work in NYC

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so i'm about to do the whole graduate from college-not knowing what to do for a year before i jump into grad school thing, and I am seriously conisdering moving to new york for the hell of it. I know a few people in the town. I was wondering, what kind of work could I find in the town? I have a few years of bartending behind me, but everyone says that its impossible to find a good bartending job. Anyone with experience?

brock (brock), Thursday, 26 February 2004 01:50 (twenty-two years ago)

can you say, "excuse me sir can you spare some change please?"

Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 26 February 2004 01:56 (twenty-two years ago)

tell some NY architects to phone me.

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 26 February 2004 02:20 (twenty-two years ago)

next week.

RJG (RJG), Thursday, 26 February 2004 02:28 (twenty-two years ago)

brock - in all seriousness, I wouldn't suggest moving to NYC to my worst enemy. Everything that has made this city unique and cool is long gone. It's expensive, filthy, and impossible to find a job. It's a playground for the affluent and the hopelessly spoiled, and run by wealthy tyrants. For the better part of 26 yeras, I've been trying to leave.

If you're drawn to 'the city,' why not try another metropolis, like Boston, Chicago, or Philadelphia? While they're still not exactly my speed, they're much better cities in my opinion, and, despite what naysayers may tell you, the pizza, record stores, book shops and bagels are pretty much EXACTLY the same in every city.

Don't believe the hype.

If you need more, I wrote an article for a magazine that pretty much sums up exactly why I hate NYC. I can post it here if you like.

roger adultery (roger adultery), Thursday, 26 February 2004 02:56 (twenty-two years ago)

well here is the thing. providence is def. the main city i'm looking at right now. i'm considering brown for graduate work at some point, but i need a little bit of a break. i'm hearing nothing but amazing things are far as rent goes, i'm just having a hard time finding information on where to live. i mean its an hour away from boston (12 dollar train ride) and 3(?) hours from NYC for the shows that i have to see. i'm visting NYC for no fun fest the 19th-21st of march, so i guess i'll get a good taste of the city then. i'm basically just at a point in my life where i need to get out of virginia and experience something new and i'm seeking out anything. ann arbor, philly, and boston are all places people have mentioned to me. i'm stuck in limbo basically.

def. post that article for me too.

and give me any info on anything worthwile on the cities i mentioned. help a brother out! thanks guys.

brock (brock), Thursday, 26 February 2004 03:49 (twenty-two years ago)

As many (very helpful) ILMers know, Lady and dog and I will be moving to California this year. It wasn't my first choice (Michigan is my favorite state and I love upstate NY) but Wifey is hell bent, and the weather is enough to get me to go along. Plus, you know, true love and all that.

I'll post that article tonight.

I'll be at the No Fun Fest! (at least on Saturday for Gert-Jan Prins and Dead Machines). I may be sitting in with some folks as well. We can do a FAP if ya like!

Providence is nice, from what I hear, but I've only been there a few times and for very short amounts of time.

Ann Arbor is pretty close to perect IMHO, as is Oneonta, NY (when school is not in session, that is). No work in upstate NY tho (which is why I'm not really pushing for us to live there)

roger adultery (roger adultery), Thursday, 26 February 2004 04:42 (twenty-two years ago)

Below is the article - it's a rough draft, but you get the idea.

XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX

ANYWHERE BUT HERE:
Why New York is Lame
(1,922)

While the Big Apple remains the ultimate ‘destination’ city for many folks across the country, the myth of New York’s cultural preeminence is a dangerous one that has endured for ages. Truth is, over the past forty years, New York City has gradually become a vapid playground for the conservative and the affluent, and remains so. Everything that once made New York City beautiful and unique is long gone.

I. Culture and the Obscene Lack Thereof, or, “COST and REVS – The Bell Tolls for Thee”
Though research shows that the cracks in New York City’s artist-friendly veneer began to show as early as the 1960s, the first time I was personally affected by the decline of culture in New York City was with the disappearance of graffiti. As late as 1993, Digable Planets rapped “New York is a museum with its posters and graffiti,” and fuck if it wasn’t. My friends and I would cut class and use our school-issued bus passes to travel from Staten Island to Manhattan, armed with cameras, to take pictures of our favorite graffiti pieces, like the ones we saw in our favorite book, Spraycan Art.
Former Mayor Rudolph Giuliani’s “Broken Window” theory – that unaddressed disorder invites bigger and more violent crimes – was the basis for the July 11, 1995 Mayoral Executive Order no.24, formally establishing an Anti-Graffiti Task Force. The trains were coated with fluorinated polyurethane, a paint-repelling chemical that caused paint to run right off of its surface. Since this fateful day, the trains are no cleaner than they were in the 70’s, but now possess all the personality of a rain puddle, resembling giant squealing antique spoons.
Meanwhile, quality-of-life programmed Cyborgs in police uniforms were on the prowl. The newspapers, naturally, did their part – I’ll never forget the fake contest the Staten Island Advance ran for graffiti writers to showcase their work on paper, with the promise of $500 for the best contribution, only to have the local police collect the real names of taggers alongside the work they sent in. I remember my astonished mother complaining to the manager of a drug store after I was refused the sale of a laundry marker (which I needed for a school project).
Almost overnight, New York became less a museum than a police state.
Also, during Giuliani’s regime, most of the homeless seemed to disappear, to the delight of all the good white people commuting to the city from Westchester to take their lucrative posts embezzling money and foreclosing on farms. And it wasn’t just the homeless that disappeared, but all kinds of riff-raff – street musicians and squatters, panhandlers and preachers – all gone.

But where did they go?


II. Gentrification, or, “Usurp, We Suffer”

Perhaps ironically, whenever enough artists populate an urban area, wealthy dilettantes are drawn to the new place to dip their toes into some weird sin, resulting in higher rents for the very people who made these places attractive in the first place. The artists are then unable to make the inflated rent, and have to go elsewhere, but the restaurants and boutiques imported by the wealthy interlopers remain.

The term gentrification came into use in the early 1960s, when rich folks began moving to low income areas in New York City to make them more ‘livable” (a relative term if ever there was one). Around this time in the West Village, rental buildings were converted into co-ops, driving out longtime residents to make room for these self-appointed fixer-uppers.

Josh Pais’s excellent film 7th Street examines this type of gentrification perfectly, casting a modern light on Bohemia driven to decimation by something as shape-shifting as national economics. Is it any wonder those vandalism-inclined among us take to culture jamming and adbusting?

Today, New York City, once a bustling marketplace of ideas and idealism, is a bastion of capitalism and tourist fraud. A Kmart is perhaps the most visible thing in the Village, framed by two Starbucks. Times Square is an Orwellian, seizure-inducing scene creepily mirroring the cartoonish excesses of modern Tokyo. Huge screens project images of soft drink giants, while flickering artificial lights beam down from overhead all through the night, resulting in something of an aurora borealis played on a concrete stage all year fucking round.

A recent article in Time Out New York estimated the average rent for one bedroom apartment below 96th street in Manhattan (including Brooklyn) between $1,200 and $4,000 a month. So, next time you’re on St. Mark’s Place and an out of work actor serving you food at some shithole cafe tries to tell you that he’s paying his own way without the assistance of mommy and daddy, forget to leave a tip.


III. Goods and Services, Truths and Lies, or, “You’ve Been Played”

Whenever The Blood Group travels out of New York, Lady Jessica, Jarvis and I are always on the hunt for four things: good Mexican food, good record stores, good book stores, and good thrift stores. And whenever we inquire of the locals where to find such places, they almost always have a list, but they always end with “it’s probably nothing compared to what you have in New York,” or “You’ll probably be disappointed, coming from New York.” Let me attest that I’ve been all over the country, and I’ve found the following to be true:

1) Despite what you have heard, pizza, bagels and other food are not much different outside of New York. As a matter of fact, the best Mexican food we’ve had was in San Diego and the best pizza was in Atlanta.

2) Thrift stores and record stores are usually better the further you go from NYC. This seems obvious, as everything cool / collectible in NYC, whether it’s a vintage Dio shirt or a really rare Van der Graaf Generator single, has long been captured by the hipster elite.

3) Book stores are ALWAYS better outside of NYC. When on tour, we always spend a good deal of time in book stores, and we’ve found that every metropolis has book stores as good as or better than the ones found in New York.

4) New York’s lineage of hip bands is criminally exaggerated. The last great influential band to come from NYC was Sonic Youth, whose first album appeared over 20 years ago. Modern day New York has less to do with Debbie Harry and Jim Carroll than it does John Zorn and his wanky downtown buddies. This realization is enough to make you question everything Greil Marcus ever taught you. Even wastoid king Johnny Thunders knew you can’t put your arms around a memory. Remember, just because Leonard Cohen once got a blowjob here doesn’t make it the rock and roll hall of fame.


IV. Punk Rock, Hardcore and Beyond, or, “You Owe Us Nothing”

Almost every major U.S city had its share of important punk and hardcore bands, and it’s clear, thanks to the luxury of compulsively-documented hindsight, that certain axioms exist. For example, DC punkers were political. Detroit punk bands loved the drugs. In LA, they loved to skate. New York’s legacy, however, is one of xenophobia and violence. While Bad Brains were rocking for light and Necros were hipping the suburban kids to the evils police brutality, the Cro Mags were mugging people and Agnostic Front were shouting about making minorities clean the sewers.

Recently, pop star Shakira made a special trip to the legendary CBGBs to procure a T-shirt bearing the famous club’s logo. I find this especially interesting in the same way I find it interesting that The Strokes and Justin Timberlake attend the same parties. It’s an old and tired song and I won’t insult your intelligence by singing it here, but when the mainstream swallows something up so wholly and immaculately (see the Pillsbury Doughboy placing the last nail in the coffin of breakdancing circa 1986), what’s left for the rest of us?

Last time I was at CBGBs, I swore I’d never return. I was dragged to a New York Dolls tribute show (to this day, the worst show I have ever attended). It was like being at the Renaissance Fair but with far worse music. Feathered hair and bullet belts were the uniform of choice, while aging troglodytes in leather jackets traded their sad old stories, often from the stage, prompting more than one joke from my immediate crew that ended with the punchline “I see dead people.”

In a way, it’s a microcosm of the rearview-gazing climate of the industry. Nowadays, when someone tells me about a band they like from New York City, more often than not they say something like “They’re awesome. They sound JUST LIKE Gang of Four!” and I suddenly feel violent. But the meds are doing wonders these days and so now I just talk shit on message boards and patiently await James Chance’s inevitable East Village killing spree.

V. Inhabitants, or, “Flux of Pink Imbeciles”

Unfortunately, the only truism generated by Hollywood about New York City is the rudeness of its citizens, and there has been little exaggeration, I’m afraid. Soundmen and salespeople, police and panhandlers - generally, all assholes. Whether you’re a high fashion model or a squatter peddling books on the street, it seems that having a chip on one’s shoulder is a prerequisite for living in the Big Apple.

Then there are the tourists, whose slow and aimless strolls keep you from catching trains. There are death-defying bike messengers who strike fear in the hearts of even the most intrepid pedestrian. Thousand of shoppers clustered on narrow city streets, all carrying umbrellas, each umbrella made up of 16 sharp metal points, poised at eye level. And despite Interpol’s typically oblique claim, the subways are nothing like a porno – unless your idea of a porno involves the orgasmic chills that ripple through a body after having a briefcase shoved into one’s knee, feeling the breath of strangers on the back of one’s neck, or being harangued by some sort of crazed and crippled Zionist.

VI. Conclusion, or, “The Truth Is a Fucking Lie”

Before you think me a white-knuckled iconoclast, there are some things I like about NYC: Gray’s Papaya and its convenient proximity to Fat Beats; Sammy’s Noodle Shop; Gimme Gimme Records; Sabir Mateen, Tom Bruno, Daniel Carter and Matt Heyner playing in and around Penn Station; most of the folks who work at Mondo Kim’s on St. Mark’s Place; the best drugs money can buy. But it’s not enough.

New York is no better than any burgeoning metropolis, and in many ways, it is far worse. Philadelphia, Boston, Athens, DC, San Diego, and Portland, from the congeniality of citizens to the cleanliness of the streets, are all much finer (and relatively cheaper) places to hang one’s mesh cap. Truth is, this grass is rarely greener, unless you’re a masochist who enjoys squandering daddy’s money on vastly overpriced apartments that look and smell like the kind of places the Misfits used to sing about.

Those who romanticize New York have never driven here. Or tried to park here. Or tried Christmas shopping, getting a job, or having a drink without having to take out a second mortgage here. When Joey Ramone sang “New York City really has it all,” he wasn’t talking about a Starbucks on every corner.

Jacks and Dianes of the world – set your trajectories elsewhere. You are being lied to.


roger adultery (roger adultery), Thursday, 26 February 2004 04:50 (twenty-two years ago)

don't spoil philly, rog! keep it a secret from the yuppie scum!!

Eisbär (llamasfur), Thursday, 26 February 2004 04:53 (twenty-two years ago)

rodger, hit me up off board about this topic. i am really interested on your take about the whole post colliegate thing and where the ideal setting would be for exploring the aspects of "big city life" coming from a rather non-cultered setting such as northern virginia. word.

brock (brock), Thursday, 26 February 2004 06:09 (twenty-two years ago)

I can't help you on NY, brock, but I can put a good word in for Providence. It's the kind of city that's slowly revealed and has a way of growing on you, especially if you've got a car at your disposal and can explore. It's cheap, dirty, and combined with Boston/Cambridge gets good music. Not sure if I could settle there long term, but it's just about right for a few years of school...

the krza (krza), Thursday, 26 February 2004 06:10 (twenty-two years ago)

I dunno James...I still like NYC...especially for the access to good shows (nearly everyone eventually plays here).
It's also nice knowing that if I were still invested in art and film, there are a lot of options.

I have a decent-paying job that doesn't drive me insane, and a relatively cheap (by NYC standards) apartment.
My neighborhood (Brooklyn Heights) is low-key and safe, and there's a good used book store right down the street.
I have an absurd amount of dining options in the immediate vicinity.

The two things I wish I had more of:
Space for projects/playing music
Good record stores
I don't even bother record shopping here.
Besides, there's always ebay/mailorder, and record shopping in other cities.
You just need to get out of the city often enough.

I like that I can put on a show with a bunch of bands that maybe got a few column inches in Blastitude (at best), and the room is packed.

There are plenty of opportunities here if you're willing to work a little harder.

Russ, Thursday, 26 February 2004 14:34 (twenty-two years ago)

I still love it here. I'm sorry it's lost its magic for you, roger. I love driving in NYC, I love trying to park here, I love CBGB, I love the Met, I love all the mania, and I will never stop loving it.

Jeanne Fury (Jeanne Fury), Thursday, 26 February 2004 14:42 (twenty-two years ago)

I really think that people find the city they want to find. More than 50% of the thrill of New York for me was walking around with the myth of New York in my head. I think this is why it's often starstruck immigrants who keep cities going. Think of the contribution to NY of two Lithuanians alone, Jonas Mekas and George Maciunas. They came to the city completely starstruck and contributed immeasurably to its legend by inventing Fluxus and Anthology Film Archive. It was, I suppose, a mixture of enchantment and disillusionment which made them do these things. Anyway, they did them in New York. I don't accept that yuppification makes parallel achievements impossible today. There are still shitty neighbourhoods waiting for artists. In fact, New York art has always had a down and dirty, people-loving quality precisely because the people making it had to live down and dirty, with the poor people, because the rest of the city was too expensive. You have to live that, and you have to love that. One way you cope is by keeping your head in the clouds, even when you're in the gutter.

Everything anyone says about their own experience of New York is going to be true, because it's a subjective truth and also self-fulfilling. If you believe bad things about the city, the city will look bad to you. But a better question to ask is 'What beliefs about New York can actually make it a better place to live? And who are the people currently holding those beliefs?'

Momus (Momus), Thursday, 26 February 2004 15:07 (twenty-two years ago)

I agree that Russ's apartment is awesome.

hstencil, Thursday, 26 February 2004 22:44 (twenty-two years ago)

Great post, Momus.

El Diablo Robotico (Nicole), Thursday, 26 February 2004 22:46 (twenty-two years ago)

Do not come to New York. K? Thankx.

ModJ (ModJ), Friday, 27 February 2004 03:07 (twenty-two years ago)

yeah, if you're an undergraduate looking for your first gig out of college, I'd advise moving to a city (there are some, y'know) with a lower unemployment rate because what you need is to find something and stick at it for a while. A lot of us with years of experience are still having trouble finding work in NYC (and I moved here with a job, thanks for asking) so I have no doubts that recent grads are not getting much either.

hstencil, Friday, 27 February 2004 04:12 (twenty-two years ago)

my quality of work life has gone up IMMEASURABLY since i started working in suburban NJ 6 months ago. i really don't think that i will go back to work in manhattan -- been there, done that, and it wasn't all that to begin with.

as i said on another thread, i will soon be moving back to central NJ for a year or so. i really doubt that i will move back to hudson county (the sixth borough, ha ha ha) -- it's nice to know people in nyc, blah blah blah. but it's also nice to cross the hudson and go home.

Eisbär (llamasfur), Friday, 27 February 2004 05:07 (twenty-two years ago)


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