Magic: The Gathering C/D

the way I understand it, it's the latter.

I feel already like a lot of the cards in DM are going to be about connecting the different guilds. Maro hinted in his article today that there was something that would link together Evolve and Populate (?)

'turn x +1/+1 counters into a token, populate' could happen

Definitely will choose Gruul for DM prerelease because I'd be very happy with 3/4 of the allies.

I can see an azorius-boros deck w/ 12 flyers and batallion/detain being pretty nasty

unexpected results: limited playable y/n

it's a card 23 for slow decks

makes sense

is it just me or do the drafts get real easy when Cube's around?

i haven't been drafting, i don't like cube and i'm tired of all the other formats that are up (except ZZW which isn't that fun a format anyway)

also at some point i decided i like sealed more than draft

yeah i havent played any mtgo since the mocs and doubt i will until the release

i do have a bunch of cube tickets from last time that but i have no desire to draft the current cube

ive been playing standard/modern but have been on a soul-crushing losing streak the past couple weeks so i could really use a new limited format right now. the 2 week delay on new sets is pretty brutal still even though it's shorter than it used to be

i'm okay with 2 weeks but the longer delays were pretty unreasonable. i agree that it's kind of hard to go back to "normal" Cube now. it seems to be firing pretty often but I can't imagine who would prefer this one over the powered one. the good thing about drafting RTR now is that all the good drafters seem to have quit the format and packs are down to 3.01 right now.

gatecrash drafting tips for tonight, ready, go

i know you guys think its awful but dimir is going to be wide, wide open for the first several weeks i think, so if you can figure it out i'd be on that plan

keys to dimir? getting walls / tradeable dudes to avoid getting overrun? some bounce hopefully? is the mill 3-cipher playable in anything but a to-the-bone mill deck?

what are the key cards for aggro Dimir vs. mill?

can't remember if I mentioned this but people really stayed away from Dimir during all the prereleases here so I wouldn't be surprised if that's true. to draw the comparison again I think everyone said "Izzet really sucks" after the RTR prerelease, until one guy wound up with 4 Frostburn Weirds and destroyed everyone

I don't think dimir has a frostburn weird

rogue would be the closest thing I guess? but that's not gonna take over a game on its own, maybe w/ cipher or in a stall, but it's not comparable to a turn 2 weird drop

key cards for dimir are hands of binding and unblockable/flying dudes, plus a blocker or 2 so you don't lose every race. shadow slice seems really good in a more aggro build and possibly underrated to the point where you could get it on the wheel. midnight recovery seems awesome in the more grindy builds, with corpse blockade and such.

yeah I guess it makes sense that hands of binding will be good if dimir has to rely on tempo and evasion if it wants to win

i think, rather than looking to draft dimir id rather draft orzhov (or simic i guess) and look to pick up useful dimir cards on the splash and let everyone else fight over boros/gruul? dimir just seems like its actually bad, rather than misunderstood or w/e

I think a strong (sole drafter, reasonable card pool) dimir deck might be better than a strong golgari deck but building it is gonna require some nuance

the prob is the drop off from decent dimir to compeltely unwinnable dimir seems like it's gonna be sharp

well there seems to be fewer 3-power dudes that come out on turn two or three, for one. I think outside of a fast Boros start (especially with the 3/2 RW dude) you should at least have a chance to establish your deck.

that said - with Izzet you really do risk getting a terrible deck if the right cards don't come in pack two and three, a risk you don't really have with Selesnya because it has so many good commons that work in a vacuum. with Izzet you can go Electromancer/Stealer of Secrets/Runewing as your "curve" and totally get blown up by a Centaur/Dread Reveler + a combat trick. Dimir looks about the same way, you really need the synergy, and probably really really need Hands of Binging

whereas even gruul at its worst is just some lame R/G dudes, still can win a game against a bad deck / draw

so yes basically what iatee said. I've built Izzets that struggled mightily to win vs. 5-color decks with Aquus Steed. again I don't think this format is going to be so fast that you just get run over - three guilds play for the long game, and Gruul isn't exactly quick either.

haha i dont think theres a dimir uncommon as strong as dreg mangler. but i strongly encourage everyone to continue drafting dimir and trying to make it work

Gruul isn't necessarily quick but it can blow you out from nowhere if you aren't careful. Wrecking Ogre can be absolutely devastating.

dinrova horror maybe xp

i think the gruul and dimir drafters should just try opening M13 boosters tbh... think of all the playable creatures youll get, i mean nothing on the level of 1/1s for three but theres some decent stuff in there.

i'm basically just gonna go with what's open but with a preference towards non-red decks

all I'm saying is that I would expect Development to try really hard to make sure all 5 guilds were somewhat balanced in Limited which is why I can't believe right now that Dimir is that much worse than Golgari or whatever the worst RTR guild is now (to be honest, I don't think Golgari's that bad??)

golgari is objectively the worst

haha, Golgari is my favorite, maybe I need to reassess my priorities...

i always did well with golgari, the trick is to take cards that aren't black or green

golgari was great for me because it was underdrafted so I would get passed all kinds of insane cards.

i think development might simply have been really worried about cipher in constructed - free spells are often a problem and i think they had to overcost a bunch of stuff to help avoid it getting out of hand when put on invisible stalker or w/e.

that seems likely but you'd think they'd balance that w/ more strong-in-limited-useless-in-constructed cards

Golgari and Izzet are the two that seem to rely more on good uncommons and rares but I dunno about "objectively the worst". It plays a good long game through Scavenge and commons like the Scorpion are pretty excellent because you can trade for an attacker and get a Common Bond later. Trestle Troll shuts down Azorious pretty well. I love playing Gatecreepers in there too because you can sac 'em to Slum Reaper or Launch Party. I think it's a deeper guild than most realize, maybe because nobody drafts Grisly Savage which is really good if you've got Shamblers and Scorpions. IMO Izzet is the one where you walk a real fine line between a contender and not having a chance.

anyway as far as Dimir goes I think the deck would work so much better if Frilled Oculous's +2/+2 was 1B instead of 1G. actually I think that's been brought up before.

i think gruul is more uncommon-dependent than izzet or golgari. i;ve won so many games just with gore-house chainwalker and pursuit of flight, or sewer shambler onto daggerdrome imp, but the common gruul cards just seem super unimpressive, while the uncommons are all nuts (guildmage, trample guy, ground assault, charm)

also the card Death's Approach may be seriously overlooked here; I've heard people argue "other drafters snap up all the good blue and black stuff anyway" which I think is a silly argument but here's a card that seems only good in Dimir

I think a super strong golgari deck still loses games at a higher rate than a super strong anything else deck

like it's not like the guild never wins games or matches or tournaments, but there's no equivalent to having 3 call of the conclaves or the perfect azorius deck etc

xp I say "uncommon dependant" not necessarily because they have the best ones (actually, Izzet's uncommons are pretty weak), but because it's real hard to wind up with 19-20 playable commons in either of those guilds. I agree that Gruul looks to be similar.

that 2RG dude is the mangler-o-gruul

I think a super strong golgari deck still loses games at a higher rate than a super strong anything else deck

there's some truth here, no equivilent to the turn 5 Rakdos kill or Selesnya vomiting out Centaurs or Azorious playing flyers every turn and detaining your Reach guy. super strong Golgaris tend to clog up everything with Jailbreakers and Trestle Trolls then start dominating with Longlegs or a big Daggerdrome Imp

the equivalent is having lots of stab wounds which realistically never happens

when your best threat is a removal spell, you get cannibalized pretty quickly

I've seen golgari decks w/ 3 stab wounds only doing okay

it mighta been better to price that card at GB tho so golgari got it to itself, its not like rakdos needed it

not really in green's flavor I guess