"I am become death, destroyer of worlds."

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Any particular reason this was worded this way? Is it like "I am (you) become death...?" What's the significance of "become" here?

http://www.freeanimations.iwarp.com/fartguy.gif

― Confused English Speaker, Friday, 12 August 2005 17:42 (twenty years ago)

http://images.amazon.com/images/P/0783225482.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

― fe zaffe (fezaffe), Friday, 12 August 2005 17:53 (twenty years ago)

http://stud.mdb.ku.dk/ged/fluffy_destroyer.jpg

― j.lu (j.lu), Friday, 12 August 2005 18:13 (twenty years ago)

Whose translation was it, and when?

My guess is that the original contained the sense of transition ("become"), but also contained a big present-tense "to be" -- such that "I am Death" didn't cover it, and "I have become Death" didn't quite get it either. Thus "I am become Death" -- something that, ha, our human English language doesn't quite accommodate, but which might be a perfectly natural approach to verb-actions for, you know, a Hindu deity.

― nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 12 August 2005 19:12 (twenty years ago)

Ha, wait, no: a little research seems to indicate that Oppenheimer read Sanskrit and just said it that way on his own. Normal translation would be "I am Death"; maybe he was just trying to squeeze in the sense of transformation that goes with it. Translation is hard.

― nabisco (nabisco), Friday, 12 August 2005 19:18 (twenty years ago)

http://www.poormojo.org/pmjadaily/archives/galactuscropped.jpg

― elmo (allocryptic), Friday, 12 August 2005 19:40 (twenty years ago)

In some archaic usage, when the main verb describes transition or movement, "to be" is the auxiliary verb. See also "Joy to the world, the Lord is come!"

― Paul Eater (eater), Friday, 12 August 2005 19:47 (twenty years ago)

and by auxiliary you mean...?

― Lazy Ignorant Man, Friday, 12 August 2005 19:54 (twenty years ago)

the Lord is come!"

I must remember this for my next orgasm.

― Jordan (Jordan), Friday, 12 August 2005 19:55 (twenty years ago)

(x-posts because I dawdled around researching this in far more detail than was actually necessary, faffed around trying to look it up in Fowler's under several possible headings, none of which existed, etc) It's an archaic form. I remember it being in the King James version of a few famous Biblical quotations which I'd guess Oppenheimer was also familiar with, if he didn't pick it up from an older translation, or a quick google brings it up as early as Chaucer and as late as Tennyson or Brontë (albeit a deliberately old-fashioned usage in at least the former case).

Thanks to the power of the internet being full of Bible studies sites I searched for it in the King James version and found that (according to the search tool I was using) "I am become" appears 8 times and "I have become" doesn't appear at all, so it would seem to have been the standard formulation. It happens with similar verbs too: "thou art waxen fat, thou art grown thick, thou art covered with fatness"; Part Chimp fans will be pleased to see "and I am come down to deliver them out of the hand of the Egyptians", and here is "all joy is darkened, the mirth of the land is gone".

Interesting that French still does this but the last few stragglers... wait, I was going to say "are gone from English" without even thinking about it! Well, there's one left for you, then. I may be the only one but I quite often say it that way.

I am not quite sure whether I am still on topic, even.

― Rebecca (reb), Friday, 12 August 2005 21:01 (twenty years ago)

(Wait, I suppose that isn't the same thing -- I mean with "gone" I'd use "be" and not "have" if the important thing is not the actual subject of the sentence and its movement but what they are/have gone *from* and their absence from it. But that really is just "to be" + an adjective which happens to be a past participle, and might not even be trying to be the perfect tense. I'm not making sense. Oh... I am become tedium, the killer of threads, right? Right. Goodnight.)

― Rebecca (reb), Friday, 12 August 2005 22:16 (twenty years ago)

I am become more confuse now.

― Confused English Speaker, Friday, 12 August 2005 22:26 (twenty years ago)

Rebecca, you should post much more often.

Italian has this usage too and I think also Russian?

Whaling report:
5 August 1786 "The Salamander, Ash, from Greenland, with eight fish, is arrived at Whitby. The Two Sisters, Banks, and Friendship, Ismay, with six fish each, and Freelove, Brown, with five ditto, from Davis Straits, are arrived at Whitby."

― Paul Eater (eater), Saturday, 13 August 2005 01:06 (twenty years ago)

Title: "Christ Is Risen"
Best for: Preschool

Sing this song to the tune of "Are You Sleeping?"

Christ is risen. Christ is risen.
Yes, he is. Yes, he is.
Risen for creation,
And for every nation.
Yes, he is. Yes, he is.

Christ went to heaven. Christ went to heaven.
Yes, he did. Yes, he did.
It was so amazing;
People stood there gazing.
Yes, they did. Yes, they did.

― Paul Eater (eater), Saturday, 13 August 2005 01:16 (twenty years ago)

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