you criticize him for being too predictable/boring but then you hold Fishscale's variety against him wtf
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 18:07 (thirteen years ago) link
i wasn't on ilx back in the days when you were still picking the ticks of ethan's ballsack
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 12:03 PM (3 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
what does ethan have to do w/ steve spacek
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 18:08 (thirteen years ago) link
impugning someone's enthusiasm as not being genuine = nagl
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 12:05 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
ppl do that on here all the time
the only thing uniting pete rock, doom & dilla is audience
rmde
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 12:00 PM (8 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
hey, more evidence whiney has no clue what hes talking about
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 18:09 (thirteen years ago) link
if everyone else jumped off a cliff etc
again dude NAGL
at the very least it's just a poor tack to take because there's no way to prove/disprove it.
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 18:10 (thirteen years ago) link
that commix steve spacek track in rev's pretentious r&b thread is real nice. (i should have posted jose james - code to that thread)
― zvookster, Tuesday, 4 January 2011 18:11 (thirteen years ago) link
and i dont think they make sense as tracks that 'fit' ghost's style either
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 17:46 (1 hour ago) Bookmark
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U23NbfDMBaI
is parthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qDFIFfsqWIs
and parthttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esVEocL5uWg
and totally fits imo.
also dilla, doom and pete rock totally rock a similar style, wtf deej. pete rock was an obvious influence on that dilla *sloppy* and open style, which doom took to the extreme (listen to something like 'tick, tick' or 'a dead mouse'). not exactly a surprise that madlib has worked with 2/3 - well afaik he hasn't worked w/ pete rock
― irish xmas caek, get that marzipan inta ya (a hoy hoy), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:13 (thirteen years ago) link
obvi theyre not totally unrelated im just saying that whats corny about it is the same as what was corny about every major label rap record in 2005 having a salih williams track w/ paul wall, a jazze pha track, a soul-sampling track, a neptunes track etc .... its like the indie version of production credits by comittee
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:25 (thirteen years ago) link
i don't think the record is disjointed at all though Rock/Dilla/Doom all sort of have a "recorded to cassette tape" vibe to their tracks on this; and the other stuff (save Back Like That) is tense, short loops. The whole record has kind of a "listening to a noir Marley Marl on shitty walkmen speakers" vibe that i love (no chillbro)
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:31 (thirteen years ago) link
I mean disjointed in the sense that the beats are pretty varied - the sound of the album varies pretty widely from track to track. although the same could be said of Supreme Clientele.
Ghostdini and Pretty Toney are the two that really have front-to-back consistent production styles.
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:33 (thirteen years ago) link
and like if Ghost WAS jumping on the doom/dilla bandwagon, he was the only real major label guy doing it at the time, so it's not really like "OHG WE GOTTA GET DRIZZY ON THIS" shit bbbbangladeshhh
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:33 (thirteen years ago) link
well and Ironman obviously
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:39 (thirteen years ago) link
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 1:33 PM (11 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
he barely counts as being on a major any more. hes in the def jam tax break category and has been since this record
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:41 (thirteen years ago) link
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 1:31 PM (10 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
so do tons & tons of rap records though. theres nothing special about the presentation here.
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:42 (thirteen years ago) link
the special part is that its fucking ghostface who is an awesome rapper
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:42 (thirteen years ago) link
SC, pre-sample clearance BP Wallets and Pretty Toney all have really unique thematic vibes to them. fishscale by comparison feels like half pretty toney b sides and half 'respectable' production from 'respected' beatmakers. its like tailor-made for passion of the weiss year-end lists. ironman is also fairly choppy & all-over-the-place thematically, but it benefits from having some of the best rap songs ever made & featuring wu at their hungriest
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:45 (thirteen years ago) link
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 1:42 PM (2 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
exactly, its a sub-par gfk album
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:46 (thirteen years ago) link
its like tailor-made for passion of the weiss year-end lists.
here you go again with this.
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:49 (thirteen years ago) link
i think the thematic elements on Fishscale are "coke" and "emotions"—both of which are played out beautifully by tense, nailbiting productions
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:50 (thirteen years ago) link
SC, pre-sample clearance BP Wallets and Pretty Toney all have really unique thematic vibes to them.
I honestly don't see how SC is somehow more coherent/consistent in its themes than Fishscale. like, be specific, cuz I have no idea where you draw that conclusion from.
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:56 (thirteen years ago) link
sell it on ebayyy!
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:57 (thirteen years ago) link
tense, nailbiting
lol, i love it when deej pulls together two completely out of context phrases to prove a "point"
― one pretty obvious guy in the obvious (jon /via/ chi 2.0), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 19:58 (thirteen years ago) link
also what is the theme of BP Wallets? that record is all over the place! (I haven't heard the pre-sample clearance version and have no idea how to even find it, that's the kind of thing that disappears quick)
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:01 (thirteen years ago) link
u can pick up the uncleared tracks, that's the way to go
― zvookster, Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:01 (thirteen years ago) link
http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_mJmwQtPmusk/SfYZ1cjoTRI/AAAAAAAADwI/MRWQ9zahPKY/s400/strawman2.jpg
― tears of a self-clowning oven (The Reverend), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:02 (thirteen years ago) link
how is riding true school production vibes not a description of the 'strawman' that is a specific site w/ specific tastes
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:04 (thirteen years ago) link
well the Sun and the Watch both appeared on Put It On the Line... are there others?
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:05 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah there are a few more, flowers is one
― zvookster, Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:06 (thirteen years ago) link
its true-school vibes on a decidedly new-school record
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:06 (thirteen years ago) link
i had the Bulletproof Wallets promo CD and threw it away before i realized there was a difference #FML
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:07 (thirteen years ago) link
the "no no no" one was for bpw iirc? idk u will find out on google
― zvookster, Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:07 (thirteen years ago) link
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 2:01 PM (4 minutes ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
its not so much an individual 'theme' but the variation w/in feels like it has a purpose besides riding off the producer's reps, like ghost had an idea of the kind of record he wanted to make & chose beats based on some kind of investement in the record's artistic success
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:08 (thirteen years ago) link
i think he wanted to make a raw record about selling coke and got a bunch of people that make gross, unwieldy, trebly beats
― darwin deej (Whiney G. Weingarten), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:08 (thirteen years ago) link
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 12:04 PM Bookmark
A straw man argument is still a fallacy whether the straw man actually exists or not.
― tears of a self-clowning oven (The Reverend), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:09 (thirteen years ago) link
i think the idea that fishscale is a better record is as absurd as thinking 'on to the next one' is the best song of 2009 but i guess this is where we part ways
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:10 (thirteen years ago) link
― tears of a self-clowning oven (The Reverend), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 2:09 PM (59 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
what is the 'fallacy' here
how do we not do this in every other genre we talk about -- i.e. 'fact music' 'swag cru' 'teenpop cru' etc
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:11 (thirteen years ago) link
BPWs producers are all Wu-affiliates (RZA and assorted disciples) with maybe one or two exceptions, iirc?
deej I really cannot follow yr aesthetic criteria, they seem completely arbitrary
xp
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:11 (thirteen years ago) link
xxp That you are misrepresenting other people itt's arguments as being those of a third party and then arguing against the third party arguments as if those are those of the people itt.
― tears of a self-clowning oven (The Reverend), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:12 (thirteen years ago) link
how so
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:12 (thirteen years ago) link
― tears of a self-clowning oven (The Reverend), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 2:12 PM (56 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
im explaining why the record got acclaim, not claiming to know why whiney has the bad taste to prefer it to bpw
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:13 (thirteen years ago) link
you're not explaining anything, you're just impugning the motives of some fictional critical-audience aggregate
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:15 (thirteen years ago) link
shakey im not sure what hard about this. bp wallets seems to have a driving purpose or force, ghost has a lot of different ideas on it & tries things other rappers werent. fishscale sounds like half cuts that should have been on the more thematically consistent pretty toney, and a bunch of lazy concessions to his niche/cult real head fanbase. as soon as he stopped engaging w/ rap outside that he became a preaching-to-the-choir type rapper imo & a lot less interesting. he was also, quite clearly i think, less invested in creating great music
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:16 (thirteen years ago) link
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 2:15 PM (58 seconds ago) Bookmark Suggest Ban Permalink
im describing the damn albums, repeatedly.
― assorted curses (Shakey Mo Collier), Tuesday, January 4, 2011 12:15 PM Bookmark
Exactly.
― tears of a self-clowning oven (The Reverend), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:18 (thirteen years ago) link
i am doing the later part but i absolutely am explaining why the album doesnt live up to that consensus. try reading?
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:19 (thirteen years ago) link
*latter
srry for being cranky. im leaving this thread now
― ich bin ein ilxor (deej), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:25 (thirteen years ago) link
Where were you when...
― those balls look like a butt (San Te), Tuesday, 4 January 2011 20:32 (thirteen years ago) link