Curb Your Authoritarianism? The 2016 Conventional Wisdom Thread (Elections, Part 6)

there is literally a greater chance that obama declares himself dictator and president for life than there is that trump becomes the nominee

― iatee, Wednesday, July 22, 2015 6:22 PM (11 months ago)

― (The Other) J.D. (J.D.), Friday, June 24, 2016 4:37 PM (23 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

I just thought there was a very high chance of obama declaring himself dictator and president for life. I get most of my political info from morbs.

There's still chance

https://www.askideas.com/media/08/Everyone-Chill-The-Fuck-Out-Funny-Obama-Meme.jpg

remember hope

That Trump has 70% negative approval ratings or whatever is small solace when only 55% of Americans bother to vote. Though I gotta assume some part of his 30% of diehards won't vote, either, because American Ninja Warrior or something is on.

It reminds me of:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DDoncJckows

Though I gotta assume some part of his 30% of diehards won't vote, either, because American Ninja Warrior or something is on

this is actually a salient point, given how underfunded GOP GOTV efforts are likely to be. If you don't constantly remind people to vote/drive them to the polls/tell them where their polling place is/make sure they mail their absentee ballot... then people don't really vote.

That Trump has 70% negative approval ratings or whatever is small solace when only 55% of Americans bother to vote.

ppl all yelling at each other on cnn

p good. one guy said, "should he (trump) have gone to some left wing european socialist golf club instead? would that make you happy?"

I don't know guys. Voting for Trump will be a milestone political action for a lot of citizens, and I wouldn't take the risk assuming they won't show up. That's how you end up with Rob Ford, or Brexit.

It was certainly a weird experience for me watching the results roll in last night and hoping to see low turnouts.

democracy is great, except when hamas/boris/trump win

he will lose but the fires of white populism have been stoked. the democrats need to work on countering trumpism with a progressive counter-narrative that speaks to people's concerns. it's not the dems' "fault" american whites decided to scapegoat immigrants en masse, but they could have done more to prevent at least some of those people from going down that road. imo.

ppl all yelling at each other on cnn

― Treeship, Friday, June 24, 2016

I've seen that show.

it's your fave and idgi

Not the last few months. The Trump din is wearing--I basically tuned out weeks ago.

he will lose but the fires of white populism have been stoked. the democrats need to work on countering trumpism with a progressive counter-narrative that speaks to people's concerns. it's not the dems' "fault" american whites decided to scapegoat immigrants en masse, but they could have done more to prevent at least some of those people from going down that road. imo.

― Treeship, Friday, June 24, 2016 7:57 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

always been there one way or another afaic

i'm starting to have an allergic reaction to the whole 'the liberals should wake up to the very notion that there is racism in western countries', as if liberals haven't been victims of racism, xenophobia, sexism and homophobia over past few decades. maybe it just happens that there is whole swaths of the population we simply don't agree with, never did and never will. it's not up to liberals to pander to their bigoted demands (they can't anyway) but them to adapt to a new reality.

I just thought there was a very high chance of obama declaring himself dictator and president for life. I get most of my political info from morbs.

a for effort here but yr future predictions will be measured against this one

xp i am not talking about pandering to bigoted demands, i am talking about making sure people know that a progressive government will give them more economic security, that it's not immigrants who made them lose their pensions, etc

for some people racism, sexism, and homophobia will always be the core of their politics. the dems don't need those people and shouldn't want them. but i am pretty sure there are others who are seduced by hate because it provides them with clear explanations for complex problems.

can't believe iatee usta march with me at OWS b4 he went to the darkside *snif*

but lol there is no need for US dictators when there are voters with low standards (no display names plz)

just got a robocall from Obomber telling me to vote for Jerry Nadler (who is in zero danger of losing his primary Tuesday); i listened for at least 8 seconds

for some people racism, sexism, and homophobia will always be the core of their politics

Agree completely; Archie Bunker was nonfiction.

However I still think that one reason those guys are spewing their shit with more volume and force these days is the same as the reason they're electorally doomed, which is the same as the reason that (long term) they're culturally doomed as well. Hit a beehive with a baseball bat and the bees will make a lot of noise; it doesn't mean they're winning. They may call the forces arrayed against them "social justice warriors" or "libtards" or "crybullies" or "liberal fascism" or "political correctness," whatevs. They are squealing louder these days - at least partly - because they sense they're losing, in the larger culture.

That was not true 25 or 50 years ago. No one would have challenged "make America white again" guy. No one would have been exercised about bakers or wedding photographers, because the phrase "gay marriage" would have made as much sense as "transatlantic penguin flights." An African American president, or a decent chance at a woman president? Get outta here.

can't wait for next liberal administration to ensure transatlantic penguin flights

_I just thought there was a very high chance of obama declaring himself dictator and president for life. I get most of my political info from morbs._

a for effort here but yr future predictions will be measured against this one

I think we've entered a world where it's safer just not to make predictions

can't wait for next liberal administration? Boy, don't I know the feeling! Been a long, long time since 1964.

^quality post

American Ninja Warrior is on?

If people believe that because Brexit won, therefore Trump will win, I offer the following:; if Brexit turns out to be economically disastrous in the coming months, then that might potentially blunt the Trump train's progress, right?

This presents a paradox: American liberals might be forgiven, for rooting for Britain's economy to tank; Trumpoids should be rooting for Britain's economy to succeed.

short of england being reduced to a radioactive wasteland in the next four months, few american voters will care or connect it in any way with their own issues

Where is england anyway

I expect few if any Trump voters will connect Brexit's failure or success with their enthusiasm for Trump and his Mexican wall. If somehow the US economy takes a dive between now and November due to Brexit fallout, I think that would be more likely to reinforce their desire for reactionary lashing out than to chasten them into meekly submitting to reasonableness.

"meekly submit to reasonableness" = new Clinton campaign slogan

Fucked xxp

wasn't that already her slogan?

I don't always meekly submit. But when I do, I prefer to meekly submit to reasonableness.

http://www.jill2016.com/stein_calls_britain_vote_a_wake_up_call

it's a tough sale -- sure, you're struggling now, but it'll be even worse if we reject (this stimulus package)/(this economic union)/etc

on the bright side, i guess, no matter how belligerent western nativists/populists get, few seem to have the appetite for enlisting

If people believe that because Brexit won, therefore Trump will win, I offer the following:; if Brexit turns out to be economically disastrous in the coming months, then that might potentially blunt the Trump train's progress, right?

before dinner + several drinks tonight, I heard this argument, to my shock, on FOX a couple times.

They have to fill the air somehow, Lord Alfred.

http://edition.cnn.com/2013/01/22/business/opinion-donald-trump-europe/

Donald Trump singing the "false song of globalism" in 2013:

I've long been a believer in the "look at the solution, not the problem" theory. In this case, the solution is clear. We will have to leave borders behind and go for global unity when it comes to financial stability.

Is this possible? Is this a new frontier? Yes and no. There is the fait accompli strategy -- stay under the radar -- and the passive aggressive strategy, acts of terror used to paralyze and so on -- so the bottom line must be balance. Rationality must rule. There are philosophical approaches to economics. However, at this point, we don't so much need philosophy as we need action. Which way to proceed is the question.

You ask about Europe in crisis as an opportunity for investment. I see the world in crisis at the moment. I'm a firm believer that there are always opportunities whether the markets or up or down, but it requires insight and sometimes creativity to see those opportunities. I have no doubt that the balance we need will be achieved, but it won't happen overnight.

Europe is a tapestry that is dense, colorful and deserving of continued longevity and prosperity. There are many pieces that must be carefully fitted together in order to thrive.

Our challenge is to acknowledge those pieces and to see how they can form a whole that works together well without losing any cultural flavor in the process. It's a combination of preservation along with forward thinking.

Europe is a terrific place for investment. I am proud to have built a great golf course in Scotland after searching throughout Europe for five years for the right location. I've seen many beautiful places.

The future of Europe, as well as the United States, depends on a cohesive global economy. All of us must work toward together toward that very significant common goal.

whoa, busted

This Op-Ed is bizarre because I've seen footage of him strongly arguing for protectionist policies and tariffs as far back as the 80s. He was definitely not saying America's economic destiny was bound to the rest of the world then and he certainly isn't saying it now. So did he just flirt with the idea of mutually beneficial trade deals a few years ago? (Now he seems to imply that in every trade partnership one side "beats" the other.) Or did he just have nothing to do with this op-ed but had someone write something that he hoped would encourage European investment?

what on earth makes you think he cares about consistency

Idk i guess he doesn't. But the idea that the US is hemmorhaging money by investing overseas and getting nothing in return has been his main political talking point for like 30 years. That pov seems incommensurable with this "we're in it together" schtick, even if he pays lip service to the eurosceptic concern of countries losing their "cultural flavor."

We are now closer to having an economic community in the best sense of the term -- we work with each other for the benefit of all.
I think we've all become aware of the fact that our cultures and economics are intertwined. It's a complex mosaic that cannot be approached with a simple formula for the correct pattern to emerge. In many ways, we are in unchartered waters.
The good news, in one respect, is that what is done affects us all. There won't be any winners or losers as this is not a competition. It's a time for working together for the best of all involved. Never before has the phrase "we're all in this together" had more resonance or relevance.

wtf

yeah that's the least trump-esque thing i've ever read!

Though I gotta assume some part of his 30% of diehards won't vote, either, because American Ninja Warrior or something is on.

american ninja warrior is a highly entertaining program

That doesn't even sound like him xp

It's cute my nephews call it super hero training

doesn't end every paragraph with "sad!"