Are you cool with forks making Spotify playlists out of every rolling thread without permission?

I've never seen Glenn on anything but the Spotify thread, if I've missed something I apologize. Still find that thread gross though.

I've been here since 2001 fwiw.

xp lol, was waiting for it and i got it

if your perspective of the issue is "romantic", by which i take you to mean idealistically principled, what does it matter if it's Adele or the indiest boy in indy folk who is losing some unspecifiable percentage of a penny because someone chose to listen on one service over another?

here is one of many cool things glenn done did:
Mapping All Music

Misgivings about Spotify/YouTube/life aside, everything forks is saying is perfectly reasonable. What's not reasonable is keeping a clusterfuck/witch-hunt poll like this open for three weeks.

I've never seen Glenn on anything but the Spotify thread, if I've missed something I apologize. Still find that thread gross though.

I've been here since 2001 fwiw.

― Οὖτις, Wednesday, February 3, 2016 9:10 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

he's a regular in the metal thread and has been forever

Doesn't Glenn tabulate Pazz & Jop these days, fwiw?

Misgivings about Spotify/YouTube/life aside, everything forks is saying is perfectly reasonable. What's not reasonable is keeping a clusterfuck/witch-hunt poll like this open for three weeks.

― dc, Wednesday, February 3, 2016 9:12 PM (1 minute ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

^^^^^

Glenn's willingness to honestly engage with folks on the spotify thread and his selflessness in transparency of posting there (under his real name yet!) is imo genuinely laudable and provides insight not available elsewhere. You would rather he didn't respond to issues that he actually has the wherewithal to talk about?

i am fighting the urge to start an answer poll of "Are you cool with Mattress starting a clusterfuck thread than ends in three weeks?" and then ending that poll in three weeks.

Just because I got curious and did the searching, Glenn's first ILM post is from Mar. 9, 2001 and his web presence is linked in the rec.music.reviews FAQ from 1996. He is as old-school of an internet music nerd as anybody here, and the strength of this site IMHO is that it still maintains a critical mass of those kind of people (old and new), generous in their musings and their list-making. I think people are allowed to stay on ILM even when their current job is for a company a lot of people don't like. Even when I've disagreed with him on the Spotify thread specifically it's kinda like, I mean, he doesn't have to post anything there. While it seems reasonable to assume there are things he can't say there for reasons of employment (not exactly a unique position among ILXors), I seeeeeeeriously doubt his Spotify overlords are cracking the whip to make sure a couple dozen people on the nerdiest of all message boards hear out their side of the story.

Huh. Live and learn

Can I fp myself?

no but as penance you must start a three-week poll about whether you should be banned from the internet for life, and only glenn can vote

Sounds fair

you should just take all the songs, mix them, upload them to soundcloud and post them on DJs post your mixes for download instead

― mookieproof, Wednesday, February 3, 2016 6:34 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

just in case mookieproof wasn't clear enough, i'm a dj, i post my mixes to soundcloud, and then post the link to the mixes on that thread, where it's available to stream and/or download. soundcloud is a convenient hosting option for this but i'm happy to share my work in other ways.

forks, what bothers me about your project is how exclusive spotify is to it. good metadata is valuable, and you're harvesting it for one organization. do they in turn have an open metadata policy? how exportable are their playlists?

would you be open to modifying your project somewhat to include links to bandcamp, discogs, artist websites, youtube? maybe in a platform-neutral format? or is this really about you riding on a community of experts to put yourself in a good light with a certain organization? because that's sure what it looks like.

... to me, and the reason my tone about all of this has been so dickish, for which i apologize.

the hell? is there something i don't know about forks that would make his/her super involved spare-time project look suspicious in this way to you? fwiw, imho, antagonizing someone and then suggest they do five to six times as much more work for you is maybe not as good a look as offering to help with that, or something. you raise some interesting points that could be interesting fodder for constructive criticism re: metadata and the value for spotify - - --- although let's be honest is spotify really going to see their profit margin leap because of these playlists? moreso than anybody else's, or carly rae jepsen's? or is it your concern that they will turn around and basically rip these off to create a marketable, hypeable product, "check out our new curated playlists, What's Next In Fruity Swag Goon Music 2016 - EDITOR'S PICKS!!!" ...? ----- but the interesting conversation side of it is kind of foreclosed if you're impugning the motives/character of the poster in question.

forks has discussed his/her method and choices a bit, see posts starting at this permalink Listening to ILX Listen - 2015 Spotify Genre Playlists ; i believe that (s)he is sincere. if it looks like a classic internet music lover list-making project, and sounds like a classic internet music lover list-making project...

I'm pretty sure what forks is doing is more benevolent and nerdy and ocd than shilling for spotify or whatever. If you wanna trash spotify, fine, but don't trash forks.

#notallplaylists

"check out our new curated playlists, What's Next In Fruity Swag Goon Music 2016 - EDITOR'S PICKS!!!" ...?

They do do this fwiw. See my last post on the Spotify thread re: stealing my friends' online radio station playlists.

ps i miss forks' scare quotes (not scare quotes) comedy title edits

I'm cool with enthusiasm.

i don't use spotify and i don't mind forks making playlists, but i would be bummed if mattress stopped posting on bobbins threads

If you wanna trash spotify, fine, but don't trash forks.

Just for the record, that is exactly what I've been doing. I don't know forks but I enjoy his posts and will concede that he's made some good points / offered some food for thought wrt Spotify and its place here on ILX

is this really about you riding on a community of experts to put yourself in a good light with a certain organization? because that's sure what it looks like.

This literally has never ever crossed my mind as being a thing that forks' project could possibly look like. What it looks like is a music dork obsessively compiling lists, and then being nice and sharing them with people.

or is this really about you riding on a community of experts to put yourself in a good light with a certain organization? because that's sure what it looks like.

I know that you specified "...to me" afterwards, but I want to foreground it, because I've worked in the music business for 20 years and I cannot imagine viewing forks's project in this light, nor can I imagine anyone I know coming to any comparable conclusion

Incredibly stupid thread. Fuck off. The playlists are cool. Private message each other. Christ.

Lol "experts"

i'm all for enthusiasm and big projects too. but when that gets used as a tactic to shut down legitimate concerns.. i have to admit that's a pet peeve of mine. since this is such a selfless project, i imagine forks will take into account the preferences of the many artists mentioned in these threads who don't like spotify and who make money from other avenues and include some equivalent way of showing support for these artists in his list-making enthusiasm.

xp to emil.y and joan, fair enough.

Mod Request: please move this thread to Ask Dr. Freud.

Incredibly stupid thread. Fuck off. The playlists are cool. Private message each other. Christ.

lol this is one of his better ones

the rolling threads should be paywalled with proceeds going to the experts, who may or may not choose to share with the artists extolled therein

god you're a fucking lowlife, go back to bed

Okay, just expunged some of the weird mojo of this thread by following some of forks other playlists, in particular Meet Elmo Hope.

this is an open community with experts in it (i never claimed to be one of them ffs). i'd hate to see it linked to one company out of hand. i care about the bobbins thread and i want more exposure for those artists (i'm under no illusion that some doofus on a message board has an appreciable amount of influence, but why not be enthusiastic about it and do it in a way you think will benefit someone the most?). i wouldn't mind doing a list for just bobbins with links to youtube, discogs, bandcamp, etc. it would probably make more sense anyway because a fair amount of those people release on vinyl only. if forks wants to talk about it more, he can shout at me off this, struggin @ gmail.

i voted no bc the project seems a little compulsive and forks has discussed it using those v words and maybe it would be liberating to be freed from the self-imposed obligation w/ a majority of 'no' votes

xp i could also put in links to whatever spotify playlist forks wants to make so it's not like a turf thing, just equal opportunity consumption. that's really my issue i guess, artists or listeners who choose not to use spotify are left out. there's the chance to do something that supplements this project (and i'm realizing it isn't neccessarily forks' responsibility to do it). i started this off in a counterproductive way as per usual, hope i can still talk to forks about doing an alternative with the bobbins thread.

we should go back to just downloading mp3s on napster and talking about those

god you're a fucking lowlife, go back to bed

start a poll just to be sure

Haha, what the fuck is this thread for? Seriously this "issue" needs a thread? Forks, I'm fucking honored that you've included my 2016 Indie thread to your playlist. I have no idea of the internal ILM politics of this endeavor. And frankly, I could give two fucks what those politics are. Seriously, please add whatever contributions are given in that thread.

Lol thomp otm

wait hold the presses an indie fan doesn't care about politics

100% added value to each thread when there is an associated playlist.

i am cool with forks making Spotify playlists out of every rolling thread without permission

start a poll just to be sure

only if forks will make a spotify playlist for it. can put all of New Order's Low Life and "Low Life" by the Police, maybe "Speed of Life" off Low...dunno man just spitballin here. I'm just the ideas guy. don't worry I will post Soundcloud links where applicable.

hey so this is a p silly clusterfuck huh

pottery

http://i.imgur.com/KHPIjHf.gif

Make my forks the p-forks

we should go back to just downloading mp3s on napster and talking about those

― carly rae jetson (thomp), Wednesday, February 3, 2016 9:35 PM (1 hour ago) Bookmark Flag Post Permalink

Gotta get back to the base.

if forks wants to talk about it more, he can shout at me off this, struggin @ gmail

how exportable are their playlists?

would you be open to modifying your project somewhat to include links to bandcamp, discogs, artist websites, youtube? maybe in a platform-neutral format?

I am dead positive that you don't have the slightest idea how much time and effort it takes to read every goddamn post in every goddamn thread and look up every goddamn song and then catalogue every goddamn song and then check back again to see if a new song has been added to the service a month later. And just so I'm entirely clear: your beef is not based on some sort of principled concern but simply that you aren't pleased with the way I am managing a massive, personally motivated and unpaid project? That not only is the soup terrible, but in such small portions? Because seriously, you don't have to give a shit if I do this. That's fine. But you wanna tell me the dance I'm doing that I just made up by myself is wrong?

http://24.media.tumblr.com/a77b23ae0d11eb0a06b7b612f1c26622/tumblr_n02ttfbgEv1t13eyho1_400.gif

is this really about you riding on a community of experts to put yourself in a good light with a certain organization?

As to why I'm using Spotify exclusively, I've answered THAT multiple times (including about ten posts up), but here we go again: it has about an 85% hit ratio; it's a service i personally use (and pay for! in addition to buying music and concert tickets and merch elsewhere!); it's reliable and easy to take on a portable device; it has a less-than-totally janky search engine and a small footprint on my mac (NB: I backtracked to .8.5 and find it prone to crashing but otherwise preferable to the social network bloat it otherwise packs in its current state); it's available internationally so out-of-America ILXors have access; and, crucially, it is available for free on the internet, meaning that it is egalitarian and not class-restricted for the listener! If you can access ILX, you can access spotify and they cost the same! The counterintuitive presumption that I am deep cover astroturfing, even after i have REPEATEDLY avowed that I have no affiliation with the company, is so wrong headed as to be genuinely funny.

my tone about all of this has been so dickish, for which i apologize

i imagine forks will take into account the preferences of the many artists mentioned in these threads who don't like spotify and who make money from other avenues and include some equivalent way of showing support for these artists in his list-making enthusiasm.

i wouldn't mind doing a list for just bobbins with links to youtube, discogs, bandcamp, etc.

http://cdn1.theodysseyonline.com/files/2015/10/15/635805362411119546-1401372307_tumblr_nr7zqaDQjg1roohd8o1_400.gif

I will subscribe and listen! I wish people would grassroots this shit and fill in the blanks and make my project obsolete! It would make me SO HAPPY! But hey, little something for you to think about: when you do finally get around to making that bobbins list, take a moment to think about how it would feel to make that same list... twenty-seven more times. Then update all those lists nonstop for a year. Then, just as you start your second year on this mad sisyphean task, imagine some rando, holier-than-thou motherfucker leans in and starts screaming FUCK YOU SOUNDCLOUD IS MURDER ARTISTS RIGHTS as the first step toward voicing their opinion, then follows that up with a poll asking who gave you permission to do the thing you felt like doing in the first place, then accuses you of being a double agent for The Orchard. Once you've worked through that particular thought exercise, I believe you might understand why I find you, your argument and this thread utterly fucking absurd.

Mordy OTM.

The reason why he tells you about it is probably that he's not a robot but an actual human bring putting in unpaid work for the benefit of the community so it would be nice if said community notices it, you know. A bumped thread hurts no one.

Spotify playlists on ILM: don't ask, don't tell.

^gets it

plug-in or applet or whatever the fuck that could pull all the music on a page by name seems like something that would catch on big if it was done right. This could be the next hipster puppies ILX success story. Call it "forks" and buy me dinner and I'll give you permission.
― ulysses, Thursday, 4 February 2016 21:52

I have a friend who's supposedly working on such an app at the moment by the way.
― posted with permission by (dog latin), Friday, February 5, 2016 9:01 AM

how did this work out dl?