Here's another clue for you all - GLASS ONION: A KNIVES OUT MYSTERY -- dir. Rian Johnson; Daniel Craig, Edward Norton, Kate Hudson, Dave Bautista, Janelle Monáe, etc etc

Last night I rewatched Knives Out for the first time since it came out. I was struck by how much more naturalistic it was compared to Glass Onion. The new one really leans into the glitz and glamour and overall spectacle, and in doing so ends up being quite a bit more cartoony.

― Muad'Doob (Moodles), Wednesday, December 21, 2022 3:14 PM (one week ago) bookmarkflaglink

OTM. I literally groaned at the puzzle box invitation thing - right away you know you're in for something much more ridiculous than a parody of manorial murder mysteries. The whole "mad scientist on his island" milieu holds much less appeal for me - likewise I'm generally less interested in a character who is an obvious Alex Jones or Elon Musk parody than one who doesn't have those obvious connotations.

Nearly all of central characters being entirely unlikable doesn't help either. I know that's kind of the "thing" these days - look at these rich assholes - but it really holds very little interest for me.

I lost it at Bautista having a google alert set up for the word "movie"

(benoit blanc getting ratatouilled) muh gawd, this creatuh – well, this RAT – he's controllin muh ev'ry move like i'm some sortuh puppet! damn this infernal rodentia, movin me against muh will... but i'd be lyin if i said i didnt wannuh see wheyuh this goes

— zach silberberg (@zachsilberberg) December 27, 2022

Enjoyed this watch, and if he's said some details elsewhere in turn it's still a good summary of how he's approaching these films

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IM1AEbnGX4

Feel like there's a bit of Knives Out revisionism going on here - it's arch and artificial as fuck and super not subtle in its social satire, has exactly as many sympathetic characters as this one does. I don't mind any of those things but they're pretty dominant in both.

I think the fact that Knives Out takes place in a cozy New England mansion and centers on a family makes it feel like a charming update of a traditional murder mystery, whereas Glass Onion feels more like the setting of a superhero movie, with characters that feel more like a league of villains than an actual group of friends. It may be no more satirical, but it all feels more garish.

i disliked the breaking glass climax a great deal. happy to see the mona lisa consumed though

― flamenco drop (BradNelson), Monday, December 26, 2022 7:52 PM (three days ago)

i was unreasonably stressed by everybody running around in sandals during that scene. in janelle's slo-mo run towards the mona lisa at the end, noticed that every step miraculously landed in a non-glass covered area - so maybe the broken glass was added in post?

I kept thinking about cut bare feet too.

i enjoyed this, i don't think i'll think about it again. biggest difference between this and the first one was with the first one you felt you at least had a chance of figuring out who did it, invites the viewer in. here that's thrown out the window with the introduction of the twin sister and half an hour long flashback that turns everything that came before it on its head. it feels more like a rollercoaster on rails than a choose your own adventure. but whatever, it's fun!

https://i.imgur.com/oJucJKk.jpg

I thought the broken glass would pay off in some way (like, Norton's character would be hurled into it) and was disappointed in that respect.

It's there as cover for breaking the bar, I think?

None of the twist has anything to do with the initial whodunnit, though. They play absolutely fair with that - the "Duke don't dance with pineapple", Myles handing Duke his drink, whatever Birdie's drink was. We don't know what the other mystery is until after the twist introduces it.

yeah but reveal of the second mystery by the twist steamrolls the initial whodunnit and also delivers the answer to you in a bowtie - the denouement isn't really that satisfying, hence needing the climax of glass breaking etc.

also, pineapple is a pretty distinct flavor, surprised that duke didn't pick up on it in his drink immediately but maybe he was already pretty wasted / preoccupied with how to blackmail miles at that point. rian johnson in shambles at these plot holes.

also, obviously should have been a soy allergy, not a pineapple allergy, duh

An interesting take from Ethan Iverson, a jazz pianist, huge crime fiction fan, and small-c conservative (which is why it's surprising — to me anyway — that this is running in The Nation instead of The Bulwark or The New Criterion).

i enjoyed this, i don't think i'll think about it again. biggest difference between this and the first one was with the first one you felt you at least had a chance of figuring out who did it, invites the viewer in. here that's thrown out the window with the introduction of the twin sister and half an hour long flashback that turns everything that came before it on its head. it feels more like a rollercoaster on rails than a choose your own adventure. but whatever, it's fun!

― 龜, Thursday, December 29, 2022 9:53 AM (four hours ago) bookmarkflaglink

having seen it twice now, this is where i am with it too. i enjoyed it, i found it funny and i loved the ending and several performances. i think my biggest issue is that the movie has no justification for withholding the helen/blanc backstory aside from shocking the audience with a fun twist. there's no formal reason for us not to be aware of helen and blanc cooperating from the start, those scenes on the island are withheld from us simply because the film wants to withhold them. it does make for a fun rollercoaster ride but a weird detective story where machinations of the detective himself are used to misdirect us, to the extent that we don't even know whose murder he's investigating for half the movie.

i have other issues with it, probably more complaints than praise at this point, but i'm also 100% on board for more benoit blanc movies and will devour whatever comes next

Agree that the mystery part was more muddled than KN1 and whoever it was here who suggested that Johnson get a co-writer next time.

lol the Nation piece refers to it as “Jerold Leto hard kombucha.” Great proofreading!

xpost *calls up Gillian Flynn* Er wait.

good old Benoit deciphering the entire murder mystery party game instantly was pleasing

"what the hell, man?"

machinations of the detective himself are used to misdirect us, to the extent that we don't even know whose murder he's investigating for half the movie

This is completely true and completely awesome.

also, pineapple is a pretty distinct flavor, surprised that duke didn't pick up on it in his drink immediately but maybe he was already pretty wasted / preoccupied with how to blackmail miles at that point.

Dude was handed a drink, sipped it, and immediately started choking

fair enough! i guess my point was i expected a spit-take, but yeah the choking is immediate.

Really enjoyed this. Appreciated the bit of misdirection which seemed to be leading towards Ed Norton getting offed early on, so Duke being the victim was a genuine surprise there, and really liked the constant noise of the party scene leading up to the poisoning. Reminded me of the Boogie Nights firecracker scene. I would want to watch it again, not even for the mystery but the sheer pleasure of watching the cast do their thing.

great cast

had the thought today that knives out is like the oceans eleven franchise, rotating ensemble casts anchored by a star riffing on a fun genre stalwart

I was disappointed that Johnson didn't go with the idea that Benoit Blanc would have a totally different accent in each film.

So what milieus/mystery settings are we going to be in in the next one, now that we’ve done Mystery Mansion and Remote Island? Ski resort seems like an auspicious choice and good for outfits.

Boat or train or train-boat

Def gotta be a hydro-train.
Or I'm thinking "impossible" museum caper

Christie liked boats and trains, obv. Some kind of culty New Age weekend spa maybe. Or a first-class cabin on one of those superluxe planes?

I’d love to see a blimp-related locked room mystery.

picturesque rural scandinavian pagan festival

“I do declare, is that a White Lotus hotel?”

Le Lotus Blanc

Helen/Blanc backstory felt like an inner ring to the onion. I was glad things were peeled back in order and not quickly during the end reveal.

Saw this last night, really liked it. I'm not sure if the timeliness of the movie is necessarily a good thing - it's amazing this movie came out right at this moment but at the same time we're all fucking sick of these kinds of people. Still I think it works because it focuses so much on Janelle Monae's character. I thought she would just be part of an ensemble cast but she feels like a bona fide movie star here. Too bad for those waiting for more music from her, I guess.

As for the movie itself I thought it was really well done. You expect these movies to deceive you so I thought some of the details were really clever. The first half had a lot of odd visual clues that make you think "wait, did anyone else see that?" which of course get explained way down the line. I thought it was great that the movie had two characters who were basically red herrings. One is particularly clever if you've seen the first one (my guess was that Peg was gonna factor greatly into the plot b/c that's sort of how the first one went but it turned out she was entirely irrelevant). It was just a really well made movie in general. I loved a lot of the visual details - the scene where Monae is just going to town on the invitation box with a hammer and you can see all the little game pieces fly out was amazing. It was full of subtle funny bits as well. Like Duke's gun being pointed directly at his dick and balls for most of the film. I also loved the grand reveal that most of these characters were just not very smart, which is the opposite of how these films usually go.

rly liked the first film. made it 13 minutes into this. what the fuck

if I wanted a barrage of hip internet nonsense I'd simply post here more!

"Active participants in a text-only message board are summoned to pub in Camden Town..."

There should be more modern movies that pretend the internet doesn't exist

this was good but not as good as the first. the big twist here was fun but twists that exist solely in the framing to mess with the audience are ultimately less satisfying, without any sympathetic/pov character to actually be surprised/impacted by the twist it ends up having less narrative weight

The fantastic thing about this movie is watching it a second time and seeing everything play out in real time exactly how Blanc pegged it before the denouement

A solid holiday watch but everyone who called it cringe otm - I am always in for a bit of hating on billionaires but at times it felt like it was a bit “see? See????”

Re the post upthread where they compared Miles having friends - isn’t the whole point by this stage in their lives that he is not their friend? He’s their meal tickets, and he’s got the means to take everything away as easily as it was given too. I wouldn’t call them friends in any meaningful way.

Also, everyone in this with blue eyes except Kate Hudson looked like they were wearing really fake looking contact lenses, I blame whatever filter they used. Isn’t the smarmy awful politician Sinema? (Sorry if that was said upthread but I didn’t read all 200+ comments.)

However I really love Janelle Monaé a lot, I will forgive a lot for her. But yeah, it’s not the kind of thing I see myself ever wanting to watch or think of again.

Agree w DJP re: rewatching.

The annoying stuff is minor notes compared to the overall fun the performers are having and the structure of the thing, which I enjoyed a lot as another take on a common mystery storytelling trope, re-seeing things from the POV where all is explained. Daniel Craig is clearly enjoying this role a million more times than Bond (post-Casino Royale movies that is) and really do hope they make a few more of these. If they can crank out three MCU films per year and ten-plus Fast and the Furious flicks I don’t think that’s too much to ask.

politician could be anyone, really. I was reading her as a Gillibrand but the recent FTX hijinks colored my perception

biggest laughs i had were the brief moments of Miles's clear shitlordness - playing "Blackbird" and "Under the Bridge" on acoustic, Frank Mackey cosplay, etc.

"Blackbird" was perfect, but the chili peppers song had to be "Soul to Squeeze".