'Pithy' and 'Glib'

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It's just struck me that, for all the time and effort that I put into learning to understand and to use new words in other languages, with lots of words that I just can't seem to understand and to use, there are lots of words in English that I hear people using, but don't understand and therefore don't use.

Two of them are 'pithy' and 'glib'.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:00 (twenty years ago)

To be pithy is a good thing, to be glib is not.

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:08 (twenty years ago)

That does help, but pithy always sounds kinda pejorative to me. Can anyone think of some examples of 'pithy' or 'glib' behaviour?

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:13 (twenty years ago)

is pithy supposed to be pronounced "pie-thy" or "pith-y"?

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:14 (twenty years ago)

This is turning into a right kettle of fish.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:14 (twenty years ago)

"pith-y"

Oscar Wilde = pithy
Jimmy Carr = glib

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:16 (twenty years ago)

Or possibly,

Winston Churchill = pithy
Tony Blair = glib

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:17 (twenty years ago)

Who's Jimmy Carr?

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:18 (twenty years ago)

Examples like that are very helpful btw.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:19 (twenty years ago)

Believe me, you don't wanna know!

This following definition of "glib" basically IS Tony Blair:

"Marked by ease and fluency of speech or writing that often suggests or stems from insincerity, superficiality, or deceitfulness."

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:20 (twenty years ago)

I thought pithy was bad.

― Cathy (Cathy), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:21 (twenty years ago)

"Marked by ease and fluency of speech or writing that often suggests or stems from insincerity, superficiality, or deceitfulness."

I thought there was something tongue-in-cheek and insensitive about it.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:21 (twenty years ago)

Actually, Churchill isn't really pithy because pithiness implies a certain economy of language and precision of delivery

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:21 (twenty years ago)

Pithy:

"Precisely meaningful; forceful and brief"

If you find forcefulness a problem (which a lot of people seem to these days) then you might have a problem with pithiness

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:23 (twenty years ago)

I thought pithy meant the opposite of that. I'm glad I've never said it now.

― Cathy (Cathy), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:24 (twenty years ago)

What's an example of somebody saying something pithy or glib?

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:25 (twenty years ago)

Plenty of examples of both on ILE!

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:27 (twenty years ago)

"Precisely meaningful; forceful and brief"

This reminds me of when people use my name when talking to me - 'the thing with you, Richard, is...' (quote my sister every now and then). Is that 'pithy'?

Actually I used to hate it when people did that, then I started to find it highly amusing and now occasionally do it myself for a semi-joke.

Oh shit, actually that's wacky.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:28 (twenty years ago)

It's more about encapsulating something in a few appropriate words

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:30 (twenty years ago)

pithy = abraham lincoln
glib = stephen douglas

― J.D. (Justyn Dillingham), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:31 (twenty years ago)

pithy = Jesus Christ
glib = the Mahirishi

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:32 (twenty years ago)

I've just thought of another one - sanguine. Absolutely no idea what it means. I've tried to learn it, but failed.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:32 (twenty years ago)

Resultados 1 - 10 de aproximadamente 3.540.000 de pithy. (0,05 segundos)

Resultados 1 - 10 de aproximadamente 6.400.000 de glib. (0,21 segundos)

Does that mean the world is more glib than pithy? Or just the internet?!?

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:35 (twenty years ago)

Both I fear

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:36 (twenty years ago)

"Laconic" used to confuse me, "taciturn" to a lesser extent. "Saturnine" still does.

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:38 (twenty years ago)

"Saturnine" sounds like it should be a good thing to be, but it isn't

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:39 (twenty years ago)

"taciturn" is just quiet and withdrawn, isn't it?

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:39 (twenty years ago)

... which is different to "laconic", which is what used to confuse me

― Vicious Cop Kills Gentle Fool (Dada), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:40 (twenty years ago)

I take laconic to mean self-contained and kind of witty.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 12:45 (twenty years ago)

Saturnine, like mercurial, comes from yr old astrological cobblers. They original implied being under the influence of their respective planets, but as we forgot the astrological implications the character associations remained. So: saturnine = gloomy, dull-spirited, taciturn; and mercurial = quick-witted, fickle.

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 13:06 (twenty years ago)

'clichy' and 'hleb'

― calderdale in the 70s (gareth), Saturday, 14 January 2006 18:08 (twenty years ago)

One connotation of "glib" would involve not taking the topic seriously -- something verging on "flip." Like a person being asked a very serious question who just throws back a joke, making himself look clever and demeaning the whole topic in the bargain. Other connotations of "glib" point toward a kind of smug, boyish demeanor -- like an insincere person who doesn't actually care about the insincerity. Like a brush-off devil-may-care thing where the person is being obviously insincere, but knows you can't do anything about it: imagine a politician who's been accused of something he totally did, but he just smiles at the cameras and says "oh, I'm not worried, I've done nothing wrong and nobody will ever prove that I did." Think of Tom DeLay's mug-shot smile. I guess the common thing here would be an air of self-satisfaction: the person is talking but doesn't really give a shit about back-and-forth communication or response.

"Pithy" just means well (and briefly) said. Which gets used two ways, mostly -- on the one hand for quips and zingers and perfect retorts, and on the other hand for really brief, effective arguments. A slogan, for instance, should be pithy: it should make a really presuasive point in as few words as possible, and in terms that are kind of charming and entertaining and easy to like.

― nabisco (nabisco), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:30 (twenty years ago)

Thanks very much for that. That's exactly what I thought 'glib' was like. I think my problem with 'pithy' is that I can't see it as anything other than negative.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:34 (twenty years ago)

I've never seen pithy used negatively. It's used as nabisco describes, and generally implies a compliment.

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:35 (twenty years ago)

Sure you're not thinking of "pissy"?

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:35 (twenty years ago)

I know what it means, it's just that to me it sounds and looks negative, and I can't bring myself to use it.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:37 (twenty years ago)

"Pithy" should be really positive, but people use it a lot as a back-handed compliment: "Well, I guess it's pithy."

Both of these make really good terms for, say, talking heads on cable-news debate shows. "Pithy" = sweet, in six words she just nailed that point. "Glib" = fuck you, you smug asshole, you're just happily spewing nice-sounding bullshit and avoiding the actual issue, and you don't even have any shame about it.

― nabisco (nabisco), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:38 (twenty years ago)

I often use the word 'facetious', but never 'glib'. That might change now.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:40 (twenty years ago)

Glib doesn't always imply a knowing superficiality, I don't think, so much as a kneejerk, unconsidered attitude.

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:42 (twenty years ago)

My gf told me that I use the phrase 'it's pure conjecture, but...' a hell of a lot, whereas I should just say (quote) 'I haven't got a fucking clue about what I'm about to talk about, but...'.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:42 (twenty years ago)

Whereas a glib motherhugger would just spout shit without admitting they hadn't got a clue.

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:47 (twenty years ago)

Yeah, that's true, Noodle -- it might actually be my personal knee-jerk to think that "kneejerk/unconsidered" also means "knowing superficiality!" (As if anyone who's being that kneejerk should know he's being lazy and non-thinking.)

― nabisco (nabisco), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:47 (twenty years ago)

Whereas a glib motherhugger would just spout shit without admitting they hadn't got a clue.

That makes me glib then!

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:49 (twenty years ago)

x post

I'm thinking of Blair and I can't work out whether he knows he's superficial or not.

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:50 (twenty years ago)

Nah, that "it's pure conjecture" is yr get-out clause. I don't think I've sounded certain about anything since I was, ooh, 30.

― Sinister Oink Kingpin (noodle vague), Saturday, 14 January 2006 22:51 (twenty years ago)

Word-wise, when in doubt, stick with your old buddies.

― Beth Parker (Beth Parker), Sunday, 15 January 2006 00:04 (twenty years ago)

Pithy: Evan Parker
Glib: Derek Bailey
Flip: Han Bennink

― truck-patch pixel farmer (my crop froze in the field) (Rock Hardy), Sunday, 15 January 2006 02:57 (twenty years ago)

I think Sinister Oink is right about glib - I've always seen it used where the person THINKS they're right on and being useful/insightful, but in fact are offering a facile argument, superficial analysis, etc. I once referred to Kate "Gender Outlaw" Bornstein as "glib" in a paper and got groused at by the professor... "Maybe one reason you find Bornstein 'glib' is that you see this glibness in yourself..." Man, I hated that teacher.

― Doctor Casino (Doctor Casino), Sunday, 15 January 2006 03:14 (twenty years ago)

So can anyone explain 'sanguine'? To me it sounds like someone has sallow blood.

― Gatinha (rwillmsen), Sunday, 15 January 2006 13:15 (twenty years ago)

san·guine (săng'gwĭn) pronunciation
adj.

1.
1. Of the color of blood; red.
2. Of a healthy reddish color; ruddy: a sanguine complexion.
2. Archaic.
1. Having blood as the dominant humor in terms of medieval physiology.
2. Having the temperament and ruddy complexion formerly thought to be characteristic of a person dominated by this humor; passionate.
3. Cheerfully confident; optimistic.

[Middle English, from Old French sanguin, from Latin sanguineus, from sanguis, sanguin-, blood.]

― theantmustdance (theantmustdance), Sunday, 15 January 2006 13:22 (twenty years ago)

Pithy and Glib. Sounds like a great comedy team, like Laurel and Hardy, Abbot and Costello...or maybe a great romance: Romeo and Juliet, and before there was Romeo and Juliet, there was Tristan and Isolde, and before THAT, was Pithy and Glib....

― pepektheassassin (pepektheassassin), Monday, 16 January 2006 00:52 (twenty years ago)

...and before that, was Precious and Goad

― Paranoid Kiwi, Sunday, 22 January 2006 02:10 (twenty years ago)

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