Curb Your Authoritarianism? The 2016 Conventional Wisdom Thread (Elections, Part 6)

it is definitely "mean" in more than one sense

maybe this is just me desperately trying to connect the dots, but it feels like at the very moment that WWII is passing from living memory (anyone who was an adult at the end of the war would be at least 89 years old now), people are finding their way back around to forms of politics that the nazi defeat had discredited for generations.

This seems super otm. Add decades of substandard public education to the mix and a resultant de-emphasis on understanding history and critical thinking skills and this is what you get. IMO, people should be constantly asking themselves what 'civilization' even means and why it exists and how it's perpetuated rather than just assuming that shit will be okay no matter what, who cares, vote for Trump and jerk off in the street like a dumb ape while firing an assault rifle into the air.

I don't know a ton about Europe but as best I can tell it was basically defined by tribal warfare on scales from local to continent- and world-spanning for a thousand years

on a related note, I am seriously considering getting a gun

I mean maybe there haven't been civilizations in the last two millennia that haven't spend most of their time and resources on plundering and despoiling abroad and bloody fratricide at home?

I am seriously considering getting a gun

you have children, plz don't do this

i have that thought every couple weeks but in the end the fear of my family getting hurt always edges out my fear of the US degenerating into some kind of post-apoc the road scenario. but if it starts to look like civilization is truly breaking down... xxp

a thousand years

think you can track it back a little further than that, more like 2,500 years (at least)

xp

I think the fact that so many people appear to be stubbornly, willfully ignorant is a big difference. Too many people apparently just don't give a fuck for no reason. Post-factual era indeed. We are in the era of people demanding proof, then just dismissing said proof because it does not conform to their expectations or beliefs. People don't vote because who gives a shit. Or vote for people who act like they don't give a shit, which is not giving a shit squared.

as per usual joni mitchell otm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xWwUJH70ubM

josh, none of those things are particularly new...

xpost

(also, that's the worst joni mitchell song.)

the fact that there was actually a vote instead of some insanely bloody mass uprising is progress of some sort...

xp

i like that joni mitchell song but i understand why some ppl find it kinda... idk what don't you like about it? it's kinda corny? but she's still otm. it's hard to be grateful for what you have.

I think what is new is that it has never been easier for anyone to be educated, or to find the facts, or to seek out answers to questions they might have. We have no excuse other than just rampant assholery.

b/c it's one of the joni songs that really just reduces to cliché. and it has a awkward melody. and i hate the way she sings the "pave paradise" alliteration.

she's capable of much, much more.

xpost Facts have never been more widely-available but how many people have the ability/time/wherewithal to sift through the equally widely-available bullshit to even figure out what's true?

And when you have people like Trump who will say a thing and then say pretty much the exact opposite of that thing a day later like that was his position all along.

I like how Trump was in Scotland talking about how excited the locals were about leaving the EU, somehow totally oblivious to the fact that Scotland voted to remain

'somehow'

I can't tell if he is a bigger dick or a bigger dummy.

Certainly the inexplicable distrust of Authority or experts makes it difficult to process information. If you are paranoid or prone to conspiracy theories, who can you trust? Certainly not the people promising answers or facts.

xpost It must not have been in this morning's Google News printouts about himself.

lol

The increasing dismissal of 'facts' and 'experts' is, I fear, the thing that will ultimately lead to me building myself a nice lean-to out in the woods somewhere and living off of twigs and berries until I mercifully croak.

Good morning!

Talk us off the ledge Alfred

you have children, plz don't do this
― Οὖτις, Friday, June 24, 2016

If you are paranoid or prone to conspiracy theories, who can you trust?

josh, none of those things are particularly new...

Everything from global warming to gun ownership to every statement from the "lie-beral" media is handwaved away by a growing segment of the American public now. That seems to be to be a sort of recent development?

Facts alone won't change your mind if you have an entire belief architecture erected against them. Shit, the majority of a perseon's beliefs are inherited & reinforced by family and social means, not concluded.

i wonder if trump even understands how the UK is configured

vote for Trump and jerk off in the street like a dumb ape while firing an assault rifle into the air.

Best one in the Cards Against Humanity deck IMHO.

Everything from global warming to gun ownership to every statement from the "lie-beral" media is handwaved away by a growing segment of the American public now. That seems to be to be a sort of recent development?

Raise your hand if you grew up in the southeast *raises hand*

Hint: not a recent development; not a growing segment, either

I've been living among Cubans voting against their interests since the days of Ronnie if not Nixon.

i wonder if trump even understands how the UK is configured

― global tetrahedron, Friday, June 24, 2016 11:39 AM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

he probably thinks that scotland is just another 'state' like georgia or wyoming.

https://books.google.com/books/about/Anti_intellectualism_in_American_Life.html?id=32rnqpOdlxQC

i have yet to be surprised by donald trump knowing something i didn't expect him to know.

the only times that trump comes across as an adult human being with some grasp of his surroundings is when he talks about real estate. that's the only realm of life where he has any particular knowledge. and even then it's probably not terribly impressive.

honestly i wouldn't be surprised if in an unguarded moment trump had a good word for texan secession. and then in the same breath he'd accuse obama of being a traitor.

Hint: not a recent development; not a growing segment, either

― El Tomboto, Friday, June 24, 2016 11:44 AM (7 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I've consistently stood by this belief, thinking that this particular demographic hadn't necessarily grown but had just become louder and more strident in recent years. Maybe Brexit just has me spooked but I'm starting to doubt atm.

xpost It isn't difficult to find examples of Trump espousing conflicting ideologies within a single long spray of word vomit.

guys:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CltzHqpWQAA8zs0.jpg

in case you can't see, those are golfballs with little swastikas on them

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CltzHqGXIAAtCNL.jpg

wtf is that for real? why???

it was a Satirical Prankster, prob not particularly helpfully.

it is absolutely for real

http://gawker.com/trump-delivered-his-scotland-press-conference-surrounde-1782552300

I posted that in the UK Politics thread earlier

Krugman: http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2016/06/24/brexit-the-morning-after/?action=click&pgtype=Homepage&clickSource=story-heading&module=opinion-c-col-left-region®ion=opinion-c-col-left-region&WT.nav=opinion-c-col-left-region

about sums up how I feel

It looks like Trump is riding one of these

http://www.china-mike.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/03/30-beijing-police-woman-segway.jpg

xpost Yeah, I'm mostly concerned about the people who will be directly affected by this. That FT excerpt, particularly the bit about a generation of Brits who've now lost the ability to freely live/work/travel throughout Europe, was heartbreaking to consider.