Curb Your Authoritarianism? The 2016 Conventional Wisdom Thread (Elections, Part 6)

xxp: I thought you were talking about Bruce Babbitt as well.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cn4-EqeWIAA_LoO.jpg

cyber

Look, we're under cyberattack, forget about them.

it reads like something from a twitter bot

lol totally

Cruz seems to be betting not just on a Trump loss, but a Huge Trump loss that will so demoralize the party that they'll come looking for the one who didn't go along to get along.

That would be interesting if things played out that way. And it is conceivable that this is exactly Cruz's thinking. "They all laughed when I went against the Trumpian tide, now you'll come crawling back once you see the error of your ways."

But if that is the plan, the math is wrong. In 2020, he'll need Trump voters on his side more than ever. The 2020 Republican candidate will need either to be more Trumpy than Trump, or be sufficiently diplomatic that he can plausibly extend an olive branch to butthurt Trumpophiles. Something like "My fellow True Americans, I know that you were disappointed in Our Dear Leader's loss back in 2016 - so was I. His Orangeness had the right message, but unfortunately he may not have been precisely the right messenger. Perhaps those sheeple out there just weren't ready for someone of his Awesome Realness. That said, now more than ever we need to reawaken the energy that all good freedom-loving Americans showed back then." That's a mostly-positive message.

"You fools! I told you so and you didn't listen!" Is not winning messaging.

Dr. Casino may be right that what he's going for is some measure of future retrospective admiration. Maybe (just maybe) he knows that his negative charisma is always going to limit his political chances.

Interviewers should start very pointedly asking Trump questions that don't make any actual sense as English language sentences to showcase very clearly how quickly Trump comes up with answers to things he can't even begin to understand.

Mr. Trump, do you or do you not want hen fap?

How would a trump administration respond to a NATO rebellion in turkey with Pinochet nuclear trade pact negotiation immigration crisis?

With strength. It's time that America stops getting kicked around, we are gonna be respected when I'm president!

we're gonna build a wall in NATO and turkey is gonna pay for it

Or, as has been mentioned a couple of times here already, just ask him very simple questions that anyone running for president should know. Such as: what is NATO?

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so what did Christie get for all his bowing and bootlicking -- a coupon for a dollar off the purchase of a Big Mac?

humiliation

probably a promise that he'll be attorney general if trump wins

thought Mike Mukasey had that one sewn up

apparently the NR set are calling christie "shinebox", so he's got that going for him

lol

go get yr shinebox

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Haven't loaded the whole thread to look at today's posts, so maybe I'm repeating stuff already said.

I spent a couple of hours in the car today listening to right-wing radio out of Buffalo. However unreal such a forum may be, it's a good place to get a sense of what one side is thinking.

The anti-Cruz sentiment was massive and fierce--callers, interviewees, one host. (The only guy who semi-defended Cruz, who tried to frame what he did from his perspective, was actually Limbaugh, whose ire was reserved for Kasich.) The most vitriolic guy I heard was the former head of Cruz's Buffalo's operations.

I'm more convinced than ever he's politically dead. (The general antipathy towards him before this ever happened complicates trying to isolate last night.) It can't help that, supposedly, he was sending out fundraising e-mails an hour later. Being very specific about his wife and father today is totally understandable from my point of view, but from his side, I think that'll be viewed as selfish four years from now. Especially if Trump goes down in a landslide--I think rather than being remembered as a gesture of high principle, Cruz will be a convenient scapegoat on which to place phantom and self-serving blame.

Katie Packer, a Republican strategist who founded Our Principles PAC in a vain attempt to stop the Trump nomination, called the Cruz speech a “Rorschach test.”

“If you can’t stand Trump, like me, you saw it as bold,” she said. “If you love Trump, you saw it as a betrayal. If you don’t like Trump but have been cowed or fallen in line, you saw it as self-serving because you need that to feel better about your own weakness.”

Cruz is a Republican Senator from Texas, and will keep that position as long as Texas stays Red (which will at least encompass one more term for him).

That I don't know--I meant in terms of running again nationally.

Just pointing out what's missing in the dialog--he's got one of the most secure gig's in Washington already.

Wouldn't last night even make him an attractive target in a Republican senate primary? Although the dynamic there is usually a rabid "outsider" taking on a party-loyal career politician, and Cruz scrambles that.

As a British observer I find Ted Cruz's 'last stand' against Trump fascinating, great theatre!

One thing I don't quite understand is, why is Ted Cruz so unpopular in his own party?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sIvsTXnik7Q

"One thing I don't quite understand is, why is Ted Cruz so unpopular in his own party?"

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/2015/12/why-everyone-in-congress-hates-ted-cruz.html

https://newrepublic.com/article/128808/everybody-hates-ted

Weasely, slimy, reptilian...Like Bernie Sanders said about Clinton's friend: "This is not my kind of guy."

He led the 2013 government shutdown, which I don't think actually hurt the GOP electorally but pissed a lot of Republican leaders off. He called Mitch McConnell a liar on the floor of the Senate, which I guess a big intra-party norms violation (judging by the amount of times I've seen it come up in the media). His reputation is that he will throw anyone under the bus for himself, and regularly does big, attention-getting things to help himself at the party's expense. Also I think he is just very unlikable, and everyone hates him on a personal level as well. The stories from the Bush 2004 (or maybe 2000?) campaign are particularly hilarious in this regard.

i will buy the inevitable 800 page book about the 2016 republican primary and convention the instant it comes out

His reputation is that he will throw anyone under the bus for himself, and regularly does big, attention-getting things to help himself at the party's expense.

Which, trying to view last night as a Republican might, pretty much describes his non-endorsement speech.

From what I can tell, he is both unlikable on a personal level and unwilling to modulate in any way that doesn't directly benefit himself. Imagine working with someone like that (if you haven't already).

any predictions for Trumps' speech tonight? I'm predicting 100% nationalism, but who knows maybe he'll go off script. Must-see TV!!

I will be shocked if he doesn't mention Cruz or Melania's 'plagiarism'. Actually, his handlers may have him rigged up so that he's literally shocked if he mentions either.

"My fellow Americans... BABA BOOEY BABA BOOEY HOWARD STERN'S PENIS BABA BOOOEEEYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY"
*runs screaming off the stage, entire trump family collapses in laughter*

i will buy the inevitable 800 page book about the 2016 republican primary and convention the instant it comes out

― nomar, Thursday, July 21, 2016 4:04 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

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my guess is it starts off as a regular convention speech about the challenges this country faces and what it takes to solve them, and Trump delivers it pretty rotely. Like with the Pence announcement, he goes off script pretty quickly, leans really hard into the "lock her up" stuff, as well as the muslim ban and the wall. My guess there is maybe a passing reference to Cruz that Trump expands on in his typical fashion.

hoping trump makes his entrance bursting out of a giant cake with his face iced on it

wheeled onstage by chris christie obv

If he's smart, he'll make a couple of innocuous, gee-whiz jokes about Cruz, who miraculously granted Trump some victim sympathy last night.

Nah, he'll mention how he defeated Cruz and how Cruz should be embarrased,. He'll definitely blow his opportunity to be statesmanlike there

Odds that Trump was going to suddenly learn how to be statesmanlike in time for this speech...?

lol was going to say ! they had three days to make this thing look respectable and said fuck that "HANG HER" why are they going to start now?

how long is Trump going to speak tonight?

He managed to discipline himself a bit with that initial tweet last night. Maybe somewhere in between; I don't think he's going to come out and yell "Lyin' Ted, back in business!"

any predictions for Trumps' speech tonight? I'm predicting 100% nationalism, but who knows maybe he'll go off script. Must-see TV!!

― frogbs, Thursday, July 21, 2016 8:06 PM (13 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

npr this morning said the speech was going to be about his ability to be a uniter, which will be a tremendous load of horse shit

I don't know, it seems like he unites a lot of people for him and a lot of people against him