― Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:37 (twenty years ago) link
― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:37 (twenty years ago) link
― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:37 (twenty years ago) link
yes and he still whines that people are cunts to him. NO SHIT SHERLOCK.
― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:38 (twenty years ago) link
― clive (Clive), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:39 (twenty years ago) link
x-post - Yeah, but that's only in one track and he spins that backwards and starts again because he knows he's being daft!
― Sick Nouthall (Nick Southall), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:39 (twenty years ago) link
I think he's taken that chance without diluting his style really. In fact if anything, he's abandoned all convention in order to do this. Could you even say he attempts to rap, at any point on this record?
― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:40 (twenty years ago) link
(xpost I hate the 'everyman' thing which has attacxhed itself to Mike Skinner. He reminds me of people I know != he is an everyman character)
― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:41 (twenty years ago) link
― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:43 (twenty years ago) link
This is obvious but it's a very homosocial record, and how straight or otherwise that is, is debatable. What Dan does to Mike is probably worse than what Simone does.
I do wish there was more C-Mone on this record, because she's great. I also wish they'd got C-Mone's former Out Da Ville colleague Tempa in because she'd have scared the living wotsits out of Mike (in the narrative and out, most likely).
― Tim (Tim), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:47 (twenty years ago) link
I liked the rewind bit despite being aware (like Nick said upthread) of it being overblown and trite. "Be nice to people and they'll be nice to you" hardly a surprising or important conclusion but there's something naive about the rewinded part which gets to me.
(xpost obv)
― clive (Clive), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:49 (twenty years ago) link
― zebedee (zebedee), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:50 (twenty years ago) link
― edward o (edwardo), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:51 (twenty years ago) link
― strongo hulkington (dubplatestyle), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:54 (twenty years ago) link
It's not that Mike Skinner reminds me of people I know, it's that Mike Skinner is laying bare a lifestyle which pretty much EVERYONE I (and I'm sure others) is living or has lived at some point.
There's a sense of cartoon about it and that's why he's sort of at the top of the pile, or he can scream "Don't you all like pills" at his gigs, but he's become the figure he is because I can't think of many others who cram so much actual real life detail into records, and this rings true even more on AGDCFF if you ask me.
He's too confined by rhythm and rapping on the first record to actually drop lines like the one about his jeans feeling funny at the end of AGDCFF.
― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 09:55 (twenty years ago) link
I know plenty of people for whom this lifestyle is pretty alien.
― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:01 (twenty years ago) link
If anything it's saying that you are on your own, it's Skinner realising that you have your friends and that's fine but ultimately you must look after yourself, and you don't deserve attention or more shoulders to cry on than anyone else, because everybody else has to look after themselves too.
And at the same time there's a beauty to that because it's our diversity and the sense that we're all unique which prevents us from getting along, from true unity. Loneliness is also independence, difference, invention. Problems need solutions.
We actually got to talking about "Empty Cans" after a discussion of the Mayday protests, and I said I thought it was kind of tragic but almost beautiful hearing these spokespersons terrified to nail their colours to the mast, politically, because there was no real political thread uniting the protestors, just a general sense that "something is wrong", and in a way there's all these people on the streets who are unhappy but aren't actually united at all.
If anything to me that's an illustration of the problems in the world, that for them to go away or dissipate and for us to exist together peacefully we must cease to be individuals, or in a perfect world what would the point of there being a "you" or a "me" be.
I think Empty Cans really goes to the core of so many human issues. It's a massive song.
x-post, oops there should be a "know" there somewhere N, "everyone I know".
― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:04 (twenty years ago) link
― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:05 (twenty years ago) link
― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:05 (twenty years ago) link
Skinner intends to up the political (small p) content of his next records, apparently. We could all be Streets-hatas in 12 months time.
Nick otherwise OTM on this thread.
― Jeff W (zebedee), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:05 (twenty years ago) link
― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:07 (twenty years ago) link
This is my point! OPM flits between stuff which isn't believable or real and stuff which is, and so the stuff which IS real is magnified and - because it happens so unconsciously - is more affecting.
Whereas AGDCFF aims to be about life as much as about himself, but... it's too contrived, and N is right, that's not life for a lot of people.
(xposts)
Also - in OPM he's not trying to convey a sense of lifestyle so much, just details about life.
― The Lex (The Lex), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:07 (twenty years ago) link
Yeah, I figured that. I was just saying that there are plenty of indiekids and regular straights who have no experience of the lifestyle Skinner depicts. I'm surprised you don't know any. It would be interesting to know if any of them would enjoy the Streets.
― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:10 (twenty years ago) link
― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:12 (twenty years ago) link
― edward o (edwardo), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:13 (twenty years ago) link
― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:15 (twenty years ago) link
― Ronan (Ronan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:18 (twenty years ago) link
Skinner's lifestyle is alien to many people (me included) but it's the same emotions in different situations (at least partly). Plus many of his songs are funny - I don't think ppl would need to identify with them to enjoy them on this level. (although obv they'd "get" smth different from it)
(many xposts)
― clive (Clive), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 10:22 (twenty years ago) link
http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/regulars/ontherecord/story/0,12255,1210210,00.html
thanks to martian's page http://www.djmartian.blogspot.com not sure if it's come up yet but worthy of some debate on the new thread nontheless.
― myke boomnoise (myke boomnoise), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 13:27 (twenty years ago) link
― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 13:30 (twenty years ago) link
― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 13:32 (twenty years ago) link
― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 13:32 (twenty years ago) link
― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 13:38 (twenty years ago) link
This needs to be released on DVD, with a video for every song.
― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:05 (twenty years ago) link
― Jaunty Alan (Alan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:11 (twenty years ago) link
― Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:13 (twenty years ago) link
― zebedee (zebedee), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:14 (twenty years ago) link
A comfy house, ha ha. He had too many throw cushions to be genuinely working class.
― Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:16 (twenty years ago) link
― Jaunty Alan (Alan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:20 (twenty years ago) link
― Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:22 (twenty years ago) link
She seems somewhat confused about the class issues she does or does not have problems with. Mike Skinner despite his slightly less than humble upbringings is no 'middle-class guiltnik'. So she assesses his honesty? Well isn't that the point of and why we love the record? Its masterfully delivered narrative? We can easily dispense with the amount of fabrication in the record because it is story, urban opera, spoken word or whatever. But something grounded in urban reality.
How many authors throughout history have represented a class from which they do not belong? This album transcends class in many ways. If there is a mass consensus about its relative greatness in the media then that stems from its universal themes and just how genuinely affecting it is for many people. Oxbridge educated or not. I think Caroline is foolish to completely disregard the album context and seems to have more disregard for the streets than The Streets.
― myke boomnoise (myke boomnoise), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:23 (twenty years ago) link
― Jaunty Alan (Alan), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:25 (twenty years ago) link
― myke boomnoise (myke boomnoise), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:30 (twenty years ago) link
― Dadaismus (Dada), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:32 (twenty years ago) link
― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:34 (twenty years ago) link
― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:35 (twenty years ago) link
― myke boomnoise (myke boomnoise), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:36 (twenty years ago) link
― stevem (blueski), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:37 (twenty years ago) link
― N. (nickdastoor), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:39 (twenty years ago) link
― Matt DC (Matt DC), Tuesday, 11 May 2004 14:39 (twenty years ago) link