Alice Cooper: Classic or Dud??

Have there been any plans to release remastered editions of the early material? I have Billion Dollar Babies as a deluxe 2cd but haven't come across the earlier 70s lps remastered since the late 80s/early 90s. Or at least not legit world catalogue. Have Flacs of some Japanese remasters but would love a decent cd of Love It To Death & Killer, possibly School's Out.
I know the first 2 of those are classic anyway.
I think the Straight lps were remastered a few years ago, possibly this side of the millenium.

Not been sure when he fell off/jumped the shark. But was pleasantly surprised by Killer which I listened to earlier. had mainly been looking out for a decent version of Love It To Death up til then.

I'd say welcome to my nightmare is the last you really need. a few decent singles after that but not many.

I really like Flush The Fashion, but I've never listened to anything from in between Welcome To My Nightmare and that one. Or anything after it really apart from Trash which was massive when I was at school.

xpost OTM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KjrgZPhuL9o

Now I'm seriously torn as to whether I should fall asleep to Love It To Death or Wish You Were Here tonight... gah!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=G-WZK4s0hbY

awesome

I may not see a better thing all week!

has anyone read "billion dollar baby," the bob greene book? it appears to be out of print

That was one of my favourite books about rock music. Such a blast. I read it from the library in the early '90s, and have never seen it since.

i see a couple of torrents of pdfs online so maybe i'll try that when i get home. chicago public library only has one copy and it's in reference (noncirculating).

haven't read the book but man do i love that song!

Dud.
― Omar, Wednesday, February 21, 2001 7:00 PM (12 years ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

wtf

lol ilm 1.0

yeah i swear if you want corny smug opinions on classic rock bands go to any old thread on ilm

Great book. Really makes you appreciate how difficult those big tours must have been to pull off without cell phones, ATMs, etc.

Decided to bump this thread because I've been playing the shit out of his very underappreciated 1983 album DaDa a lot over the last couple of weeks or so and have been wondering to myself why this album hasn't gained the widespread acclaim it deserves in the years since it was released. I guess this album has always been something of a cult favourite within Cooper's own fanbase, but for me it's a record that definitely deserves to be seen as up there with classics such as Welcome To My Nightmare; in fact, DaDa features the same "creative" core as that record of Cooper, guitarist Dick Wagner and producer Bob Ezrin.

The circumstances surrounding the recording of DaDa are pretty well known at this point: it was the last album in Cooper's contract with Warner Brothers, who apparently weren't even expecting an album to be made (allegedly, they thought Cooper was just going to take the advance and not bother to make another record)... according to Dick Wagner (RIP), who probably had the most clearest memory of making the record, everyone involved with the record apparently knew going in that Warner Brothers weren't going to do much in terms of promoting the record, and as such took the opportunity to make something indulgent and without much care as to whether the album was going to sell or not.

The album was also made at a time when Cooper was at his worst in terms of alcohol and substance abuse; he had already been to rehab once for alcoholism, which inspired the From The Inside album. However, during the making of From The Inside, Bernie Taupin introduced Cooper to cocaine, and it was not long before Cooper fell off the wagon completely again. By the time of Zipper Catches Skin (the album preceding DaDa), Cooper was smoking crack. According to Dick Wagner, who was present during the sessions for Zipper Catches Skin, Cooper had a curtain behind his vocal mic in the studio which had a stool and crack pipe behind it, and Cooper and other members of the band would sneak behind the curtain and take hits. Because of these issues with alcohol and substance abuse, Cooper has absolutely no recollection at all of recording three albums: Special Forces, Zipper Catches Skin and DaDa.

Where Flush The Fashion, Special Forces and Zipper Catches Skin are an often fun and throwaway blend of then-contemporary new wave and hard rock, DaDa is a far, far, far more serious proposition. Sure, there's no shortage of humour on the record ('I Love America' certainly being one of the most wittiest tracks that Cooper had ever written), but there's something unsettling about much of what is here, whether obviously (as on the title track, which features what sounds like a talking doll saying "dada" over thudding percussion and twinkling keyboards, before introducing a conversation between a doctor and his senile patient) or un-obviously (the way that 'No Man's Land' sounds on the surface like it's a hard rock song about a girl whisking away a guy from his job for "a bit of fun", until you listen closely to the lyrics and realise that not only was his job playing Santa in a mall for the benefit of the kids there, but also he has a multiple personality disorder).

'Former Lee Warmer' and 'Scarlet and Sheba' are both, to me, absolutely Cooper classics, both of which could have fit in snugly on 1975's Welcome To My Nightmare and I wouldn't have batted an eyelid, 'Scarlet and Sheba' especially could have gone onto become a Cooper live favourite, but sadly has never been performed live (in fact, none of the album has)... and certainly there's some great production details here, especially in 'I Love America' with its gunshot noises during the "car sale" spiel and the cavalry noises during the middle section ("here they come!"..."there they go!")

DaDa is also home to one of Cooper's more autobiographical moments in the closing track, 'Pass The Gun Around', in which he directly addresses his drinking problem. In this song, he likens a bottle of vodka to a gun: "pass the gun around/give everyone a shot". Lyrics such as "I wake up watching cartoons, the television's on/there's a couple of party balloons and all my money's gone/she was just a reason to unwind/and actually the last thing I could find" and "I've had so many blackout nights before/I don't think I can take this anymore" definitely display an unhappy mind. The song, predictably, ends with a gunshot (which sounds immense on headphones) and a talking doll saying "dada" as in the opening track, utilising the same "cyclical" device that Ezrin used on Pink Floyd's The Wall. However, this is also quite fitting, as, in a sense it is the sound of Cooper "killing off" this particular era, before cleaning up his act for good and going onto greater commercial success with his subsequent flirtation with pop-metal. I do find it an incredible shame that Cooper never again made a record quite like this, although perhaps this has contributed to DaDa pretty much standing alone in his catalogue.

Also, in some ways it's a shame that Cooper himself doesn't remember a single thing about writing or recording this album, but perhaps that also works in the record's favour. The fact that he is unable to discuss the album from any angle has given the album a sense of mystery which to me (and perhaps others) is quite alluring. I don't think even Bob Ezrin has spoken about this album much, but given that he was a notorious substance abuser at the time, he probably doesn't recall much about the making of the record either.

And the cover artwork is probably the best artwork that has ever graced an Alice Cooper album... seriously!

For those that haven't heard this record and love Cooper's work from 1971-1975, I urge you to give this record a chance. But bear in mind, it's not hard rock, it's not new wave, it's... something else. Definitely a unique record in his discography and one well worth exploring.

Superb.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5QS7JxxbCOE

has anyone read "billion dollar baby," the bob greene book? it appears to be out of print

― congratulations (n/a), Friday, August 2, 2013 12:08 PM (1 year ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Ive always wished i could find a copy

I found a copy in a used book store once and got really excited until I saw how much they wanted for it.

really! I have a first edition hardback copy. Is it worth money?

Not tons of money but more than I'd ever pay for a book I planned on reading...right now the cheapest hardback on Amazon is $59.69 and it's missing the dust jacket.

I haven't read the book, but it's something I've wanted to read for a long time now. The fact that the band weren't pleased with its content actually makes me hungrier to read it!

As much as I love some of the stuff that Alice did after the split of the original band (Welcome To My Nightmare and DaDa in particular), I still very much find it a shame that when most people think of Alice Cooper, they think of the man and not the band. That band put out 7 (seven!) albums and were as classic as any classic rock band of the era, in my opinion. Up there with yer Sabbaths, Zeppelins, Purples etc.

Wow, what a stroke of luck that was, managed to find a copy! Looking forward to finally getting around to reading it!

So yeah, finally got around to reading the Bob Greene book and man, was that an eye-opening read. I can totally see why Alice Cooper (the band) ended up splitting up. The impression that I get from reading the book is that they should have taken a much longer break after the Billion Dollar Babies tour to recharge their batteries, rather than pretty much jumping straight into the Muscle Of Love album and tour which by the looks of it was the straw that broke the camel's back.

In summary: Alice is already a huge alcoholic at this point, never without either a beer or some whisky, but remarkably seems to be still quite functional with it all. As the focal point of a band that are succeeding in causing outrage, he naturally has his bodyguard with him at all times. During the tour for Muscle of Love he seems to be getting bored with the stage show (which is near enough the same as the stage show for the Billion Dollar Babies tour), and seems increasingly unenthusiastic about his status as a "shock rocker", although he's still very much into the theatrics. Also, even though he's drinking like there's no tomorrow, he expresses discomfort about his road crew smoking marijuana and during a moment where they're all watching the movie Deep Throat comments "even I think that's obscene, this should be illegal, whatever happened to the meaningful relationship?".

On the other hand, Michael Bruce and Neal Smith are getting sick of the theatrics and are beginning to resent Alice being the focal point of the band and are beginning to feel that the theatrics are beginning to overshadow the music and that Alice himself is beginning to overshadow the rest of the band. There's a moment in the book which captures Bruce and Smith having a discussion where they're clearly fed up of doing the theatrical stage show and want to take it back to basics. Smith also goes postal on a chauffeur for asking him to move to another car so Alice can use the car he's sitting in, and later on Smith gets absolutely hammered and trashes a hotel.

Glen Buxton at this point is barely able to function, and the band seem incredibly tired of his presence and clearly want to fire him. He doesn't socialise with the rest of the band and stays out the way doing drugs in his hotel room.

The only member of the band that comes out of it looking any good is Dennis Dunaway, who seems to be calm in the face of all the madness that's going on around him.

Man i gotta get a copy of that

I saw the recent "Super Dooper Alice Cooper" film which was pretty good. The only weird thing is that even though it spends a vast majority on the AC Band years, Michael Bruce is not mentioned once. The guy only wrote all the goddamn songs, it made no sense.

Yeah, that's true! Like you said, it makes absolutely no sense because he was responsible for a large amount of Alice Cooper classics. Incidentally, I read an old interview with Neal Smith where he complains about people calling the band "The Alice Cooper Group" or "The Alice Cooper Band"... there seems to be this bitterness that still exists over Alice Cooper being the name of the band, a name which was subsequently hijacked by the lead vocalist changing his name to Alice Cooper, dumping the group and going solo.

The thing is, there's nothing more that I'd love to refer to the band solely as "Alice Cooper", but it would make talking to people who are unaware of the difference between Alice Cooper "the band" and Alice Cooper "the solo artist" a total ballache. I feel sorry for the other members of the band, to be honest.

wait isn't he Furnier credited as "Alice Cooper" on those early record sleeves

like I thought that name change happened before he dumped the band

Yeah. He didn't change his name until 1972.

Incidentally, I read an old interview with Neal Smith where he complains about people calling the band "The Alice Cooper Group" or "The Alice Cooper Band"... there seems to be this bitterness that still exists over Alice Cooper being the name of the band, a name which was subsequently hijacked by the lead vocalist changing his name to Alice Cooper, dumping the group and going solo.

^Dickie Betts always had the same problem with the name "Allman Brothers Band". I guess he was originally for it, but after Duane died it kind of made Gregg de facto leader even though Dickie was the musical force of the band.

Dave Gilmour should've changed his name to Pink Floyd

around 1980 or so

Yeah, it's true that Mr. Furnier was credited as "Alice Cooper" on the sleeves of the albums well before the band disintegrated, but Vincent Furnier was still his legal name. He had his name legally changed to Alice Cooper in 1974 (the same year the band disintegrated), so Alice Cooper has actually been his legal, official name since then.

So yeah, I mean, even though he was known as Alice Cooper, the lead singer of the five-piece rock band Alice Cooper, he didn't have his name legally changed to his stage name until some point after Muscle of Love and before his first solo album Welcome To My Nightmare. I guess in a way this could be seen as him legally hijacking the name of the band, even though he was already known by that name.

^Dickie Betts always had the same problem with the name "Allman Brothers Band". I guess he was originally for it, but after Duane died it kind of made Gregg de facto leader even though Dickie was the musical force of the band.

― Prince Kajuku (Bill Magill), Thursday, December 18, 2014 9:21 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Yeah... I mean, Michael Bruce obviously had a large hand in writing a lot of Cooper classics, and I think most fans recognise this. Hell, he deserves all the acclaim in the world for writing the music to 'No More Mr. Nice Guy' alone! Let's not forget though, the contributions of the other guys: before Glen Buxton started getting too fucked up to play, he wrote the main riff to 'School's Out'! 'Billion Dollar Babies' (the song) wouldn't have existed if Neal Smith hadn't come up with that main drum part first, and Dennis Dunaway single-handedly came up with 'Black Juju'. That band had such an underrated rhythm section too: Smith's drumming on 'Billion Dollar Babies' and Dunaway's bass playing in general, but particularly on 'Gutter Cat vs. The Jets'. Sure, Furnier may have had a large hand in lyrics/concepts/the visual side, and producer Bob Ezrin more than played his part too as an arranger, but musically that band were definitely a unit, and it's such a shame that when people hear the name Alice Cooper, they think of one person and not the incredibly talented, incredibly classic five-piece band.

And sure, Furnier may have struck it lucky with Welcome To My Nightmare, and I still believe DaDa to be an incredibly underrated and classic record (both records driven by Bob Ezrin and Dick Wagner as much as Furnier), but when you go to see him live, large portions of his set are songs from when he was the lead singer of the band and not a solo artist.

I guess in a way this could be seen as him legally hijacking the name of the band, even though he was already known by that name.

it's p obvious as a legal move - at the same time, I would say the groundwork for that was pretty clearly laid by appearing publicly as "Alice Cooper" as part of a band that also happens to be called "Alice Cooper". Inviting that kind of confusion was clearly to his personal advantage.

Oh yeah, there's a laugh-out-loud funny moment in the Bob Greene book. He's sitting with Glen Buxton in his hotel room, and Buxton is showing Greene some the poems and writings and stuff in his notebook, and suddenly Buxton says something along the lines of "oh, some of the messages I write in there are in code, so if says 'buy Cocaine' it means I need to pick up the groceries" (!!!)

This conversation takes place near the end of the tour, and it says a lot that Buxton actually has no idea that Greene has been on the whole tour, such is his disconnect from the rest of the band and the situation in general.

man that book must be rare. we have a great library system in minneapolis, they do have a copy but it's listed a "library use only" meaning you can read it there but you can't check it out

found a couple of shady download links...but there is this:

it's a site where you can download stuff if you get a paid membership, but there is in-browser reader that you can make full screen and read the whole thing it looks like, not the most fun way to read but i checked and it goes $60 and up online

http://www.docstoc.com/docs/62794170/BILLION-DOLLAR-BABIES-by-Bob-Greene-an-Alice-Cooper-biography-BILLION-DOLLAR-BABIES

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVHUyDxmi_Q&list=RDJVHUyDxmi_Q

VH1 Classic showed Super Duper Alice Cooper last night. It's a pretty great documentary, especially if you dig the Alice Cooper (the band, not the man) period.

Dang, looks like it was showing again at 7:00PM tonight, don't know if they will show it again, don't see it on the schedule.

Definitely dig the band and think they were undersung. Always think the same thing about Elton John's classic lineup. Obviously that is a much different situation in terms of who was doing the songwriter, but in terms of a band that played well together and made great records, well..

Complete Warner Bros. Studio Albums Box: http://www.amazon.com/Studio-Albums-1969-1983-CAB-15/dp/B00ZGVMKU6/ref=sr_1_1?s=music&ie=UTF8&qid=1436212419&sr=1-1&keywords=alice+cooper+box+set

damn it. I don't have the later stuff but I don't need to replace the early stuff either. Grr.

Looks like this is the 2011 Japanese remasters, at least for all the stuff through the 70s. Ugh. No money.

Found some money. Box set arrived today.

So our own EZ Snappin there was a little bit of history tonight...

https://twitter.com/EZSnappin/status/651598763157381120

https://twitter.com/EZSnappin/status/651599309297709057

https://twitter.com/EZSnappin/status/651606411059707904

And some more:

https://twitter.com/RobertWilonsky/status/651599023820832768

https://twitter.com/RobertWilonsky/status/651604977136177153

AT a little bit of history, but sure he's a little bit of history now too!