craftsmanship, consumerism, virtue, privilege, and quality

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Our texts for today:

http://thisismadebyhand.com/shoppe/
http://thisismadebyhand.com/film/the_knife_maker
http://cutbrooklyn.com/artwork/1711581_Available.html
http://www.bestmadeco.com/collections/axes

We all like to have nice things. Some people like to make very nice things in archaic ways. I'm not going to try to claim there is a "handmade movement", but there's definitely a cultural current of people wanting to buy stuff that is verifiably good and not just the best of the available options at Target for instance. It's hard to say that an enthusiastic craftsperson making kitchen knives by hand is somehow being evil by making cool stuff in a way that is economically viable for them, or that the people who buy the results can't do what they want with their money. But when he's selling one knife for six times as much as a block of kitchen knives costs at Target then you really have to question what exactly is going on here.

He's gotta be pricing his knives based on the value of his labor creating them, plus materials and whatnot. I certainly think $40 an hour is a fair rate to pay yourself for knife-making.

On the other hand, the resulting product, a $600 knife, seems pretty much like a Veblen good. Its use value has to be very close to even the $200 equivalent from Global, if we assume for the sake of argument that both are better knives than the $25 equivalent from Victorinox or the $10 equivalent from Ikea. Anyone who buys a knife from this guy either is spending a big part of their hobby budget on a knife they think is really excellent (maybe a few people) or…they've got cash and want something fancy and Handmade In Brooklyn By A Man With A Beard for its fetish value.

Something about this whole process is probably virtuous, and something about it is just conspicuous consumerism. And it all sort of feeds into the eternal quest of enthusiasts on the internet trying to figure out what thing is best. Running polls, seeking out trustworthy tastemakers, etc.

whoop, up the butt it goes (silby), Thursday, 3 November 2011 18:55 (six years ago) Permalink

I certainly think $40 an hour is a fair rate to pay yourself for knife-making

really

The Uncanny Frankie Valley (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, 3 November 2011 18:56 (six years ago) Permalink

craftsmanship, consumerism, virtue, privilege, and quality [Started by whoop, up the butt it goes (silby) in November 2011, last updated 1 minute ago]
Innocuous things that make you irrationally angry (a list thread) [Started by the great aussie ballkicking vids (jjjusten) in September 2010, last updated 2 minutes ago] 10 new answers

glorified version of appellate court (get bent), Thursday, 3 November 2011 18:56 (six years ago) Permalink

xp considering programming contractors bill their time at $75-$100 an hour or more $40 seems fairly reserved. Plus the guy obviously has rent, fixed costs, etc.

whoop, up the butt it goes (silby), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:00 (six years ago) Permalink

so yeah maybe the guy could be pricing his labor at $18-$20 and selling the knives for cheaper but I don't think "how much do people deserve to get paid for their labor for doing one thing vs some other thing" is a focus here?

The "$40 an hour" thing by the way was inferred from $600 knives / 15 hours of work = $40 an hour, assuming materials costs are negligible.

whoop, up the butt it goes (silby), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:03 (six years ago) Permalink

Materials, tools, rent also factor into the cost of that knife, and whatever it cost him in time and materials to learn the skill in the first place, he's probably really only paying himself $20/hr.

Tied into this is also a sense of satisfaction at supporting craftsmen - I'm wearing a pair of jeans right now that cost more than $200. I can justify it (in my mind) because they're the only jeans I wear, the materials and construction are of higher quality than basic Levi's, and they're made by one guy in a loft in the bay area (Roy's Jeans). Objectively, it's an absurd amount to spend on jeans, but I appreciate the craftsmanship and that I'm supporting someone making them on his own rather than feeding $50 to a corporation that uses sweatshop (or near-sweatshop) labor.

Kiarostami bag (milo z), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:28 (six years ago) Permalink

The ability of machines to mass-produce items, which in turn cost less because of economies of scale, is not something I have a problem with. It is the steady flow of profits away from under-compensated labor toward over-compensated capital that seems to me like the essential problem to address. That and overconsumption in general.

Aimless, Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:29 (six years ago) Permalink

let me use your shit and you can use mine

puff puff post (uh oh I'm having a fantasy), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:31 (six years ago) Permalink

one one hand, yeah i think 'fetish' is a very good word to use in terms of what's happening from the consumer side here, it's inarguably luxury for the sake of luxury

Otoh, paying living wage to local craftspeople for good product isn't a bad thing, i guess. Haven't ever heard of any millionaire 'dude who makes knives in a workshop' types.

blind pele (darraghmac), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:34 (six years ago) Permalink

there's a real arrogance to the new breed of millenial craftsman, i.e. the kids who went to college in the '90s and '00s and then realized they liked doing manual work that was, by their standards, "below" them. To justify their own egos and intellectual pretentions they take to correspondingly hiking the prices/ramping up the cultural "worth" /finessing the language in their copy to include shit like "artisan-made" and "uniquely sourced and crafted" so that they feel their middle-class prejudices being satiated while they're doing work that would otherwise be, you know, plain old labor.

(and I don't buy for a second that the high cost of labor is due to some benevolent workers' solidarity with their underpaid brethren)

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:43 (six years ago) Permalink

darraghmac on the mark ^

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:43 (six years ago) Permalink

There's certainly a handmade movement. Wallpaper is fixated with it. It reflects a cultural shift in the way wealth is spent. It's considered a little vulgar or, at best, impractical to want the most stuff or the biggest stuff, people with money to throw around want something unique - something with its own instant 'heritage'.

I think there's also an element of the 'shop class as soulcraft' idea, in a strange way. People like the idea of working with their hands, creating something beautiful from raw materials - a counterpoint to people shifting numbers between Frankfurt and Zurich, making millions of intangible dollars. Even if it's the latter group with the cash to pay for it, but not the time or skill to do it themselves, an element of the romance remains.

I can't really see a moral problem with people spending £30,000 on a couture Chanel dress, tbh, given the number of people involved in making one and the number of dying crafts the company keeps alive. It's a needless luxury but it's not the worst needless luxury out there.

Mohombi Khush Hua (ShariVari), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:01 (six years ago) Permalink

there's a real arrogance to the new breed of millenial craftsman, i.e. the kids who went to college in the '90s and '00s and then realized they liked doing manual work that was, by their standards, "below" them. To justify their own egos and intellectual pretentions they take to correspondingly hiking the prices/ramping up the cultural "worth" /finessing the language in their copy to include shit like "artisan-made" and "uniquely sourced and crafted" so that they feel their middle-class prejudices being satiated while they're doing work that would otherwise be, you know, plain old labor.

(and I don't buy for a second that the high cost of labor is due to some benevolent workers' solidarity with their underpaid brethren)

― turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, November 3, 2011 12:43 PM (35 minutes ago) Bookmark

this kind of bald-faced self-serving projection is 100x more arrogant and prudish than any of the "new breed" of "millennial craftsmen" i've met or known.

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:29 (six years ago) Permalink

making something yourself and selling it, as your livelihood, and trying to be good/get better at it, is such a weird proposition in today's market that some kind of authenticity branding is kind of unavoidable, no?

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:36 (six years ago) Permalink

not talking about domino's obviously

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:36 (six years ago) Permalink

artisan means square in that context

mark s, Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:43 (six years ago) Permalink

Matt, I don't give half a shit whether you agree with me or not, but why don't you do it without the ad hominems?

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:44 (six years ago) Permalink

also: chunky xp

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:46 (six years ago) Permalink

tbf your entire post is basically an ad hominem

J0rdan S., Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:46 (six years ago) Permalink

I would categorize remy's post more as an appeal to emotion and prejudice.

Aimless, Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:50 (six years ago) Permalink

first of all, you're kinda being dicks.

second of all, i'm dyspeptic after paying $14 for a shitty plate of vertically-arranged eggs crafted by an "artisanal cafe" started by trust fund brats that took out the breakfast place where i used to buy excellent burritos for $5.50 and included a side of dirty rice so this is probably feeding into it

third, eh, fuck it

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:55 (six years ago) Permalink

occupy burritos

Mr. Que, Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:56 (six years ago) Permalink

remy, not sure where the ad hominem is, unless it's taking a guess at why someone would write that kind of boilerplate horseshit.

xp yeah, sorry, that sucks?

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:56 (six years ago) Permalink

occupy burritos

― Mr. Que, Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:56 (40 seconds ago) Bookmark

^^

Abattoir Educator / Slaughterman (schlump), Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:57 (six years ago) Permalink

probably the most vile part of this trend is the tacit assumption that the guys making those global knives (or any high-quality product made by a skilled craftsman) are not putting equal or greater amounts of skill, effort, and passion into the things they're making.

call all destroyer, Thursday, 3 November 2011 20:59 (six years ago) Permalink

remy what's the new place called?

call all destroyer, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:00 (six years ago) Permalink

The ability of machines to mass-produce items, which in turn cost less because of economies of scale, is not something I have a problem with. It is the steady flow of profits away from under-compensated labor toward over-compensated capital that seems to me like the essential problem to address. That and overconsumption in general.

― Aimless, Thursday, 3 November 2011 19:29 (1 hour ago)

otm!

iatee, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:01 (six years ago) Permalink

i'm writing off the cuff here, but in my experience a lot of the current iteration of 'craftsmanship culture' i.e. 'dudes who have a hobby making shit' gets elevated all out of proportion into 'artistry' that shortchanges long-time practitioners and career creators of that same ("mass-produced") items. maybe i'm thinking narrowly (though not – sorry – appealing to prejudice or bald-faced self-serving) but in the case of my uncle the snobby pro-'artisanal' attitude cost a good and devoted laborer his job.

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:04 (six years ago) Permalink

In other words, I guess I agree with CAD.

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:05 (six years ago) Permalink

there's a real arrogance to the new breed of millenial craftsman, i.e. the kids who went to college in the '90s and '00s and then realized they liked doing manual work that was, by their standards, "below" them. To justify their own egos and intellectual pretentions they take to correspondingly hiking the prices/ramping up the cultural "worth" /finessing the language in their copy to include shit like "artisan-made" and "uniquely sourced and crafted" so that they feel their middle-class prejudices being satiated while they're doing work that would otherwise be, you know, plain old labor.

(and I don't buy for a second that the high cost of labor is due to some benevolent workers' solidarity with their underpaid brethren)

it goes beyond 'justifying their own egos and intellectual pretentions' - if you can sell shit for more money by marketing it differently, *that is a good idea*. this happens in basically every market for everything!

iatee, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:06 (six years ago) Permalink

otm

Mr. Que, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:07 (six years ago) Permalink

how about when the product is bank accounts, iatee?

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:08 (six years ago) Permalink

this is really easy to run into if you buy liquor these days--microdistilleries are popping up all over the place and using words like "local" "artisinal" and "craft" and they pretty much ignore some basic facts of the beverage alcohol industry (liquor branch in particular), such as 1) distilling is really hard; 2) once you can do it it's really easy to do large-scale; 3) market competition and consumer choice have resulted in an environment where 95% of midshelf and higher products are quite high-quality.

the response of microdistillers is to give something "unique" (i.e. a gin that can't be used in martinis) or to essentially just put something out there and provide no reason for drinking it beyond who/how/where it was produced (i.e. the glut of awful, pointless "white whiskies" that you can get now).

call all destroyer, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:11 (six years ago) Permalink

i'm writing off the cuff here, but in my experience a lot of the current iteration of 'craftsmanship culture' i.e. 'dudes who have a hobby making shit' gets elevated all out of proportion into 'artistry' that shortchanges long-time practitioners and career creators of that same ("mass-produced") items. maybe i'm thinking narrowly (though not – sorry – appealing to prejudice or bald-faced self-serving) but in the case of my uncle the snobby pro-'artisanal' attitude cost a good and devoted laborer his job.

― turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, November 3, 2011 2:04 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah, i can see how the appeal to "artistry" is arrogant, especially when there are so many other people who make and sell the same kind of thing in a factory and do a good job and don't loudly claim to be "artists" and probably aren't white. agreed that mass-produced <> "lovingly crafted" etc. xp

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:16 (six years ago) Permalink

it goes beyond 'justifying their own egos and intellectual pretentions' - if you can sell shit for more money by marketing it differently, *that is a good idea*. this happens in basically every market for everything!

― iatee, Thursday, November 3, 2011 2:06 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark

yeah, i mean, that's where things get complicated imo

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:17 (six years ago) Permalink

the Global website has just this one photo of dudes grinding knives

http://www.global-knife.com/global/img/photo_04.jpg

whoop, up the butt it goes (silby), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:19 (six years ago) Permalink

if he had a beard maybe he would be ok to work out of brooklyn instead of japan

call all destroyer, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:20 (six years ago) Permalink

i guess i think there should be a distinction made b/w stuff that "appeals to artistry" in a way that is kinda slimy and stuff that is actually "artisan" by definition. and if ppl wanna pay $600 or for an actual artisan knife i guess that's their prerogative?

J0rdan S., Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:20 (six years ago) Permalink

competition in the market for personal bank accounts is a great idea and the fact that large banks don't seem to want to offer a competitive price (free) anymore is why people are switching to alternatives. xp

overall if someone is consuming less cause they're spending more money on fewer things, I'm totally cool w/ artisan stuff. if it's just creating more needless consumption opportunities otoh, there's a good argument against it.

regardless of 'higher quality' (true sometimes, bullshit sometimes) this trend has to be looked as primarily as marketing. you know what else has marketing behind it? all the cheap crap in the world.

anyway I find this interesting but am getting on a train. surely will be 500 posts while I'm gone.

iatee, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:21 (six years ago) Permalink

xp what is artisan by definition?

call all destroyer, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:21 (six years ago) Permalink

Many of the best chefs in the world use knives costing 1/2 - 1/3 as much as those in the OP, made by folks whose family/ancestors have been in the "artisinal" "knife"-making business for centuries.

Global is not very "artisinal" fwiw, it's a fairly large manufacturer.

citation needed (Steve Shasta), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:22 (six years ago) Permalink

thanks for this thread, this is a subject i've been mulling over a lot lately. *mulls*

elmo argonaut, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:23 (six years ago) Permalink

also, making one particular thing is like 95% tedious and brutal anyway, it's not like someone making knives in their warehouse is going to know something ^those guys don't. factories improve quality control for products like that big-time. xposts

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:26 (six years ago) Permalink

(it's only on ilx that i remember what a socialist i am, at heart)

true story:

my Uncle J spends 30 years making a niche product so successfully that it becomes ubiquitous in his corner of the [classical music] industry. Uncle J charges a very reasonable fee to make a custom, one-of-a-kind [widget], and takes on an apprentice who studies with him for six months. apprentice comes to my Uncle, and says he wants to become a partner –– AFTER SIX MONTHS –– because he's learned everything Uncle J. has to show him about making very complicated [widgets]. Uncle J. says no, not yet, and apprentice informs J. he'll be quitting if he can't make more $$$; what he feels is fair compensation. Uncle J. asks what fair compensation is, and the kid lists a price that is easily three times what Uncle J., himself, makes. Uncle J. is already paying the new kid a pretty top-shelf salary (middle five figures) roughly equal to 4/5 of J.'s own salary, in an industry that is flagging in this recession. Uncle J's apprentice quits and a few weeks later opens up a business at the other end of town where he charges many many times more than Uncle J. for the [vastly inferior, vastly less-experienced version of the highly technical widget –– now made with recycled! metal!]. Uncle J. loses all of his clients, who (are carefully seduced by the former apprentice to) feel that his product is inferior and less "ethical", because Uncle J.'s his experience and craftsmanship and desire to be reasonable are trumped by the geewhiz factor of a kid who slightly alters a half-stolen design and stamps ARTISANAL and HANDCRAFTED over a product that has always - obviously - been artisanal and handcrafted. Reducing my (inchoate) argument to a nut, I find it reedikerus that 'artisianal' and 'craftsmanship' are currently applicable to anything that, say, a 23-year-old has done for less than a few years.

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:26 (six years ago) Permalink

I don't think I thought that Global was particularly artisanal, just their knives are more expensive than and probably better than random stamped piece of crap knives from Target. So from a purely use-value perspective ("I want an objectively good knife and will pay more for quality because this matters to me") they are competitors. xps

whoop, up the butt it goes (silby), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:27 (six years ago) Permalink

obv. i know this is not a generalizable anecdote, but it's illustrative of the attitude that bothers me

turkey in the straw (x2) (remy bean), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:28 (six years ago) Permalink

yeah that kid sounds like a massive tool

whoop, up the butt it goes (silby), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:29 (six years ago) Permalink

The customer is always right, even when the customer is a flagrant idiot.

Aimless, Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:30 (six years ago) Permalink

ha i finally looked at the links in the original post and pretty much had the same reaction tbh xxp

ah, how quaint (Matt P), Thursday, 3 November 2011 21:31 (six years ago) Permalink

I reluctantly am willing to accept everyone is actually this horrible

mh, Tuesday, 27 March 2018 20:57 (four months ago) Permalink

It's a lifehack! Ask for free stuff all the time!

Yerac, Tuesday, 27 March 2018 20:58 (four months ago) Permalink

the only risk is to your own reputation! and possible legal action for harassment!

mh, Tuesday, 27 March 2018 21:09 (four months ago) Permalink

anyone up in here want to hook me up with some free coffee

mh, Tuesday, 27 March 2018 21:09 (four months ago) Permalink

thats either an obvious troll or a fake. no way you anyone continue to respond after the first f bomb

Hazy Maze Cave (Adam Bruneau), Tuesday, 27 March 2018 21:21 (four months ago) Permalink

I mean some of these people feeling entitled to free stuff or drastically reduced costs are obviously teenagers but some of these are so abusive, negging, gaslighting...the usual shit some men do.

Yerac, Tuesday, 27 March 2018 22:00 (four months ago) Permalink

I would respond because it's fascinating and f bombs don't disturb me.

Yerac, Tuesday, 27 March 2018 22:02 (four months ago) Permalink

two weeks pass...

What’s Cooking in That Egg Spoon? A Bite-Size Culture War

https://nyti.ms/2pGkWjc

On one side were those who viewed cooking an egg over a fire as the embodiment of food elitism and all that is annoying about the Slow Food movement. Only people who are very rich or very poor have fireplaces in their kitchens, critics said. Where is a working parent supposed to find the time?

In the opposing camp were people happy to discover a slow, delicious way to make those farm eggs that they had worked so hard to find. Even if the egg spoon was merely aspirational, it set the bar for a simpler way of cooking and eating — one in which a fire-roasted egg slipped onto levain toast seemed the antidote to an unthinking, tech-dominated culture fueled by unhealthy, overly processed food.

The egg spoon became a mark of insider status and a tool of seduction.

...

Kat Kinsman, the senior food and drinks editor of the website Extra Crispy, devoted a column to what she saw as the inherent sexism in the egg-spoon attacks. If Francis Mallmann, the subject of a recent Esquire profile titled “Is Francis Mallmann the Most Interesting Chef in the World?,” had cooked an egg with a spoon instead of roasting a lamb on a wooden cross near blazing wood, he’d be a hero, she wrote. (Ms. Waters, incidentally, has given Mr. Mallmann one of her own beloved egg spoons.)

The new round of criticism also struck a nerve with Samin Nosrat, a cookbook author and New York Times Magazine columnist. Cooking an egg in an iron spoon over open fire is really no more precious and probably a lot less elitist than cooking an egg in $300 sous-vide machine, she said in a recent interview — except that women tend to do the former and men the latter.

fleetwood machiavellian (Ye Mad Puffin), Monday, 16 April 2018 17:01 (four months ago) Permalink

If holding an egg in a spoon over a fire is "simpler" than frying or soft-boiling it then it would be even simpler to omit the spoon and hold it in your fingers.

A is for (Aimless), Monday, 16 April 2018 17:12 (four months ago) Permalink

or just eat the egg raw with boiling water chaser

DACA Flocka Flame (Hadrian VIII), Monday, 16 April 2018 17:15 (four months ago) Permalink

an egg spoon is a spoon for eating boiled eggs. this is a wee iron frying pan surely

Louis Jägermeister (jim in vancouver), Monday, 16 April 2018 17:16 (four months ago) Permalink

I have thought about this a lot and agree that "simpler" is an indefensible word choice here.

It would have been slightly more defensible to say something along the lines of rugged/primitive/elemental, back-to-basics, back-to-nature, rather than "simpler." No, of course it's not simpler than just tossing an egg around in a nonstick Calphalon over gas.

One COULD make an argument following Thoreau, who proposed a race of some distance between him walking, and someone else taking the train. Because the man who takes the train needs to work all day to earn the train fare, whereas the walker can set out immediately. But that would be bullshit, because everyone involved in the conversation clearly ALSO has a normal stove and normal skillets. It IS about the perceived coolness of the endeavor.

And on that ground, no, the egg spoon is no more precious than spatchcocking with hand-forged swords, or making your own yeast, or making broth from scavenged squirrel bones, or sous-viding your morning oatmeal, or hand-hewing your own shad planks, or raising your personal flock of civet cats to process your coffee beans, or whatever other shit some hipster gourmand recommends.

fleetwood machiavellian (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 18 April 2018 14:48 (three months ago) Permalink

If I had a fireplace, wood burning stove in my house I would totally make my eggs in it. In my mind it seems more efficient and tastier.

Yerac, Wednesday, 18 April 2018 14:53 (three months ago) Permalink

Activate those almonds, brother.

I'm Finn thanks, don't mention it (fionnland), Wednesday, 18 April 2018 14:55 (three months ago) Permalink

A sous vide circulator is less than $100 now, that's a pretty bad comparison to a $250 Kinfolk-approved spoon (which is pretty much the entire controversy I've seen).

louise ck (milo z), Wednesday, 18 April 2018 14:55 (three months ago) Permalink

Every time we grill (not often) I just look for random things in the kitchen to cook over a fire. I am going to try eggs now.

Yerac, Wednesday, 18 April 2018 14:57 (three months ago) Permalink

If I already have a wood fire going for other reasons, I love to cook things in/on it. I am unlikely to build a roaring fire just to fry an egg, though. Just my own personal line in the sand; other may vary.

fleetwood machiavellian (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 18 April 2018 15:17 (three months ago) Permalink

(i vaguely know KK from that article, she took me up the empire state building once. or was it too foggy? it was 1997)

koogs, Wednesday, 18 April 2018 15:38 (three months ago) Permalink

I don't know why people feel the need to make this an either/or issue. It's easy enough to wake up a couple hours early and make four spoon-frizzled eggs AND half a dozen 62.5°C sous-vide eggs. The kids love to have one of each before they leave for school!

mick signals, Wednesday, 18 April 2018 16:18 (three months ago) Permalink

Truth. And if you have your own laying hens (as I presume most of us do), so convenient!

fleetwood machiavellian (Ye Mad Puffin), Wednesday, 18 April 2018 17:34 (three months ago) Permalink

slow-poached Masai ostrich egg or gtfo

DACA Flocka Flame (Hadrian VIII), Wednesday, 18 April 2018 18:25 (three months ago) Permalink

I feel like the fact that this exists means the revolution is overdue:

https://www.goldbely.com/about

posted here because it's such an absurd contradiction, enjoy all that special local small-business foodcraft by having it shipped across the country by a silicon valley startup using outrageously expensive means only within reach of the top .01%.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:10 (three months ago) Permalink

https://www.goldbely.com/louie-mueller-barbecue/legendary-beef-brisket

fuuuuuuuuck you

louise ck (milo z), Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:12 (three months ago) Permalink

i was ok with it until i scrolled down to the "the team" section

na (NA), Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:12 (three months ago) Permalink

Haha, yes, ship that fresh-off-the-grill bacon wrapped hot dog from Los Angeles to Maine!

nickn, Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:13 (three months ago) Permalink

https://www.goldbely.com/buona-italian-beef/italian-beef-sandwich-kit-8-pack

$14/each for sandwiches that are $5 each, and you still have to make them yourself. Is it really that hard to find a decent beef sandwich where you live? Or you just HAVE to have THAT beef sandwich, because you're such a special person.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:23 (three months ago) Permalink

Ora King is a brand of farmed salmon raised in New Zealand. It tastes good. You can get a raw vacuum-packed fillet of it in the US for about $20/lb0/lb, or a raw artisanally vacuum-packed fillet of it shipped from NZ via Honolulu by Goldbely for https://www.goldbely.com/honolulu-fish-company/17505-ora-king-salmon75.

mick signals, Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:42 (three months ago) Permalink

Well, that link didn't work, did it. $175.00. One fillet of raw farmed fish. https://www.goldbely.com/honolulu-fish-company/17505-ora-king-salmon

mick signals, Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:43 (three months ago) Permalink

I grew up on this, the real Sloppy Joe, still a regular at any shiva in Essex County.

https://www.goldbely.com/town-hall-deli

seem to be well "curated", good to use the site as a road trip guide and skip the shipping fees.

dan selzer, Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:46 (three months ago) Permalink

https://pantograph0.goldbely.com/s820/uploads/product_image/image/1909/naked-dog-fifty.f6d4a2cff5a51adabab42c242ed7dfc3.jpg

65 bucks. Buns, mustard etc not included.

mick signals, Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:52 (three months ago) Permalink

Ora King is a brand of farmed salmon raised in New Zealand. It tastes good. You can get a raw vacuum-packed fillet of it in the US for about $20/lb0/lb, or a raw artisanally vacuum-packed fillet of it shipped from NZ via Honolulu by Goldbely for https://www.goldbely.com/honolulu-fish-company/17505-ora-king-salmon75.

― mick signals, Thursday, April 19, 2018 3:42 PM (ten minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Well, that link didn't work, did it. $175.00. One fillet of raw farmed fish. https://www.goldbely.com/honolulu-fish-company/17505-ora-king-salmon

― mick signals, Thursday, April 19, 2018 3:43 PM (nine minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

This is very similar to the fact that they sell Table 87 pizza, which is already available in supermarkets, in the same packaging in which you get it in supermarkets. You can also get it from online grocery sites, e.g. right now Jet has the 10" pizza for $10. However, if you prefer, you can pay $10/slice for goldbely to send it to you.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:58 (three months ago) Permalink

or I guess for more accurate comparison, $20 per ten inch pie:
https://www.goldbely.com/table-87/17408-coal-oven-margherita-pizza-pie-4-pack

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 20:59 (three months ago) Permalink

I live in New York but I had never heard of this famous Table 87 Pizza. So I had to look it up. Apparently its claim to fame is selling pizza cooked in a coal oven, by the slice. Both of which are obviated if you have to buy an entire pie by mail-order and cook it in your home oven.

This is turning me right now into the curmudgeon I did not intend to become for at least another 5-7 years. I am going to close my laptop. And maybe toss it into the bathtub.

mick signals, Thursday, 19 April 2018 21:58 (three months ago) Permalink

I actually did know Table 87 because I used to walk past it, but I never thought of it as a "famous" place (like Lucali, DiFara, etc.). And then I saw it on Shark Tank, when they launched this freeze-wrapped pizza idea. Which I guess is alright, but like I said, you can already order the exact same product online for literally half the price. And even at that price it seems a little expensive.

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 22:08 (three months ago) Permalink

Ess-a-Bagels, nearly $5/bagel
https://www.goldbely.com/ess-a-bagel/17232-ny-bagels-13-pack

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 22:11 (three months ago) Permalink

looooool NJ Taylor Ham at $20/lb
https://www.goldbely.com/taylor-ham/15423-taylor-ham-pork-roll-3-lb-roll

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Thursday, 19 April 2018 22:15 (three months ago) Permalink

And now I am researching Table 87. because I had never heard of it either. It definitely has never been talked about in the same breath as even the newer places (Motorino, Roberta's). But I guess they got lucky.

Yerac, Thursday, 19 April 2018 22:22 (three months ago) Permalink

If some careless moron can't spell and goes to "goldbelly.com" by mistake, not to worry, it redirects straight to goldbely.com.

mick signals, Friday, 20 April 2018 16:54 (three months ago) Permalink

due to looking at goldbely i'm getting their ads on facebook. Feat. LCD Soundsystem.

dan selzer, Friday, 20 April 2018 18:22 (three months ago) Permalink

appropriately artisanal

as god is my waitress (Ye Mad Puffin), Friday, 20 April 2018 19:35 (three months ago) Permalink

https://www.superdenim.com/us/freedom-sleeve-sweatshirt-oatmeal.html/

Description
A crew-neck sweatshirt made in Wakayama, Japan, of 100% cotton on vintage loop wheel machines, which are known to weave a sluggish pace, with only a single meter of fabric produced every hour. When compared to contemporary manufacturing methods, Loopwheel machines apply a very low thread tension allowing the production of an exceedingly premium and unique fabric.

Lol. "This is good because it is made inefficiently."

Fedora Dostoyevsky (man alive), Wednesday, 2 May 2018 21:58 (three months ago) Permalink

exceedingly premium

Larry Elleison (rogermexico.), Wednesday, 2 May 2018 22:14 (three months ago) Permalink

made on the very machines that authentic, virtuous high-quality craftspeople would have smashed to pieces in protest at the destruction of their way of life

noel gallaghah's high flying burbbhrbhbbhbburbbb (Doctor Casino), Wednesday, 2 May 2018 22:28 (three months ago) Permalink

xp you left out the important part man alive

A crew-neck sweatshirt made in Wakayama, Japan, of 100% cotton on vintage loop wheel machines, which are known to weave a sluggish pace, with only a single meter of fabric produced every hour. When compared to contemporary manufacturing methods, Loopwheel machines apply a very low thread tension allowing the production of an exceedingly premium and unique fabric. The resulting material feels like it has been hand woven, with a stretchy element to it, a quality that cannot be replicated by modern production techniques. The crucial difference is that Loopwheel fabric is knit in an oval shaped sequence to yield a fabric that will comfortably stretch with wear, but will return to its original dimensions with a wash.

the late great, Wednesday, 2 May 2018 22:36 (three months ago) Permalink

you may not agree that a marginal cost is worth it but it's not just "slow for slow's sake"

the late great, Wednesday, 2 May 2018 22:39 (three months ago) Permalink

the marginal cost, not a marginal cost

the late great, Wednesday, 2 May 2018 22:39 (three months ago) Permalink

Even the "very low thread tension" of the Loopwheel process is not nothing, and -- especially in combination with the downward effect of Earth's oppressive gravitation on the threads -- tugs hurtfully at one's skin.

mick signals, Wednesday, 2 May 2018 23:49 (three months ago) Permalink

you can buy a companion "grounding" liner iirc

illegal economic migration (Tracer Hand), Wednesday, 2 May 2018 23:52 (three months ago) Permalink

Yet another reason to go to Wakayama this June.

American Fear of Pranksterism (Ed), Thursday, 3 May 2018 00:03 (three months ago) Permalink

was there always a prestige line of Champion sportswear/sweats or did this pop up in recent years as a cash grab because of the trends

I always thought it was a standing brand that was just kind of standard sportswear with some downmarket products

mh, Thursday, 3 May 2018 00:14 (three months ago) Permalink


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