Jaco Pastorius: S/D.

Since I'm neither, let me elaborate on my point. I haven't been listening to to jazz until the last couple of years. Since I come from the world of electronic music, I'm not that interested in virtuoso playing or complex compositions, as I am to how the music sounds. I'm not a hardcore fusion fan, but I like fusion jazz because it tried to add new and previously uncovered sounds into jazz, which was about to face the same fate as classical music. I like synthesizer jazz, but synthesizer was more often used as a gimmick than as a way to expand musical horizons. Return to Forever is a good example of this (Herbie Hancock's "Sextant" serves as a counter-example).

Pastorius, however, didn't use synthesizer, but he nevertheless widened the sound world of jazz, not only by his imaginative bass playing, but (more importantly) by utilizing a wide spectrum of instruments, as well as production and arrangement techniques. As I said, the best thing in "Jaco Pastorius" (and "Word of Mouth", albeit to lesser extent) is that all the tracks sound different from each other, and also different from traditional jazz and jazz-rock.

A track like "Okonkole y trompa" sounds more like ambient than jazz to me; it's amazing Pastorius could create such a soundscape with merely an electric bass, a french horn and percussions. Or, as another example, take "Crisis" from "Word of Mouth". With that song, Pastorius (according to his biography) first recorded the bass track, then played only that to the soloists, who were recorded individually. So the soloists didn't know what the other soloists were playing, except on brief moments when Pastorius brought the some or all of the other tracks in. The result is a song that alters between chaos and moments of unison, with Pastorius' metronome electric bass being the only unifying factor.

It's weird, if you consider Pastorius' reputation, how little his bass playing is actually showcased on his solo albums. His playing is always beautiful, but there are only a couple of bass solos on "Jaco Pastorius" and "Word of Mouth"; especially on the latter Pastorius is mostly on the background. Herbie Hancock probably has more solos on those records than Pastorius does. I think Pastorius ultimately understood that being "the greatest electric bassist in the world" wasn't enough; in order to have great records you have to make great music.

It's also been a problem in terms of the development of the electric bass guitar (especially the fretless) that Jaco is ASSUMED to be the GREATEST EVER and the GREATEST THERE COULD EVER POSSIBLY BE, so that his relatively harmonically bland playing becomes a reference point by which plyers judge themselves and are judged. If you're looking for the new Jaco, you'll miss some other amazing bass guitarists out there.

Pastorius was apparently a victim of his own fame. According to his biography (which is a good read for those who like sad stories) he eventually began to believe "the greatest bass player ever" hype himself, and finally the gap between Jaco Pastorius the Bass God and Jaco Pastorius the Person was so big, that he collapsed under pressure.

I actually prefer the funkier bass playing style to Pastorius', and I think Stanley Clarke was technically better than him. It's just that just that Pastorius made better music.

Try Jamalaadeen Tacuma, although I fear his eighties material is hard to find, since it hasn't been reissued on CD. I'm not sure about the nineties records. Stanley Clarke is still the electric bassist for me, but he has to be in a good environment. His solo material is mostly indulgent and useless. Try the early Return to Forever records, or Airto's and Flora's seventies records. Alphonso Johnson is also a great funky player.

I know, I happen to be one of 'em myself. Unfortunately it doesn't make me one of the jazz bass greats.

One thing I do know from SS interviews is that he doesn't share your low opinion of Jaco. And Jaco's influence is all over Stomu's playing like a rash. Both these guys are bigger Jaco fans than I'll ever be. (I mean, have you actually read my fucking posts? I was the one getting stick for being "unfair" to JP, which it the reaction I normally get when I argue he's not on the same level as Blanton or Jamerson. My point is I can't deny Jaco has many of the characteristics of a remarkable talent but ultimately he doesn't do it for me. It's loopy that I'm having to defend this against a charge of being too pro Jaco, particularly by someone besotted by Stomu Takeishi.)

And I don't have a low opinion of Jaco -- I adore his playing on Hejira and Bright Size Life, for example, so search those -- but I do think that his importance as a bass player and especially as a musician has been wildly overstated and that worship of him is pernicious.

I also think that you're underestimating Swallow's uniqueness as a bassist and brilliance as a musician regardless of instrument, which is a little weird given your fandom.

Most of the reviews I've read of ST's playing, whether on record or live, reference Jaco, so it isn't just me that hears it. OK, you're going to say fretless bass guitar/lazy, musically illiterate reviewers etc and I'd be with you up to a point, but I don't believe it's that simple. Without Jaco, no Stomu, at least not as we know him.

This argument keeps coming up, so I have to ask: have you actually listened to his solo records? I don't know about his Weather Report stuff, I'm not familiar with that, but saying that he isn't playing in the service of music in his own records is simply wrong. Sure, there are a couple of (admittedly good) bass solos, but most of the times he simply plays as a part of the rhythm section, just like a bassist should. This claim would fit far better to Stanley Clarke.

The live record "Invitation" is worth tracking down. It is better than "Word of Mouth" and features the same band, but has been out of print in the US since the 80s. I've had it on tape since the 80s when my guitar teacher got me into alot of jazz.

like a real life SHRED SERIES CLIP

what a douche

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=25DXcFg1TFo

i love that shit. he makes some beautiful sounds. he was the real deal.

he's barely tolerable on joni mitchell stuff but this isn't even good soloing it's just bleeby bleeby bloop ding DING ding

Joni has said that the reason she liked working with Jaco is that he was one of the only bassists she hired who didn't insist on playing the root.

mjt otm.

i love that shit. he makes some beautiful sounds.

OTM.

Anybody who does a school music workshop drunk as a skunk, refuses to play anything and then covers themselves in correction fluid is classic!

-- dave q, Wednesday, July 2, 2003 11:19 AM (4 years ago) Bookmark Link

lol @ real life shreds. it kinda was

he's killing it here though. after the song he goes solo w/repeater delay on and fucks up some 3rd rock from the stone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sm1jdhiwoZs

Not saying that Third Stone isn't awesome, but Portrait of Tracy is just gorgeous. Holy shit.

http://www.usatoday.com/life/music/news/story/2012-05-23/metallica-trujillo-movie-jaco-pastorius/55178046/1

I hope this is good. I don't know why Trujillo would want to interview Sting and Santana for it though.

Probably because (per Wikipedia):

After sneaking onstage at a Carlos Santana concert on September 11, 1987, and being ejected from the premises, Pastorius made his way to the Midnight Bottle Club in Wilton Manors, Florida. After reportedly kicking in a glass door after being refused entrance to the club, he was engaged in a violent confrontation with the club bouncer, Luc Havan. Pastorius was hospitalized for multiple facial fractures and injuries to his right eye and left arm. He fell into a coma and was put on life support.

There were initially encouraging signs that he would come out of his coma and recover, but a massive brain hemorrhage a few days later pointed to brain death. Pastorius died on September 21, 1987, aged 35, at Broward General Medical Center in Fort Lauderdale and was buried at Our Lady Queen of Heaven Cemetery in North Lauderdale.

I mean, that doesn't explain Sting. Nothing explains Sting.

xp: oh shit. I didnt' know about the Santana concert.

Thread bump on the occasion of the 25th anniversary of Jaco's death.

I'd play "Teen Town" in his honor, but I don't have the chops. I'll just listen to it instead, and aspire.

original discussion here is actually pretty interesting and has people going into what they actually mean about what they do/don't like about his style! then later it's people going "I hate him he sucks"

nu-ilm for ya

did anyone here see the film? is it worth it?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xYE-tm8UBSM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=29R-QdnQNpw

came across this Holiday for Pans record, looks to have been released a considerable time after his passing. This is the first time I've heard any of his records, I'm guessing this isn't particulary representative? Posted it on the bobbins of the past thread before thinking he probably has his own thread