Rolling Brexit Links/UK politics in the neo-Weimar era

kind of strikes me that May's refusal to elucidate a Brexit plan is tremendously effective at trapping Labour in the short term: regardless of Sensible Moderates' insistence that Corbyn is secretly a fervent Brexiteer, I can't see a politically successful way for him to come out firing against article 50 - look at how the High Court judges were treated. But there's nothing for Labour to oppose until there's a specific plan, so you get this ludicrous stasis where no one appears to have any plan or position. May's rhetoric gives the impression she is sticking to her principles, and she's effectively denying Corbyn the chance to do the same.

Where this surely falls down for May is that her rhetoric is completely delusional and this has to become very clear very soon? Surely, surely there is no way for her to stick to her current guns and sail through her self-imposed Article 50 deadline with even a workable deal?

(I also have no faith that Corbyn's tactics have ever been to oppose a specific May plan, nor that if she's forced to reveal her strategy he'll actually seize the opportunity to come out all guns blazing. I really hate everyone involved in UK politics again.)

(I've been reading a lot about the idea of city states returning and freeing themselves from the social reactionaries of their rural surrounds and I wish this was a workable thing.)

best piece on a potential Labour strategy I've yet read -

http://novaramedia.com/2016/12/06/debating-immigration-a-labour-strategy-for-ukip-votes/

Where this falls down for me is that I believe a much larger proportion of the great British electorate is straight-up racist than would be the case for this to work

rainy fascist knife-crime zugzwang pop island

Also I feel in both UK and US electorates the most important question shouldn't be about winning over this or that demographic of existing voters but what to do about the much vaster numbers of non-voters

(Is there any good recent reading on the non-voters?)

i had a similar conversation the other night re: the logistic issues blamed on immigration not being caused by immigration. felt like the guy i was talking to agreed with a lot of the points i made, but you're right, an unknown but probably large part of the problem is "shy racists".

on the other hand, i find it hard to believe that the country is more racist now than it was 30 years ago, so it seems to me that racism isn't that big a voting priority for - excuse me - moderate racists if you focus your campaign in other areas. the same way that UKIP were never going to be a parliamentary force without the referendum - not enough people gave enough of a shit about the EU to vote them seats in a general election.

weird bad-shoop tale that acts as symbol of everything currently wrong with tepid centralism:

"the big polly toynbee guardian headshot Q: was someone standing in front of her when took it, or did they photoshop a shadow on her face?"
(via https://twitter.com/tristandross/status/806556543437176835)

"i've fucking cracked it lol. they've photoshopped polly toynbee's head..... onto her own body????"
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzF53y8XcAEI-lS.jpg:large

pollymorphous perversity

"it's in my contract that i'm always seen wearing this butt-ugly red jacket whatever i actually happen to be wearing"

i find it hard to believe that the country is more racist now than it was 30 years ago

more terrorism 30 years ago too, and yet... (I agree basically)

PT seems a centrist compared to Mr Corbyn or Paul Mason but is not really centrist compared to the UK government or incoming US government or many of the people she has campaigned against (eg as a feminist) for c.45 years. Compared to them she is a leftist.

I wouldn't really call her a leftist but I would still call her a progressive, and a social democrat which is essentially what I am also.

Just kicking words around. Don't know about the photos.

(Is there any good recent reading on the non-voters?)

Was under the impression that large numbers of this grouping turned out to, er, vote Brexit. Don't know if there are any stats on that, Lord Ashcroft probably has them.

i find it hard to believe that the country is more racist now than it was 30 years ago

ehhhh racism has evolved a lot and the kind of racism people can't even recognise let alone admit in themselves is a harder thing to combat in some ways

yeah having thought about it there's a lot of truth in this - the kind of dog whistles and coded language that have taken over mainstream racist discourse probably help to blur people's view of their own prejudices

it's amazing how the idea of racism, or the word racism, has been so entrenched as shameful and immoral, yet only the most absolute egregious and violent acts of racism are seen as such

and that's without getting into the qualifications and hierarchies inherent in so many people's perceptions of other races - if you think of some as "the good ones" that gives you free rein to treat the others like subhumans; the way it intersects with class prejudices too. bigotry and the doublethink involved in it is weirdly complex

it's amazing how the idea of racism, or the word racism, has been so entrenched as shameful and immoral, yet only the most absolute egregious and violent acts of racism are seen as such

― lex pretend, Saturday, December 10, 2016 8:00 PM (four minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

So otm. And it's getting even worse: Calling someone or something racist today, because it is, is perceived a worse offense than the act of racism itself (at least here in Holland but sure it's happening all over Western Europe). From our 'blackface' Santa to racist trolling online: people will defend someone saying or doing something racist simply by countering "but you can't call me racist! We're the Netherlands, we can't be racist therefor we aren't!"

I don't want to live on this planet any more.

calling someone racist is often framed as an act of racism in and of itself

and from the NYT

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzL503wWIAAa0jJ.jpg

calling someone racist is now exactly the same level of hate as THREATENING TO SET SOMEONE ON FUCKING FIRE FOR BEING A MUSLIM

the thing is the absolute refusal to admit the prevalence of racism is as strong, maybe stronger, among "liberals" and "centrists" and "moderates" and most crucially the mainstream media

Same here just today, reputed Dutch papers writing a woman was convicted for "speaking up to a woman wearing a headscarf" (literal translation), when in reality said white Dutch woman tried to pull the headscarf of this woman's head violently at a bus stop.

"Both sides" bullshit a la NYT makes me feel so helpless.

the liberal/centrist types are far more dangerous than a gaggle of thicko scruffs with Britain First banners. And they are currently like a dog with a bone with this projected "concern" agenda they are using for their own racist policies. They all have the same insipid script for equality/social justice etc while actively assisting in the destruction of the welfare state and disseminating racism. They are the fucking worst.

^^^^^

except "agenda" gives them too much credit for thinking it through to an end game; it's about other people's Legitimate Concerns, it's about Mail journalists are just doing their jobs, it's about well we have to hear both sides, it's even about in giving fascists the biggest platforms possible we're actually helping to expose them!!!

calzino as otm as it's possible for someone to be... apart from lex

v much otm. this lrb article (don't think its paywalled) about the starvation of councils makes me think fascism is inevitable.

left wing councils deprived of money by central control.
people attack councils.
left wing dies in trad heartland.
right wing is voted in or no one votes at all (not unreasonably)

i guess you rely on incompetence and general broke-ness of ukip.

i mean i know this has already happened to a degree but it just looks like this country is totally fucked.

The BBC and right wing media constantly aids and abets them by running news about councils or NHS trusts "running out of money" like as if it is mismanagement is to blame rather than cuts to funding.

"political debate" comprises a kremlinology of manners: https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2016/dec/11/theresa-may-trousers-row-angry-text-exchange-nicky-morgan

upon such court gossip turn our fortunes

Ther-ouser May

I could care less how much TM spends on a pair of trousers but OMG brown leather with black everything else? *writes penalty notice on behalf of Fashion Police*

I can't really imagine any clothes those incredibly ugly trousers would pair well with

i'm going to weather the torrent of hate here and posit that all types of leather trousers are unacceptable

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rbZVlKKd7I8

AGREED

1983: "maggie maggie maggie! out out out!"
2017: "may may may! it's turned into a paste!"

http://www.harrowell.org.uk/blog/2016/12/11/the-turn-to-neo-edwardian-politics/

this is good

https://www.theguardian.com/education/2016/dec/12/uk-halve-international-student-visa-tougher-rules

I have banged on about this enough for several lifetimes but the two tier system seems to inevitably point to a fair few British universities going out of business over the next couple of years and half the British students in the country having their institutions branded unfit for genuine international students - or at least, not places the 'best and brightest' would ever want to set foot.

what good are universities though? how do they enrich our society, and why would we need all the revenue they bring into the country?

I mean obviously I don't believe the above, I can't even conceive of any reason other than self-defeating racism and xenophobia that would support it.

I can't think of anything more miserably 2016 than the government choosing to eviscerate our higher education sector in order to further mollify racists, none of whom will be remotely satisfied anyway.

Jesus Christ why are they so horrible??

as difficult as it may be to have some racist xenophobes understand and accept the ways in which their points of view are actually self-defeating

it seems equally difficult to have some e.g. new labour types understand and accept the ways in which they seek to further mollify racists will never remotely satisfied them

where do we start?

a bit hesitant to go here for various reasons but the third-rail word for mollifcation is appeasement

the problem is racists/xenophobes don't want to be challenged on their racism/xenophobia, they want it to be flattered

and politicos therefore think they can win these people's votes by flattering them rather than challenging them

I often wonder what kind of world we'd be living in if Gordon Brown had had the courage to say, "Actually, yes, Gillian Duffy is a racist, and we're all a bit racist, and we need to work to overcome our prejudices for the sake of the country"

This is a not-terrible piece of writing, I think. https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/dec/12/devolve-issue-of-immigration-communities

"PM: Gillian Duffy IS a racist" ('is' in red) would have been the front page of every tabloid, with a 4-page rebuttal by her in the Sun.

when you've incrementally accommodated what are now referred to as "legitimate concerns" to the point that it can be suggested that to even question the legitimacy of these "concerns" is something offensive comparable to the offensiveness of the very thinly-veiled violence that "legitimate concerns" often imply

I dunno what else you call it

xposts

"PM: Gillian Duffy IS a racist" ('is' in red) would have been the front page of every tabloid, with a 4-page rebuttal by her in the Sun.

I know, and Brown would've lost the 2010 election. So glad he equivocated instead and Cameron didn't get in. Oh hang on.

I mean at some point we'll have to grasp the nettle that the only way past this is to incur the wrath of the tabloids. Cowardice in the face of racism and xenophobia will only end in self-defeat.

I don't know how we make it work but "Oh hello racist person, you are not a racist, please vote for me" doesn't really seem to be leading us in a good direction either does it?

Oh I'm not saying he shouldn't have, I'm just suggesting this is almost certainly the picture in his head which caused his recantation - whether growing naturally or placed there by advisors, none of us know.

gillian duffy wouldn't have been a good hill to die on because I don't think she said anything substantial enough for someone to challenge her on it. we don't know enough about her beliefs to say anything useful about them