classic Wu-Tang solo run poll

what does bragging have to do w/ this?

so by "persona & personality" i guess you mean flow and not persona & personality

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/2005/10/12/arts/13sann.1.184.jpg

― drawl the whine (underrated aerosmith albums I have loved), Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:27 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

thats a t shirt not a genre

RIP the Luniz Condom genre of Sex Rap

so by "persona & personality" i guess you mean flow and not persona & personality

― da croupier, Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:29 PM (4 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

flow is a part of personality -- this is so obvious that i swear you are trolling

aesthetics are a part of personality

you're right deej

hardly anybody rapping about dealing coke

it's more a blown out of proportion by the media thing

i give up

i remember reading a like four-page story on coke-rap in XXL

i love the idea that the notion of "coke rap" was started by sylvester & sean f on the pfork staff board -- it's very tea party

xp @ deep YOU WERE THE GUY USING ONE DUDE'S FORMER-CRACK-BABY STATUS FOR POINTS ON A THREAD a few minutes ago, btw

seriously, if you can't see how the rapper who rapped smooth and fast about how great he was and the rappers who rapped slow and loud about how great they were share similar "personas & personality"...fine.

i hope shakey can appreciate a conspiracy theory of this level

xp @ deep

very unfortunate typo

dude I'm pretty sure you know what I mean by "coke rap". but maybe you don't? so I dunno, lemme try to spell out what bugs me about this whole conversation:

- You think GZA's style sounds played-out; other people don't. So far, no problem.
- You attribute this to his use of certain forms of 'wordplay' which have since fallen out of fashion.
- You attribute this falling-out-of-fashion to an increased emphasis on 'persona/character'.
- You posit that rappers who never succumbed to the temptations of wordplay were objectively better ("timeless") thanks to their uncanny foresight into the future evolution of rap, or what-the-fuck-ever.
- Numerous people protest that both wordplay and persona have been part of rap from the start; that it's pretty silly to talk about an overall "direction" of something which continues to evolve and change; that you're using a narrow criterion of 'persona' that tautologically asserts the superiority of -- surprise! -- the very same stylistic devices that rappers with those personas tend to have used to construct them, while consigning everything else to some realm of naive outdated 'character-breaking' shit; and probably some other arguments, because JESUS MAN

(many xposts, obv)

and I might be talkin' to a dude who's not even here anymore

oh don't worry, he'll be back

should i put out the gucci call?

if the "paper planes" argument taught us anything, it's that a little dinner is not gonna come in between a depressingly long argument b/w deej & miccio

haha i said i'm done! should have learned from that that trying to unpack his terminology just gets you a lot of "hey it's all subjective man" jive. Apologies to everybody that just wanted to rank the wu debuts

"there's no such thing as a crime novel - crime is an element in many novels, but to then group all which adhere to some fairly strict constraints of tone & style & theme under the term 'crime novels' is just insane"

I have had to come back and refresh this thread three times before getting a chance to say but

So yeah, Meth has three platinum albums whereas Ghost has only one (Ironman).

Four if you count Blackout! That discography is also really interesting to note how generous Meth has been about appearing on almost any other Clan solo album that wants him, which has an additional effect of increasing his “brand awareness,” as a business-minded coke dealer might say

i never even thought GZA was especially cokey. dude always talked about mind elevation and dickhead record labels are iirc

i hope shakey can appreciate a conspiracy theory of this level

reminds me of the '86 secret meeting in Vienna where Geir invented power pop

he did bring out the girls for a mud fight that one time

xp

this is some bullshit

the everybody vs deej pileon i mean

- You posit that rappers who never succumbed to the temptations of wordplay were objectively better ("timeless") thanks to their uncanny foresight into the future evolution of rap, or what-the-fuck-ever.

bullshit

learn to read?

i remember reading a like four-page story on coke-rap in XXL

― rusko p. coltrane (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:30 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

yes a cynical piece in xxl written in the wake of critics obsession with the clipse

hardly anybody rapping about dealing coke

it's more a blown out of proportion by the media thing

― drawl the whine (underrated aerosmith albums I have loved), Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:29 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i never said 'no one was rapping about coke' i said it wasnt a genre, its just an aspect of life that happens to be covered by rappers a lot because of where it happens to have a huge fucking impact. its not an aesthetic of musical creation

seriously, if you can't see how the rapper who rapped smooth and fast about how great he was and the rappers who rapped slow and loud about how great they were share similar "personas & personality"...fine.

― da croupier, Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:31 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

this is like offensively stupid

- Numerous people protest that both wordplay and persona have been part of rap from the start; that it's pretty silly to talk about an overall "direction" of something which continues to evolve and change; that you're using a narrow criterion of 'persona' that tautologically asserts the superiority of -- surprise! -- the very same stylistic devices that rappers with those personas tend to have used to construct them, while consigning everything else to some realm of naive outdated 'character-breaking' shit; and probably some other arguments, because JESUS MAN

― rmde and dangerous (bernard snowy), Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:32 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i think you can talk about broad trends & tendencies w/out throwing up your hands & saying "who knows whats actually happening! its all so complicated!!"

yes a cynical piece in xxl written in the wake of critics obsession with the clipse

― j. sargent & lil k3v (deej), Thursday, October 14, 2010 8:57 AM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark

written btw by kris ex who was v much interacting w this world

hahaha oh my

i hear xxl did their "Shyne: The last real rapper alive" cover in response to Joe Tangari's Cloud Nothing's review

i didn't wanna pile on but it's not like your ideas are developed or clear here, and you getting angry when ppl are dickish doesn't make u get clearer.

deej in 10... 9... 8...

http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y176/edwardiii/scanners.gif

i hear xxl did their "Shyne: The last real rapper alive" cover in response to Joe Tangari's Cloud Nothing's review

― gr80 antebellum (Whiney G. Weingarten), Thursday, October 14, 2010 9:01 AM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i heard whiney is a moron & actually yeah the rap blogosphere was a lot smaller back then ... kris ex would post comments on dk from ilx's blog! he was absolutely responding to the 'coke rap' stuff being written about exclusively (at that time) by pfork

& 'coke rap' is meaningless. its not a genre. or subgenre. its just common subject matter for music that comes from the inner city SHOCKER

i pile on for my city, on on for my city...
i pile oooooon

i never even thought GZA was especially cokey. dude always talked about mind elevation and dickhead record labels are iirc

― rusko p. coltrane (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, October 13, 2010 8:09 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

maybe listen to his album

the difference between me and you is that my statements are like "well i never really thought of it this way" and yours are like "the way you think of it is wrong"

its just common subject matter for music that comes from the inner city major label record execs SHOCKER

deej, i'm gonna go work now, go argue with the other 500 people itt calling you an idiot

pulled Tical off the shelf today and holy shit, I'd sort of forgotten how much I like this

haha i said i'm done! should have learned from that that trying to unpack his terminology just gets you a lot of "hey it's all subjective man" jive. Apologies to everybody that just wanted to rank the wu debuts

― da croupier, Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:39 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark

wow youre so reasonable!!

for some stupid reason I only have Tical and Ironman; this thread is making me want to change that immediately

xp @ deep YOU WERE THE GUY USING ONE DUDE'S FORMER-CRACK-BABY STATUS FOR POINTS ON A THREAD a few minutes ago, btw

― drawl the whine (underrated aerosmith albums I have loved), Wednesday, October 13, 2010 7:30 PM (Yesterday) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

i wasnt using it for 'points' u goof i was pointing out how you treating REAL LIFE SHIT like its some kind of tasteless 'trend' is offensive

you're treating "realism" and "rap" as though they were linked on some basic conceptual level, as though it didn't take YEARS to get from raps about how well you rap to raps about WHAT IT'S LIKE ON THE STREETS

wait, waht

I mean, I was going to stay out of this but how the hell can this be considered anything but crazy talk given that "The Message" is routinely considered to be one of the greatest hip-hop tracks of all time?

(I kind of want to go into early party-record hip-hop as a modern iteration of plantation music sung by a downtrodden people to uplift themselves as well, making it a direct reaction to the real-life situations many of the early emcees dealt with but I'd be regurgitating other people's words and not really making my own arguments, plus you probably know that argument already.)

for some stupid reason I only have Tical and Ironman; this thread is making me want to change that immediately

oh man return to the 36 chambers

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xrv3SSpncPM