For Star Wars Geeks, a question of symmetry...

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could you take someone, totally unknowledgable of star wars, sit them down and have them watch episodes one to six, and reasonably expect to have a fan afterwards?

of course the age of this person would be a big factor, but i cant help but feel that you must watch the movies 456-123 to truly enjoy and appreciate them.

― JD from CDepot, Friday, 20 May 2005 05:06 (twenty-one years ago)

yup, you'd have to go that way

― kingfish maximum overdrunk (Kingfish), Friday, 20 May 2005 05:57 (twenty-one years ago)

i can envisage kids watching 1-3 and then finding 4-6 lacking in terms of what's going to stimulate them more, and that's always been the fundamental flaw of doing the prequels so long after - they unequivocally undermine IV-VI just by existing at all, it's an inescapable compromise (Star Wars being the first big example of someone doing things 'backwards' in this way as far as I can recall).

― $V£N! (blueski), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:06 (twenty-one years ago)

Wasn't Indiana Jones backwards, not that it mattered for the sake of the plotlines. Didn't George say he was doing another one? Or was he ragging us?

― Ste (Fuzzy), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:10 (twenty-one years ago)

there's been a 4th indiana jones film on the cards for a long time -- too long, harrison ford could not do it now.

i think kids will like any old shit, so maybe 1-6 would work.

― N_RQ, Friday, 20 May 2005 09:15 (twenty-one years ago)

The second Indiana Jones takes place before the first, but the third one after the first.

Watching episodes 1-3 before 4-6 would totally ruin the "I am your father" twist in Empire Strikes Back.

― Tuomas (Tuomas), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:16 (twenty-one years ago)

and make the luke/leia 'thing' in IV even weirder.

― N_RQ, Friday, 20 May 2005 09:18 (twenty-one years ago)

ew yeah I forgot about that

― Ste (Fuzzy), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:21 (twenty-one years ago)

i think kids will like any old shit

Amen to that.

― Huey (Huey), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:25 (twenty-one years ago)

Adults like any old shit too. It's not kids buying that stuff at the top of the charts remember.

― $V£N! (blueski), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:30 (twenty-one years ago)

I haven't thought about this, before, but, yeah, I think it'd have to be 4-6 then 1-3.

― RJG (RJG), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:32 (twenty-one years ago)

Then it seems like everyone agrees that the whole idea of doing the prequels was fundamentally flawed from the beginning.

― $V£N! (blueski), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:44 (twenty-one years ago)

i don't think adults generally like any old shit the way kids do, although some adults continue to like the shit they liked as kids, thus distorting our picture (that's probably mean to star wars fans but hey-ho).

i don't think the idea of prequels was flawed from the beginning, but having george lucas write and direct was probably a bad idea.

― N_RQ, Friday, 20 May 2005 09:46 (twenty-one years ago)

I would strongly encourage people who've never seen any of them to watch them in order (1-6). There should be people out there who know what it is to have that experience and it would be interesting to see this alternative perspective.

― $V£N! (blueski), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:48 (twenty-one years ago)

Get one local-area-mind-eraser

― Ste (Fuzzy), Friday, 20 May 2005 09:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Damn, I thought this would be about maths and not sci fi geekery.

Symmetry! The Curies! Shimura curves! Yay!

― The Square Root Of Negative Two (kate), Friday, 20 May 2005 10:00 (twenty-one years ago)

katebot

― RJG (RJG), Friday, 20 May 2005 10:03 (twenty-one years ago)

Sssssshhhhhh! That's a secret between me and Johnney B!

― The Square Root Of Negative Two (kate), Friday, 20 May 2005 10:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Chronicles of narnia?

― , Saturday, 21 May 2005 07:16 (twenty-one years ago)

maybe they'd be fans if you MADE them sit through all of the movies, but i cant' reasonably expect anyone who doesn't have a prior stake in star wars sitting through eps 1 & 2 and actually wanting more...

― s1ocki (slutsky), Saturday, 21 May 2005 15:05 (twenty-one years ago)

Zoinks, What a dog!

...Still I struggle to figure out what’s so annoying about the movies. I loved the first one, after all. C.B. suggested the following as a way to understand the annoyance factor: George Lucas is like a kid who won’t grow up. He persists in playing a child’s game in a manner thoroughly inappropriate for an adult. Picture 60 year-old Lucas dressed in a Victorian-era schoolboy outfit. Short trews, knee socks, a sailor shirt, wide-brimmed hat with a ribbon. Lucas is throwing himself a birthday party. There will be clowns and pin-the-tail-on-the-Sith. Oh, and pony rides. With tiny, tiny, tiny ponies. So small that when the adult-sized George Lucas sits on the pony’s back, the animal’s spine actually snaps, killing the brute. George begins to cry. All the guests go home. Roll credits.

― EComplex (EComplex), Saturday, 21 May 2005 23:13 (twenty-one years ago)

Hahah.

I *have* been watching them in 1-6 order one a night here just to see how it works (with Thursday being 3 in theater, obv.) and it's been interesting to sense how my reactions are now keyed into essentially paying the most attention to Obi-Wan, Yoda and Darth V when I hit 4-6.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Saturday, 21 May 2005 23:36 (twenty-one years ago)

me to thread.

i haven't seen 4-6 yet. i'm going to when i watch 3.

― ken c (ken c), Saturday, 21 May 2005 23:59 (twenty-one years ago)

i kind of.. know how the story goes though

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 22 May 2005 00:03 (twenty-one years ago)

It's true, yes. The king returns.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 22 May 2005 00:28 (twenty-one years ago)

wow Ken, yours is a rare breed.

Saw it today, liked it. We saw an afternoon matinee, got there 30 mins. early and *still* had to sit on the front row. grr. that was suckage.

― Miss Misery (thatgirl), Sunday, 22 May 2005 00:29 (twenty-one years ago)

Was the beer good?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 22 May 2005 00:42 (twenty-one years ago)

mm, yes. also had artichoke heart pizza and stuffed jalapenos. yum.

while we sat and waited 30 minutes for the show the theater played various cheesy Star Wars related things such as cartoons and a COPS parody called "TROOPS" where storm troopers respond to a domestic disturbance call to the home of a certain farmer on Tattooine.

― Miss Misery (thatgirl), Sunday, 22 May 2005 00:53 (twenty-one years ago)

yeah i somehow managed to escape it all during childhood (i saw bits of it when it's on tv and all but it was all in english and back then i didn't understand much of it)

and then the whole like episode 1 thing came out and i just went along to see, and i wasn't that particularly interested in seeing the old ones and then 2 was out and i realised i should totally not watch any of the star wars old until i have seen 1-3.

― ken c (ken c), Sunday, 22 May 2005 01:03 (twenty-one years ago)

a COPS parody called "TROOPS"

Heh, yeah, this is the legendary fan film from 1997 or so done by a bunch of characters in their spare time. I think it was the one that really kickstarted the continuing craze for them because it was the first one I heard about being heavily downloaded and shared.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 22 May 2005 01:05 (twenty-one years ago)

I want to see the prequel to "Hardware Wars," surely needed now more than ever.

― Tracer Hand (tracerhand), Sunday, 22 May 2005 01:31 (twenty-one years ago)

You'll laugh, you'll cry, you'll kiss ten bucks goodbye...

― Kim (Kim), Sunday, 22 May 2005 02:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Pre-show Troops or Disco Lando would have rocked, instead we got 30 minutes of insane dog food and Red Bull ads.

― Rufus 3000 (Mr Noodles), Sunday, 22 May 2005 03:00 (twenty-one years ago)

My friend Sarah is going to try this too.

― caitlin (caitlin), Sunday, 22 May 2005 08:13 (twenty-one years ago)

i have come to the frightening realization that the only reason I liked these films in the first place is because i played with the toys a lot. The elements that _I_ imbued the characters with are, in my mind, far superior to what Lucas did.
Now that my banky is in the closet, I feel no need to continue going back to a dead well.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Sunday, 22 May 2005 23:45 (twenty-one years ago)

Thanks for illustrating my larger point on the other thread, Forksclove. I apologize on behalf on everyone who isn't as adult and reasonable and perfect as you.

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Sunday, 22 May 2005 23:49 (twenty-one years ago)

Ouch.
Ned, you're welcome to like whatever; why so defensive?

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Sunday, 22 May 2005 23:56 (twenty-one years ago)

I mean, f'rchrissakes, these are personal choices! What, I can't decide that these movies belong in my "I-liked-these-once-but-no-longer" without shitting on your enjoyment of em? C'mon!

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Sunday, 22 May 2005 23:57 (twenty-one years ago)

Besides which, am I actually arguing about Star Wars.... on the INTERNET?
Excuse me while I go kill myself.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Sunday, 22 May 2005 23:58 (twenty-one years ago)

Anyone is welcome to like or hate whatever, or indeed feel like they've moved on from something. That's the point of changing tastes. However, when couched in terms that make it seem that to like something or dislike it or to change your mind on it is a specific indication of 'maturity,' however conceived, then I grow suspicious. You're the one who brought up your 'banky,' m'friend.

Some things I still like from my youth, some things I don't. Am I the more mature for having changed my mind partially, or the less for having not completely?

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 23 May 2005 00:02 (twenty-one years ago)

It's less an issue of maturity and more an issue of being willing to put away the expectation. Fuck, I sleep on Superman and Empire Strikes pillowcases EVERY NIGHT. But I don't expect the movies to continue to resonate. I like the Rankin and Bass cartoons a lot too, but they're hella boring to watch.
As for maturity, it's overrated. All I'm saying is that I'm putting away THAT toy, as I put away my banky. Lord knows that any number of OTHER toys (from my childhood era or more recently) still litter my landscape.
I just remember the old parable about the man who saw a rabbit run by and bonk his head on a tree and when that provided him dinner, he sat there another twenty years waiting for it to happen again. THAT'S what I mean by "dead well", which is perhaps more meaningful than "banky" anyway.
My banky was black and white checkerboard. What was yours?

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Monday, 23 May 2005 03:58 (twenty-one years ago)

what the heck is a banky?

― s1ocki (slutsky), Monday, 23 May 2005 05:06 (twenty-one years ago)

A banky is a blue-matte steel semi-automatic 9mm 14 round pistol, with a high capacity magazine (plus 1 in chamber). Mine had a manual safety, but that's not always necessarily the case.

― Forksclovetofu (Forksclovetofu), Monday, 23 May 2005 05:44 (twenty-one years ago)

Cozy! (Mine was orange with a squirrel on it, I seem to recall.)

― Ned Raggett (Ned), Monday, 23 May 2005 05:46 (twenty-one years ago)

Adults like any old shit too. It's not kids buying that stuff at the top of the charts remember.

Steve, are you suggesting that the "stuff at the top of the charts" is "any old shit"???

I find your lack of faith in the pop disturbing...

― Spencer Chow (spencermfi), Monday, 23 May 2005 08:15 (twenty-one years ago)

it's not totally out of line to bring up 'maturity' if you base your conception of it on the content of the films. some stuff-that-we-liked-as-kids had something-we-can-preserve-in-adulthood because it has something you could call 'mature', maybe because it helped us become not-kids. i don't think 'star wars' is in that mold; and i think george lucas's conception of politics (and much more than politics) would shame a 9-year-old.

― N_RQ, Monday, 23 May 2005 08:21 (twenty-one years ago)

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