Self-promotion

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Another spin-off from 'Vice' monster. I see this accusation come up over and over, '(x) is a crap artist but a genius at self-promotion, hype merchant etc.' Doesn't politicising and networking etc. = using other humans as materials = exhibiting far more skill, craft, awareness and understanding of society/human psychology/economics etc than producing yet another unread book, crummy photo that could be done by aunt w/ Polaroid, and (esp.) some shit-ass cliched 'music' wank that's only a retread of 99,999 other records that came out in the same month by equally untalented losers? ANYBODY can create 'art', it's just a bullshit indulgence of pampered slobs who are desperate to be validated and also avoid work in the bargain, so these socially inept types who string phrases together and call the 'poems' come up with all these abstract concepts like 'quality' to justify their lack of contribution to civilisation, while anybody who's actually intelligent realises that in order for the stuff to be worthwhile at all it's got to cut thru all the other shit! Even the most obnoxious self-promoter is actually more stimulating than the best efforts of somebody who is unable to see why self-promotion is necessary.

― dave q, Wednesday, 16 October 2002 05:57 (twenty-three years ago)

ANYBODY who is at all impressed with their own work would do well to remember this - "Everything you've done has been done before, and better, by somebody you've never heard of." Unless you're me. Fuck all y'all

― dave q, Wednesday, 16 October 2002 05:58 (twenty-three years ago)

so dave do you consider yourself a failed or successful artist in that case?

― jess (dubplatestyle), Wednesday, 16 October 2002 06:00 (twenty-three years ago)

"Everything you've done has been done before, and better, by somebody you've never heard of."

Yes, but they didn't do it my way.

― electric sound of jim (electricsound), Wednesday, 16 October 2002 06:06 (twenty-three years ago)

Peter Stringfellow > Thomas Pynchon, then?

They are different things, and the confusion comes when they are conflated. However impressive the self-promotion, I don't see why that should alter my view of the person's books or music, and these very separate matters are generally what is under discussion. There seems to me nothing terribly interesting in self-promotion in itself - the kind of self-promotion found in the music of Eminem or Mott The Hoople, or the books of Philip Roth or Dave Eggers, is an entirely different matter.

― Martin Skidmore (Martin Skidmore), Wednesday, 16 October 2002 12:02 (twenty-three years ago)

but when people are using autobiographical material, they're filtering it somehow, turning it into 'art' (ie superfluous narcissistic bullshit), while trying to impress people demands a lot more skill and 'artfulness', because you're actually 'improvising' in real time to try and create an effect that will proliferate itself, rather than just putting a frame around it and saying "look at this (me)"

― dave q, Wednesday, 16 October 2002 13:54 (twenty-three years ago)

I understand what your saying but all Im hearing is waahh wahh wahh wah , wah waaaaaaaaah wah. Frustrated?, dont like your job perhaps? go do some finger painting youll feel better.

― jeskam, Thursday, 17 October 2002 02:56 (twenty-three years ago)

This board is infested with art lovers

― dave q, Thursday, 17 October 2002 06:19 (twenty-three years ago)

And artist haters

― Ray M (rdmanston), Thursday, 17 October 2002 11:39 (twenty-three years ago)

http://www.angelfire.com/wy/bby2k/piclinks.html

(being literal about the thread title)

― jel -- (jel), Thursday, 17 October 2002 11:54 (twenty-three years ago)

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Self-promotion > art?