Sorry, I didn't mean that, I was just satirizing a certain posting style to demonstrate the depressing futility of even posting at all.
― That's My Brother Doug's Grandmother On Bass (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 17:46 (nine years ago) link
I also took the piece to be about "artistic futility." whether or not you find it funny is up to taste but for me the premise of the "joke" seemed to depend on already having a high regard for Rollins/jazz as meaningful, etc.
― ryan, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 18:04 (nine years ago) link
precisely
― Daphnis Celesta, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 18:32 (nine years ago) link
it definitely didn't have a disclaimer in the print mag, right? i'd get my lawyers dewey, cheatham, and howe on the phone right away. mental anguish!
― scott seward, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 19:35 (nine years ago) link
It wasn't even in the print magazine - it was online-only. That's what's even more amazing about the response. Who knew all these old crybaby jazz fucks had even heard of the internet?
― Humorist (horse) (誤訳侮辱), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 19:36 (nine years ago) link
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-TwniIS2_C2w/TaK13AOntiI/AAAAAAAACmA/cOIfUqesS1I/s1600/Thing.jpgIt's Flag-Postin' Time!
― That's My Brother Doug's Grandmother On Bass (James Redd and the Blecchs), Tuesday, 5 August 2014 19:40 (nine years ago) link
lol
― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Tuesday, 5 August 2014 19:48 (nine years ago) link
So is this Django Gold the same kid who wrote the Ten Jazz Records You Must Own thing in the Voice a little while back, and now he is already senior editor at Teh Onion? Cream really rises to the top faster and faster in this best of all possible worlds we live in.
― Flan O'Brien, bibliotecario de Babel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 02:21 (nine years ago) link
Whiney are you even serious here
this to you seems "fucked"? like I get that you'd die before reading the New Yorker but anybody who's read two issues of it knows Shouts & Murmurs is a humor column
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 13:29 (nine years ago) link
You couldn't imagine a scenario where a piece of "humor" could mean aggregating funny quotes from a colorful personality who's not exactly famous?
― dilligaf escape plan (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 14:31 (nine years ago) link
He is famous, you're just not into jazz. My entire week has been jazzers lolling about that piece
― fgti, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 14:45 (nine years ago) link
Well it's a good thing this was published in a niche publication like Jazz Times and not a national general interest magazine like the New Yorker with a 1M+ circulation. Dodged a bullet there!
― dilligaf escape plan (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 14:51 (nine years ago) link
That could have been really embarrassing!
― dilligaf escape plan (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 14:52 (nine years ago) link
Whiney this is your golden opportunity to write a very serious thinkpiece about the real harm done by a joke whose punchline is "one of the greatest living jazz players actually hates jazz." imagine all the clicks
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 14:56 (nine years ago) link
the negative responses to the piece definitely have a lot to do w/ the profile of the pub and the subject. when's the last time Sonny Rollins was the subject of a high profile piece in a general interest publication? the same basic "joke" could've been done with, like, Bob Dylan, and it would've been totally unfunny then too, but it wouldn't have been vaguely unseemly for quite the same reason.
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 14:57 (nine years ago) link
some dude otm.
still have yet to come across one of these token jazz musicians who are lolling at this. But I guess, to paraphrase Ian Faith, NYC is not a big jazz town.
― Flan O'Brien, bibliotecario de Babel (James Redd and the Blecchs), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:16 (nine years ago) link
xpost, yeah, if it was like Young Dro or Big Daddy Kane or Shalamar or the Bar-Kays, it would be the same problem
― dilligaf escape plan (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:18 (nine years ago) link
someone post an example of terrible music writing please.
― 3kDk (dog latin), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:22 (nine years ago) link
nothing by me please.
The New Yorker also covers classical music
― fgti, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:37 (nine years ago) link
when's the last time Sonny Rollins was the subject of a high profile piece in a general interest publication?
About four years ago, in the New Yorker - doesn't fit high profile, but then again, the New Yorker probably gives more ink to Rollins than any other general interest publication
the error of this piece is that its humor seems mean because most people just don't give a fuck about jazz: fake Rollins is kinda right, most people don't care, no matter how immense his contribution to jazz is. so it's a mean joke: the idea that Sonny Rollins might feel like his craft, which is unassailable, has been a waste; that nobody gives a shit. kind of a mean joke. that notion that this rises somehow to some higher level of offense than "kinda mean" is a little baffling
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:52 (nine years ago) link
4 years is a pretty long time, so that kinda helps my point imo.
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:55 (nine years ago) link
― dilligaf escape plan (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, August 6, 2014 11:18 AM (35 minutes ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink
that reminds me, Nick Sylvester's old blog with lol hilarious fake interviews with rappers was terrible in a pretty similar way
you're a music critic, right? pitched any Sonny Rollins pieces lately?
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:57 (nine years ago) link
huh?
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:58 (nine years ago) link
rolling stone puts sex crimes in a flashback listicle but the real problem is jazz satire in the new yorker
― da croupier, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:59 (nine years ago) link
Sonny Rollins hasn't released new studio material since 2006, fyi. His last three albums are all called "Road Shows." Not sure sure what any publication is supposed to be doing to satisfy the "you don't get to joke about Sonny Rollins unless you're covering his shit on the regular" hurdle, but if you can name a general interest publication anywhere who gives him more coverage than the New Yorker, I'll be pretty surprised.
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 15:59 (nine years ago) link
he has a whole journal dedicated to his sax sound fyi
― john wahey (NickB), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:03 (nine years ago) link
rollin's tone
well yeah that kinda makes the humor of the piece even more specious. graying legend pokes his head out of semi-retirement to denounce his life's work, oh the laughters out loud!
i'm not saying the piece is totally indefensible, but i don't really understand the basis upon which you're defending it other than the usual bullshit internet "freedom of speech means you can't say this was lame."
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:03 (nine years ago) link
would you describe this as a "general interest" magazine
is that really something I would say, some dude? c'mon man. I'm not "defending the piece," I don't give a shit about it, I just think people getting heated about it are being ridiculous and honestly fronting
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:11 (nine years ago) link
graying legend pokes his head out of semi-retirement to denounce his life's work, oh the laughters out loud!
no accounting for taste
― BIG HOOS aka the steendriver, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:13 (nine years ago) link
i gather that the reactions around the internet to this thing have run to some extremes. i don't really say anybody getting that heated, here, beyond thinking it's fair game for this thread.
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:14 (nine years ago) link
But this is exactly why it's good satire. It's not meant to be "ha-ha" funny; it's meant to confront the ugly truth of how much American society really values the great artists in their midst. Real satire is rarely funny, and frequently seems cruel, because the reality it's pointing out is itself cruel and ugly and not fucking funny.
― Humorist (horse) (誤訳侮辱), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:15 (nine years ago) link
there's a difference between being a part of a vehement backlash to a piece and being on the periphery saying "well, this backlash was pretty inevitable, what did the writer fucking expect" xp
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:16 (nine years ago) link
rather than cruelly acknowledge their irrelevance to pop culture, jazz greats should be respected from afar silently until the artist dies, at which point a ten-song spotify playlist will be curated if the site has someone who could put that together. failing that, a solitary youtube of their tooting will do.
― da croupier, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:19 (nine years ago) link
or, y'know, just not make an 80-year-old icon have to get online and tell his fans, many of whom are probably also his age, that he didn't just denounce his whole career, a shitty McSweeney's post just made its way to a major magazine's site
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:22 (nine years ago) link
that's what i said!
― da croupier, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:24 (nine years ago) link
Genuinely baffled that anybody is angry about this or that anybody couldn't tell it was a joke.
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:24 (nine years ago) link
― Humorist (horse) (誤訳侮辱)
otm
― Harper Valley PTSD (WilliamC), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:25 (nine years ago) link
a shitty McSweeney's post just made its way to a major magazine's site
as part of a column that any reader over 18 knows is a humor column
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:26 (nine years ago) link
that's cold, man, you think a 17 year old can't see the word 'humor' in the URL of a site's humor section?
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:28 (nine years ago) link
our safesearch is set to "make the kid think all humor sites are true." no-one can challenge our asshole parenting style
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:29 (nine years ago) link
the "omg i can't believe anyone would be fooled by this!" thing is mainly theoretical since the overwhelming majority of people who even read it did so after the brouhaha and SR's response already happened. but this probably popped up on the RSS reader or whatever of a few jazz fans who were momentarily confused and asked Rollins what was up, let's keep harping on how dumb they must be.
― some dude, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:30 (nine years ago) link
OK they're dumb. I don't know much about how Rollins talks and thinks and I could tell it wasn't him. You'd think his stans would have an advantage.
― Re-Make/Re-Model, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:36 (nine years ago) link
everybody knows Rollins said he thought it was funny right
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-j3LfPYqSZs
and gave a reading roughly in line with 誤訳侮辱's, that it was kind of a cutting piece, and expressed concern that people might have thought it was real
then after he thinks about that for a while he seems to change his mind, but his take seems readable as "taken as humor, fine; if people take it seriously, a drag"
― Now I Am Become Dracula (underrated aerosmith bootlegs I have owned), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:36 (nine years ago) link
Oh fuck anyone who thought this might be srs, that's just goofy
― sonic thedgehod (albvivertine), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:41 (nine years ago) link
no one is saying people didn't know it was a humor column, aero, but the fact that "humor" on the internet in 2014 can mean "made up stuff" or "aggregated actual things that are also funny" is where the confusion lies...
― dilligaf escape plan (Whiney G. Weingarten), Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:46 (nine years ago) link
the irony of protecting old people from a humor column started circa the great depression
― da croupier, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:52 (nine years ago) link
it's about a year older than sonny rollins
― da croupier, Wednesday, 6 August 2014 16:53 (nine years ago) link