The Native American Thread ("Dang Freeloaders...")

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This question was inspired by a few individual things

1. Jesse Ventura's inane statement that, if the U.S is going to keep it's old
treaties with the Indians, said Indians should revert to hunting in bark canoes.

2. Hyper-defensive apologies for American genocide in the "Who is the
nicest imperialist overlord" thread.

3. A constant undercurrent of anger/suspicion/distrust of the American Indian
population, by white Americans, especially in the western states. Maybe this
phenomenon does not scientifically exist, but anecdotally I have experienced it.
This negative feeling seems to center around the (percieved) fact that Indians are
poor, dumb, and alcoholic. And the fact that U.S government "waste" millions
supporting natives so they can sit at home with the whiskey bottle and watch
Howard Stern. Never mind the fact that these millions are a fractional and
half-hearted attempt to make good for centuries of lies, bad faith, and outright
slaughter.

4. There seems to be many conservatives who lazily lump Native American
issues into the pile of "wishy washy, politically correct" issues like saving
the wolves. Whereas, I think if they studied the issue, they'd realize that
it's a very old issue that has little to do with current fashionable politics.

So for you disgruntled whites (or anyone, really), here's your forum.
What are your opinions on U.S Indian Policy, or the Indian issue in
general.

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 April 2004 18:51 (twenty-two years ago)

This was a scary true-life observation:

I was at the Horseshoe Casino in Tunica, Mississippi, sitting at a blackjack table with a few others. I got in a conversation with this old trucker-looking guy. After a few minutes, he told me that he regularly drives from Oklahoma to Tunica just to play the tables.

I asked him why he 350 miles out of the way when there were casinos back home. He looked around and muttered underneath his breath, "Indians."

I turned my head and got my chips after the hand. The funny thing is that I could just as easily hear one of my uncles from the area say that they were driving to an Indian casino just to get away from the blacks.

"When was the last time you saw an Indian family having dinner at Red Lobster?"

Pleasant Plains (Pleasant Plains), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:01 (twenty-two years ago)

"The race it's still okay to be bigoted against!"

Dan I. (Dan I.), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:05 (twenty-two years ago)

http://www.sharpergraphics.com/Native%20Americans/CB-1102_I_Am_Wolf.jpg

"The .99 buffet is by the Keno room, paleface."

andy, Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:20 (twenty-two years ago)

I know it might be more on the politically corec side, but the whole sports mascot thing really drives me crazy. I went to a high school in Oklahoma where the mascot was Redskins. One of my friends dressed up in a ridiculous costume with feathers for football games. My girlfriend at the time was 1/2 Choktaw and never said anything about it, and I guess no one else did. But I think it is terrible.
The Cleveland Indians logo is just simply incredibly offensive. His name is Chief Wahoo!

Magic City (ano ano), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:31 (twenty-two years ago)

Seriously, the casual bigotry with which popular culture and your average american refer to Natives sickens me. It's the equiv. of the way african americans were always shown in the first half of the 20th cent. ("sho nuff", blackface, minstrel shows, golliwogs, etc.) and it's treated as totally acceptable.

Xpost: and yeah, that mascot thing! case in point!

Dan I. (Dan I.), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:35 (twenty-two years ago)

A lot of Natives around here have reappropriated Chief Wahoo. In Saskatchewan, at least, aboriginals are really on the move and are probably the best hope the future of this region has.

The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:39 (twenty-two years ago)

Wait, I thought they were called First-Nationers in Canada...

Lil' Wobbler, Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)

(I keep thinking that this thread is about me.)

VengaDan Perry (Dan Perry), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:40 (twenty-two years ago)

Natives, aboriginals, first nations, Indians, it totally depends on the situation. Often they identify themselves by band name even. You gotta keep on your toes.

The Huckle-Buck (Horace Mann), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:43 (twenty-two years ago)

Makes me wish I had an ethnic background with which to align myself.

I'm tired of, when it comes up, describing my heritage as, "uh... well scandanavian with a sprinkling of western european"

Lil' Wobbler, Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:47 (twenty-two years ago)

300 new answers by 8:00 PM

Curt1s St3ph3ns, Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:48 (twenty-two years ago)

(Ferfucksake nobody was apologizing for anything in that thread. try reading what people write, rather than what you think they 'really' mean.)

oops (Oops), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:49 (twenty-two years ago)

Search: Atom and His Package - If You Own the Washington Redskins, You're a Cock.

martin m. (mushrush), Thursday, 15 April 2004 19:55 (twenty-two years ago)

I am 1/128 Native American. My college offers completely free tuition to anyone who can prove their Native American ancestry. For some stupid reason I decided it was wrong for me to take advantage of this.

christhamrin (christhamrin), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:08 (twenty-two years ago)

The tribal casinos in Oklahoma are crap, though. They make Shreveport look like paradise.

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:15 (twenty-two years ago)

how are you going to prove being 1/128 native american? i'm sure you aren't registered in any tribe. I'm just under 1/2 and even I'm not registered with a tribe (I do, however, have a tribal "certificate of heritage" or something, so I guess I could go to UMN for free if I ever decided to give up on life).

My mother's entire family is Native American and she's from the reservation at Pine Ridge. None of us or anyone in her family has ever benefited greatly by their heritage or been given anything resembling a handout or a free pass in life. We don't know anyone making millions off of casinos. And even if some are, so fucking what? Heaven forbid some indians make some money!

anthony kyle monday (akmonday), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:17 (twenty-two years ago)

Dang's so vain.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:20 (twenty-two years ago)

Vaing, I mean.

Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:26 (twenty-two years ago)

Most benefits cut off at 1/4 or 1/8, I think. I'd wager that anyone more than a couple of generations deep in the south/southwest is 1/128. That means you only need one blood ancestor in the last, what, six generations?

miloauckerman (miloauckerman), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:28 (twenty-two years ago)

Yeah I realize its a joke, but there is no actual cut off at my school because it used to be a school for native americans and it has some kind of special charter or anything.

christhamrin (christhamrin), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:34 (twenty-two years ago)

well I would assume they'd want some proof. This charter also exists (or existed) at Dartmouth. And I almost went there until I realized it wouldn't be any fun at all.

anthony kyle monday (akmonday), Thursday, 15 April 2004 20:41 (twenty-two years ago)

>(Ferfucksake nobody was apologizing for anything in that thread.
>try reading what people write, rather than what you think
>they 'really' mean.)

See what I mean? Hyperdefensive! Why the jumpiness?

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:02 (twenty-two years ago)

I'm talking about stuff like this,

"Well, it's true that most of the natives were wiped out,
but it was mostly by disease!"

Llike that affects the argument
in any way, it's just an irrelevant deflecting mechanism

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:04 (twenty-two years ago)

gosh i love it when people accuse you of doing something you didn't do and then when you respond say "jeez why are you so defensive?"

but wait, i thought it was apologetic. surely an apology affects the argument.
whatever dude. yeah, I think how Native Americans were treated was perfectly okay and thank you for pointing out the error in my ways on this thread.

oops (Oops), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:09 (twenty-two years ago)

fwiw, i never said anything about diseases being the cause

oops (Oops), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:11 (twenty-two years ago)

sorry, i'm just sick of the witchhunt mentality that is prevalent on ILE

oops (Oops), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:11 (twenty-two years ago)

Shit, you got me oops. I meant to type "apologetics."
Please note, everyone.

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:12 (twenty-two years ago)

I wrote "hyper-defensive apologies for American genocide"
which is incorrect, since "apology" implies an admission of guilt.
"Apologetics" does not, it's trying to justify or excuse
behavior.

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:15 (twenty-two years ago)

can i ask you something? why do you think i would to try justify or excuse this particular behavior? white man's guilt?
another question: why do you choose to ignore me when I say I'm not attempting to excuse or justify this particular behavior? all I can figure is that you get some sort of satisfaction from thinking that there are people out there who aren't as enlightened as yourself.

oops (Oops), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:40 (twenty-two years ago)

yo do you two have any idea what you're talking about cause the rest of us don't.

Dan I. (Dan I.), Thursday, 15 April 2004 22:47 (twenty-two years ago)

Oops, I didn't specifically accuse you of anything. I made a
blanket statement about vague nobodies, and you got offended.
That seems strange to me.

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Thursday, 15 April 2004 23:59 (twenty-two years ago)

Anthony sez:
>My mother's entire family is Native American and she's from the
>reservation at Pine Ridge. None of us or anyone in her family has
>ever benefited greatly by their heritage or been given anything
>resembling a handout or a free pass in life. We don't know anyone
>making millions off of casinos.

Anthony, it is admirable that you have chosen to be self-sufficient.
But it is not akin to turning down a "handout" or "free pass,"
your choice is akin to turning down an inheritance. The "handouts"
are actually partial repayments for stolen property.

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Friday, 16 April 2004 00:03 (twenty-two years ago)

Often they identify themselves by band name even.

What, like Rush or Journey or Styx?

Skottie, Friday, 16 April 2004 00:19 (twenty-two years ago)

? and the Mysterians?

Curt1s St3ph3ns, Friday, 16 April 2004 00:20 (twenty-two years ago)

siouxsie and the banshees?
jamiroquai?

zappi (joni), Friday, 16 April 2004 00:35 (twenty-two years ago)

I encountered a drunken Indian on the bus today. He asked me to sit on his finger.

Pat Wornicke, Friday, 16 April 2004 00:47 (twenty-two years ago)

And what's with all these comedians mocking Indians for running
casinos? Don't white people own and operate casinos too?

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Friday, 16 April 2004 01:36 (twenty-two years ago)

Anyone know how many Indians there are in North America?

Charles Dexter (Holey), Friday, 16 April 2004 03:29 (twenty-two years ago)

In the 2000 census, 2.5 million self-identified exclusively as "American Indian" or "Alaska native," and more than 1.5 million identified as same in combination with one or more additional classifications. About 20% are Cherokee, and ~12% are Navajo. 30% live in five states - California, Oklahoma, Arizona, New Mexico and Texas.

gabbneb (gabbneb), Friday, 16 April 2004 03:41 (twenty-two years ago)


But it is not akin to turning down a "handout" or "free pass,"

I didn't say anything about turning anything down, I'm saying there aren't as many benefits to being Native American as some people would think. Well, we're Sioux, there is a lot of money that was given to the tribe and is sitting in an account, but the tribe won't accept it because they say they never put the Black Hills up for sale.

anthony kyle monday (akmonday), Friday, 16 April 2004 05:29 (twenty-two years ago)

That's true, anthony, although it's variable from tribe to tribe.
I remember reading that there's quite a bit of corruption and
graft affecting these things, as well.

Squirrel_Police (Squirrel_Police), Saturday, 17 April 2004 02:52 (twenty-two years ago)

Here's a series of articles about the reservation I'm from that were the biggest items on the front page of the Star Tribune yesterday and
today: http://www.startribune.com/leech/

I really feel frustrated with these articles. While most of the facts in them are true, I think they don't depict Leech Lake realistically (The whole "lock your doors at the stoplight in Cass Lake" thing is SO MUCH BULLSHIT, and Brenton Headbird was in my junior high school class, he was popular and well-balanced and I have never heard anything to indicate that he walked in front of the car intentionally). What good is telling the entire state unrepresentative horror stories about life on the reservation going to do?

Dan I. (Dan I.), Monday, 26 April 2004 21:49 (twenty-two years ago)

Actually maybe they weren't on the front page yesterday; I only saw the cover of today's paper.

Dan I. (Dan I.), Monday, 26 April 2004 21:50 (twenty-two years ago)

Fuck it, I don't know, maybe it is as bad as the articles say. It's not like I'd ever go through Tract 33 when I'm up there. It just seems like there's something so patronizing about them.

Dan I. (Dan I.), Monday, 26 April 2004 21:58 (twenty-two years ago)

You've JUST NOW noticed the dead, patronizing tone of the Strib? The whole paper is written as if unsure that the readers need remedial lessons or something.

suzy (suzy), Monday, 26 April 2004 22:05 (twenty-two years ago)

nine years pass...

http://stanmed.stanford.edu/2013fall/article9.html

In the emergency room of the Rosebud Indian Health Service Hospital, suicide attempts by drug overdose are seen nearly nightly. Alcohol-related car accident injuries fill many of the small hospital’s beds, competing for space with tuberculosis, pneumonia and liver and kidney failure. Diabetes is common, leading to loss of life and limb.

The physical complications of poverty, joblessness and epidemic rates of alcoholism, diabetes and depression spill over into the wards here at the only hospital on the Rosebud Reservation, which has a population of 13,000 and stretches across 1,970 square miles of South Dakota prairie. Life is short, violence high and health care lacking in Todd County, the second poorest county in the nation.

“There are three ‘spiritual’ paths here: Native Lakota, Christian or alcoholism,” says Rick Emery, a physician assistant here for the past 13 years. He’s hunkered down in command central, a small office in the ER, awaiting the arrival of an assault victim. It’s late March — spring break for the local schools. Drug- and alcohol-related cases are up. The staff morale, down.

“Bath salts, meth, Sudafed, anything that’s cheap,” Emery says. His hair is gray, his kind face weathered. “It’s worse when school’s out, when kids on the reservation have nothing to do. We get young people, 17, 18 years old, coming in with chest pains.” Sometimes they’re drug-induced, sometimes not. The night before, a 16-year-old came in with a severe anxiety attack. The night before that, a 25-year-old male who had hung himself arrived too late to save.

Cursed with some of the highest suicide rates in the country, tribal leaders declared a state of emergency here back in 2007 making headlines in The New York Times. But today, six years later, not much has changed. Across the United States, American Indian and Alaska Native youth ages 15 to 24 are still committing suicide at rates three times the national average of 13 per 100,000 people for their age group, according to the U.S. surgeon general. On the Great Plains, the suicide rate for Native Americans is 10 times the national average. Unemployment hovers at 80 percent, and the life expectancy of 46 years is one year shorter than Haiti’s — 33 shorter than the U.S. average.

Elvis Telecom, Tuesday, 5 November 2013 06:27 (twelve years ago)

two years pass...

village of whitesboro votes to keep emblem of white man choking a native american man

home organ, Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:14 (ten years ago)

what goes through your head when you cast that vote?

Cuombas (jim in glasgow), Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:26 (ten years ago)

The official emblems of towns and villages generally attract little attention. Often pastoral, they are generally gentle and unassuming. Not so the seal of the Village of Whitesboro, in central New York.

A white man appears to be throttling a Native American man — clearly identified by the feather in his hair — and wrestling him to the ground. The Native American, eyes closed and head cast back, is on the verge of defeat.

Forget microaggression. Critics say the image is aggression.

marcos, Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:36 (ten years ago)

"critics say the image is aggression"

marcos, Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:36 (ten years ago)

nice work nytimes

marcos, Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:36 (ten years ago)

it was just some friendly throttling

Οὖτις, Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:46 (ten years ago)

that story reads like the bully's version of why he and his nerd victim are actually friends now

Οὖτις, Thursday, 14 January 2016 17:47 (ten years ago)

that "critics say" construction in news stories is the worst

a little too mature to be cute (Aimless), Thursday, 14 January 2016 18:07 (ten years ago)

one year passes...

https://alaskaindigenous.wordpress.com/2017/01/21/federally-recognized-tribes-should-brace-for-possible-termination-policy-under-trump/

Whether we like it or not, Saglutupiaġataq (“the compulsive liar” in Iñupiatun) is now president of the United States and Republicans control Congress. Federally recognized Alaska Native and American Indian tribes should brace for the worst, including the possibility that Congress may move to terminate federally recognized tribes.

The termination era of 1953 to 1968 involved Congress stripping tribes of their lands and criminal jurisdiction. The policy was thinly disguised as an attempt to lift American Indians and Alaska Natives out of poverty by assimilating them into mainstream society. However the real goal was to privatize and ransack American Indian and Alaska Native lands.

j., Wednesday, 25 January 2017 17:55 (nine years ago)

http://www.sfgate.com/science/article/Plan-would-bring-majestic-California-condors-back-10883087.php

Οὖτις, Wednesday, 25 January 2017 17:58 (nine years ago)


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