Independent Launches Tabloid Edition

The thing is, the best thing about the Indy has always been the pullouts and the review section and this is the bit I can really see suffering if the paper does go tabloid.

to which should be added, "recently". I suppose the last was the Daily Express, which went tabloid in 1977. I don't know much abt the old, broadsheet Express in the days just prior to its transformation, but presumably it was thought that going tabloid would boost sales when in fact the reverse happened I believe.

is it really is the stupidest idea ever- i think only time will tell. It is an expensive gamble, but one which may pay off - if overall sales improve and the tabloid edition has a much larger share of the overall market for the paper than the full-size one, then the Indy would then be sensible to go tabloid only.

Is the writing on the wall for Broadsheet dailies?

Hum. How wrong I was - I'm a tabloid convert.

Blackheath Station now only stocks the tabloid version. In all honesty though, the original broadsheet Indy was so thin that conversion to tabloid format was relatively easy. Can you imagine the Tuesday Guardian as a tabloid? It'd be huge.

Because it makes me read it?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_ltxCWvi_SlE/SPYBr_BkyDI/AAAAAAAAAQg/wuJmnbNUDY4/s1600/expressdependent.jpg

What the fuck has gone wrong with their design team?

The decline of the Indy as a visual paper is sad. It used to be the paper that prided itself on its photojournalism, there'd usually be a fantastic image on the front page, better than on any of the others, now you're lucky to get a badly drawn picture alongside DOLPHINS TO BE EXTINCT BY 2015 or whatever.

LONDON, Nov 2 (Reuters) - British newspaper group Daily Mail & General Trust is considering a bid for the Independent and its Sunday sister title, part of Independent News & Media (INME.I: Quote, Profile, Research, Stock Buzz), Britain's Observer newspaper reported.

The titles could be off-loaded for as little as 1 pound, with DMGT taking on the loss-making papers' liabilities, the report said, citing industry sources.

The report cited sources close to IN&M as saying the newspapers are not for sale but that rival groups have offered to take on some back office functions, including human resources and accounts.

IN&M must renegotiate several loans next spring but the Observer says banks are unwilling to underwrite the company at a time when its UK operations are loss-making and an advertising downturn is likely to push them further into debt.

Spokespeople for DMGT and IN&M were not available for immediate comment.

Quite like that DMGT single, surprisingly.

Can't quite see what's in it for DMGT really.

One less Loony Leftie Politically Correct Broken Britain newspaper?

november 3: indie denies having such talks. mail says nowt. "hmm," says everyone else.

the entirety of british newspaper journalism ... oh, and radio, certainly ... is so spectacularly fucked that nothing would surprise me any more. and i've run out of fucks to give.

Graun had to liquidise its trust and replace it with a new, presumably more geared towards an eventual sale, one last month as well.

Although this story from a few months back explains a _lot_:

http://blogs.pressgazette.co.uk/wire/3829

xpost

really? i didn't know about that: probably because i've stopped paying much attention, but even so ...

Thought radio was generally as healthy as it has been in years? Mind, I only listen to the BBC because I'm a muesli-eating beardie twat.

The Scott Trust, the non-profit organisation which owns the Guardian Media Group, has been wound up and replaced by a new limited company entitled The Scott Trust Limited. The reasoning behind the move is "to guarantee the ongoing independence of the Guardian" as at present the Scott Trust is a non-charitable trust and therefore has a finite lifespan, unlike a limited liability company.

The trust transferred ownership of GMG - which controls Guardian News & Media, publisher of MediaGuardian.co.uk, GMG Regional Media, GMG Radio, GMG Property Services and Apax Partner joint ventures Emap and Trader Media Group - to the new parent, The Scott Trust Limited, at the beginning of the month. The Trust also pointed out that the move will have no impact on the amount of tax it must pay.

Created in 1936 to protect the legacy of the longstanding editor and former owner of the Manchester Guardian, CP Scott, the remit of the Scott Trust has always been to retain its independence, both editorially and financially.

did it? Fucking hell.

When people look sceptical as i tell them lots of newspapers are about to close or merge I tell them to watch The Independent. It'll be the first domino to go.

xpost to NV: it's the really small stations i mean: a lot of which were swallowed up by regional media groups that are now trying to offload everything they own and run for the hills. i was going to say the likes of virgin etc are safe, but -- given that virgin doesn't really exist any more -- that'd be a bit stupid.

i think the difference with radio and newspapers is that people still give a toss about the former. unfortunately, if your local radio station is owned by a group that's struggling ...

It'll be the first domino to go

i have fears closer to home, dude.

we're not big enough to be a domino.

Apparently there are serious legal problems with a BBC-only digital radio if commercial stations keep folding. If it's only used by the BBC then it is illegal at the charter for the spectrum stands, and it would have to be turned off.

(my brother tells me this, and he is investigative tech reporter for the register, which means he knows what he's talking about, but is also a professional troll)

I think the Express will go prior to the Indie, because at least the Indie _can_ reposition itself (however fuckwittedly). The Express has nowhere to go other than into non-existence.

caek: good point. i've read stuff alluding to that, but none of it quite as succinct.

^ joking about Maddie, suspend for 3 months, no pay

Soyrr.

If the Express goes, no sci-fi predictions of BRITAIN FACES ARCTIC FREEZE IN JULY

CANCER CURED BY SMALL DOG

SUPERFOODS LINKED TO ASYLUM SCANDAL

I like this military jazz drum fill on CNN

8 hours, fuck this, I have a PhD to do.

wrong thread, but the PhD thing stands

More than a fifth of jobs to go; subs in firing line, predictably.

Hey ho.

once again a Guardian exclusive.

This recession will be the one that finally delivers the coup de grâce to the newspaper industry. The Independent has been at death's door for years, surely it won't survive a couple of years of recession.

Nah this came out yesterday. I give the Indy two years, tops (xpost SNAP).

xpost

Not in the form it is now, certainly. Mind you: 230 hacks across the Indy and Sindy? That astonishes me; I thought they had way fewer than that already. Didn't they merge various bits several years ago, for a start?

Anyway: I shouldn't be sitting here wittering about journalism. I've got some serious re-skilling to be getting on with ;)

I'm surprised by those numbers as well, I thought they were already a skeleton staff. Especially given that 85% of their stories are the exact same stories you find in other papers. I honestly think the Metro is a better paper than the Independent at this point.

lol at this

Most of the Indy's copy is just rewritten from newswires, it's part of the reason why they've become so opinion-heavy over the last few years. Those numbers amaze me.

Indie doesn't have a chance, surely. There's going to be some high-profile media casualties by this time next year. London market is really, really ugly.

I don't expect the overall media recession to be as deep this time as it was at the turn of the decade. The difference is that this time it's going to be print that's hit hardest.

Maybe British newspapers could take the extraordinary step of not having AN ENTIRELY SEPARATE STAFF FOR THEIR SUNDAY EDITIONS.

Was thinking this

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/organgrinder/2008/nov/13/evening-standard-london-paper

and this

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/nov/17/pressandpublishing-nationalunionofjournalists

Free evening papers, don't do it kids.

The fact that the London freepaper wars have been going on for two fucking years now is ridic.

Even Roger Alton was talking recently about the likelihood of the Indy Sunday being absorbed by the daily. Mind you, he also said the London Lite/Papers are responsible for some of this country's finest journalism so, y'know, he crazy.

'lol at this' -- why?

'ridic' -- why?

Some of you people seem nasty. Well, some of you ARE nasty, of course. But not all of you.

Even Roger Alton was talking recently about the likelihood of the Indy Sunday being absorbed by the daily

That was Kelner's big thing a few years back, though; indeed, when I was a Sunday-paper hack, we looked at the Indy and its supposed "seven-day operation" and quaked in fear.

Trouble is ...

Maybe British newspapers could take the extraordinary step of not having AN ENTIRELY SEPARATE STAFF FOR THEIR SUNDAY EDITIONS

... dude, I was a senior production hack on a Sunday paper and I worked a fucking 60-hour week just to get that thing away. The notion that merging a daily and a Sunday = getting rid of loads of jobs is nonsensical. As with any organisation, I'm sure the Indy and Sindy have dudes who aren't pulling their weight; it's easier for a reporter to be lazy on a daily, though.

Really, do you think Sunday-paper hacks spend four days a week twiddling their thumbs, then knock everything together on the Saturday?

Ridiculous, because they cost the parent companies a fortune and are strangling other, better, aspects of their output.

I was just about to do pinefox singing "Don't Let's Be Beastly to the Journos" but I guess I missed my window.

(I should make it clear: the organisation I work for is now PARED TO THE FUCKING BONE, so a merger of the daily and Sunday titles would make not a scrap of difference. I'm quite sure that the Indy/Express/Mail etc could afford to cut many, many dudes and still continue with little noticable difference; whether those cuts occur as part of a merger or not is moot. Sure, if they do employ reporters who have just one or two bylines in the entire Sunday book: that's a bit daft. But if you look at our Sunday, you'll see the whole thing is written by about four names, and the notion that their job could be done simultaenously by daily staffers, or vice versa, is nonsense.)

Ridiculous, because they cost the parent companies a fortune and are strangling other, better, aspects of their output.

― Pete W, Wednesday, 19 November 2008 11:37 (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

This. The idea, one would assume, would be that they waved their respective dicks around for six months and then the winner cornered the market and doubled their advertising rates, and the loser skulked off and licked its wounds.

Not "Two years later and two major media companies are pissing money down the train to read what that fat girl with Kate Nash's hair has been up to in her love life this week"

And "lol at this" because fuck the Indie and its intern-abusing ways.

'Four names? Are you sure you couldn't do it with three?'

^^^^^^^
How publishers think.

The newspaper "brands" will live on, but some of them are going to end up as websites run by a dozen people.

xpost

Not so sure about that. These days it's more like: "Couldn't you do it with two? Actually, can't we just take it all from PA?"

^^^already happening in Scandinavia, which seems to have been the first major media market where these problems have kicked in.

xp

Actually, can't we just take it all from PA?"

― grimly fiendish, Wednesday, 19 November 2008 11:43 (35 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

^^^a good look, imo

The Mail is a license to print money surely? They have to turn advertising away.

However, if the London freesheet wars end up killing the Evening Standard then it will all have been worth it.

xpost, damn!

It's the only look in town.

The Mail is a license to print money surely? They have to turn advertising away

Not any more. They're turning large numbers of their staff away now.

Has the Independent abused you, stickman?

No, but their working practices of filling near-entire sections with unpaid staff on the loose promise of "being considered for a full-time job" somewhere down the line is pretty sickening. I mean, that's how magazines work, not newspapers.

Well Grimley you know better than I, but no American newspapers work that way (to my knowledge). Then again no American newspapers do anything as ambitious as the Observer Music Monthly or whatever. I dunno.

I too hate the Evening Standard but I have an outsized affection for their vendors and would hate to see them go.

I've never been employed in a sweat-shop, so I'm cool with them meself.

Any paper that has employed Bruce Anderson for years deserves everything it gets imo.

Well Grimley you know better than I, but no American newspapers work that way (to my knowledge)

I think the quid pro quo is that the seven-day operations there have much, much larger newsrooms (ie, umm, about the size of UK daily + UK Sunday)? The staggering size of US copydesks in comparison to UK ones has always been a source of much envy in GrimlyWorld.

I'll admit, though, I know sod all about US newsrooms. All I can really do at the moment is survey what's left of my own and weep softly. Sorry to be a bit prickly about this, but, y'know, we're fucked :)

Which is why I should be getting on with writing a lab report, not thinking about the remnants of my former career. Nads.

I didn't think stickman had enough of that 'human feeling' stuff to find anything sickening.

I hate it nearly as much as you hate black people, piney. I'm that passionate about it.

^^ that remark was just snide. So snide in fact, that if anyone must be lost to the tragic carnage of the Middle East, then let it be you.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2008/nov/28/independent-titles-associated-newspapers-northcliffe-house

Now this IS funny. Like Love Thy Neighbour with newspapers.

Another Guardian exclusive...

They forgot to say "Kensington, west London." It's a disgrace.

Comes to something when businesses move to Kensington to save costs...