The Thread Where We List The People Who Put Kanye As Their Token Rap Album on an indiecentric top 10 2004 list

exactly. I take away from the semi-gibes that he doesn't think the world of these bands, but that the pop charts are without such marginally different - from the charts and each other - bands, and poorer for it.

good point. I didn't know Modest Mouse were so big. But is he saying that he wishes Coheed (who?) and the Walkmen were even bigger than Wilco, who he then comparatively reduces in market share (even while they are growing in their fan base) to a 'cult'?

yes, these are record company boats. he wants the smaller boats to be bigger and maybe the bigger boats to lose a few of their amenities.

Miccio! Miccio! Miccio!

I agree. But I don't see that being his argument, necessarily. I think you're too tied to his examples.

this same argument was also made in the following years: 2003, 2002, 2001, 2000, 1999, 1998, 1997, 1996, 1995, 1994, 1993, 1992, 1991, 1990, 1989, 1988, 1987, 1986, 1985, 1984, 1983, 1982, 1981, 1980, 1979, 1978, 1977, 1976, 1975, etc. my guess is that it was first made a few years -- maybe as many as ten, though -- after edison invented the phonograph. no, strike that. my guess is it was first made a few years after man walked upright for the first time.

no it wasn't

And to the "what's wrong w/ not liking gangsta?" question:

Basically, "gangsta" is being used as a catchall to describe something that has a lot more social implications than "just" gangsta rap - certain "kinds" of rap by certain "kinds" of rappers etc. etc. etc. It's not too difficult to see that there's a lot more too it than preferring de la soul to nwa.

xp gab, absolutely it was.

ok maybe, but all of these arguments - with the exception of MTV, which I'll exclude, because it wasn't a mass phenomenon in its early years and/or had to reach a position of power before it could be exercised - seem more about diversity of style rather than diversity of artists. in the '70s, the bands all sounded the same, but there were more of them. today, there's quite a bit of diversity on top 40 radio, but there aren't too many bands.

15.60.75 - Jimmy Bell's Still In Town
Crime - San Francisco's Still Doomed
Meic Stevens - Outlander
Nektar - Journey To The Centre Of The Eye
Nektar - A Tab In The Ocean
Pere Ubu - One Man Drives While The Other Man Screams
Arthur Russell - Calling Out Of Context
Wire - Wire On The Box:1979
Minor Threat - First Demo Tape
The Homosexuals - Astral Glamour
Bunnybrains - Box The Bunny
Sun Ra Research - Sun Ra Research

Big Bummer: that david byrne world psychedelic classics african comp that doesn't have any psychedelic music on it. there oughta be a law. the above list is exclusive to this thread and will not be posted elsewhere.

online rap purists in late 2004 = kanye is a coon and i will punch him the face

the worm turned like a motherfucker on kanye with a lot of heads. limited research states that ghost and madvillain were tops for most people, but kanye made very few lists when polled at boards and shit.

then again..

white rock crit + non-violent, accessible black rap = pazz and jop

i liked it when it first dropped, but it went from maybe five or six songs i liked a lot to me just ripping 'spaceship' and giving the disc to my 10 year old sister for christmas.

also, i was pretty shocked by the lack of rap on my list. i had m.i.a, the streets and dizzee, none of which are trad-rap. also had madvillain, rjd2 and ghost. john smith and masta ace would've gotten in if i though they had a chance to make it in pazz and jop. which is weird, considering i heard maybe 60-70 rap albums this year.

whatever, most would call this year pretty light for solid rap albums. i thought kanye was gonna be popular with indie folks when i first heard his tape drops in 2002 but not quite to this extent.

remove the word "than you" and yes. This is soooo not about me. I'm Budgie Klos! My time will come.

but his stuff's composed,
and I think his guest rapping
is just not as tight

urban legend's GREAT
not spotty at all to me;
I am a big fan