Your Biggest Musical Disappointment.......

it is, but knowing a bit about your tastes I can see why it would disappoint (I like your tastes fwiw)

the first 3 and last 4 on Good Humor are great but its middle really really drags.

― brimstead, Monday, December 1, 2014 10:53 PM (4 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Thinking about what you said a few posts ago: how would the expression of this sentiment have been improved by your writing "but its middle is just not for me." ? Even if you were sincere, it would come off as somehow much more precious & irritating than the straightforward assessment you actually gave.

what the hell is your beef with people on this thread and their opinions

?

I.....like opinions? I have them....too? Others.....presumably have them? They.........are not all the same?

What exactly is going to happen on a thread about "musical disappointments," we're all going to agree about what is "disappointing"?

you have asserted that people who were disappointed by Radio City are somehow incorrect ("complete nonsense", like you have any authority there), and brimstead's opinion was not "precious and irritating", it was a specific reference to the gear used/overall sound on that comp.

stop criticizing other people's personal aesthetic experiences and tell another story about how some artist crushed your hopes, that's what's going on itt.

i.e you have confused this for a debate thread, it's a "tell a story thread"

the most recent GY~BE was a pretty big disappointment imo (altho I got a lotta mileage outta the drone tracks)

long repetitive post-rock crescendos sans interludes or spooky disembodied voices is, like... less than half of what I like about Lift Yr Skinny Fists

Look, my post to brimstead was friendly. brimstead's post noted that "we" act like we are objective but that it is ok to just say something is "not for me".

I pointed out, hardly in some kind of mean way, that brimstead had just recently posted something that was had "objective" sounding opinions in it. I then said maybe it wouldn't be better to change that post to some kind of "hey we're all just subjective" type post, because basically writing that way is incredibly boring.

Also nobody here does it, and if you are really serious about this "tell a story thread" thing you should probably whip out the citation book with some other people on the thread. This thread, if you haven't noticed, is full of opinions. Rather strongly stated opinions. And there have been some arguments. Arguments I wasn't involved with.

I also called for positive type disappointment-with-a-happy-ending stories a while back in this thread, none of which have materialized, so you can step off on the stuff about me bringing all the negativity.

one time I bought a Danielson Family CD (used), listened to half of it once & then immediately gave it away to somebody I met that night

xp dude it's one thing to say "hey I disagree, I think the first three Wire albums are great", and another thing to say "your direct personal experience is complete nonsense and here's why" or "the way you expressed your disappointment in that record was precious and irritating" (obviously paraphrasing there)

if you don't see the difference there, I don't know what to tell you.

Drive-By Truckers show in Sacramento earlier this year. We took my BiL for his birthday, he's a fan but hadnt seen them live.

We've seen them four or five times over the last 5 years or so, each show was like a huge party, just fun & jubilant & awesome every time.

This show was...not that. Setlist was uneven, weird mix of slow contemplative stuff right into a barn burner, never really establishing a mood either way. All of us sat for most of the show because it was just so average & boring. and they didnt even sound that good, which surprised me.

and i can't stand the new bass player. he stood smack bang in the middle of the stage grinning like a loon the whole time, annoyed the shit out of me. why am i forced into watching YOU? i dont even know who you are

I didnt go to any of their Fillmore shows in SF this month bc I'm still kind of mad about how boring they were :(

i love them so much but i feel like this really soured me. i'm not usually so fickle but they felt like a completely different band to me & i dont think i like what they are now

..like, life is too short to blindly follow a band that may or may not put on a good show anymore.

:(

I do see the difference.....between what I said and what you are saying I said. And this is so boring to explain at length and I apologize to everybody else:

brimstead did NOT express disappointment in a "precious and irritating" way; nor did I claim so!!! This is not that hard. brimstead HAD expressed disapproval, saying 'really really drags'. Had brimstead been putting the same judgment as 'this just isn't for me', THEN it would have been precious. But brimstead didn't. Christ, I was expressing hypothetical disapproval by way of supporting a more assertive manner of expressing opinions. Which as I've pointed out, everybody here does anyway already.

And why shouldn't I call some aesthetic opinion "nonsense"? Note this is a bit different than what you claimed I did, which was to say "your direct personal experience is complete nonsense." Which would be hysterically melodramatic bullshit to say. If I did. But I didn't. Neither did anybody else.

the first 3 and last 4 on Good Humor are great but its middle really really drags.

― brimstead, Monday, December 1, 2014 10:53 PM (4 days ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Thinking about what you said a few posts ago: how would the expression of this sentiment have been improved by your writing "but its middle is just not for me." ? Even if you were sincere, it would come off as somehow much more precious & irritating than the straightforward assessment you actually gave.

― Vic Perry, Friday, December 5, 2014 7:58 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post

It's the whole "listening to an artist once and offering a hot take" bullshit that walks a fine line. Like reading a lot about Big Star and then being not all that into what you hear at first...is fine... but people act like they've been put upon sometimes and it irritates me is all. I Know, I'm probably just projecting.

like being disappointed by a favorite artist's new album is not the same as being disappointed when you hear a critically acclaimed legendary myth-laden artist for the first time. But i do it all the time probably.

In any case, I apologize for my holier-than-holier-than thou tone, it's not really any better than the attitude i'm decrying

Sleeve in all fairness I didn't take Vic's "complete nonsense" phrase to be aimed at my disappointment per se, but at my characterization of that album's musical style (as power pop). I disagree with him, but have no problem with his objection.

As for the whole "precious/irritating" comment re brimstead's post, are you sure you're reading it correctly? I don't thing Vic is saying that b's post was precious etc, but that it would have been, had he added the type of qualifier he seemed to be advocating (to emphasize the subjective nature of one's pronouncements itt).

Lol entire treatises have been written while I composed that

brimstead -- you haven't been a bit holier-than-thou

I wonder if there is as much buildup now when it's easier to hear things quickly. I don't read about things for long any more before I go hear them, so there isn't as much chance to be strongly disappointed. But wow, when you had to plunk down nine bucks and get the shrinkwrap off....

As for favorite artists, I did develop a weird tendency to just expect to be disappointed after a few albums by everybody, to kind of a chilling extent. I'm not a very loyal fan. I nearly feel bad about this.

Multiple xp's iow

xps if y'all are cool with it then I have no right to complain on yr behalf, just thought Vic's tone was excessive (not that I am one to point fingers there, but w/e)

when you had to plunk down nine bucks and get the shrinkwrap off....

OTM

sorry for taking offense, carry on.

bring on further disappointments!

It was humorist(horse)'s use of the word "boring" that set me off, i guess. It's a word that drives me up the wall for some reason, maybe because it can rudely imply that people are seeing something that isn't there... which is a fine argument to make! and critics shouldn't be nice all the time. but just saying "boring" by itself is ehhh boring

All's cool.

I'm dealing with so much pent-up rage over Brown, Garner etc and dealing with thinly veiled racism in my neighborhood that to come in here and have someone rail at me for calling a band "power pop" is a positively delightful, heart-warming experience, and I feel nothing but good will to my pop-taxonomically offended interlocutor. I'm dead serious.

"Good will toward..." I meant

And Vic: sorry for assuming you're a "he". Feel free to correct

collardo OTM on all points and yes I am very upset about all that shit as well, sorry again for projecting

I remember being really really bummed out by the Legendary Pink Dots' Shadow Weaver, I was broke in the early 90's and had bought it new for , y'know, probably $16 or so. it's generally rated as one of the weakest albums (otm), and it followed The Maria Dimension which is a consensus high point in the discography. 22 years later and I can still recall the "I could have eaten for a few days on that" feeling, along with the "should I ever buy anything by this band again" feeling

fwiw I still have the fucking thing b/c I am a dumbass completist, plus it does have a few solid tracks which is all I need to keep a CD around

I'm a MANNNN, yes I am & I can't help but love you so....

Yeah very much enraged over cops getting away with murder again and again, and ridiculous excuses for. Which tend suspiciously to get super-micro, as if there weren't some sort of larger patterns or anything.

somebody who is totally into Shadow Weaver should get in here and argue with me, where's jjjusten when you need him

now that I think about it I could probably have eaten for close to a week on $16 in 1992! bread, eggs, beans, rice, greens. CDs really were a scam, weren't they?

Mass disappointment: I think there's a disturbance in the force, or the farce, at the temporal moment when Peter Frampton's "I'm in You" appearance. I don't know how people now feel about the pop juggernaut/endurance test that was Frampton Comes Alive, but that next album & single with its snicker-producing title....I mean, wow. I can remember hearing it: the new Frampton single! (I had been a fan, I was like 13 or 14) and then it goes on: "I'm in YOUUU....You're in MEEEEEE"

What an odd phenomenon that was. "Comes Alive" has to be the album with the least subsequent influence in proportion to its popularity, like, ever.

Btw I always thought of Leo Sayer as the reductio ab absurdum of Frampton, and Richard Simmons as the reductio ad absurdum of Sayer.

I think you are right with the FCA popularity-to-influence level. Although the career winner has to be John Denver. He was inescapable. Now quite escapable.

Richard Simmons always reminded me of Leo Sayer. Sayer though had this oddball appearing in mime makeup thing going on for a while that isn't very Frampton like.

The (fake) rock critic writing the liner notes to Aja mentions at the start he has just completed a "lukewarm review" of a Leo Sayer live concert. Those notes are hysterical, for years I thought they were real.

The albums made possible by In a Silent Way are much better than IASW itself.

which albums do you have in mind?

The Necks discography, for one.

the necks was a big disappointment indeed. everything i heard from them was so bloody repetitive. a positive surprise in this kind of instrumental, calm & slow music was bohren und der club of gore. really sublime night music with a dark undertone.

sorry i think i got it wrong, you didn't cite the necks as disappointment. still i didn't get them.

I have a Necks' album and to compare in any way to 'In a Silent Way' would be laughable.

I have a lot of disappointments about genres not being what I expected or not having enough of the elements I liked best or bands going in a direction I wasn't as fond of, but generally in both cases I don't think I can blame them for not creating the sort of music I want to hear.

xp: About 8,540 results for "the necks" "in a silent way"

It isn't a novel comparison. One could also look at Hassell or late Talk Talk for other interesting directions taken from IASW. It's certainly a great album, but like many great albums, I find its influence to be much greater than the actual sound, in hindsight.

I love the Necks (and have been lucky enough to see them live) and love IASW and am glad I don't have to choose, but if I did have to choose only one to ever hear again, I'd pick that 39 minutes of magic over the Necks entire discog.

I feel sorry for anyone who finds disappointment in the wondrous beauty of The Necks.

never heard of Hassell and have avoided Necks because of the name, but may investigate.....
yeah, bohren & der club of gore are excellent ....
Sanpaku, did you hear IASW after having already heard Necks, Hassell, Talk Talk, etc?

Jon Hassell, in case of confusion.

I don't think I can blame them for not creating the sort of music I want to hear.

Which reminds me, when I finally got a copy of "My Life in the Bush of Ghosts", having heard bits and pieces of it over the years, I found it to be pretty disappointing.(xp)

Yeah, me too but again I think its because its influence has permeated a lot of things, it seems less, um, original now.

@MostlyClean

I'm only slowly getting to classic jazz (besides the Davis/Mingus/Coltrane canonical picks). I'd heard modal Miles and electric Miles, but despite having the album and seeing it namechecked for years, hadn't gotten around to hearing In a Silent Way until only a few months ago. I've had everything by Hassell for decades due to the Eno association, late Talk Talk due to Ned (I think), and The Necks (especially Hanging Gardens, Drive By, Quay, and Raab) are my most exciting musical discoveries of 2014.

So while I hear IASW, or some hypothetical album very much like IASW, as a neccessary antecedent for many musics I love, the experience of listening to it was a bit underwhelming, possibly because it was Teo Macero's first complete reedit of Miles sessions. Good selections, but disjointed. Macero perhaps hadn't quite perfected his editing technique with the thematic progression of his electric Miles constructions.