the day after the deadline: can the union survive brexit and other deep questions

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electoral reform is even more of a "surely the grown-ups will now come and save us!!" move than "second referendum now": discuss

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:32 (seven months ago) Permalink

Yes it will survive and Ruth Davidson will save it

xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:35 (seven months ago) Permalink

lock thread

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:36 (seven months ago) Permalink

Do you mean the idea that whoever is in power* will be grown-up enough to say "Yes this system that got us here must go for the good of everyone - but probably not of us"? Or just that it will unleash further waves of swivel-eyed loons from every side.

* there is arguably no-one in power right now..

Andrew Farrell, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:37 (seven months ago) Permalink

it does seem like electoral reform could go a long way to provoking some meaningful change - the two parties contain multitudes of views that go too far along the political spectrum - a system which reduced their power and increased the chances of coalition, and led to more parties cropping up, would probably be good. but we've prob seen in recent years the strange suspicion of coalitions that exists in the uk and the perception that they are weak or a sign of a decadent state or whatever.

― Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:21 (twelve minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Going to quote LocalGarda here because I feel what he's saying - but with the obvious caveat that we're both from a country that used an electoral system of beauty, nuance and power to elect the same shower of corrupt bastards in over and over for ever.

Andrew Farrell, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:40 (seven months ago) Permalink

no i mean the tendency -- which LG's post and yr affirmation of same dpn't really sidestep -- to pass the responsibility for significant change for the good onto a process that doesn't appear to have an agent (the "grown-ups" being the right-thinking people who will somehow to cause this to come about without it having to pass upwards through the extant political thingumajic you want to transform)

il a le pas de hors texte, as someone liked to say

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:45 (seven months ago) Permalink

thingumajic is the slovenian for what the old norse used to call the þing

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:46 (seven months ago) Permalink

No electoral reform when there won't be a country left to save.

xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:49 (seven months ago) Permalink

xp surely both these things are inevitable given how dysfunctional a shitheap british politics has become. it's not representative enough to have actually good agents

ogmor, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:50 (seven months ago) Permalink

By far the most politically significant thing in that Waterson tweet is the bit about Facebook. Things will profoundly change again when we really hit the social media backlash - not because of fake news or Trump or Russia or whatever, but just because the next generation think it's lame.

Matt DC, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:53 (seven months ago) Permalink

yes that's what i thought: that facebook and twitter are both OLD news (i mean, i'm on snapchat and friends with ppl who use it a LOT but it's more or less a closed book to me, and there's a micropolitics right there)

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 12:55 (seven months ago) Permalink

Actually curious as to why Twitter is perceived as 'boring' in presumably a different way to 'ruined by our parents and big business' re Facebook. If there is a distinction.

If you're 17 you probably don't/shouldn't think of (your) media as not social by default so that term itself is dating speedily.

nashwan, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 13:09 (seven months ago) Permalink

People spending a lot of time on Instagram were the first non-political people (in the sense that they’re not nerding on threads like us) I heard talking about the Labour surge (am not on Insta FWIW).

kim jong deal (suzy), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 13:13 (seven months ago) Permalink

That sounds like my first option there, mark - there can be no saving grownups in this scenario except the MPs, who aren't well suited for the job - no-one is going to march for AV.

Andrew Farrell, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 13:17 (seven months ago) Permalink

interesting analysis (again irish academic) of what we can learn outcomes underlying tactics and strategy on all sides -- undermined a bit by annoying and smug rhetoric ("it is essential to analyse the motivations – more academically and more objectively", and also by bad style decision re the formating of dates (superscript -sts, -nds, -rds and -ths are the devil)

http://blogs.lse.ac.uk/brexit/2017/12/05/a-high-risk-game-of-chicken-is-being-played-over-the-irish-border/

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 13:59 (seven months ago) Permalink

lol s/b "what we can learn ABOUT outcomes VIA underlying tactics and strategy on all sides"

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:02 (seven months ago) Permalink

"They care about animals, it's disabled people they hate."

Or in Blairite Labour's case it was: "They care about foxes, it's The Iraqi people they hate."

it seems most of the UK are far more likely to get upset about animal welfare issues than atrocities committed against fellow humans, especially disabled or foreign peoples.

calzino, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:14 (seven months ago) Permalink

Why do you think this is, Calzino? And is it a particularly British thing or common to all countries? (never lived anywhere else so genuinely don't know).

Grandpont Genie, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:25 (seven months ago) Permalink

Don't think that's particularly different in any Western European country tbf. (with the exception of foxes, that is really your thing)

Le Bateau Ivre, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:40 (seven months ago) Permalink

I don't think the UK population are particularly more susceptible to hate propaganda than other nations. But in recent times Blair kept the benefits scrounger rhetoric going for a high viz wearing Gideon to continue with. And in recent times it would easy to believe that much of the UK electorate are callous, hateful, xenophobic, racist etc. But I think that might be an exaggeration encouraged by far too many callous, hateful, xenophobic, racist politicians.

calzino, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:44 (seven months ago) Permalink

i remember in the 80s having quite an unsettling conversation on the phone -- for a piece I was researching for Dylan Jones lol -- with a young woman from PETA in America, quizzing her about the argument that animals should of course be sacred but that people e.g. with spectacles, bcz unfit, should be herded to the Darwinian die-off, .

I said "but that includes me" and she said "so be it" (to be fair this was the correct response rhetorically to my manipulative gambit). Unsure if this was actual PETA doctrine at the time or since but the distinction being made was p stark. And is in some sense or other quite widespread.

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:45 (seven months ago) Permalink

peta are equal parts stupid and stupid, there are a lot of far better animal advocate groups out there that don't just do hateful shit for stunts

faust apes (NickB), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:50 (seven months ago) Permalink

EU official on DD's suggestion that whole of UK will align with EU regs. "The UK will not have any say on the decisions taken in Brussels and will basically implement them without having any influence over them... it makes the UK kind of a regulatory 'protectorate" of Brussels'".

— Daniel Boffey (@DanielBoffey) December 5, 2017

faust apes (NickB), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:56 (seven months ago) Permalink

DD taking back contrololol

faust apes (NickB), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:57 (seven months ago) Permalink

BANTZustan

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 14:58 (seven months ago) Permalink

no i mean the tendency -- which LG's post and yr affirmation of same dpn't really sidestep -- to pass the responsibility for significant change for the good onto a process that doesn't appear to have an agent (the "grown-ups" being the right-thinking people who will somehow to cause this to come about without it having to pass upwards through the extant political thingumajic you want to transform)

i don't have to be able to implement the solution to suggest it, or to have an idea how it could come about. i'm just posting about the situation, i'm not putting myself in a position where i am the one to set the wheels in motion to solve it.

if we discounted all political views that pass responsibility for change onto a process that doesn't appear to have an agent we wouldn't be left with very many views imo.

we're both from a country that used an electoral system of beauty, nuance and power to elect the same shower of corrupt bastards in over and over for ever.

sort of true but every party bar sinn fein has been in power in my lifetime, and several independents have had sway as well for better or worse.

you could argue that "stops things getting done" or you could say it tempers the worst excesses of the bastards.

Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:08 (seven months ago) Permalink

not sure there's an argument against brexit that doesn't involve some level of condescension towards vast swathes of the electorate. what can you do when people vote for something which will fuck them over?

it's certainly not an endorsement of the current democratic system and it's arguably less patronising to suggest a new system of democracy than it is to suggest going out to people and teaching them why they should value the lives of people whose skin colour is different or whatever.

Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:11 (seven months ago) Permalink

tbf i wasn't saying that, i was saying that Remain needs to make more of a case for the awesomeness of the EU than they bothered doing during the referendum campaign

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:12 (seven months ago) Permalink

cos "hey guys, everything's great, you want this to carry on forever, right?" didn't really cut it

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:13 (seven months ago) Permalink

“what can you do when people vote for something which will fuck them over?”

Don’t put forth policy proposals that will fuck people over?

YouTube_-_funy_cats.flv (Jimmy The Mod Awaits The Return Of His Beloved), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:14 (seven months ago) Permalink

right, but we're past that point.

Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:14 (seven months ago) Permalink

fair enough LG -- i'm not exactly out manning picket lines myself here -- but i think it's a baked-in weakness of arguments for (and via) electoral reform, that they always seems to elide agency or (which is the same thing) trust in some slightly magical top-down institution to take charge of the process, which (to me)* makes ER quite a bad element to focus on or to foreground

*confessing: it's a bugbear, not least bcz step two is always a unresolvable stand-up drag-out fight between minutely distinct kinds of AV or STV or whatever, that causes the rest of the world's eyes to roll as they glaze over

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:15 (seven months ago) Permalink

i'd guess most brexiteers don't believe they will be fucked over, especially the people who are already fucked over. scratch that, those peeps don't really vote. it's the tier above them that are kinda paranoid about going back to being fucked over or have learned to believe that the only reason they're not fucked over is because of their own rugged individualism.

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:16 (seven months ago) Permalink

yeah i mean it is essentially saying "some powerful people" need to reshape democracy. but a lot of discussions in recent months have had this element to them - eg the idea that brexit should never have gone to a public vote.

we sort of rely on a fair democratic system to shape its own rules or reform them, maybe that doesn't work or ever happen. maybe that's what we're seeing in america, uk etc, the idea that only a few people actually know the inner workings of these systems and they are all establishment politicians or academics - the rest might want to change the system but have no idea what that means, and are never offered the chance to do so apart from these roundabout tassels that bob above their head every now and again, not intended for that purpose but ripped down as a way of changing something.

xpost

Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:19 (seven months ago) Permalink

i mean fundamentally -- and this is the root of my politics i suppose -- i think meaningful transformation of the "system" for the better is just no longer going to be top-down tinkering with the machinery: for a variety of reasons, we've moved out beyond the end of the technocratic era (which began with bismarck-gladstone and ended maybe with blair-obama) -- which is also why the "mass education project" is a non-starter, yes, practically or politically

(something like this *did* exist back in the age of empire, bcz it was consonant with the structures and flows of empire -- but the structures and flows are really really different now, in whatever the current era is)

anyway, beyond saying "it must come from below to be meaningful" and "and actually it WILL come from below whether we accept it or not" and then flourishing my red flag dramatically, i don't really have much idea what "it" is actually going to be (except that it could be quite a bad "it" if nice ppl don't involve themselves)

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:28 (seven months ago) Permalink

have learned to believe that the only reason they're not fucked over is because of their own rugged individualism

see i think this is a commonly stated belief, that is deep down not believed at all: its most aggressive defenders have often simultaneously internalised serious but unspeakable self-blaming assumptions about their own uselessness

i derive this insight from watching the apprentice feat.sir a.sugar obv

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:34 (seven months ago) Permalink

baron sugar i mean

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:34 (seven months ago) Permalink

well you know i don't really count those dorks as fully human

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:36 (seven months ago) Permalink

"i got where i am today thru the sweat of my own brow" is a pretty common working class trope as well as lol entrepreneurs

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:37 (seven months ago) Permalink

which brings us back to Baron Harkonnen i guess

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:37 (seven months ago) Permalink

Remain needs to make more of a case for the awesomeness of the EU than they bothered doing during the referendum campaign

I don't buy this really. It suggests there actually WAS a better way for the status quo to have been sold (or resold) to various sceptics and, pessimistically or cynically, I don't think in practice that was feasible (without getting into more general issues like how the Tories like to govern).

nashwan, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:38 (seven months ago) Permalink

prob like 9 out of 10 people think this way, either fully or to an extent.

xpost to nv

Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:38 (seven months ago) Permalink

yeah that doesn't feel like an overestimate, even if you're trust fund scum you probly like to kid yourself that you're worth it

after "after cease to exist" (Noodle Vague), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:40 (seven months ago) Permalink

as a trope, i think it's very often a psychic defence against deep unstated belief in one's own weakness and (same thing ) unworthiness -- hence the outfacing rage that cocoons it

no one is fully human: those dorks are collective manifestations of the most problematic of all the symptoms we share

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:41 (seven months ago) Permalink

👉🏽 i'm fired

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:41 (seven months ago) Permalink

i dunno if people can function without some sense of "i am who i am because of choices i make"

and to some extent it must be true for everyone, tho not maybe in the ways they think.

Bein' Sean Bean (LocalGarda), Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:42 (seven months ago) Permalink

"i could be who i could be because of choices i must now make" is the lifeline

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:48 (seven months ago) Permalink

what are examples of bottom up change in british political history and why couldn't it happen wrt electoral reform?

ogmor, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 15:55 (seven months ago) Permalink

Civil war; repeal of the corn laws; agitation in the colonies against being colonies. Electoral reform followed from all of them, but the form it took was not predetermined or even the primary motor of the change.

I mean. maybe a mass movement could be formulated round electoral reform (like the suffragettes): but you'd need a structural change first, for it to be meaningful; for it to "take" (suffragettes achieved their goals as a consequence of the social changes wrought by WW1).

mark s, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 16:03 (seven months ago) Permalink

It's very possible that Brexit brings just that major upheaval (so far ofc it hasn't actually happened) that could mean the occurrence of structural changes.

Can't see anything like 2nd ref, not least bcz Europe has huge problems the likes of Juncker don't care and are perhaps unable to solve.

xyzzzz__, Tuesday, 5 December 2017 16:12 (seven months ago) Permalink

‘this isn’t even... my final forrrrrrm’

http://is-a-cunt.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/philip-2.jpg

BIG RICHARD ENERGY (bizarro gazzara), Friday, 20 July 2018 16:08 (three days ago) Permalink

Brilliant quote, stet.

Britain's Sexiest Cow (jed_), Friday, 20 July 2018 16:14 (three days ago) Permalink

History has a way of repeating when you refuse to learn from it, cf Edward Carson in 1921:

What a fool I was. I was only a puppet, and so was Ulster, and so was Ireland, in the political game that was to get the Conservative Party into power. And of all the men in my experience that I think are the most loathsome it is those who will sell their friends for the purpose of conciliating their enemies, and, perhaps, still worse, the men who climb up a ladder into power of which even I may have been part of a humble rung, and then, when they have got into power, kick the ladder away without any concern for the pain, or injury, or mischief, or damage that they do to those who have helped them to gain power.

gyac, Friday, 20 July 2018 16:22 (three days ago) Permalink

A big death just a day after they opened that massive sarcophagus dug up recently? The realest curse my dudes.

nashwan, Friday, 20 July 2018 16:41 (three days ago) Permalink

Fiona Bruce is wearing a baby pink news jacket, Phil lives.

suzy, Friday, 20 July 2018 16:59 (three days ago) Permalink

weekend ruined, thanks phil you immortal lizard-man

BIG RICHARD ENERGY (bizarro gazzara), Friday, 20 July 2018 17:07 (three days ago) Permalink

Boris Johnson has been my second-top trend on Twitter for a few days now, despite having only a few thousand tweets about him. Has he literally paid for enhanced exposure?

imago, Saturday, 21 July 2018 09:14 (two days ago) Permalink

my brain now answers all such questions with "THEY DRANK THE TOMB JUICE"

mark s, Saturday, 21 July 2018 09:18 (two days ago) Permalink

on my twitter:

Hockney World Cup

FPBE party leader Micheal Heseltine speaks

Star trek

Buffy

thankfully no fucking BoJo!

calzino, Saturday, 21 July 2018 10:01 (two days ago) Permalink

Etymology of sarcophagus practically demands you drink the tomb juice

Centipedes? In this economy? (wins), Saturday, 21 July 2018 10:02 (two days ago) Permalink

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illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Saturday, 21 July 2018 10:04 (two days ago) Permalink

stir in a little gelatin for the al dente effect

mark s, Saturday, 21 July 2018 10:05 (two days ago) Permalink

Right, so Vince Cable missed a very important vote to oppose Brexit in the Commons last week because he was at a secret meeting about forming a new centrist Remainer political party?

suzy, Saturday, 21 July 2018 21:50 (two days ago) Permalink

you could not make it up.

Britain's Sexiest Cow (jed_), Saturday, 21 July 2018 21:51 (two days ago) Permalink

Forming 'centrist' political parties is the opiate of The Worst.

Leaghaidh am brón an t-anam bochd (dowd), Saturday, 21 July 2018 21:53 (two days ago) Permalink

if there’s one thing this country needs more of it’s centrism

BIG RICHARD ENERGY (bizarro gazzara), Saturday, 21 July 2018 21:55 (two days ago) Permalink

I almost admire his complete dearth of conviction politics tbf, he makes Gove look like a driven ideologue. But lol, what a complete fucking risible arsewipe!

calzino, Saturday, 21 July 2018 22:39 (two days ago) Permalink

if there’s one thing this country needs more of it’s centrism

― BIG RICHARD ENERGY (bizarro gazzara), Saturday, 21 July 2018 21:55 (one hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

yes

dele alli my bookmarks (darraghmac), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:11 (two days ago) Permalink

no

calzino, Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:14 (two days ago) Permalink

if there’s one thing this country needs more of it’s dads

Chase Knobbe? Have you Courtney Cox? (Tom D.), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:16 (two days ago) Permalink

yes

dele alli my bookmarks (darraghmac), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:19 (two days ago) Permalink

what this country needs right now is Mcat 2.0!

calzino, Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:26 (two days ago) Permalink

GHB?

Britain's Sexiest Cow (jed_), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:32 (two days ago) Permalink

I'd say I haven't done it 15 years, but apparently the very same psychoactive drug is present in red wine, albeit in much smaller quantities!

calzino, Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:42 (two days ago) Permalink

i did it once quite recently and had to be dragged into a taxi and deposited in my bed at the other end.... allegedly! (I have no memory of anything after taking it although my state has been alluded to several times since)

Britain's Sexiest Cow (jed_), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:49 (two days ago) Permalink

my brother once walked into a McDonalds and took a piss on table whilst on it, and somehow managed not to get arrested!

calzino, Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:51 (two days ago) Permalink

thankfully, my concern has mostly been around how loudly i was snoring while i was out.

Britain's Sexiest Cow (jed_), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:54 (two days ago) Permalink

although since it was around a bunch of gays that could do you enough reputational damage.

Britain's Sexiest Cow (jed_), Saturday, 21 July 2018 23:56 (two days ago) Permalink

Can’t read the whole piece but this is from today’s Sunday Times:

In a survey that will spark unease in Downing Street, the YouGov poll found that the public believes Boris Johnson, the former foreign secretary, is better placed to negotiate with Brussels and lead the Conservatives into the next election.

It highlights how voters are polarising, with growing numbers alienated from the two main parties. About 38% would vote for a new party on the right that was committed to Brexit, while 24% are prepared to support an explicitly far-right anti-immigrant, anti-Islam party.

One in three voters are prepared to…

I'd Rather Kecak (NickB), Sunday, 22 July 2018 07:09 (yesterday) Permalink

...bring back Hitler, one assumes

I'd Rather Kecak (NickB), Sunday, 22 July 2018 07:09 (yesterday) Permalink

oh apparently it’s vote for a new anti-brexit centrist party

I'd Rather Kecak (NickB), Sunday, 22 July 2018 07:12 (yesterday) Permalink

"with growing numbers alienated from the two main parties"

Election '17 was the biggest turnout in percentage and numbers of the electorate in 25 years, and support for the 2 main parties at '92 levels as "black-death" UKIP support cratered. But yeah, let's try and push the Tories even further to the right before the bacilli has even become airborne again, eh YouGov?

calzino, Sunday, 22 July 2018 07:28 (yesterday) Permalink

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcROz-DWP4q5nwv8rp8FkelFRauP8hg8ZB5_z7tXFPksI0okY19t

I think this once popped up on an earlier incarnation of this thread. This 4th form hubris in dashed off essay form might not have aged well, but it might give some insight into how well things are going to go with our current Brexit negging hotshot!

calzino, Sunday, 22 July 2018 08:10 (yesterday) Permalink

britannia sat on some sort of ducking stool and just about to pull the lever

I'd Rather Kecak (NickB), Sunday, 22 July 2018 09:15 (yesterday) Permalink

christ what a lineup of shitheads (tesco ceo included obv)

BIG RICHARD ENERGY (bizarro gazzara), Sunday, 22 July 2018 09:19 (yesterday) Permalink

to make case for Chequers, Government needs to emphasise, believe, & warn on the impact of hard Brexit on factories, companies, and people (eg stockpiling).

But then in trying to claim No Deal is an option it then simultaneously has to downplay all the same.

Not sustainable.

— Faisal Islam (@faisalislam) July 22, 2018

This is obviously true though with 54% of people, per the ST poll, preferring to remain in the EU rather than take a no-deal Brexit, outlining the implications in full will probably mean an even higher number being pushed towards Remain.

Wag1 Shree Rajneesh (ShariVari), Sunday, 22 July 2018 09:29 (yesterday) Permalink

But yeah, let's try and push the Tories even further to the right before the bacilli has even become airborne again, eh YouGov?

Mixed feelings about this - we need to know that this constituency is out there (assuming the poll in question isn't asking dumb leading questions, which is a big assumption). But the last election probably showed the limitations of that approach for the Tories - they hoovered up the UKIP vote but enough of the rest of the country went "fuck no", and would continue to do so - it's just handing votes to Labour.

Then again there are plenty of people in the country who would vote for Robert Mugabe if they thought he'd cut their taxes, although they'd make clear how uncomfortable they were with it.

Matt DC, Sunday, 22 July 2018 09:50 (yesterday) Permalink

If the Tories' membership is as small and as decrepit as is reported then the party is absolutely ripe for infiltration by disgruntled centrists* (as are the LibDems) - the fact that hasn't happened suggests that all the new Centre Party stuff is just hot air.

*Although I'm guessing they skew metropolitan and as a result aren't going to have enough influence on Parliamentary selections where it matters.

Matt DC, Sunday, 22 July 2018 09:59 (yesterday) Permalink

"assuming the poll in question isn't asking dumb leading questions"

How much more Islamophobia do you want to protect us from TERRORISM? More, More or Kill Them All!

calzino, Sunday, 22 July 2018 10:02 (yesterday) Permalink

You’ll notice there’s a reference to “religion or belief” as a protected characteristic in there. That is presumably how a claim of antisemitism would be dealt with. However, the Conservative code of conduct does not at any point mention the word “antisemitism” or spell out a definition of antisemitism, IHRA-approved or otherwise.

"Responding to her backbencher on Wednesday, Theresa May said that she agreed all political parties should adopt the full, unredacted IHRA definition – adding that “the Conservative party has done that”."

TM lying about her party's stance on antisemitism at PMQ, and nothing to see here.

calzino, Sunday, 22 July 2018 11:23 (yesterday) Permalink

EDL marched in my home town this weekend, because there's plans to build a new mosque. Think they mostly came from out of town as usual.

Colonel Poo, Monday, 23 July 2018 09:11 (five hours ago) Permalink

Meanwhile, I'm sure Sajid Javid will be practicing his power pose for the official announcement of this...

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/uk-isis-beatles-death-penalty-sajid-javid-us-extradition-james-foley-jeff-sessions-a8459556.html

Father Ted in Forkhandles (Tom D.), Monday, 23 July 2018 10:18 (four hours ago) Permalink

This is bad obviously, but there is an appeal to seeing "The Beatles" and "death penalty" in the same sentence.

calzino, Monday, 23 July 2018 10:23 (four hours ago) Permalink

a penalty which has been levied on half of the beatles already tbf

a Stupendous Leg of Granite (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 23 July 2018 10:24 (four hours ago) Permalink

NO LONGER A DEBATE

mark s, Monday, 23 July 2018 10:31 (four hours ago) Permalink

Britain’s foreign secretary, Jeremy Hunt, has warned there is a risk of the UK leaving the EU in March 2019 without a deal because of stalling by the bloc’s negotiators, and that British views of Europe would sour as a result.

Speaking in Berlin on his first overseas trip since being appointed to the role earlier in July, Hunt told his German counterpart, Heiko Maas, that “there is now a very real threat of a Brexit no deal by accident, and this is because many people in the EU are thinking that they just have to wait long enough and Britain will blink”.

In comments directed over the head of Germany’s social democrat foreign minister towards Brussels, Hunt said: “Without a real change in approach from the EU negotiators we do now face a real risk of a no deal by accident, and that would be incredibly challenging economically.

“Britain would find that challenging, but in the end we would find a way not just to survive but to thrive economically. But my real concern is that it would change British public attitudes to Europe for a generation.”

oh noes, wouldn't it be terrible if people in the uk start ('start') hating the eu after a no-deal brexit but actually we'd be fine after an no-deal brexit anyway and anyway it'd be the eu's fault but i'd hate for that to happen will this do subs pls fix

a Stupendous Leg of Granite (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 23 July 2018 14:31 (thirty-six minutes ago) Permalink

meanwhile in more things to ry not to think abt at all: recent severe absence of rain means crops yields are down and there’s not enough grass to make hay for the winter; farm animals can't be properly watered and so are being culled i guess early?

mark s, Monday, 23 July 2018 14:54 (thirteen minutes ago) Permalink

lol we're all gonna starve ;_;

a Stupendous Leg of Granite (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 23 July 2018 14:58 (nine minutes ago) Permalink

Yeah I work in a lab quality testing crops & my manager is a sheep farmer, this is what we call an “atypical year” (maybe to become less so as the planet cooks)

Centipedes? In this economy? (wins), Monday, 23 July 2018 15:00 (seven minutes ago) Permalink

the good thing is that this ruinous summer definitely won't be followed by a catastrophic winter like the one we just had which will further compound our agriculture problems because climate change is a fiction ha ha oh god help us

a Stupendous Leg of Granite (bizarro gazzara), Monday, 23 July 2018 15:03 (four minutes ago) Permalink


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