tbf nothing can escape commodification
― lag∞n, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 15:49 (nine years ago) link
true enough
lol oh davies, you and your junkie skulk
― slothroprhymes, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 15:52 (nine years ago) link
― lag∞n
I'm sort of left with that being one of the major points of the series.
― the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 16:32 (nine years ago) link
People in advertising really can have a bizarre life outlook after a while. A friend in the industry realized the amount of cognizant dissonance when her firm was working for a large national banking/loan company that was as culpable for the home mortgage crisis as any other bank, maybe even moreso. They weren't the helpful, life-enabling savings and loan institution their advertisement made them out to be, nor were they the one-note profiteers of the nightly news. For her, they had to be both.
― ultimate american sock (mh), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 17:04 (nine years ago) link
as a person in a variation of that line of work i can confirm it definitely sucks for those reasons sometimes bordering on frequently & you deal with a lot of gray-area shit but fuck, i got rent and loans to pay
― slothroprhymes, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 17:08 (nine years ago) link
If the show had been set in the '70s and ended up around '79, it all would have pointed towards Heinz's "Anticipation" commercial.
Not the Mean Joe Greene Coke ad?
― Sir Lord Baltimora (Myonga Vön Bontee), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 17:26 (nine years ago) link
In that context it was a deeply cynical finale in the guise of a sugared ending
tbf nothing can escape commodification― lag∞nI'm sort of left with that being one of the major points of the series.
I agree with both of these.
To me the ending was the previous season's ending on a larger scale - instead of coopting the family meal with Burger Chef, they've coopted the search for the self as it were.
Watching the Coke ad made me infuriatingly angry. Then the jingle got stuck in my head for 7 hours.
― a silly gif of awkward larping (Sparkle Motion), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 17:44 (nine years ago) link
people under 40-45, had you never seen the Coke ad before?
― the increasing costive borborygmi (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 17:47 (nine years ago) link
i was familiar with it as being legendary also feel like they reran it or remade it in the 90s
― lag∞n, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 17:49 (nine years ago) link
I've seen. Also heard the song a million times. And as lagoon says they've remade it a few times.
― One bad call from barely losing to (Alex in SF), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:00 (nine years ago) link
I've seen/heard it a million times.
― polyphonic, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:01 (nine years ago) link
Yeah i heard it a million times. Did the remake it? That sounds familiar..
― ©Oz Quiz© (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:04 (nine years ago) link
Pretty sure I heard it first on Negativland's "Dispepsi".
This one had a much bigger impact on me: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7ThA2zlnm6g
― schwantz, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:08 (nine years ago) link
It ran on TV for about five years straight. We sang the de-Coked version in school and thought we were very funny singing '...and furni-SHIT with love' with special emphasis.
― scientist/exotic dancer (suzy), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:09 (nine years ago) link
We used to sing it in school too, so it had legs into the early 90s anyway.
― Love, Wilco (C. Grisso/McCain), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:43 (nine years ago) link
but you sang about "love" rather than "Coke," right?
(and snow-white turtle doves, no subtext there eh)
― the increasing costive borborygmi (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:45 (nine years ago) link
I'm sure they ran it sometimes on British telly when I was a kid in the 80s. Certainly very familiar.
― the joke should be over once the kid is eaten. (chap), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:50 (nine years ago) link
― the increasing costive borborygmi (Dr Morbius), Tuesday, May 19, 2015 5:47 PM (1 hour ago)
I remember Oasis having a big hit with that song on their first album. Seriously though, I was aware of it before that.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JUoVQ-kB7DQ
― tayto fan (Michael B), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:56 (nine years ago) link
In a way I kind of like the ad's optimism and naivety. Ads nowadays feature characters that are all judgey and cynical hyper-consumers.
― ©Oz Quiz© (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 18:56 (nine years ago) link
Except for the dumb blonde guy in the Sonic ads.
― Johnny Fever, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:02 (nine years ago) link
Well there often has to be a dumb person there asking obvious questions to act as audience surrogate and also someone the audience can look down on.
― ©Oz Quiz© (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:03 (nine years ago) link
I think I remember being surprised at learning that song was a coke jingle. But I have no idea how I would have heard it in Denmark, in what version.
― Frederik B, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:09 (nine years ago) link
i learned about it from a smash mouth song
― difficult listening hour, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:25 (nine years ago) link
i've still never seen it but eventually miscellaneous references accrued the density of an actual experience
― difficult listening hour, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:28 (nine years ago) link
I think I may have seen remake with the candles before seeing the original. (Plus I had "The New Seekers Live at Royal Albert Hall" as a kid and knew the song from there)
― Sir Lord Baltimora (Myonga Vön Bontee), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:44 (nine years ago) link
did the finale remind anybody else of /inherent vice/?
― gwyneth anger (patron sailor), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 19:54 (nine years ago) link
Someone at work asked me about the ending, someone who watched the first season, a few episodes from the next, then stopped. After giving her the most minimal 45-second summary possible of what she'd missed of Don's story--divorce, remarriage, divorce again, ups and downs at work, ongoing identity crisis, Ken dancing, now estranged from everything, job included, embraces fridge guy--I played the final scene for her, curious as to how she'd interpret it. Without a second's hesitation, she said that Don had had a flash of inspiration and went back and created the Coke ad. Which doesn't mean anything, I just thought it was interesting that someone who wasn't nearly as immersed in the show as some of us are would immediately come to that conclusion.
Before putting all this aside, I rewatched the first episode last night. Pretty great, with lots of fascinating connections to where it all ends up.
― clemenza, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 21:11 (nine years ago) link
Yes re:inherent vice
Xp
― Οὖτις, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 21:27 (nine years ago) link
i do think that if don didn't make that exact coke ad then i imagine he made a different coke ad plagiarizing the sad stranger's refrigerator dream. "you're a can of coca cola. you're in the fridge, and when the people open the door, they see you and smile and reach for you and you feel their love"
― gwyneth anger (patron sailor), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 21:37 (nine years ago) link
Hm, Don also pretended to be giving away a fridge full of Miller beer just two weeks ago
― Sir Lord Baltimora (Myonga Vön Bontee), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 22:10 (nine years ago) link
Probably Leonard was inside that fridge, which is the real reason the husband chased Don away--he didn't want this sad-sack of a man living inside his house in a fridge. It's all starting to come together.
― clemenza, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 22:25 (nine years ago) link
I am the secret man who lives in your fridge
― panettone for the painfully alone (mayor jingleberries), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 22:59 (nine years ago) link
I suppose you *could* interpret the Coke ad purely metaphorically but why on earth would you want to when the literal interpretation is so much better?
Otm.
― Acting Crazy (Instrumental) (jed_), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 23:23 (nine years ago) link
the literal and metaphorical interpretations are p much same diff
― lag∞n, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 23:51 (nine years ago) link
Yeah it's up in the air what he does with the rest of his life. If you believe he goes back and makes that ad, your still back to square one w what he does after that.
― ©Oz Quiz© (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 19 May 2015 23:53 (nine years ago) link
13 years after the success of the Coca-Cola ad, Don retired and died while watching television. On the tv? Wendy's famous "Where's the Beef?" ad played for the first time.
― Johnny Fever, Tuesday, 19 May 2015 23:58 (nine years ago) link
I don't think the literal and metaphorical readings are same diff,
― Acting Crazy (Instrumental) (jed_), Wednesday, 20 May 2015 00:07 (nine years ago) link
fridge seems like it has the right idea
― slothroprhymes, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 00:12 (nine years ago) link
Need to re-read Conquest Of Cool. Coincidentally I drove past Esalen yesterday.
― Elvis Telecom, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 01:52 (nine years ago) link
13 years after the success of the Coca-Cola ad, Don retired and died while watching television. On the tv? Wendy's famous "Where's the Beef?" ad played for the first time.Holy shit how great would it be if they would have ended with the where's the beef ad instead
― Darin, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 04:03 (nine years ago) link
avoid the noid
― T-Boz Scaggs (get bent), Wednesday, 20 May 2015 04:58 (nine years ago) link
i just squeak in at "under 40" but i was very familiar with the ad. i don't know where i first encountered it -- woodstock-era nostalgia started to reach a fever pitch around '88-'89, but i feel like this was something i was exposed to much earlier than that.
― T-Boz Scaggs (get bent), Wednesday, 20 May 2015 05:02 (nine years ago) link
my grandparents had this album and that's why i knew the song from way back
http://eil.com/images/main/The-New-Seekers-Wed-Like-To-Teach-371107.jpg
― piscesx, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 05:12 (nine years ago) link
Hamm thinks he wrote the ad! not sure if this has already been posted, thread is crashing Firefox.
http://artsbeat.blogs.nytimes.com/2015/05/18/mad-men-finale-jon-hamm-interview/
― piscesx, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 05:14 (nine years ago) link
was that the first actual pop hit that originated with a TV ad? or did it originate there?
i find it weird that people doubt that the takeaway was that don created the ad (or helped to create it, anyway). there were a few things in the episode—- the girl whose outfit looks precisely like that of a character in the coke ad, don's knowing smirk just before the last cut to the ad-- that really serve no purpose /except/ to strongly point to the obvious conclusion. i don't really see it as being particularly ambiguous. the other options would be almost embarrassingly protracted and/or literal: don writing down "i'd like to teach..." on a napkin; don jetting back to NYC and pitching the idea to Coke; Don calling up Peggy and saying "I'm comin' home!" i mean, to the extent it was a formally satisfying ending it's largely b/c it was clear but terse.
― he quipped with heat (amateurist), Wednesday, 20 May 2015 05:52 (nine years ago) link
(i mean the other options to getting the same conclusion across)
If you consider it a question of whether or not Don is capable of becoming a less shitty person then it's a pretty big difference, not least because it completely changes the nature of his interaction with Leonard.
If he makes the advert then the 'Don Draper' story pretty much begins and ends with him making a bigger and more successful self from other people's misery and/or destruction.
Something about Leonard reminded me a bit of Dick Whitman's brother, but that might be all in my head.
― Matt DC, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 07:20 (nine years ago) link
But it's been Don's destruction and misery as well. Not that Leonard's feelings aren't valid, but Don isn't just looking into the fridge and wondering if he is alienated from his family. He has lost everything, his house, his wife, his car, his kids, his other wife, his other wife, etc. This is why he went to the ends of the Earth. The final downward arc of his character was nihilistic and miserable. He was spiraling into annihilation. He welcomed it.
Leonard simply reminded him of his own misery. All season he has been seeking validation, asking people about the future, about the past, and not having any real confidence in himself. Don may go on to bigger and more successful things after the finale but that is what he does, it is how he survives.
― ©Oz Quiz© (Adam Bruneau), Wednesday, 20 May 2015 07:53 (nine years ago) link
He has lost everything, his house, his wife, his car, his kids, his other wife, his other wife, etc.
He also hadn't had a big win on an ad campaign in a long time, which seems (to me, anyway) just as relevant. I don't know if the spiralling personal life or the creative slump came first, and I'm open to correction because I haven't rewatched recent seasons, but when the ad came up at the end, it occurred to me that the smile wasn't just one of inspiration, but one of relief.
don's knowing smirk
I liked the fact that you have a second where you're not quite sure. It might not be a knowing smirk, it might be a genuine smile of enlightenment. But then the ad kicks in, and you realise that Don has a different idea of what constitutes enlightenment.
― trishyb, Wednesday, 20 May 2015 09:22 (nine years ago) link