classic Wu-Tang solo run poll

listening to dude now and I am really enjoying him

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q4MoHtk1UUw

possibly because... this sounds like it could have come out in '94

he does

― j. sargent & lil k3v (deej), Thursday, October 14, 2010 3:40 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

unusual details in wikipedia articles

RZA has stated Ennio Morricone, Mark E. Smith, Syl Johnson, Marley Marl, Augustus Pablo and Danny Elfman as musicians he is fond of and has taken influence from.

why is that unusual...?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dAonsDOKD84&feature=related

xp Mark E Smith is pretty unexpected I gotta say.

btw, I've never listened to this dude but probably I would say something along the lines of: "can't you rap about anything else?"

― rmde and dangerous (bernard snowy), Thursday, October 14, 2010 3:37 PM (14 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

he does

― j. sargent & lil k3v (deej), Thursday, October 14, 2010 3:40 PM (11 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

lol I say this as a guy who loves oakland/bay area rap a lot & repsects stalin's flow but "he does" here means he also addresses human sexuality, e.g. 'When you see the dick, don't act retarded'

And also apparently not true according to google.

? http://www.dapslyrics.com/j-stalin/last-night-lyrics/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uxz0fOUj0Hk

1:21

I may be an asshole Alex but I wouldn't misquote somebody to win an argument w/deej when he'll have changed positions in a few more posts anyway

that's pretty rich coming from someone who said "coke rap" was a genre with "fairly strict" definition up thread and is now all like, these sex raps don't uplift the ghetto.

xp sorry I was talking about RZA being a Mark E Smith fan.

i never said anything abt 'real life reporting'

vs.

i mean what do you tell a rapper like j stalin, actual crack baby who sold drugs when he was young & turned to rap -- 'sorry your life story is passe!'

I mean come on dude this is just... waht

― i was like a person at a table at a place (Shakey Mo Collier), Thursday, October 14, 2010 10:41 AM (21 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink

this isnt contradictory at all. Cocaine in inner cities is real. it inspires both realism- based rap & grandiose scarface fantasies. its not a genre, its a fact of life that difft ppl deal with differently. its not something that CAN be 'passe' -- certain APPROACHES can be passe.

and my argument here is relentlessly consistent

http://weeklydaily.org/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/04/BillClintonSadFace.jpg

cocaine in inner cities is kinda fake actually

in ny maybe

although 'inner cities' is more & more inaccurate

it's inconsistent to simply say "call me sire" is out of character in a way "don corleone hold the throne, that you know in your heart" isn't. it's inconsistent to dog gibbs or odd future for misogyny that you forgive in YG. it's inconsistent to co-opt rakim for a move away from rapping abt rapping and wordplay. it's inconsistent for a rap fan to be even dogging on wordplay. from a dude who can connect "lemonade" to "more colors". these just seem arbitrary distinctions based on ineffable likes and dislikes rather than "charisma" or "character" being all-important.

hey whiney have you actually pointed out one example of backpedalling or self-contradiction yet? no? stfu

gee what a surprise deej arguing with 3 or more people in a thread

and my argument here is relentlessly consistent

it's just the pile-on mentality that has everbody pointing out supposed inconsistencies right

like you know what else is a reality, a much more prevalent one, than the drug dealer? the drug addict. res ipsa loquitur, to have a drug dealer you're going to need a customer base. but the reality of the addict & his suffering family and community - can you point me to a realism that addresses this for more than a verse or two? maybe one album from that standpoint? or to album sleeves with guys who've got hepatitis from dirty needles, hitting up their families for money, or losers doing three-year bids having no fun at all because prison actually kinda sucks? (nb if you don't think those stories are every bit as compelling as stories of dealers then man I have issues w/yr priorities straight up.) Cocaine in "inner cities" is real. The rap that it inspires is almost entirely focused on how it's either awesome to deal, or a burden to have to deal in order to make money, and it's deeply cynical. imo. and I think the audience for it is as much white guys who wouldn't know a kilo if it landed on their doorstep as it is people in poor neighborhoods who have to live next door to scumbag dealers. I still like the stuff when it's stories well told, who'm I kidding, I listen to goregrind, that shit is foul. but I don't make the argument (made by some gore freaks) that because serial killers exist, it's 'realistic' to have body counts in the thousands album after album. it's kinda bullshit, really, on both counts.

consistency is the etc etc oh whatever

"it's inconsistent to dog gibbs or odd future for misogyny that you forgive in YG. "

its not about that -- in gibbs case, its that crimes can be forgiven by aesthetics. but when u are an aesthetic retread its hard for me to think anything but 'whats the point of this'

in odd future, the misogyny isnt the casual "i like one night stands -- ok now leave my house" its "I RAPED HER"

if you cant see a diff in tone then i dont know
& of COURSE we're talking about taste not objective rules abt what is 'good music' -- i never make those presumptions & no one ever does. we're always debating taste on here. should go w/out saying

ke you know what else is a reality, a much more prevalent one, than the drug dealer? the drug addict. res ipsa loquitur, to have a drug dealer you're going to need a customer base. but the reality of the addict & his suffering family and community - can you point me to a realism that addresses this for more than a verse or two? maybe one album from that standpoint? or to album sleeves with guys who've got hepatitis from dirty needles, hitting up their families for money, or losers doing three-year bids having no fun at all because prison actually kinda sucks? (nb if you don't think those stories are every bit as compelling as stories of dealers then man I have issues w/yr priorities straight up.) Cocaine in "inner cities" is real. The rap that it inspires is almost entirely focused on how it's either awesome to deal, or a burden to have to deal in order to make money, and it's deeply cynical. imo. and I think the audience for it is as much white guys who wouldn't know a kilo if it landed on their doorstep as it is people in poor neighborhoods who have to live next door to scumbag dealers. I still like the stuff when it's stories well told, who'm I kidding, I listen to goregrind, that shit is foul. but I don't make the argument (made by some gore freaks) that because serial killers exist, it's 'realistic' to have body counts in the thousands album after album. it's kinda bullshit, really, on both counts.

― drawl the whine (underrated aerosmith albums I have loved), Thursday, October 14, 2010 11:19 AM (1 minute ago) Bookmark

fwiw i agree with all this?? you arent arguing w/ what i am actually saying & havent been

"arbitrary distinctions based on ineffable likes and dislikes"

aka music discussion/writing/crit

"it's inconsistent for a rap fan to be even dogging on wordplay. "

the issue is the centrality of wordplay, not its existence -- pretty much every form of rap has 'wordplay'

it's inconsistent to simply say "call me sire" is out of character in a way "don corleone hold the throne, that you know in your heart" isn't.

one suggests more nuance & character than the other, no?

anyone else want to go back to talking about solo Wu albums

it's inconsistent to co-opt rakim for a move away from rapping abt rapping and wordplay.

no. rakim's character as reflected by his aesthetic approach offered more dimension, more character, than simple wordplay. wordplay was there but it was superseded by character suggested by aesthetic

YES, DAN, EVERYONE

metal is a funny analog to rap in a lot of ways in terms of ugly/dark subject matter - I think that where it differs is that (with some exceptions) most metal is so plainly a huge cartoon. Realism/authenticity is not really a huge part of it (Varg Vikernes etc excepted yeah yeah). There's not a lot of metal dudes who are like, "no really, I am a serial killer and my music is like this cuz I'm keepin it REAL", it doesn't usually have the same relationship with authenticity (or perceived/claimed authenticity anyway) that rap does. which kinda makes it easier for me to enjoy, the jokiness/theatricality/fantasy of it is more up front.

xp

xxxpost I would HI DERE but that would violate the spirit of ILX rap threads

imo we need to wait another 200 off-topic posts before we start talking about Tical again

anyone else want to go back to talking about solo Wu albums

I thought deej did that when he quoted this classic ODB boast:

my argument here is relentlessly consistent

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_L7GRx-CiE

ODB could really bring the love jamz

I was bumping "Release Yo Delf" in the car on the way into work today and I know everyone around me was wondering what medical emergency the approaching-middle-aged black dude in the Rav4 was having but GODDAMN that song makes me move.

I won't call Tical 'underappreciated' cuz it's received a lot of love, but I think Method gets taken less seriously, yet this album has always been a favorite of mine.

^^^ODB also a guy who could do great raps about being an addict/alcoholic/total fuckup (altho no he didn't make a whole album out of it. ODB contained multitudes!)

xp

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JrkrTprs0DY

^^^fave Tical track

I think that where it differs is that (with some exceptions) most metal is so plainly a huge cartoon.

I think most people living in the neighborhoods where cocaine barons are allegedly becoming wealthy in every other building would argue that a lot of "rap about cocaine, of which there is rather a lot" is also plainly a huge cartoon

I was bumping "Release Yo Delf" in the car on the way into work today and I know everyone around me was wondering what medical emergency the approaching-middle-aged black dude in the Rav4 was having but GODDAMN that song makes me move.

the prodigy remix? because that thing makes me act like an insane person

curious if deej thinks "like a fax machine you get the message" is "corny"

the prodigy remix? because that thing makes me act like an insane person

The original, although the Prodigy remix is FUCKING BONKERS

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uivw43LOwKo

A THOUSAND TIMES YES

I think we can all agree that that is a fucking all-time jam and anybody who doesn't like it is nuts

Ever notice how so many threads on ILM devolve into a bullshit-y melange of pointless bickering in which half-thought explanations/post-hoc rationalizations for personal preferences by one guy are countered by equally half-thought arguments by another guy about why the first guy's half-thought arguments are inconsistent with many of his other half-thought arguments? Ugh.

yes, I have

xp hey that's not fair, I put a lot of thought into showing why the first guy's half-thought arguments contradicted each other!

no one's posted a picture of food in this thread yet so it really doesn't meet the standard