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FUCK EDITORS

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weirdly (?) i've never had any problem with any editor i've ever worked with. then again i've mostly written for my friends, and people i know through ilm.

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:00 (seventeen years ago) link

ilm is like the free masons of music critics except you can google it. im sure all the really secretive shit is discussed on cell phones which are promtly disposed of afterwards.

― artdamages, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:03 (seventeen years ago) link

Jess, the only time I've really been unhappy with your editing is when you shoehorned 2 references to 'minimalism' into one of my reviews. But I guess your brain's been so burned out by ILM that you just see the word everywhere, like sunspots.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:04 (seventeen years ago) link

i plead adjective burnout.

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:05 (seventeen years ago) link

my dreams of writing for vibe

http://www.vibe.com/blog/rapidshare/

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:44 (seventeen years ago) link

dude, Fennessey is like the Candyman, don't talk about him on ILM unless you want an e-mail from him about how you shouldn't talk about him on ILM.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:47 (seventeen years ago) link

FENNESSEY FENNESSEY FENNESSEY

I don't really have an issue with him per se, i mean he's been corny or whatever but he's putting in work which is more than i've been able to say for my lazy ass. But really, who can read a blog thats basically him copying his IM logs with Jon Caramanica for like six straight entries???

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:50 (seventeen years ago) link

unfortunately 'a khaki kid looks at hip-hop' was taken offline a while back

― and what, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:52 (seventeen years ago) link

even IM conversations need editing as anyone on ilm knows

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:56 (seventeen years ago) link

'a khaki kid blogs for vibe' > 'rapidshare'

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:58 (seventeen years ago) link

haha well I actually read those just because I like reading next-day American Idol analysis, and really anyone's IM logs can make them look like a moron in the cold light of day, but oof, all that slang.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:58 (seventeen years ago) link

maybe this belongs on the nathan rabin RIP thread

― and what, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 17:59 (seventeen years ago) link

as anyone who has seen the way my own blog has ground to a halt knows, i have no problem with posting IM chats as blog content.

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:00 (seventeen years ago) link

though this might only be why i blog run-on sentences in all caps on my myspace page these days.

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:01 (seventeen years ago) link

guess i'm the only person who would love to see more mc 900 ft jesus references scattered about ..

― mark e, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:01 (seventeen years ago) link

pitchfork makin me stay one step ahead of the spider

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:02 (seventeen years ago) link

on the other hand, you aren't paid by the LMAO

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:02 (seventeen years ago) link

i wonder if i could actually pass an IM convo off for the CP blog

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:05 (seventeen years ago) link

i'm just amazed you dudes can keep up with all these blogs! doesn't xxl have like 900 alone?

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:06 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah but most of them are updated sporadically and I think Billy Sunday is just a computer program that spouts out random rapper/athlete analogies and the word "hardbody" over and over.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:19 (seventeen years ago) link

lololol

― and what, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:25 (seventeen years ago) link

haha yeah what the fuck

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:29 (seventeen years ago) link

I was looking at a regional map of the United States for informational purposes and I saw that Texas wasn’t actually part of the southern region. The south ends with Louisiana. So if all the rappers from Texas that have been killing shit for the last few years are removed from the southern bracket how many official emcees would that give us from the south? T.I.,Young Buck, Andre, Big Boi, Jeezy on a real good day and… Shamrock?!? The south just lost the regional rap competition.

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:33 (seventeen years ago) link

North East – This is still the strongest bracket in regional rap competition

!!!!

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:34 (seventeen years ago) link

I mean obviously his m.o. is to rile people but still its just stupid. who can even take him seriously?

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:35 (seventeen years ago) link

Let's hear it for REGIONAL RAP COMPETITION!

― David R., Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:36 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah what's the point in a second Byron Crawford if he isn't as occasionally funny on purpose as the first one.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:37 (seventeen years ago) link

if his job is to make byron look good by comparison i guess he's worked out nicely

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:37 (seventeen years ago) link

if you take philadelphia out of new york, they're basically swizz beats and screwball but whatever

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:38 (seventeen years ago) link

I think almost every teenagerish that writes goes throught that I'M HOT SHIT SO DON'T TRY IT phase.

Eh, you don't have to think you're hot shit to be uncomfortable with people changing your words and your meanings! Especially if you honestly thought about your prose enough to write it that way for a specific reason. There are all kinds of edits that are fairly transparent and which ANY writer can understand as "tightening" or "clarification" or whatever, but it seems like some editors start thinking -- with new writers -- that they can actually re-write and punch up stuff. (And that can be part of the game, too, just providing raw copy and letting a publication use it as they will -- but I don't think that's anything a new writer is going to be ready to adapt to: I can understand editing the fuck out of professionals in Entertainment Weekly, but if you're a 22-year-old all excited to see your name for the first time on a local alt-weekly review, there's absolutely no reason it shouldn't say what you meant to say!)

(Hahaha on the other hand I actually first worked for Pitchfork for like 2 days in 1999, or something, as a news writer, and got horribly indignant and quit because someone added an unfunny joke to the first thing I wrote -- in retrospect I may have puffed up a bit much over "I will not have people thinking I made that joke" principle. Although there was no pay back then, and nobody wants to be forced to put his name on a bad joke for free.)

― nabisco, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:46 (seventeen years ago) link

well that regional rap entry isn't nearly as crazy as the one where he says the top 5 mc's of 2007 include Paul Wall and Mos Def (or the one where he says that Juelz Santana and Mike Jones have "where are they now?" status).

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:48 (seventeen years ago) link

his paul wall obsession is extremely bizarre

― deej, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:51 (seventeen years ago) link

(Hahaha on the other hand I actually first worked for Pitchfork for like 2 days in 1999, or something, as a news writer, and got horribly indignant and quit because someone added an unfunny joke to the first thing I wrote -- in retrospect I may have puffed up a bit much over "I will not have people thinking I made that joke" principle. Although there was no pay back then, and nobody wants to be forced to put his name on a bad joke for free.)

that pretty much sums up my Pitchfork experience (except it was in 2000 instead of '99). NEED MORE FUNNY is not a sound editing philosophy.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:55 (seventeen years ago) link

i wrote a review for a magazine once and i had to rewrite it five times AND they added all kinds of stuff that i didn't write, so i asked them if i could take my name off of it and have the review credited to "Rick Rockwrite". AND i belittled the editor on the phone when he called me at work. i still feel kinda bad about that. but i was younger and drunker and not very professional. how is Spin doing these days, anyway?

― scott seward, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 18:57 (seventeen years ago) link

Yeah, you kinda just have to hire funny from the beginning -- there's no editing it in.

Hahaha unless music crit goes Hollywood, and editors are all like "Hey, we really liked your article, it's got a great shape to it ... I think we're gonna bring in Nick Sylvester to punch it up, and if that doesn't get us there, then Ben Stiller's going to do a rewrite."

― nabisco, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:00 (seventeen years ago) link

ugh re jokes: how about an unannounced parka joke showing up at the end of a 50 word blurb for a celtic frost show?

― fukasaku tollbooth, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:03 (seventeen years ago) link

lol BRING A PARKA ;-)

― and what, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:05 (seventeen years ago) link

pfork edited the fuck out of my rvws too (including addition of unfunny joeks) except the eminem review & later mullah omar/choppa moussaoui stuff

― and what, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:06 (seventeen years ago) link

I am really REALLY sensitive / suspicious about the idea of editors adding stuff you didn't write -- it seems just ethically wrong to put something out there where people can say "here is what so-and-so said, verbatim," and there's your name, proof, in print ... there's an ethical duty for the person whose name is on there to have absolute final say on what text is going to be attributed to him/her on the everlasting record.

It's also a weird admission of failure on the editor's part -- that they couldn't find a writer to hand over something they'd find workable as-is, or that they couldn't coach, edit, or steer the writer into the kind of shape they wanted. If a good editor wants a piece to be, say, funnier, probably the ideal is to have a writer you can call and say "make it funnier" and get results.

― nabisco, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:08 (seventeen years ago) link

P.S. Pfork editing has been great to me since I started writing for real, and getting better over the years -- normal copyediting, all content requests discussed and debated, chance to preview stuff before it runs, etc. (I assume this isn't just because they know I'd be an indignant diva about it, cause I've gotten better about that. I've even gotten over the Brit-style quote/comma placement on there.)

― nabisco, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:12 (seventeen years ago) link

yeah, i'm kinda the same way, chopping out and omitting stuff is fine but adding anything seems weird, like they should run it by you before putting stuff you never wrote about your byline to be seen by the whole world. but then if it is an actual improvement I'm also OK with taking credit for the whole finished product.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:12 (seventeen years ago) link

i think i'm just a big baby. i'm glad i don't deal with that stuff anymore.

― scott seward, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:15 (seventeen years ago) link

NABISCO AND STRONGO: NEVER FORGET YOUR ROOTS

― Andy K, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:20 (seventeen years ago) link

I've even gotten over the Brit-style quote/comma placement on there

It still bugs me. The usage of dashes might be worse, though. If for some reason you can't enforce everyone to use solid em-dashes, at least have it be [word][space][hyphen][hyphen][space][word] all the time.

― jaymc, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:22 (seventeen years ago) link

if there's one thing the past few years have taught me, it's that i'm not supposed to be in charge of anything

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:23 (seventeen years ago) link

my fearless leader, so modest.

― Alex in Baltimore, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:29 (seventeen years ago) link

I didn't resent editing at first because I [i]needed it[/it] pretty badly until I had a few pieces under my belt. When you're 21 and writing your first stuff for magazines and alt-weeklies (which is, uh, right now for me), and all you've written until now were pieces for your school paper (or whatever), (good) editors are like a godsend--people who actually can tell you how to improve your writing!

But even when you're a bad (or at least novice) writer, you can tell who bad editors are, and you hate them because you know you could do their job.

― max, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:33 (seventeen years ago) link

we're all faking it anyway

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:37 (seventeen years ago) link

And ugh, I hate it when things are added to my shit, and it goes double for jokes (even good ones!) because it seems like such a Hollywood thing (like Nabisco was saying)--"Yr piece wasn't funny enough so we PUNCHED IT UP." Taking out is fine though since I tend to be long-winded and have trouble figuring out what parts aren't good enough to stay (since I'm usually too obsessively protective of my stuff).

― max, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:37 (seventeen years ago) link

my life is like that kids in the hall sketch where dave's giving a report at work and thinking in voiceover "when are they going to realize that i have no idea what i'm talking about?"

― strongohulkington, Wednesday, 28 February 2007 19:39 (seventeen years ago) link

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