Cloning humans....erm, whats the point again?

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sorry i've forgotten....how exactly did it work anyway? did they clone tissue from an embryo? they'd be like twins then basically...what if the original tissue's DNA contains the 'evil gene'? heh

― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 29 December 2002 22:03 (twenty-three years ago)

they claim the baby is a clone of her mother...does this mean she will literally resemble her exactly in appearance at every stage of her life (barring obviously easily-adaptable features such as hair style/colour)? i expect her personality could end up different enough based on how she is educated and treated.

initially this outcome seems harmless enough...being as it is effectively not too dissimilar from when people produce children naturally, kids can look like one or both of their parents often uncannily - and clones occur naturally with twins, triplets etc.

there's talk that the process of manufactured cloning could solve the supposed impending population dwindling in Europe, and even a Star Wars Episode 2 scenario seems envisagable eventually - attractive to some military leaders as it would mean natural individuals wouldnt have to fight, especially advantageous as it preserves the youth

bad points would of course be 'playing god = trouble' and a deeper crisis of individuality among people, something that already exists really...what other drawbacks if any?

― stevem (blueski), Sunday, 29 December 2002 22:41 (twenty-three years ago)

will anti-clone speech be protected?

― boxcubed (boxcubed), Sunday, 29 December 2002 23:00 (twenty-three years ago)

I think the point is supposed to be something to do with that never-ending quest for immortality that most folks seem to be on. You know, the same reason people have children and publish their art. If you clone a whole person then they sort of get to feel like they're going to live forever. If, on the other hand, you only clone peices, then that's all the more organs and stem cells to work with, presumably prolonging human life.

Or maybe it's more closely related to that other, equally apparent, impulse towards self destruction.

But really, as for why anyone would care to do this, you got me.

― , Monday, 30 December 2002 00:07 (twenty-three years ago)

BRAIN TRANSPLANTS!!

i can imagine a matrix-type scenario of body-growing factories, built for the sole purpose of giving people an exact youthful clone of their old body to move their BRANE into once they've decided their regular body ain't cuttin it no more... big question though: what do you do with the 16-year-old brain once you're ready to evacuate it? i mean you can't just throw it away!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 30 December 2002 00:24 (twenty-three years ago)

hahaha the Raelians btw are the most awesomely stereotypical arch-villians ever (and not just because they're French-Canadian!) - did you READ what their fearsome leader's past is?? alien robots with enormous hooters forced him to take hot baths! i want IN!

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 30 December 2002 00:27 (twenty-three years ago)

but it completely counters the 12ft Lizards and thus should be discouraged post haste

― stevem (blueski), Monday, 30 December 2002 00:30 (twenty-three years ago)

Clones will age at the same rate as their "parents," but they will die much younger. DNA slowly gets shorter and shorter as cells divide, until finally essential genes become damaged and you die. Pleasant, ne?

Thus no human can live longer than about 120-140 years.

― Curtis Stephens, Monday, 30 December 2002 00:44 (twenty-three years ago)

err, to apply this to cloning: a clone of a 40-year-old woman wouldn't live past 80.

― Curtis Stephens, Monday, 30 December 2002 00:46 (twenty-three years ago)

no biggie, unless cell preservation/restoration allows people to be 80 years old but retain the body of someone half that age, which is also possible in the long run

― stevem (blueski), Monday, 30 December 2002 00:48 (twenty-three years ago)

curtis how is 80 years old "much younger"?

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 30 December 2002 00:51 (twenty-three years ago)

the raelian are poseurs. (rael hails from france, not quebec btw)
"oooh face, now they got their own raelian christ"... must I say something as boring as : their claim remains scientificaly unverified by an objective party.

I don't think they did it (yet). No one did it yet.
5% chances of success when you clone a rat is acceptable but the same percentage applied for humans is criminal. Think about,like, the 50 difformed babies (lungs outside the body etc) they had to went through before hitting the jackpot. they r not 4 real.

eventually I would like a clone and this is an impulse towards self construction: I want a headless one to use as available spare parts in case I get sick in my old age :-)
Brain transplant is a bit too tricky with today's technology so I would rather leave it right where it is and change the broken parts that are hooked to it instead :->

bruce stirling said human clone babies will grow into the bitterest and surliest adolescents evah. funny thought isn'it?

― the Hegemon, Monday, 30 December 2002 00:59 (twenty-three years ago)

The parent could still live to be 120 (if she's really lucky.)

― Curtis Stephens, Monday, 30 December 2002 01:00 (twenty-three years ago)

"lucky"

― ron (ron), Monday, 30 December 2002 01:18 (twenty-three years ago)

hey it's sick but if i'd been brainwashed into believing hot sauna rubdowns by huge-titted robots awaited me upon my faithful execution of the high Raelian's orders i'd participate in whatever twisted misery was required.... these are some of the only types who would manage to stomach going thru this stuff i think. maybe they didn't do it yet but if somebody DID do it they'd probably be a lot like the Raelians... also the announcement seems uncannily real, i.e. Dec 26TH, not the 25th, for which they were clearly aiming...

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 30 December 2002 01:19 (twenty-three years ago)

living beyond 80 terrifies me as it is

― stevem (blueski), Monday, 30 December 2002 01:20 (twenty-three years ago)

Dec 26TH, not the 25th, for which they were clearly aiming...

stupid, as its proved tricky to determine the real birthdate of Christ lately

― stevem (blueski), Monday, 30 December 2002 01:21 (twenty-three years ago)

"Clones will age at the same rate as their "parents," but they will die much younger."

There is no clear answer to that yet. it may be true... and it may be false.

― the hegemon, Monday, 30 December 2002 01:25 (twenty-three years ago)

it'll all fall apart when age six the eyes move towards the back of the head and an extra foot comes out the torso, Alien3 style.... "keeeell meeeeeeee.... keeelllll meeeeee!!"

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Monday, 30 December 2002 01:30 (twenty-three years ago)

CC the cloned kitten doesn't look exactly like her mother (is "mother" the right word in this context?); apparently the differences in color distribution are a result of environmental factors. Even identical twins don't look completely identical, if you know what to look for. If this baby is literally a clone, she also probably will have only a family resemblance to her mother.

And stevem is OTM as to how upbringing will affect this kid's personality -- especially if the Raelians raise her as some sort of Messiah.

― j.lu (j.lu), Monday, 30 December 2002 01:36 (twenty-three years ago)

Curtis, correct me if I am wrong but from what I understand of genetics (admittedly, not much) the accumulation of errors in the genetic code and loss of non-transcribed sequences appears to be correlated to the ageing of the individual, but there is, as yet, no proof that this causes aging or death, nor that it would do so in a clone.

― , Monday, 30 December 2002 01:41 (twenty-three years ago)

I'm jealous of the attention raelians get.
journalists run with their "news" because it sellz even if there is nothing scientific to back them up.
"oooh face, now the Hegemon got their own jupiter brain ! I mean it! people? hey! HEY!!!!!1!! the Hegemon wants to b in google news!"

― the hegemon, Monday, 30 December 2002 01:41 (twenty-three years ago)

(!)
DNA test to confirm human clone claim
http://www.expressindia.com/fullstory.php?newsid=18099

they called her "eve"...
Sheninagan aside this is fucking interesting. Maybe this experience will clarify a lot of things about cloning and genetics. At best she could be the key to immortality for everybody living today etc.
Now she'll be shot by both sides: psychologically she is doomed obv.

― the hegemon, Thursday, 2 January 2003 06:16 (twenty-three years ago)

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