At what point in your writing career do you/did you get incredibly frustrated and scream "THERE IS NO WAY I'M DOING ANYTHING FOR FREE"

Ronan, is this some kind of site or magazine where the people running it are paid for, ooh, advertising space in between the content? If they've promised you pay, then you should be paid. If they bait and switch to having you and your friends work for free, even temporarily, they are a bunch of cowboys and you should not 'work' for them.

Mail them and ask them to explain why they are going back on the original payment plan. The explanation will *never* be good enough and you can bin them off with a clear conscience. Go write for the Irish papers instead - most of the writing in them is shite and you'd shine in comparison.

Right now I am owed by a Japanese magazine which is no biggie, but am owed $800 by art magazine in LA which I should have had before Christmas. January always sucks for the freelancer but being down to last £3 and making three-day soup out of very tired-looking carrots and parsnips was not part of the plan. Nor were bank charges of £30 a throw for not honoring pissy little £15 direct-debit things (I feel your pain, Anna, over and over, and it doesn't get better).

'Free' copies of magazines with your articles in are NOT a bonus, they're a given because of the necessity of tear sheets. You shouldn't ever think you have to buy when that happens - you're giving enough 'support' as a writer.

It's in the interest of press officers etc. to guest-list writers and send out promo items (and usually these things are unsolicited). It's PROMOTION, all of it. They're building up their contacts and they're also paid better money than you/me to do so.

- my stuff
- people who dont (might or might not want to) write professionally's stuff
- stuff professionals write but don't have a market for
- ideas people are still knocking into shape: i provide the bandwidth and get some kudos but the writers keep the copyright and can sell it on, something not available to freebie print contributors in general.

Which is a good call, but I think raises a question -- to quote Suzy earlier:

by working for free you are in effect a slave and - this is important - you are pushing down the value of the work done by other
aspiring/professional writers if you accept unpaid work

I'm guessing the key word here is 'accept,' ie agree to work an assignment rather than volunteer something up. But in the world of weblogs, webzines, etc. has the line become further blurred at all? Perhaps it hasn't, certainly.

As you say the 'accept' thing is important - I wouldn't commission specific work from a professional, though I would happily email them and say is there anything you want to write which you know nobody would pay you to do currently? Then cos of the non-copyright thing the response and feedback might help them firm up a pitch on a similar topic.

Then again, Suzy works freelance for a living. I work freelance for the heck of it and some extra income. That's a crucial distinction and I can see how where I'm coming from can really grate with Suzy's take.

Incredibly poorly. I've just stumbled into most of the lists I'm on, and I'm barely on any.

I'd love to write for the Irish papers and yeah there's reams and reams and reams of crap in there daily, I have submitted stuff before, I guess I have to keep trying and see.

To be honest everytime I read these threads and hear how shitty it is it just makes me more determined to do radio and later tv aswell.

Re:the promos, it's nice but they do give them away easily, they don't give a shit in my experience. I don't even bother writing reviews or previews of half the stuff anymore.

I have developed and made pitches for things about 5 times which is a small amount but then I haven't felt my stuff was good enough for very long either.

The system in place where for-profit organisations get free labour out of writers does two things. One: soon only people from moneyed backgrounds will be able to enter the profession. Two: those who enter will have to wait longer and longer to commence paid employment. Rates for many of the magazines and newspapers I work for haven't gone up in five years but every single expense I have to set against that has gone wayyy up.

Ronan, you cannot just submit pieces to the Irish papers already written. Just precis your idea, give them three good reasons why it's newsworthy, and PHONE FIRST even if what they'll do is ask you to send an email. Meet editors. Get those PRs to slip you some addresses and direct telephone numbers.

& is there any nice resource where you can get the info for record labels so I can call them/write them (& i guess send my tear sheet) and be like "Hi you want to mail me albums, really"?

I'm pretty clueless on most of this stuff. Is a freelance writer's handbook a good resource? any particular ones?

The trick is to do this without becoming Baboon Dooley.

ok boom, this just happened.

what should i do, for a career?

So, seven years of "content providing" is enough for me.

"No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money." - Samuel Johnson

What Suzy said is wise.

pls everybody just stop writing

^^^^^^^^^^^