were rock stans this belligerent when the genre was 25 years old and people didn't think it was still some radical new force for shakin up the charts and started lookin around for other shit to get excited about?
wait lol don't answer that
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, October 21, 2009 4:02 PM (6 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
who's being belligerent? is dubstep a radical new force?
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:09 (fourteen years ago) link
So I was really enjoying Arch Cupcake's "Box of Bees" (wow that sounds dirty) until it got to the bit with the pitchshifted chanting of his name which reaffirmed that, no matter what the music actually sounds like, seriously fuck anyone who thinks calling themselves "The Arch Cupcake" is a good idea.
― the blackest thing ever seen (HI DERE), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:10 (fourteen years ago) link
i am excited about new rap. a bunch of us have been transcribing, in detail, one popular rapper's verses in another thread every time a successive tape comes out. & hes the one huge artist this article really seems to overlook
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:11 (fourteen years ago) link
"who's being belligerent?"
Yeah I wouldn't characterize deej as belligerent. Ridiculously whiny hits the mark, I think.
― We call them "meat hemorrhoids" (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:12 (fourteen years ago) link
my cousin Arch Cupcake Darn13113 is going to beat your ass btw Dan
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:13 (fourteen years ago) link
wait so john d. isn't darn1elle? but he is also a singer/songwriter. i'm confused.
― amateurist, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:15 (fourteen years ago) link
are "state of the genre" essays that make big pronouncements EVER satisfying? i have yet to read one that doesn't sound foolish.
― amateurist, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:16 (fourteen years ago) link
john d's real name is Cupcake Jones
― pariah carey (Mr. Que), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:16 (fourteen years ago) link
john D is actually John Dean
― Jesus, the Czar of Czars (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:17 (fourteen years ago) link
is he related to persecution smith?
― amateurist, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:17 (fourteen years ago) link
xpost
QUE, GOOGLEPROOF
― the blackest thing ever seen (HI DERE), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:17 (fourteen years ago) link
shit my bad SLutc@ke J0nes
― pariah carey (Mr. Que), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:18 (fourteen years ago) link
i mean Cupc@ake J0nes
i don't think it's that whiny to think that sfj piece seems to pick three pretty odd albums to hang it's "state of hip hop" thesis on...i mean i'm no gucci stan but it seems like as much noise as he's made in the last two years he should be mentioned.
― hotel coral essex (M@tt He1ges0n), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:18 (fourteen years ago) link
no but "lol rap is important fuckin dubstep what are you nerds on about" is kinda the '09 version of "punk rock, pshaw, that's not even music"
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:21 (fourteen years ago) link
I find deej to be generally pretty shrill and whiny (and this "why do people care about I don't, I don't get it" thing is part and parcel of that). I have no interest in SFJ's particular (weak) thesis cuz whether or not he thinks "hip-hop is dead" will affect how I listen to music not one bit.
― We call them "meat hemorrhoids" (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:22 (fourteen years ago) link
so dubstep is the new punk rock
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:23 (fourteen years ago) link
QED, lock thread
― the blackest thing ever seen (HI DERE), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:23 (fourteen years ago) link
too many u.s. rap fans burned by grime. and then ilm made them buy a big & rich album. they are understandably suspicious about this so called "dubstep".
― scott seward, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:24 (fourteen years ago) link
I love deej a lot & actually especially love that if you suggest that rap's kind of an established genre experiencing the same sort of pertinence-slump that all pop genres experience after a few decades, he will unload on you as the out-of-touch ancient fossil u are
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:24 (fourteen years ago) link
reviewer in oversimplification shockah
― mookieproof, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:24 (fourteen years ago) link
The future is here, Foghat fans. Embrace it or fuck off.
― We call them "meat hemorrhoids" (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:25 (fourteen years ago) link
personally i'm loving all the stuff in the margins of rap right now...like all the stuff that will never be big and doesn't seem to care, like sean price or dj quik or that dj paul album or marco polo & torae or prodigy mixtapes or freddie gibbs or trae or killer mike or the new raekwon etc etc etc
― hotel coral essex (M@tt He1ges0n), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:26 (fourteen years ago) link
foghat had some pretty tasty grooves
is burial "real" dubstep or like fake dubstep for suckas, cuz i thought that album was pretty neat
― hotel coral essex (M@tt He1ges0n), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:27 (fourteen years ago) link
He's a little of both.
― We call them "meat hemorrhoids" (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:29 (fourteen years ago) link
i dont think i ever disagreed that raps relevance to wider pop music was at a low(er) ebb but i cant help but feel like his pursuit of the "the avant-garde, or even the timekeeper, for pop music" is part of the reason i dont think he really understands what the genre has ever really been about, or that him being drawn to it feels like this endless quest for superficially "avant-garde" "timekeepers" that ignores what is actually fundamentally shaping ppl's engagement w/ music ... basically the whole "any rap song that sounds like 'grinding' is a crazy avant garde classic" writ large
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:30 (fourteen years ago) link
okay, i looked this one up too from that list. i dunno how i feel about it. can we ban robot fartz in 2010?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-a0YirtI-M
― scott seward, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:31 (fourteen years ago) link
Hmm, saw Jimmy Fallon recently, and of all things Eve was on and felt the need to mention that she was currently working with some Dubstep artists, which she then qualified as some underground music from England.
― grandavis, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:32 (fourteen years ago) link
I still don't know how to tell if something's dubstep unless someone tells me it's dubstep tbh.
― Comfort Me With Apples (Jon Lewis), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:34 (fourteen years ago) link
Tbh, anyone watching Fallon is probably stoned enough that the clarification was warranted.
― & other try hard shitfests (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:34 (fourteen years ago) link
^^^ misread that as 'Falcon' and envisioned dudes re-watching Balloon Boy youtubes and doing bong hits.
― Comfort Me With Apples (Jon Lewis), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:36 (fourteen years ago) link
Well, yeah.
― & other try hard shitfests (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:37 (fourteen years ago) link
heres the thing -- im fine w/ dubstep existing in its own world & 'continuum' (that i mostly ignore) but it really does feel like every time theres a new microgenre of triphop in the uk everyone starts shitting themselves about how its the next big thing & wow this totally avant garde timekeeper zeitgeist music is blowing my fuckin mind man. then i go to a party here where someone's playing dubstep & it looks like an IT dude with a ponytail is playing Quake while he DJs this generation's IDM to some stoned hippies in hoodies.
one of the reasons ive really been drawn to funky house is that it feels like a genre so unconcerned w/ hitting some linear PROGRESS OF MUSIC narrative & instead is simultaneously "not doing anything new" but more accurately doing something very very new, w/out lazy signifier of THIS IS THAT NEXT SHIT-type acid squelches or grinding basslines or ridiculous dissensus narratives imposed & overdone (i.e. is anyone gonna pretend that the concept of Burial doing ghostly versions of two step is a concept deserving of more than a couple songs?)
this is also how i feel about gucci, its w/in a traditional rap framework, sure, no autotune, hes not feeling to disco, instead hes subtly & quietly doing a whole bunch of shit w/ his music that i havent heard an artist do before ... its not advertising itself as NEXT LEVEL PROGRESSIVE CRIT MUSIC but its basically the freshest sounding rap music out right now (ties in w/ what matt is saying about quik & kurupt etc too -- altho dude that marco polo / torae album is super dry)
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:37 (fourteen years ago) link
nstead hes subtly & quietly doing a whole bunch of shit w/ his music that i havent heard an artist do before
Really? Like what?
― the blackest thing ever seen (HI DERE), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:39 (fourteen years ago) link
should say "fleeing to disco" not feeling
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:39 (fourteen years ago) link
trying to decide what's a worse name - Arch Cupcake or Porcupine Tree
― sarahel, Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:39 (fourteen years ago) link
^^^totally feelin deej on dubstep, I gotta say. I hate that whole forced "music must move FORWARD" narrative. load of bullshit.
― Jesus, the Czar of Czars (Shakey Mo Collier), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:40 (fourteen years ago) link
I AM FEELING TO DISCO TONITE, MY SWEET FOXES...
― Comfort Me With Apples (Jon Lewis), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:41 (fourteen years ago) link
the band is called "fleet foxes" jon
― Bobby Wo (max), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:42 (fourteen years ago) link
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:02 PM (39 minutes ago)
nah
http://dkpresents.files.wordpress.com/2009/07/2503394061_e13334a22a_o.jpg
― k3vin k., Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:43 (fourteen years ago) link
was my "don't answer that" joak at the end of the post there really so opaque
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:43 (fourteen years ago) link
altho dude that marco polo / torae album is super dry
ah man it's nothin' new for sure, but that shits like pizza to me. just what i want sometimes you know?
― the blackest thing ever seen (HI DERE), Wednesday, October 21, 2009 9:39 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
i mean...i'm not near as big on him, but i think deej is right in a way, he's definitely...eccentric i guess seems like the right word...like his words and flow is eccentric in a way that's not instantly going to hit you like "weird" like a doom or kool keith but IS really weird in a way...but you gotta kinda dig to hear it.
― hotel coral essex (M@tt He1ges0n), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:44 (fourteen years ago) link
Dubstep is probably the most backward looking "continuum" genre ever though. It's a new genre name, but anyone pretending its anything outside a refinement of existing genres is fooling themselves.
― We call them "meat hemorrhoids" (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:44 (fourteen years ago) link
i read that as "deej please don't bring gucci into this" :(
xxp
― k3vin k., Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:44 (fourteen years ago) link
"(i.e. is anyone gonna pretend that the concept of Burial doing ghostly versions of two step is a concept deserving of more than a couple songs?)"
1) this is a pretty vast oversimplication of Burial and 2) you could make the claim that virtually nothing is conceptually deserving of more than a couple of songs.
― We call them "meat hemorrhoids" (Alex in SF), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:46 (fourteen years ago) link
― the blackest thing ever seen (HI DERE), Wednesday, October 21, 2009 4:39 PM (5 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
lol @ this turning into deej on gucci again but:
hes sorta found a way out that balances the whole 'character' narrative of southern/gangsta rap with lyricism, basically becoming like this venn diagram intersection for ppl who want rappers lyrical & ppl who want rappers gangster & ppl who want rappers-playing-interesting-characters, hes come up with a way to adapt to an era where an artist needs to release lots & lots of music & his audience expects it for free, by setting up maybe fifty to a hundred individual ideas & basically mix-and-matching variations on each as he freestyles much of his lyrics, so each song is fresh because hes doing a totally new flip of a joke he already made. hes also really good at coming up w/ evocative images for these jokes. (the one i always talk about is his drop top/missing roof jokes: "panoramic roof clearer than a cup of water" "eazy e drop top call the car roofless" ((eazy e was with ruthless records, get it??)) & then just combines them in different orders, making new jokes, i.e. combing gucci concept of 'killing the parking lot' w/ aforementioned missing roofs: "got a murda one, i just killed the parkin lot / decapitated bmw, i cut off the top"& he does this all w/in a framework of being entertaining, un-intellectualized regular southern pot-bellied backwoods character w/ a sense of humor & really good taste in beats
― i got nothin (deej), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:47 (fourteen years ago) link
― hotel coral essex (M@tt He1ges0n), Wednesday, October 21, 2009 5:44 PM (17 seconds ago)
i'm a gucci fan but havent put nearly as much thought into him as, say, deej or sarge. i don't think you have to get all masters thesis to get to the point w/ him, which is that he's an excellent technical rapper & lyricist and great personality. it's that simple for me
― k3vin k., Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:47 (fourteen years ago) link
what I hear you saying is "he is writing interesting rhymes w/in an interesting persona" which, good on him, but it doesn't sound like he's breaking down any doors the way these radical dubstep pioneers are every night tbh
― a full circle lol (J0hn D.), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:49 (fourteen years ago) link
lol @ this circling back to gucci mane but it's actually pertinent to the discussion of the sasha frere jones article that is being discussed itt.
― brrrmuda triangle (J0rdan S.), Wednesday, 21 October 2009 21:50 (fourteen years ago) link