― jed_ (jed), Sunday, 20 November 2005 21:01 (eighteen years ago) link
Uniting (or negotiating the space between) the bedroom and the dancefloor is a cliche, but it's a building block cliche for pretty much any dance music which is not marketed directly as "club fare", and I think you're actually making the same point (negatively) when you say that this record is not dance music or pop music, but IDM (which implies all sorts of things about how this music might or might not be useful and useable).
I tend to bristle at the suggestion that "club" music isn't really suitable for private use in a home setting, but I can't deny that when I listen to it at home my enjoyment comes from imagining responding to it in a club setting (and, if no-one can see, perhaps acting that out a bit). Whereas there is other music whose relative gentleness/spaciness/quietude etc. seems not only more suitable for bedtime use, but also more suitable for imagining "the inner space of the dream or the terrestrial space of the country yard" - it's almost as if I'm in my bedroom listening to this music and imagining being in my bedroom and listening to this music, only in a way more romantic than any fly-on-the-wall camera in my room would actually pick up.
The issue with this cliche is how sensitively it's used: is it applied unthinkingly, uncritically, prejudicially to one side (usually the dancefloor), sloppily, boringly, or in a way that seems to bear no relationship to the record being discussed?
I can't tell any of that from the quote from Mike's piece. It's a little bit purple prosish yes, but less so than I would probably be if trying were I to try to make the same point...
I still haven't heard this record BTW, but from what everyone has said I can imagine enjoying it more than the Metro Area CD simply because it sounds like it has fuller, lusher melodies. With Metro Area I find myself returning to the "big hits" - "Miura", "Caught Up", "Strut", "Pina" - and often skipping over that long spell of disco minimalism that characterises the middle part of the record.
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Sunday, 20 November 2005 21:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 18:24 (eighteen years ago) link
― jaymc (jaymc), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 18:38 (eighteen years ago) link
IDM is back bitches!
― biz, Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:06 (eighteen years ago) link
― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:10 (eighteen years ago) link
― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:18 (eighteen years ago) link
― biz, Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:18 (eighteen years ago) link
― tricky (disco stu), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:19 (eighteen years ago) link
― tricky (disco stu), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:32 (eighteen years ago) link
― tricky (disco stu), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:38 (eighteen years ago) link
― biz, Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:42 (eighteen years ago) link
― vahid (vahid), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:52 (eighteen years ago) link
because i disagree
― vahid (vahid), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― vahid (vahid), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:55 (eighteen years ago) link
this is what i am getting at...claro intelecto has released stuff this year. i could name others from the "housey idm" group with current releases as well: andreas tilliander, the narita label, more artists from the AI label, matthew herbert (when he actually made music before he entered the conceptual zone of no return), donnacha costello's colour series....
― tricky (disco stu), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 19:57 (eighteen years ago) link
― tricky (disco stu), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 20:04 (eighteen years ago) link
― biz, Tuesday, 22 November 2005 20:06 (eighteen years ago) link
― biz, Tuesday, 22 November 2005 20:14 (eighteen years ago) link
― Susan Douglas (Susan Douglas), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 21:07 (eighteen years ago) link
And yes, I also think Kelley Polar has more in common with Larry Heard then Aphex Twin.
― Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 21:21 (eighteen years ago) link
― cutty (mcutt), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 21:51 (eighteen years ago) link
― jed_ (jed), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 21:55 (eighteen years ago) link
no, but at the same time IDM is not only autechre. it can have pop or retro elements.
― tricky (disco stu), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 22:01 (eighteen years ago) link
― tylero (tylero), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 22:39 (eighteen years ago) link
with turntables behind our backs.
and no headphones.
― Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 22:44 (eighteen years ago) link
― tylero (tylero), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 22:50 (eighteen years ago) link
― Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 23:01 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Tuesday, 22 November 2005 23:44 (eighteen years ago) link
anyway, biz, you say try mixing Hammer/Anvil with Can You Feel It? as if by default, as though you are taking it for granted it would sound right. i think maybe "hammer/anvil" would sound better mixed w/ "windowlicker" than w/ "can you feel it" (and sure enough, kelley polar shows up in way more "eclectic"/"downtempo" (read: IDM for people who don't aren't aggro/pimply) sets than house sets.
"can you feel it" would prob sound better mixed w/ LFO or something or monolake or juan atkins than it would w/ a morgan geist production.
― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 01:02 (eighteen years ago) link
about your parenthetical statement "((and sure enough, kelley polar shows up in way more "eclectic"/"downtempo" (read: IDM for people who don't aren't aggro/pimply) sets than house sets.)
did you do a search for this info? it's the "sure enough" part that makes me think you did a comparative analysis of dj set lists and discovered KP in more downtempo/eclectic/IDM sets...cuz i only know of KP appearing on Bents' Fabric (where it's mixed into Chicken Lips, another classic IDM act), Chicken Lips NRK mix (another IDM staple). Yes Bent make Downtempo (or IDM in your world) but their mix includes House Music! Even if "Intelligent" people "Dance" to this "Music", it's still House.
let's have a mini competition. I'll mix Can You Feel It with Kelley Polar or Morgan Geist and you mix it with LFO/Monolake/Juan Atkins/AFX/IDM of your choice, post a YSI to this thread in 3 days time and let the citizens decide what sounds better.
You do mix right? Cuz you know alot about what sounds good with what...so is it a deal?
― biz, Wednesday, 23 November 2005 01:33 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 01:35 (eighteen years ago) link
― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 02:53 (eighteen years ago) link
― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 02:56 (eighteen years ago) link
um ... hello? boards of canada? morr music? isan? plone? carpark? all that "idylltronica" garbage?
― vahid (vahid), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 02:58 (eighteen years ago) link
(anyway, I think it's the other Chicken Lips mix - Body Music - which has the Kelly Polar track on it, yeah?)
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 03:04 (eighteen years ago) link
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 03:15 (eighteen years ago) link
Defining all dance music which might get a review in Pitchfork as IDM makes this a lot easier.
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 03:31 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jacobs (LolVStein), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 03:36 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jacobs (LolVStein), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 03:46 (eighteen years ago) link
― biz, Wednesday, 23 November 2005 04:03 (eighteen years ago) link
― scott pl. (scott pl.), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 04:14 (eighteen years ago) link
― scott pl. (scott pl.), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 04:16 (eighteen years ago) link
The problem I have with Vahid's contributions here is his tendency to link together a string of reasonable propositions in order to create an overall argument which seems to have powerful persuasive and shaming force but is actually linked together rather tenuously. Here that seems to be:
- IDM-related discourse privileged certain aspects of music- Kelley Polar-related discourse privileges some of the same aspects- historically, IDM-discourse sneered at dance music, and ended up missing what was really good about dance music- therefore, Kelley Polar fans are inevitably fated to make the same mistake, and their Kelley Polar-fandom is but one example of this mistake.- Kelley Polar's music can be deduced to be inferior by reference to the above observations.
This all hinges on the assumption that the Pitchforkization of dance music discourse (or the dancification of Pitchfork discourse) has done something awful to dance music discourse and, consequently, dance music itself. This itself rests on the assumption that Pitchfork's pitchforkiness (i.e. corny indie fuxxiness) perserveres despite its critical warming toward dance music, and in effect "conquers" dance music under the banner of corny indie fuxxx.
This ignores entirely the fact that Pitchfork really have changed, that there is a world of difference b/w ignoring all dance music except for Mille Plateux (Pitchfork circa 2000) and simply ignoring Vahid's favourite deep house and tech house producers (Pitchfork circa 2005).
― Tim Finney (Tim Finney), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 04:26 (eighteen years ago) link
― Jacobs (LolVStein), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 04:27 (eighteen years ago) link
http://carparkrecords.com/acute_US.html
― Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 05:17 (eighteen years ago) link
― Yawn (Wintermute), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 05:30 (eighteen years ago) link
― Dan Selzer (Dan Selzer), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 05:46 (eighteen years ago) link
― Yawn (Wintermute), Wednesday, 23 November 2005 05:55 (eighteen years ago) link
Electronic music genres are pretty liquid. Their sounds evolve and take cues from various other genres over time. Jungle starts by appropriating Reggae and Dancehall, then takes in avant-jazz then changes to incorporate techno influences. Other genres have developed in the same way. House and techno are starting to look to IDM for cues and tricks, and repackage those exciting elements in a cozier box. This does not make House and Techno synonymous with IDM because it appropriates some defining elements of IDM.
on a brighter note, does anyone have the Morgan Geist Re-Edit from the Promo 12"?
― biz, Wednesday, 23 November 2005 07:14 (eighteen years ago) link