Il Douché and His Discontents: The 2016 Primary Voting Thread, Part 4

I don't see how they wouldn't sweep past HRC.

Maybe that is because the future is so hard to see.

we didn't really talk about Trump's NYT interview on international policy.
it's horrifying and fascinating. he's a moron.
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/03/27/us/politics/donald-trump-transcript.html
i don't even know where to start quoting.

SANGER: So we talked a little this morning about Japan and South Korea, whether or not they would move to an independent nuclear capability. Just last week the United States removed from Japan, after a long negotiation, many bombs worth, probably 40 or more bombs worth of plutonium or highly enriched uranium that we provided them over the years. And that’s part of a very bipartisan effort to keep them from going nuclear. So I was a little surprised this morning when you said you would be open to them having their own nuclear deterrent. Certainly if you pull back one of the risks is that they would go nuclear.

DRUMPF: You know you’re more right except for the fact that you have North Korea which is acting extremely aggressively, very close to Japan. And had you not had that, I would have felt much, I would have felt differently. You have North Korea, and we are very far away and we are protecting a lot of different people and I don’t know that we are necessarily equipped to protect them. And if we didn’t have the North Korea threat, I think I’d feel a lot differently, David.

SANGER: But with the North Korea threat you think maybe Japan does need its own nuclear…

DRUMPF: Well I think maybe it’s not so bad to have Japan — if Japan had that nuclear threat, I’m not sure that would be a bad thing for us.

SANGER: You mean if Japan had a nuclear weapon it wouldn’t be so bad for us?

DRUMPF: Well, because of North Korea. Because of North Korea. Because we don’t know what he’s going to do. We don’t know if he’s all bluster or is he a serious maniac that would be willing to use it. I was talking about before, the deterrent in some people’s minds was that the consequence is so great that nobody would ever use it. Well that may have been true at one point but you have many people that would use it right now in this world.

SANGER: For that reason, they may well need their own and not be able to just depend on us…

DRUMPF: I really believe that’s true. Especially because of the threat of North Korea. And they are very aggressive toward Japan. Well I mean look, he’s aggressive toward everybody. Except for China and Iran.

See we should use our economic power to have them disarm — now then it becomes different, then it becomes purely economic, but then it becomes different. China has great power over North Korea even though they don’t necessarily say that. Now, Iran, we had a great opportunity during this negotiation when we gave them the 150 billion and many other things. Iran is the No. 1 trading partner of North Korea. Now we could have put something in our agreement that they would have led the charge if we had people with substance and with brainpower and with some negotiating ability. But the No. 1 trading partner with North Korea is Iran. And we did a deal with them, and we just did a deal with them, and we don’t even mention North Korea in the deal. That was a great opportunity to put another five pages in the deal, or less, and they do have a great influence over North Korea. Same thing with China, China has great influence over North Korea but they don’t say they do because they’re tweaking us. I have this from Chinese. I have many Chinese friends, I have people of vast wealth, some of the most important people in China have purchased apartments from me for tens of millions of dollars and frankly I know them very well. And I ask them about their relationship to North Korea, these are top people. And they say we have tremendous power over North Korea. I know they do. I think you know they do.

SANGER: They signed on to the most recent sanctions, more aggressive sanctions than we thought the Chinese would agree to.

DRUMPF: Well that’s good, but, I mean I know they did, but I think that they have power beyond the sanctions.

SANGER: So you would advocate that they have to turn off the oil to North Korea basically.

DRUMPF: So much of their lifeblood comes through China, that’s the way it comes through. They have tremendous power over North Korea, but China doesn’t say that. China says well we’ll try. I can see them saying, “We’ll try, we’ll try.” And I can see them laughing in the room next door when they’re together. So China should be talking to North Korea. But China’s tweaking us. China’s toying with us. They are when they’re building in the South China Sea. They should not be doing that but they have no respect for our country and they have no respect for our president. So, and the other one, and this is an opportunity passed because why would Iran go back and renegotiate it having to do with North Korea?But Iran is the No. 1 trading partner, but we should have had something in that document that was signed having to do with North Korea as the No. 1 trading partner and as somebody with a certain power because of that. A very substantial power over North Korea.

SANGER: Mr. Drumpf with all due respect, I think it’s China that’s the No. 1 trading partner with North Korea.

DRUMPF: I’ve heard that certainly, but I’ve also heard from other sources that it’s Iran.

SANGER: Iran is a major arms exchanger with...

DRUMPF: Well that is true but I’ve heard it both ways. They are certainly major arms exchangers, which in itself is terrible that we would make a deal with somebody that’s a major arms exchanger with North Korea. But had that deal not been done and they were desperate to do it, and they wanted to do it much more so than we know in my opinion, meaning Iran wanted to make the deal much more than we know. We should have backed off that deal, doubled the sanctions and made a real deal. And part of that deal should have been that Iran would help us with North Korea. So, the bottom line is, I think that frankly, as long as North Korea’s there, I think that Japan having a capability is something that maybe is going to happen whether we like it or not.

SANGER: Mr. Drumpf with all due respect, I think it’s China that’s the No. 1 trading partner with North Korea.

DRUMPF: I’ve heard that certainly, but I’ve also heard from other sources that it’s Iran.

He's pulled this before, right? Citing his unnamed and unverified secret sources?

http://d.gr-assets.com/books/1330545377l/13505602.jpg

forks your Drumpf filter is driving me crazy

^^^

^^^

___,,,^._.^,,,___

shit a bear, everybody run

"Ooh babe, of course mama's gonna help build the wall"

HA.

And I randomly heard this album again at a house party on Saturday. Which reminds me, I need to listen to the Final Cut.

forks your Drumpf filter is driving me crazy

you know, i've also never listened to the final cut. xp

the wall is one of the best albums of all time though for sure. PINK FLOYD

but more to the point: in flagrant disregard of 75 years of foreign policy, this guy is strongly suggesting Japan get nukes because "it'll be good for America"!
that whole interview reads like it's with a first year poli-sci major from a safety school who has yet to crack a book

it's all good man xp

de-drumpf'd for your reading horror:

DRUMPF: Well I was a fan as you probably know, I was a fan of Douglas MacArthur. I was a fan of George Patton. If we had Douglas MacArthur today or if we had George Patton today and if we had a president that would let them do their thing you wouldn’t have ISIS, O.K.? You wouldn’t be talking about ISIS right now, we’d be talking about something else, but you wouldn’t be talking about ISIS right now. So I was a fan of Douglas MacArthur, I was a fan of — as generals — I was a fan of George Patton. We don’t have, we don’t have seemingly those people today, now I know they exist, I know we have some very, I know the Air Force Academy and West Point and Annapolis, I know that great people come out of those schools. A lot of times the people that get to the top aren’t necessarily those people anymore because they’re politically correct. George Patton was not a politically correct person.

SANGER: Yeah I think we can all agree on that.

DRUMPF: He was a great general and his soldiers would do anything for him.

SANGER: But the other day, I’m sorry, this morning, you suggested to us you would only use nuclear weapons as a last resort.

DRUMPF: Totally last resort.

SANGER: And what did Douglas MacArthur advocate?

DRUMPF: I would hate, I would hate —

SANGER: General MacArthur wanted to go use them against the Chinese and the North Koreans, not as a last resort.

DRUMPF: That’s right. He did. Yes, well you don’t know if he wanted to use them but he certainly said that at least.

SANGER: He certainly asked Harry Truman if he could.

DRUMPF: Yeah, well, O.K.. He certainly talked it and was he doing that to negotiate, was he doing that to win? Perhaps. Perhaps. Was he doing that for what reason? I mean, I think he played, he did play the nuclear card but he didn’t use it, he played the nuclear card. He talked the nuclear card, did he do that to win? Maybe, maybe, you know, maybe that’s what got him victory. But in the meantime he didn’t use them. So, you know. So, we need a different mind set. So you talked about torture before, well what did it say — well I guess you had enough and I hope you’re going to treat me fairly and if you’re not it’ll be forgotten in three or four days and that’ll be the story. It is a crazy world out there, I’ve never seen anything like it, the volume of press that I’m getting is just crazy. It’s just absolutely crazy, but hopefully you’ll treat me fairly, I do know my subject and I do know that our country cannot continue to do what it’s doing. See, I know many people from China, I know many people from other countries, I deal at a very high level with people from various countries because I’ve become very international. I’m all over the world with deals and people and they can’t believe what their countries get away with. I can tell you people from China cannot believe what their country’s, what their country’s getting away with. At let’s say free trade, where, you know, it’s free there but it’s not free here. In other words, we try sell — it’s very hard for us to do business in China, it’s very easy for China to do business with us. Plus with us there’s a tremendous tax that we pay when we go into China, where’s when China sells to us there’s no tax. I mean, it’s a whole double standard, it’s so crazy, and they cannot believe they get away with it, David. They cannot believe they get away with it. They are shocked, and I’m talking about people at the highest level, people at — the richest people, people with great influence over, you know, together with the leaders and they cannot believe it. Mexico can’t believe what they get away with. When I talked about Mexico and I talked about they will build a wall, when you look at the trade deficit we have with Mexico it’s very easy, it’s a tiny fraction of what the cost of the wall is. The wall is a tiny fraction of what the cost of the deficit is. When people hear that they say “Oh now I get it.” They don’t get it. But Mexico will pay for the wall. But they can’t believe what they get away with. There’s such a double standard. With many countries. It’s almost, we do well with almost nobody anymore and a lot of that is because of politics as we know it, political hacks get appointed to negotiate with the smartest people in China, when we negotiate deals with China, China is putting the smartest people in all of China on that negotiation, we’re not doing that. So anyway, I hope you guys are happy.

SANGER: Thank you, you’ve been very generous with your time.

"see, MacArthur was just trying to scare the North Koreans so he was talking to Truman about nuking them to scare them"
"how would they know he was doing that"
"let's talk about that wall"

MacArthur & Patton? Surprise surprise, Trump reads Dad books.

trump doesn't read books dude

"Hold that book up," Trump told the man. "That's my second favorite book of all time. You know what my favorite is?" he asked. "The Bible!" he said, giving a thumbs-up. "Nothing beats the Bible, not even The Art of the Deal. Not even close."

these are the words of a non-book reading person

the author at the end was like "plus if its franken thatll make this more entertaining and thats what rly matters 4 me" and i was getting some morbsian apoplexy

The fact that this neverending parade of fuckos is being openly presented (once you get past the True Believers) as Entertainment and Nothing Else is the only charming thing about it. You'd all love a Franken-Christie debate.

who all?

The rabble.

Given that there's an American Psycho revival at full steam (there's an imminent Broadway musical), i'd forgotten that Trump is Patrick Bateman's idol.

http://blogs.bookforum.com/review/2015/08/05/will-the-real-american-psycho-please-stand-up-why-donald-trump-was-patrick-batemans-hero/

the final cut is bad, don't bother

usually don't feel like i need vox to explain this to me but in this case it was v helpful

http://www.vox.com/2016/3/28/11318722/trump-foreign-policy

4) Trump sees himself as applying business savvy to foreign policy, but shows profound ignorance of even basic business concepts
5) Trump just does not understand how foreign policy works

also apologies if this was linked earlier on the thread but today trump actually got challenged on his answers by.. some conservative radio guy in wisconsin
the end of the interview is especially bad where trump just gets more and more petulant about 'well, he started it' re cruz and finally the host says, donald, we're not on a playground, we're running for president

how is it that wolf blitzer and anderson cooper and others get the same kind of answers from trump and just let him keep talking unchallenged?

http://www.politico.com/blogs/2016-gop-primary-live-updates-and-results/2016/03/trump-charlie-sykes-interview-221289

Anybody see the anti-trump thing his former communications lead posted?

It's blowing up I guess, despite the fact that she seems like a fucking terrible person as well

yeah i read it - i didn't know how seriously to take it given the source (not her, i mean xojane)

xojane is like the adult version of tumblr or something, i don't think they exert any sort of editorial control

how is it that wolf blitzer and anderson cooper and others get the same kind of answers from trump and just let him keep talking unchallenged?

If you lived in Wisconsin you'd know: Charlie Sykes's job is being a dick and he is really good at his job

i read the xojane piece. it was sort of odd. she is saying that trump is a "fraud," that "the presidential candidate" is just a "character" the same way he claims the misogynistic reality show host was. this is basically what ben carson says, except he uses this argument to justify his endorsement of trump

it's also hard not to hate the writer, who seems to have been trump's publicist or whatever. she keeps saying "i wanted to believe." belive in fucking what?

like, the issue is not that he is a fraud. the issue is that he is a lying, irresponsible, racist, piece of shit

Is there any line to be drawn btwn complaints at all the free press ye complain about trump getting and the observable fact that left to yere own devices he's 80% of yere chosen topic, I wonder

he's like that kid in ubik who absorbs people's life energy. he just keeps expanding, dominating our thoughts and conversations, edging out everything else until, one day, there will be nothing else left

we can't do anything about it. this is a metaphysical situation.

It's just called 'UK' fyi, they leave out British & Irish these days at our request, and that guy might tbf be injured for the euros

Trump talks as if he believed MacArthur had the power to order DEFCON 1. At any rate it fascinates me how Trump cites approvingly a general whose defiance of President Harry Truman is legend as if Trump’s leadership style as perceived by his followers wouldn’t demand the drawing and quartering of Douglas MacArthur.

some Senate Dems wanted to publish an 'open letter' calling on Sanders to quit; Schumer and Mikulski reportedly nayed it

@dick_nixon
Meaning Schumer wants something from Clinton and she isn't playing ball.

(or S and M don't want to alienate Sanders supporters in their states who haven't voted in primaries yet)

I don't like giving this guy more pixels than he's already gotten but still, the point buried in here is crucial:

SANGER: General MacArthur wanted to go use them against the Chinese and the North Koreans, not as a last resort.

TRUMP: That’s right. He did. Yes, well you don’t know if he wanted to use them but he certainly said that at least.

SANGER: He certainly asked Harry Truman if he could.

TRUMP: Yeah, well, O.K.. He certainly talked it and was he doing that to negotiate, was he doing that to win? Perhaps. Perhaps. Was he doing that for what reason? I mean, I think he played, he did play the nuclear card but he didn’t use it, he played the nuclear card. He talked the nuclear card, did he do that to win? Maybe, maybe, you know, maybe that’s what got him victory. But in the meantime he didn’t use them. So, you know.

This is like the ninetieth time this has come up in discussion of the Donaldigensian philosophy: part of his vaunted mad dealmaking skillz is to stake out an extreme position, then negotiate down to where you actually want to be.

"45-percent tariffs [or whatever] on Chinese goods" could be seen as an initial position on the way to a slightly altered trade deficit. "Deport 'em all," then, may just be an initial position on the way to strengthened use of e-Verify and, I guess, streamlined deportation of violent offenders. "Mexico's gonna pay to build a 25-foot goldplated wall" is an initial position on the way to, I dunno, slightly more areas with an eight-foot chain-link fence. "I'm gonna nuke your cities into glowing rubble" is an initial position on the way to "stop shooting at people I like." "Your face is ugly and you suck hobo cock in urine-soaked alleyways" is an initial position on the way to "You're not the right choice for the country, and anyways I'm leading in the polls ha ha! Sad."

On one level, this stuff makes a certain kind of twisted self-consistent sense. Trump's willingness to nudge and wink while giving away the game might even be appealing if he weren't such a horrible human being.

What makes it mind-fuckingly strange is that many of his supporters have heard all this, and they like it: yeah, that's what we need, a dealmaker! That's what we need, someone who fights and fights dirty and is devious with our enemies (both foreign and domestic).

But they have weirdly failed to internalize the lesson. They're somehow mystically certain that he's only bluffing OTHER people, not THEM. When his spew involves stuff they like, they assume THAT is the bit that is sincere; he's only bullshitting the people we don't like. This odd blind spot is, dare I say, yuge.

At any rate it fascinates me how Trump cites approvingly a general whose defiance of President Harry Truman is legend as if Trump’s leadership style as perceived by his followers wouldn’t demand the drawing and quartering of Douglas MacArthur.

trump's leadership style would demand the forcible retirement of harry truman to some missouri dacha

that's all?

looks like paul ryan is getting primary'd.

he is a traitor to the right

well he'll have to be drafted at the convention, then

part of his vaunted mad dealmaking skillz is to stake out an extreme position, then negotiate down to where you actually want to be.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azZr1cSu9-4&sns=em

So I spent Easter with some Republican Trump-hating relatives (4 Kasich, 1 Cruz) and gleaned some things. One, Trump is drawing heavily from the "Patriot" population. These people are xenophobic, but how "patriotic" is someone so reckless. He doesn't strike me as particularly patriotic. Makes me wonder what the future is for the right in terms of claiming "America hate" by anyone who doesn't think like them. It's not convincing coming from Trump. So that may be one good thing coming out of this - he's poisoning the jingoism these people engage in. This could be the beginning of the end for that stuff.

read that as "Trump hunting relatives" at first and then my contact lens slid back in place :(

I spent Easter with a League of Shadows

I spent Easter watching my kids on an Easter egg hunt, which was awesome.

Later that evening I had a horrifying neverending gastrointestinal incident so it feels like I spent the day talking about Trump.