ago) link

opening up a can of worms i'm sure, but ethan how come you don't make any distinction between a person being racist and just not being sensitive re: race issues? honest question.

firstworldman (firstworldman), Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:47 (eighteen years ago) link

As I figure it … racism's conscious and intentionally oppressive or hurtful behavior, and racial insensitivity is ignorant / misinformed idiocy without maliciousness.

Remy (x Jeremy), Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:55 (eighteen years ago) link

Also, they both suck when directed towards you.

Dan (Tomayto, Tomahto) Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 3 November 2005 20:56 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't think the line is ever that clear between those two things, and I'm incredibly skeptical of the "conscious" and "intentionally" in that particular framing of it. (Plenty of people are actively-racist in ways that are more ignorant than consciously considered, and even segregation wasn't "intentionally" oppressive/hurtful.)

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:00 (eighteen years ago) link

There should be an "always" qualifier in that last bit, but I still think the majority of segregationists would have argued and largely believed that the system was better for everyone involved.

It's really, really dangerous to start thinking "racism" is solely limited to people who actively hate certain other races and take active steps to be mean to them; this describes like a really tiny portion of the history of racism, which is almost always more about having particular expectations of people or ideas about them and their status based on race. Whether those ideas are "conscious" or "ignorant" is a pretty vague spectrum based on how much people have sat down and thought about the nuances of their belief systems -- i.e., something really, really hard to judge without mind-meld technology.

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:04 (eighteen years ago) link

is there an acceptable audience to joke irreverently about race? there must be a difference between something directed at a race rather than using it as a mask to hide a punchline, right? i'm asking this because whenever i get in one of these sorts of discussions on ilx, i suddenly feel as though i am being inappropriate. in real life, otoh, i almost never feel this way, unless i am talking with someone from another generation, or in the presence of someone who actually does harbor racist/ignorant feelings.

i have never had a racial slur directed to me, though i'm sure that in various confrontations some people may have regarded my actions as having to do with being white. i have been with friends who have been racially slurred in my presence and it is indeed an incredibly awkward, hurtful and, yes, sometimes somewhat funny situation. the right idiot making the right bizarre racist comment can sound so absurd that you have to laugh at it. is that okay?

i don't think that sensitivity is always necessary to promote the alleviation of racism. i'm not asking for permission to tell racist jokes, i'm saying that it seems like there's a way to talk intelligently and with humor about race that shouldn't offend people.

firstworldman (firstworldman), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:10 (eighteen years ago) link

I don't know that anyone would disagree with that!

nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:12 (eighteen years ago) link

No one cares if Mexicans all sit together at a table, either.

as long as they speak english on the job *groans*

hstencil (hstencil), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:19 (eighteen years ago) link

Point taken… if not necessarily agreed-upon, Nabisco. However (to pick at a tangential point): refusal to consider 'intent' always strikes me as more of a clever poststructural conceit than an actual way to operate intellectually. Especially re. touchy subjects like race, we're constantly evaluating intent, nuance, audience, authorship, etc.

pretentioRemy (x Jeremy), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:21 (eighteen years ago) link

It is an easy way to validate whatever response one might have.

discus (dr g), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:22 (eighteen years ago) link

but isn't the whole issue of 'when boondocks does X it's funny… and when mallard fillmore does X it's offensive' really framed in terms of intent?

pretentioRemy (x Jeremy), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:24 (eighteen years ago) link

I think you'll need better than a rhetorical example to make yr point.

deej.. (deej..), Thursday, 3 November 2005 21:30 (eighteen years ago) link


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