And to any UK rock writers on the board here, a disclaimer - I should've written "probably unfairly". I'm talking about a writing style here more than anything else, so take my uninformed generalization for what it is.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 19:17 (thirteen years ago) link
If this is any indication of Sade's critical stock: at some point in the 90s, Q did an extended feature which named the worst album of each year. Diamond Life was their choice for 1984.
interesting. i stuck up for sade's critical rep, cuz i never got any clear sense that US critics hated her. most of her albums seemed generally well-reviewed, at least by the most visible mainstream critics. maybe i'm remembering this incorrectly? it's been a while.
the reason i described sade-hate in terms of (always tediously divisive) "hipsters" was that...A) the wufs used that term in initially asking about sade's supposed critical rehabilitation, and...B) i observed a lot of smooth music hate among trendy indie/anticorporate/punk types during the 80s and 90s.
seems to me that this was the dominant form US hipster/scenesterism took during that era, and the attitude was certainly prevalent among "edgier", low-circulation zine & magazine critics. but hipsters of this sort are hardly representative of pop criticism as a whole, right? even when they publish reviews and essays in your trendier magazines.
suppose this is the same argument put forth by xhuxk, with his constant appeals to P&J in attempt to establish an objective critical baseline (often in opposition to the confusion of trendy points of view with "critical consensus"). tbh, i've found that annoying in the past, but suddenly understand the impulse. not saying that sade's critical rep wasn't in the dumps, just that i never saw much evidence of it. were love deluxe and lovers rock critically savaged or ignored upon release?
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Thursday, 16 June 2011 19:27 (thirteen years ago) link
Love Deluxe actually ranked #31 in the 1993 Pazz & Jop. So obviously I didn't know what the fuck I was talking about a few posts back.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 19:45 (thirteen years ago) link
when lovers rock came out it was pretty huge and acclaimed and tbh when i heard it i finally "got" sade. unfortunately i think a lot of people only knew her from lite fm ads which juxtaposed 'smooth operator' with 'songbird.'
― omar little, Thursday, 16 June 2011 19:52 (thirteen years ago) link
xp And Lovers Rock places at #25 in 2000.
― 51 suggest gang (The Reverend), Thursday, 16 June 2011 19:56 (thirteen years ago) link
And since I went out and said "hipster" I'm wondering if there's a better or at least less contentious/less played-out term to use. I was questioning it myself because it's so overused, but I think in a place like ILM it's basically understood - not least because many tastemaking ILMers are hipsters themselves. I didn't mean it as a term of derision either - I envy hipsters their temperament and their ability to pick up on new shit and what have you. But whenever I've tried that look on for myself it didn't take. Better to be honestly unhip than a trying-too-hard poseur.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 19:58 (thirteen years ago) link
other side of the coin is that, not among critics but among music-inclined friends (many of whom are unregenerate punks, rockers, indies & metalheads), i find that my enthusiasm for sade often raises eyebrows. was so in the 90s and hasn't changed much since.
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:03 (thirteen years ago) link
Actually I love "Smooth Operator." Love Deluxe has some shitty New-Age style drum loops, but "Pearls" is pretty great if you ignore some of the lyrics. Right now mid-80s production kitsch sounds better than early-90s production kitsch. That'll change, though.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:03 (thirteen years ago) link
I think I am going to have to killfile this "thewufs" person.
― The Brainwasher, Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:04 (thirteen years ago) link
Hey, sorry I wasted your time.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:07 (thirteen years ago) link
wufs, re: "hipsters"
main problem is that the word is unitary, implies that all hipsters are of a stripe when they aren't. hipsters come in endless varieties, and worse, everyone defines and views them differently. you might as well say "those people over there" for all the real specificity the term possesses.
i mean, i know what i mean when i talk about "hipsters" and i'm sure you do too, but if we were to hash out the details, we'd almost certainly find that we weren't talking about the same people in the same way. plus there's so much pejorative baggage, intended or not.
which is fucked. because it's hard to talk about the interaction of art and culture without taking early adopters and other trendsetters into account. you just have to be careful w/it.
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:14 (thirteen years ago) link
Thanks contenderizer. This is a hard thing to really talk about openly and honestly - too easy to generalize and piss people off, I agree. And often they have a right to be pissed off about it, too.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:20 (thirteen years ago) link
Anyway, avoiding easy generalizations is a hallmark of good (as opposed to half-assed) criticism.
― thewufs, Thursday, 16 June 2011 20:22 (thirteen years ago) link
one of the things that makes u realize how truly great Sade is, is when you hear a great Sade song, and you go, man, what are some other artists like THIS, and then you realize there are none
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:29 (thirteen years ago) link
well i guess there's sweetback
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:30 (thirteen years ago) link
Maxwell?
― 51 suggest gang (The Reverend), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:36 (thirteen years ago) link
Tracey Thorn comes closest, I think.
― The Edge of Gloryhole (Alfred, Lord Sotosyn), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:37 (thirteen years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okd7DJhnmc4
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:39 (thirteen years ago) link
dang, man, that's pretty great. sade by way of K&D.
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:46 (thirteen years ago) link
k&d?
― 51 suggest gang (The Reverend), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:47 (thirteen years ago) link
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41VH7V170VL._SL500_AA300_.jpg
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:54 (thirteen years ago) link
school me, i've never heard of them
― 51 suggest gang (The Reverend), Friday, 17 June 2011 00:58 (thirteen years ago) link
austrian trip-hop/downtempo DJ duo, popular in the 90s alongside the likes of thievery corp.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rU789_SJ6Ishttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aL4IoJ42eDohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfnR1cOnfS0
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Friday, 17 June 2011 01:17 (thirteen years ago) link
austrian trip-hop/downtempo DJ duo, popular in the 90s alongside the likes miles ahead of thievery corp.
― ...wow! (Le Bateau Ivre), Friday, 17 June 2011 01:19 (thirteen years ago) link
LBI OTM. i was just connecting dots.
if you're interested, rev, check out their G-stoned EP and K&D sessions collection (both pictured & represented above).
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Friday, 17 June 2011 01:42 (thirteen years ago) link
haha yeah don't taint k&d by association with their contemporaries. they were like the only good thing to come out of "downtempo."
― strongo hulkington's ghost dad, Friday, 17 June 2011 01:50 (thirteen years ago) link
k&d sessions is still really good it's-too-hot-to-move late-night late summer listening.
― strongo hulkington's ghost dad, Friday, 17 June 2011 01:52 (thirteen years ago) link
i like those thievery corp joints that arent very downtempo, like that doors remix
also lebanese blonde is kinda dope imo
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Friday, 17 June 2011 01:52 (thirteen years ago) link
man i owned JAZZANOVA records and i still could not fuck with tc
― strongo hulkington's ghost dad, Friday, 17 June 2011 01:53 (thirteen years ago) link
Haha so true Strongo :)
― ...wow! (Le Bateau Ivre), Friday, 17 June 2011 01:58 (thirteen years ago) link
not a TC fan, but deej OTM re: "lebanese blonde"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d99LRLnPeLg
― And the piano, it sounds like a carnivore (contenderizer), Friday, 17 June 2011 01:59 (thirteen years ago) link
also copped this after i heard harvey drop it, kills imohttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NLRf2CX4Iu0
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Friday, 17 June 2011 02:02 (thirteen years ago) link
theres a downtempo version i dont like as much but they remixed their own shit & it kinda bangs
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Friday, 17 June 2011 02:03 (thirteen years ago) link
K&D was so ubiquitous at a moment in time - don't think I could ever decide to put it on.I need to give Sweetback another go tho
― licorice oratorio (baaderonixx), Friday, 17 June 2011 07:43 (thirteen years ago) link
I enjoyed the Sweetback album a lot at the time (it was as close as I ever got to buying a Sade record between the "Your Love Is King" 12" and the Soldier Of Love album) - must find out whether it still holds up.
― mike t-diva, Friday, 17 June 2011 07:48 (thirteen years ago) link
The Brainwasher
― buzza, Friday, 17 June 2011 08:10 (thirteen years ago) link
Only one of those doing anything for me is the Who Is David Byrne? joint
― 51 suggest gang (The Reverend), Saturday, 18 June 2011 20:41 (thirteen years ago) link
sweetback is sade btw, just wout the singer
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Saturday, 18 June 2011 20:42 (thirteen years ago) link
yeah, i know that
― 51 suggest gang (The Reverend), Saturday, 18 June 2011 20:46 (thirteen years ago) link
well, for everyone else then
― arachno-misogynist (D-40), Saturday, 18 June 2011 20:51 (thirteen years ago) link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=15WDBuvovXo&feature=player_embedded
― these goons were made for waka (The Reverend), Friday, 8 July 2011 09:39 (thirteen years ago) link
so good! the visuals and the intro sorta remind me of gotan project
― 40% chill and 100% negative (Tracer Hand), Friday, 8 July 2011 10:39 (thirteen years ago) link
sade dancing!!!
― lex pretend, Saturday, 9 July 2011 13:22 (thirteen years ago) link
amazing. fucking psyched for the new orleans show next week.
― adam, Saturday, 9 July 2011 14:38 (thirteen years ago) link
buying tix for austin tx next weekend, show's in october :D :D :D
― i genuinely thought when i first joined that he was the admin (ilxor), Saturday, 9 July 2011 23:38 (thirteen years ago) link
really great show. totally worth the (not inconsiderable) ticket price. classy stuff. also it was a sade show in new orleans in july, everyone looked amazing, great vibe.
― adam, Saturday, 23 July 2011 18:35 (thirteen years ago) link
so im getting into sade
― plax (ico), Tuesday, 23 August 2011 18:52 (thirteen years ago) link
i got lovers rock, it is epically fantastic. i am in love with the song flow especially but also somebody already broke my heart and immigrant and by your side which along w/ smooth operator is p much the only sade song i had heard before. i am in my room bc my housemate has banned me from listening to sade (i am also banned from listening to enya wtf)
― plax (ico), Tuesday, 23 August 2011 18:54 (thirteen years ago) link
evict your housemate imo
― zsa zsa and digweed (donna rouge), Tuesday, 23 August 2011 18:57 (thirteen years ago) link
there's a quiet storm and you are just gonna have to DEAL OK
― zsa zsa and digweed (donna rouge), Tuesday, 23 August 2011 18:58 (thirteen years ago) link