WASHINGTON, Feb. 13 — President Bush challenged the United Nations Security Council today to show "backbone and courage" in its deliberations over Iraq, lest it "fade into history as an ineffective, irrelevant debating society."
A day ahead of a crucial report to the Security Council from the United Nations chief weapons inspectors, Mr. Bush baited council members who oppose military action in Iraq, primarily France and Germany.
"You've got to decide when you lay down a resolution, does it mean anything?" he said, speaking at the Maypole Naval Station in Jacksonsville, Fla. The Security Council "can now decide whether or not it has the resolve to enforce its actions."
― Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:47 (twenty-three years ago)
― Stuart, Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:52 (twenty-three years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:53 (twenty-three years ago)
― jess (dubplatestyle), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:53 (twenty-three years ago)
― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:53 (twenty-three years ago)
No, but claiming that others aren't showing it is.
― N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:54 (twenty-three years ago)
Granted the speech was to service men and women, but I find it just gauling. The implication is that the U.N. has made the resolutions and they're pussing out by not enforcing them, but oh no not us, we've got the might and we're not afraid to use it.
Good point Jess. Like I said, I try to keep my blinders on pretty tight these days. Serenity now.
― Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:57 (twenty-three years ago)
― Kerry (dymaxia), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:57 (twenty-three years ago)
Given the whole spat with the French, I sincerely hope this was intentional. ;-)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:58 (twenty-three years ago)
― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:58 (twenty-three years ago)
Because of an editing error, a front-page article yesterday about diplomatic developments in the Iraq crisis misidentified the Bush administration official who said about the weapons inspectors in Iraq, "At some point it will become obvious that it's time for them to go." It was an administration official speaking on condition of anonymity, not Condoleezza Rice, President Bush's national security adviser.
― maura (maura), Thursday, 13 February 2003 20:59 (twenty-three years ago)
― stevem (blueski), Thursday, 13 February 2003 21:00 (twenty-three years ago)
― Horace Mann (Horace Mann), Thursday, 13 February 2003 21:01 (twenty-three years ago)
― N. (nickdastoor), Thursday, 13 February 2003 21:01 (twenty-three years ago)
...this statement of course does not apply to Israel and their rampant numerous SC resolution violations.
― nickalicious (nickalicious), Thursday, 13 February 2003 21:03 (twenty-three years ago)
― Aaron W (Aaron W), Thursday, 13 February 2003 21:03 (twenty-three years ago)
― hstencil, Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:17 (twenty-three years ago)
A senior official in Pyongyang, Ri Kwang-hyok, told the AFP news agency that North Korea was capable of attacking "all military personnel and all military commands of the United States in the world" as a self defence measure.
He also called on the Security Council to investigate the United States' own nuclear programme. "We insist that the responsibility of the US must be discussed too," he said.
BBC News
― Momus (Momus), Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:24 (twenty-three years ago)
― Amateurist (amateurist), Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:26 (twenty-three years ago)
Yes. Because they are poor and we can kick their asses blindfolded.
Of course this is a macho thing. You should just be thankful he didn't call the French "A bunch of fru-fru pussies" or make any comments about how "The UNSC ain't got the BAWLZ!"
The idea that any other nation is doing any less 'posturing' than you seem to think Bush is guilty of is ridiculous. The concept that Chirac and Schroeder are behaving out of some populist idealism and respect for the wishes of 'the people' is a lot of crap (PS why is everyone so ready to buy this continental BS while regarding their own elected leaders with such suspicion that it borders on the absurd?).
Oh, wait. Nevermind. Now that Momus and Amateurist have arrived with such insightful comments I suppose I'll go buy that toilet auger.
― Millar (Millar), Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:40 (twenty-three years ago)
He'd also claim Kim Il Sung brought the dawn of each day. Take this with the whole shaker of salt.
>>He also called on the Security Council to investigate the United States' own nuclear programme. "We insist that the responsibility of the US must be discussed too," he said.<<
The various ceasefire accords between North and South Korea from over the years (eg the Korean Denuclearization Treaty of 1992 and 1994 Framework with US) prevent North Korea from manufacture of nuclear weapons. No treaty prevents the US from having a stockpile of nuclear weapons. Therefore, the US is under no obligation to allow Security Council members in. It is, however, a rather humorous idea from the Koreans.
-Alan
― Alan Conceicao, Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:41 (twenty-three years ago)
the Republican congressmen are virtually doing just that according to reports
i'm not saying that Bush is the only one posturing - in fact thats the problem, Chirac and Shroder's posturing is not obtuse enough to contend with the torrent of bullshit that appears to be streaming from Bush, Powell and co. right now. as exquisitely pointed out on other threads, its a friend and ally that calls you to question over what they consider to be dubious actions on your part, to do anything else renders them a sycophant - Bush's heart may be in the right place but his head seems to be so far up his arse its no wonder we're talking about a million people marching to Hyde Park on Saturday
I should also have pointed out that i was wanting a leader technically on the same 'side' as Bush to contest his backward stance on the 'axis of evil' dilemma, so not Kim Sung obviously
― stevem (blueski), Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:50 (twenty-three years ago)
― nabisco (nabisco), Thursday, 13 February 2003 22:58 (twenty-three years ago)
so are *ahem* the Democrats
― Millar (Millar), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:03 (twenty-three years ago)
I believe we will see something extraordinary on Saturday. There will be a sense of euphoria, a sense that, whatever the supreme court did in 2000, and whatever Tony Blair is doing now, it can't change and can't resist the will of the people, which will prevail. I feel a huge sense of relief, because I'm usually isolated, a minority voice. But on this, I'm just a speck in the ocean, a fleck of foam in a huge rising tide. We, the people! It sounds strange. Bush, the unifier!
― Momus (Momus), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:20 (twenty-three years ago)
― Millar (Millar), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:24 (twenty-three years ago)
― Millar (Millar), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:26 (twenty-three years ago)
― Momus (Momus), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:27 (twenty-three years ago)
― Tad (llamasfur), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:28 (twenty-three years ago)
― suzy (suzy), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:30 (twenty-three years ago)
― Dan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:32 (twenty-three years ago)
― DJ Martian (djmartian), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:32 (twenty-three years ago)
― Millar (Millar), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:35 (twenty-three years ago)
No, in a word. I think people here feel their views are represented all the way to the top, which is a nice feeling, but doesn't exactly get anyone out onto the streets.
http://www.stopwar.org
details where the demos are in every city. Please, everyone go. Even you, Millar.
― Momus (Momus), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:35 (twenty-three years ago)
http://www.stopwar.org.uk
― Momus (Momus), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:36 (twenty-three years ago)
you'll be at home playing Risk then?
― stevem (blueski), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:42 (twenty-three years ago)
― mark s (mark s), Thursday, 13 February 2003 23:44 (twenty-three years ago)
― N. (nickdastoor), Friday, 14 February 2003 00:23 (twenty-three years ago)
Because UN support for this operation would be an endorsement saying that Bush and the U.S. are doing the Right Thing. The UN realistically can't do much more than refuse to rubber-stamp approval of Bush's war, but I'm pleased to see that they are standing their ground.
― j.lu (j.lu), Friday, 14 February 2003 02:25 (twenty-three years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 14 February 2003 02:28 (twenty-three years ago)
Bush has done more for international socialism than any number of Socialist Worker pamphlets could have done.
That's real easy for you to say sittin' over in Paris, Mr. Nader.
Can't go to the big rally here in NYC 'cause my mom gets in to Newark about the time it all starts. I can't rightly ask her to bail me out of jail, considering she's coming on a weekend super-saver fare.
― hstencil, Friday, 14 February 2003 02:31 (twenty-three years ago)
I did my time as a naive college student for about one semester before I realized that the people leading these sorts of march/singalong antics were pompous hypocrites no better than the suits they endlessly criticized for everything wrong in the world and that said leaders were more often than not so far removed from the people they claimed to speak for that they could barely communicate on the same level.
I believe in the sanctity of the entire bill of rights, not just the First Amendment, and I will not pretend even for a moment to hold solidarity with a trust fund brat who can see no reason for the second, fourth, ninth or tenth.
I took an oath with many others to defend the Constitution against all etcetera you know the story and I think that my getting up in the morning and going to work every day for $2800 a month after taxes is probably enough of a political statement.
No thanks, Momus- I will be staying in for most of the weekend, I imagine, checking in on friends and waiting to see if my phone rings to call me in for a little unpaid overtime.
To the rest of you, I am certain your beliefs are as strong as mine (it's going to be cold as fuck out there) and I wish you the best of luck. Don't do anything stupid and remember to bring a kerchief, you never know when those pig cop bastards will decide to teargas the lot of you for no good reason at all.
― Millar (Millar), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:01 (twenty-three years ago)
Out of curiosity, what is your take on Patriot Act II or whatever version of it has leaked so far? Seems like a compromise at the very least when it comes to them amendments (though as you note, Ashcroft's no friend of yours -- is he a friend of anyone?).
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:03 (twenty-three years ago)
― Millar (Millar), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:06 (twenty-three years ago)
― hstencil, Friday, 14 February 2003 04:07 (twenty-three years ago)
1. Certain jerks like Poindexter of TIA fame think that the current situation means they can get away with anything re: new legislation to help prosecute American citizens and Green Card holders.
2. Congressmen and state governors are not buying any of it, because at the bottom line it's their privacy too, and moreso the states have no desire to give up any more jurisdiction than they already have in such matters - TIA is already getting torn to pieces on the house floor and I'll be quite surprised if any of this shit actually goes through.
3. The big hole in all of these schemes is posse comitatus - the military cannot be mobilized against the citizenry in any capacity. Since most of the current plans to spy on us depend on leveraging DoD assets, I'm speculating that anything that does pass will shortly be annulled in the Supreme Court the first time someone tries to give one of my colleagues a 'lawful order' to monitor the derring-do of what we call a US Person.
We will not turn into Brazil or 1984. Too many people remember that fuck Hoover. Finally, I personally will not allow such garbage should it ever approach accepted practice, and based on that, I don't imagine many others in my profession would either.
― Millar (Millar), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:20 (twenty-three years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:26 (twenty-three years ago)
― Millar (Millar), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:33 (twenty-three years ago)
― Ned Raggett (Ned), Friday, 14 February 2003 04:35 (twenty-three years ago)
― Tad (llamasfur), Friday, 14 February 2003 05:29 (twenty-three years ago)
It seems to me the the Republicans are simply using the macho bullying rhetoric that has done so remarkably well for them in the US (hell, it's allowed them to annex the Democratic Party!) -- the only thing surprising about this is how surprised they are that it doesn't fly in Europe.
― Colin Meeder (Mert), Friday, 14 February 2003 10:41 (twenty-three years ago)
― stevem (blueski), Friday, 14 February 2003 12:34 (twenty-three years ago)