Seizing back control: The ILX lol brexit is how we're all gonna die thread.

of course, but labour are not responsible for the centrist tendency to prioritise getting a dynamic strong leader over the welfare of their fellow citizens

The banal truth is that most of West London voted against Livingstone because he had the audacity to add them to the Congestion Charge zone.

Still amazed me how such an image-conscious lot as nu lab could pick a candidate you would avoid standing near for fear of being drenched in spittle

Re: Dobson, of course

xxp
ken probably hadn't revealed his penchant for "eccentric" historical revisionism at this point either, so maybe something to that.

https://t.co/bXPvpHGDx8 pic.twitter.com/pjq1OhVQ3k

— Socialist Dad (@shirleymush) June 20, 2019

So much Brexiter betrayal narrative boils down to "we would have our Brexit by now if people hadn't decided to behave in exactly the way everyone knew they were going to behave all along" and you see a reflection of that in some parts of the left as well. The Labour leadership know that isn't a way to prepare for an election, hence the ongoing evolution of their own policy - and the current one probably won't last beyond the party conference in any case.

I don't think that Labour will lose the next election but if they do it's likely to be primarily due to a strategic error rather than the sudden popularity of the Tories, the person in the leadership seat, or just people being dicks. (I don't think they'll win a majority either but that's a different question).

if labour insist on putting forward these scruffs people will have no choice but to vote for the destruction of the welfare state

I don't get the sense that Johnson is particularly toxic in London, tbh. There's still a fairly widespread belief that underneath the layers of cynical opportunism, he's a competent, City-friendly, socially liberal Conservative.

Labour scruffs...like Robin Corbyn?
https://youtu.be/wZsYvkTw4Rg

xp I think the socially liberal part has been torpedoed by the last three years. I couldn’t see him winning now.

i don't think baroness warsi could be persuaded to join a boris cabinet.

I didn't pay much attention to NV's scenario because it's giving too much power to FBPE in a real world sense which I've yet to be convinced they have.

Great for concern trolling on what the left Labour leadership do or don't do though.

FBPE is just shorthand for centrist scum who will literally do anything other than vote for a leftish government tbf

Everything we've seen over the last couple of years suggests that those people make a disproportionate amount of noise but there just aren't very many of them.

i think that's probably true, especially if we're talking about the professional Twitter side of them, and i hope the dice roll accordingly, but i have been kicked in the face at a lot of general elections by some fucker or other

It's a big reason why the media were so surprised that 40% of voters were prepared to vote for a leftish government, and why they were so surprised that CHUK was a dismal failure.

just feel about 10 % happier after reading that post... but still ready to open a vessel!

That centrist grouping would always find an excuse not to vote Labour. Their Brexit position is only their latest iteration on what is a fragmentation but also reformation of what Labour could be. That's a positive development.

Labour let's brexit position is only their latest excuse, they could always find other things

yeah.. literally any leader of labour not slightly to the right of centre-left is on a hiding to nothing with these cunts, whatever they do. I just wish they'd be more honest and admit that they are tory wets who don't care about the working poor poor and disabled .. and start another hilarious centrist party.

Yes with the caveat that some lines of attack are more potent than others and the Brexit position is one of the potent ones. Having said that the current position is pretty unlikely to survive past party conference season anyway.

The problem seems to me that the position can’t really evolve until the new PM is in situ and advocates for a particular form of Brexit, at which point Labour says ‘no, not like THAT’ again. We don’t even know if the new PM will be able to form a government etc because of the inclinations of other Tories. I too see an over-representation of FBPEs in my timelines who just want to ride roughshod over how people voted three years ago and although I think Brexit is awful, I’m not willing to slate Corbyn for his caution.

By the by, at 10.8% would PM Johnson have the smallest majority in their constituency of any PM (since..?). Would like to think this could yet scupper him.

(I've not checked further back than Thatcher yet)

Labour and Momentum have been campaigning to unseat him since his majority narrowed to 5000 in the last GE. The Labour candidate is 25, articulate, a native of the constituency, and properly working-class. I don’t think Johnson’s keen to call an election and this might have something to do with that.

There's still a fairly widespread belief that underneath the layers of cynical opportunism, he's a competent, City-friendly, socially liberal Conservative.

Hear it all the time, though couched in different language, from Tories.

You have to play to the rubes but, underneath, he's one of us, etc.

I may regret saying this but i think a large proportion of Tory-leaning voters who think of themselves as sensible and moderate are going to reconcile themselves to the idea that their three options in the medium term are hard Brexit under a business-minded, amoral Johnson, hard Brexit under some kind of hardline High Tory 1922-Committee relic or a Corbyn government and they're going to decide that the first suits them best.

I'm betting almost all of them think Boris is putting on an act to woo the Brexiteers.

Ken Clarke said as much on Newsnight last night.

xps Correct. Either way Johnson will be unable to actually deliver said hard brexit because of the arithmetic and then what? We'll have to be back in the polls.

But this isn't a mystery -- someone, surely, is going to manage to land this point in the hustings to come. And none of the three have a strong answer to it

So if the big motivation is "avoid Corbyn", it's actually a matter of "which of these can beat undiluted communism?"

xxxp That would be Boris "Fuck Business" Johnson, then?

Johnson's non-performance so far is an indication that all isn't well. A lot of May-like vibes so far.

xp Just Boris being Boris.

xp

he is struggling a bit because he knows he can't win with unfettered boris and this muted version of him hasn't got much to say.

he's over

obviously so are we

Wtf

WATCH: Conservative MP Mark Field shoves a protestor against a pillar then grabs her by her neck and shoves her out of the Mansion House dinner after climate change protestors interrupted the banquet. pic.twitter.com/DFwZYxROfF

— Paul Brand (@PaulBrandITV) June 20, 2019

Field's first marriage to Michèle ended in divorce in 2006, with his ex-wife citing his affair with Liz Truss.[41] Elizabeth Truss is now Conservative MP for South West Norfolk since 2010 and a Cabinet member since 2014.

Looks like he's been at some of Michael Gove's magic powder.

his wife wouldn't have divorced him for publicly throttling a green protester, but fucking Liz truss was the last straw!

the longer version is far worse.

In this longer version of the video, you can see the woman apparently posing no immediate threat as she passes behind Mark Field. He marches her out of the room by her neck. I wasn’t there, so I can’t say she didn’t pose a risk, but it looks heavy handed. pic.twitter.com/zX2BtcPW4t

— Paul Brand (@PaulBrandITV) June 20, 2019

I mean EVEN worse

they practically fucking soil themselves thinking why people would even josh about throwing battery in their faces... do these cunts.

battery acid .. obv I'd just stab them with a knife.

That’s quite upsetting, really hope he faces some consequences for this.

get him charged. dick

sorry about stabby knife talk, but Fuck these arseholes - hope they all die - very slowly.

jail the cunt