Janelle Monae

Tim, to sidestep the whole genre issue (I don't know enough about R&B to argue this), I'm just not sure to what extent I typically listen for the character-of-the-song," but I suspect it's not how I usually listen to things. I'm generally not having trouble making a satisfactory emotional connection with these songs (if I may put it so clinically), although I suppose they don't typically flood me with emotion as some music does. Lyrically there is plenty to latch onto that is not so android-epic specific that I can't relate to it. I hate to say it (since it sounds narcissistic or something) but I almost think I tend to leap right into identifying with the emotions in a song, rather than looking for a person-in-the-song. As if I make it about me, or some projected version of me. I'm sure I don't do this all the time though. (I don't know, it's pretty hard to generalize across so much listening.)

(I usually stress the importance of emotion and the immediacy of my emotional response to music, when talking about how I enjoy music, but in the past several years I find myself liking a lot of albums that don't quite fit that mold, or that start out being unemotional experiences, but become more emotionally satisfying over repeated listens. I'm not sure what to make of this. A change in my taste? Something that's always been there but hasn't fit with my "official" account of enjoying music? Aging? Don't know. It's not as if I no longer respond strongly emotionally to any music.)

Incidentally, I have to agree that the chorus on "Locked Inside" is particularly weak, if not outright bad. It doesn't ruin the track for me though, because there's enough going on that I like, plus it's supported by the momentum of the previous two tracks. But it seems like a tossed off chorus, almost a parody of some sort. (Maybe it is and we're missing it?) I don't agree that there's a problem with her choruses in general though.

Against my better judgment I am going to say that I have always found Beth Gibbons's vocals to be really unconvincingly bad acting. I haven't listened to Portishead much, for the simple reason that I haven't liked what I've heard (though that has included I think at least a couple albums), but I did check out some songs on youtube to refresh my memory of what Portishead sounds like. One connection I was probably thinking of is that Portishead seemed to me to make an attempt at some sort of elegance and sophistication (fitting in pretty well with the whole 90s cocktail revival thing in mood). I could obviously be way off one what they were going for since I haven't listened much and never followed them, but Janelle Monae nails elegant and sophisticated better (when she wants to), to my ears, and some so in a way that I find satisfyingly expressive. I know there is much love for Portishead here and I'm not just bashing them, or Gibbons specifically, in order to troll.

I don't quite understand this:

I think what the second disc of Aerial tries to do is to tell a story without human interaction or even strong human emotion which remains moving

I do think there is a similarity (between Aerial, esp. disc 2, and The ArchAndroid), but I'm not sure I'd describe it that way. Just purely lyrically there is plenty of interaction (with a child, a street artist, a husband sort of implied, etc.). Or would you say they are there present, but they remain shadowy? It is sort dominated by Kate Bush (or this Kate Bush-like character) and her inner world, not a lot of exchange. Then again, some of the other characters even get to talk (the son and the street painter at least), which isn't the rule in songs.

If anything, I think I'm a little more interested in looking for an actual person (singer or songwriter, typically), or at least actual persona, in a song, than in the narrator constructed in the particular song. (That would probably be a big weakness in a critic.)

Lyrically there is plenty to latch onto that is not so android-epic specific that I can't relate to it. I hate to say it (since it sounds narcissistic or something) but I almost think I tend to leap right into identifying with the emotions in a song, rather than looking for a person-in-the-song. As if I make it about me, or some projected version of me. I'm sure I don't do this all the time though. (I don't know, it's pretty hard to generalize across so much listening.)

I hadn't intended to suggest some sharp distinction here.

With song-based vocal music generally (as opposed to R&B specifically) I suspect there are basically the following ways of "identifying with" the music:

1) Identify with the character of the song - "this is a convincing song about heartbreak and it either reminds of that experience or forces me to imagine myself experiencing it." Implied in this is a certain refusal (or at least absence) of separation between "song" and "performance". You can't really say whether it's the song or the performance of it that move you because the two are so inextricable.

2) Identify with the sound/performance itself - "the song itself is just a vehicle for me to experience something really moving in the music or the singing." Archetypal example here maybe is jazz interpretation of "standards" where the emotional impact is secreted inside the variations and departure's from the song's standard. But this is also linked in with the emotional impact of other, non-song-based music, where the idea of song or story falls away entirely. In other words, enjoyment of music qua music.

(most music that can be defined loosely as "pop" involves at least a mixture of (1) and (2))

3) Identify with the creator/performer in a manner separate (or at least distinguishable) from the song - this could be desire for the performer (they look hot in that video clip) or respect for their intentions or motivations or background or whatever.

I don't think that (3) is illegitimate, but I think leaning on it can be a weakness in writing/thinking about music because it encourages you to skip over working out how (1) and (2) work, except in some really blunt deterministic manner that flows from (3). Ultimately in the act of listening to an album, only (1) and (2) are actually grounded in the music, whereas (3) is something you apply to (and use to shape or articulate) your reactions.

Your distinction between narrator and persona is actually being more specific than what I was thinking of. I can see how it might be important in terms of Janelle and Kate - and I'm now assuming that where you see the resemblance between them is both essentially play dress-ups in their songwriting: Janelle is no more an actual android than Kate is actually Cathy, and the character-of-Kate and the character-of-Janelle transcend any particular pose in any particular song.

But that notwithstanding, the emotional impact of Kate's music in part derives from the fact that she makes the issue of her not actually being Cathy irrelevant - and "Wuthering Heights" isn't only moving if you think Kate does a good job of inhabiting the consciousness of Bronte's character. Likewise, you don't need to know what "Cloudbusting" is about to find it moving. "Identifying with the character" simply means "identifying with the single appearance-of-consciousness who is performing and emoting." I don't see how Kate's music does anything other than fall squarely within that rubric.

If Janelle's music occasionally doesn't allow that, it's less because of the subject matter or even the songwriting generally and more to do with certain performative choices she makes. The relationship between Kate herself and her characters is not dry at all; she invests herself in her characters in a very emotional way. Janelle chooses not to do this, I think, but the lyrics are pretty much irrelevant to this distinction one way or another.

I do think there is a similarity (between Aerial, esp. disc 2, and The ArchAndroid), but I'm not sure I'd describe it that way. Just purely lyrically there is plenty of interaction (with a child, a street artist, a husband sort of implied, etc.). Or would you say they are there present, but they remain shadowy? It is sort dominated by Kate Bush (or this Kate Bush-like character) and her inner world, not a lot of exchange. Then again, some of the other characters even get to talk (the son and the street painter at least), which isn't the rule in songs.

On a literal level this is of course correct, but ultimately A Sky of Honey is "about" the enjoyment of nature, the painter and the child really just pass through as characters who are also communing with nature.

"Cold War": much better than I'd initially given it credit for.

(I will come back later to try to deal with whatever has been posted in response to my last post. I am not ready at the moment.)

Oh, this is pretty nice, although I kind of hate the philosophy of this song (Janelle Monae--why do I feel I need to use her full name every time--covers Charlie Chaplin's "Smile"--a Billboard studio exclusive or something):

http://www.billboard.com/column/mashupmondays/janelle-monae-makes-mj-fave-by-charlie-chaplin-1004099335.story?tag=hpflash1#/column/mashupmondays/janelle-monae-makes-mj-fave-by-charlie-chaplin-1004099335.story?tag=hpflash1

Gotta love YouTube comments:

mikhkos
4 days ago
woah woah woah... contemporary R&B that is not shit? but actually really good? what is happening to this world

I'm an idiot. I just realized where else I heard "Smile" covered recently: on India's new album Unica (yes, the Latin freestyle/salsa India). (In fairness, I hadn't actually heard the full recording, just a snippet.)

Tim, that seems like a reasonable breakdown.

On a literal level this is of course correct, but ultimately A Sky of Honey is "about" the enjoyment of nature, the painter and the child really just pass through as characters who are also communing with nature.

This isn't the place to argue about this, but I don't really agree with this. I think the presence, however shadowy, of a lover is pretty crucial. The more I think about it, it's a "we" that's immersed in nature (albeit, it's a we that seems comfortable existing for the moment in some sort of mutual introversion--which could make you go, "See!" but it still seems different to me than truly being alone).

the fact that I couldn't in a million years imagine having ^this^ sort of discussion about this album goes a long way toward explaining why it's not working for me and i swear i don't mean to be smarmy or mean-spirited by saying that.

she guests on two songs on the new of montreal album

which may debunk our "barnes just sent her some leftovers" theory

Oddly enough, "Make the Bus" has become one of my favorite songs on this album.

Janelle does Prince:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bp2mzRf6_mU

shes good but prince covers never really work without well, prince.

yeah you're completely wrong (Sinead? Chaka Kahn? TLC?)

TLC one is kinda bland tbh.

I debated about adding that one

Figure now is as good a time/place as any to repost this:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgwfsi9yzww

that version of 'let's go crazy' is pretty slammin' imo, good fit for her

man, that was a terrible rendition of Let's Go Crazy; every over-the-top gesture and HAVING A GOOD TIME EVERYBODY!!!!!1!!! move felt really manufactured.

i knew instantly that the cover would be "let's go crazy"

man, that was a terrible rendition of Let's Go Crazy; every over-the-top gesture and HAVING A GOOD TIME EVERYBODY!!!!!1!!! move felt really manufactured.

Totally. Because Prince is in no way "over-the-top" in his own live short.

live show.*

UGH

or studied

last time I saw prince live, he climbed on top of his piano while playing a medley, back flipped off a piano, landed in the splits and stood up to continue playing the song. he also made it look natural.

last time I saw monae live, she leapt off the stage and ran through the crowd looking for people to mosh with and everybody kind of shied back and waited for her to climb back on the stage with the help of a hype man.

so in summation: u old

well done, you came up with a mammoth TWO good prince covers. my point was totally off base!

monae is a fab live performer, just not doing that song. i think she should have picked something like under the cherry moon or do you lie, something less obvious that would give her a chance to show off her more theatrical side. lets go crazy is too 'big' a song for her.

Your point was totally off base; most absolute proclamations are.

name some other good prince covers then. of course theres a few good ones (sinead and chaka being the most obvious) but most of them dont work imo cos of how vital princes personality is to them.

I have a sneaking suspicion you don't know what the word "never" means

*cough* TWILIGHT SINGERS... *coughcough*

ive relaxed my position from 'never' to mostly. and no twilight singers doesnt really change that.

Prince covers

Two great ones off the top of my head:

Cyndi Lauper - When You Were Mine
Elvis Costello - Pop Life

Just got this in a mailout:

Janelle Monae proved that she is undoubtedly a star on the rise in a live session KCRW (89.9FM and KCRW.com) taped in front of a small studio audience at legendary producer Bob Clearmountain’s Berkeley Street Studio in Santa Monica, and now it will hit the airwaves just in time for the holiday weekend.

The forward thinking R&B diva’s performance, as well as an interview with KCRW Music Director Jason Bentley, will be available online in the archives here and air live on Morning Becomes Eclectic at 11:15am on July 2: http://www.kcrw.com/music/programs/mb/mb100702janelle_monae

Janelle’s ambitious sophomore album “The ArchAndroid” is currently the most played album on KCRW and the station supported the Atlanta-based musician very early on in her career.

The interview touched on a wide variety of topics, from her desire to “preserve art,” her musical theater background and comparisons to David Bowie to working with Sean Combs, her own artist collective -- the Wondaland Arts Society – and, best of all, her hairstyle.

“I'm the type of person that I experiment in my room when I'm alone and I just come up with all these crazy things, and whatever works, you know, works. It works for me and it's a “Monae.” People call it a "Whompador," and a "Pompador,"- it's called a Monae.”

Janelle referenced her single “Tightrope” in talking about how she is handling the praise she is getting for her work, saying she’s not getting to high off of any accolades or too low off critiques but sticking to her core values.

“My community and the people are my main focus and I want to always stay connected to them and creating the music that uplifts them,” said Monae.

“I have parents, my mother was a janitor growing up and my father drove trash trucks and my stepfather, who is just like my father, works at the Post Office. So, I wear uniforms, black and white, paying homage to them. It just keeps me connected. This is my job, this is my responsibility to create music to uplift them and free them from any oppression, or people holding them back, or depression. I want my music to be their choice of drug, you know? So that's what I'm focused on.”

Hear the full performance and interview, and view a transcript, online here: http://www.kcrw.com/music/programs/mb/mb100702janelle_monae

Okay, one small complaint. In the spoken word bit in the last track: "This time we will relax." After all this dramatic musical and verbal ("and violence will not move me") build-up we get "this time we will relax"?! That sounds like my mother making plans for another Friday evening at home watching TV and eating to many Doritos. (Thank goodness Janelle Monae comes back singing before it ends.)

(I somehow have trouble referring to her simply as either "Monae" or "Janelle." Not sure why.)

late pass but this record is fun as hell. 2010 is the best for music. is this thread worth reading?

there's a decent amount of hate iirc

People get quite involved. Some of it's interesting, probably worth a skim.

its weird how almost every interview i read with JM is near identical. someones been press groomed very well.

well ive only read about 4, but still.

or.... everyone is asking her the exact same things

Just bought a couple tix for the Janelle Monae + Of Montreal tour, which is gonna be monstrous.

xpost -- exactly what I was thinking.

i'm always surprised when people are, er, surprised that artists give the same answers to every interviewer. if i had to spend all day being asked the same or similar questions i'd go on autopilot after a while too.

well yeah it could be that. but i also thought it might just be old fashioned artist grooming. plus it would also tie into jm's love of 50s/60s pop.

I interviewed her recently and found that the first 20 minutes was boilerplate blah while she was talking about the album but she opened up and became more interesting and warmer as we moved on. It supports my theory that most interviewees can only keep up the boilerplate for half an hour, which is why I always try to get an hour if I can, and why publicists like to keep things short.

so basically, always ask for the last slot in the day? ;)

or first!

# BookishBohem
Anyone who DOESN'T like Janelle Monae is probably just a CLONE of whatever's popular and is terrified that they might have to change now.

# Sky Pie La Blondie iSpySky
You can be indifferent toward the music if it's not your cup of tea, but Janelle Monae is one of most well-intentioned artists around today.

# SMarie GiirlFriday
RT Seriously if u dislike Janelle Monae...u generally suck as a human being. #thereitis/ this is where i wud side eye @mskayess; not Nemore!

"Seriously if u dislike Janelle Monae...u generally suck as a human being."

^^correct.